Question on value of DVC?

[pentex]

I love my DVC points and always have considered them an excellent investment. We bought in 1993 and have had the best vacations ever, ones that we would not have had otherwise.

However, one thing confuses me. A friend of mine owns an RCI or Inverval (I forget which one) timeshare with a red week (easiest to trade) that she bought on a resale for far less than we paid for DVC.

I understand how our ownerships differ, etc. One question though: she says she can trade it to stay at a DVC resort in 2 bedroom and that she knows others who've done so without a problem.

My question: would I have been better off buying something like this? We want to buy a DVC resale now and while checking prices, it seems we'd save a lot of $ by buying elsewhere.

Am I missing something???????

 

[ClarabelleCow]

my understanding is its very hard to trade into. And you can only trade into Disney if someone puts there resort into Interval International. If Disney owners don't deposit their weeks, there is nothing to get. If you love Disney, then I would buy Disney, but if you plan on trading all over the place, I would buy a cheaper gold crown(RCI) or 5 star property. Maybe even in Hawaii or the Caribbean - all red time and great traderss.

 

[SCDizneyDawn]

Hi, My father owns a week at Marriott's Ford Colony in Williamsburg,Va. He tried 3 yrs in a row to trade this into DVC and had no luck. If you look at TUG, this resort has been in the top 10 several different yrs so it is a very sought after timeshare. Now I have owned at BWV for 2 yrs and he has not requested anything since I bought. So, I guess it may have become easier in the last couple yrs, but my understanding is that DVC properties on Disney property are very, very difficult to get thru an Interval International trade!
Oh, they were able to get into the Hilton Head DVC once and have never requested Vero Beach.

 

[Cruelladeville]

My sister has a Marriott Grand Vista, and has tried for 3 years to trade into Disney, at any of the resorts, even Vero, with no luck. I don't think I would take the word of your friend as truth until you have spoken directly with the people who supposedly did it, so you can verify that the story is factual. If you are interested in trading, buy a cheap 5 star some place that trades well. Disney is for staying at Disney, it's too expensive to trade out when you can get a cheap resale in the $4000-$$6000 range to do the same thing.

 

[Caskbill]

Keep in mind that if any DVC member did want to trade out, they only have to trade a DVC resort, not necessarily a specific resort.

So, since in the world of trades, ALL of Disney is considered Red Time, members (with the aid of MS), will trade the lowest cost week they can. This means OKW in off-season. So if anyone thinks they can trade IN to Boardwalk, Beach Club, Wilderness Lodge can just forget it. And the thought of getting one of those places at high season would mean the DVC member was 'nuts'.

A 2-B/R for a week at BCV during spring break is 462 points. A 2-B/R for a week at OKW in January is 218 points. Both of these have the same trading 'power', basically any resort anywhere they want. So why would a member use their points for the BCV high season for trading purposes?

And home resort means nothing. Members can exchange their points for any valid DVC resort.

I remember a post way back where someone mentioned they traded an OKW STUDIO for a one (or maybe even two) bedroom unit somewhere else.

There may be some exceptions where a member will trade something more valuable for one of the ultra expensive resorts around the world. Maybe 4 or 5 places. But don't think you could buy a $6000 timeshare somewhere and expect to be able to trade it for a week at Boardwalk at Christmas time. It just isn't going to happen. In fact that $6000 resort most likely will never get you into Disney at all.

You're competing against that Hilton owner who owns a $20,000 week in Honolulu. That's the person who is going to successfully trade into Disney.

Disney owners who want to trade for a $6000 resort somewhere else are going to buy a $6000 timeshare themselves for that very purpose. Use it for trading around. They're not going to trade their DVC points for that level of resort.

 

[deerh]

So Caskbil,
Is it hard to trade to Hawaii owning DVC? I have read several posts that has said it is HARD to trade into Hawaii. If we have such a "HOT" property as you say, why are people waiting to get into a Marriott in Hawaii? I have trouble understanding the "trading out" aspect of DVC. I am not talking about the Concierge of DVC, I am talking about the "other" timeshares we can trade into, like marriott, etc. Why or is it hard to trade into their beautiful resorts when we own a top notch resort as well. I don't quite understand. Please help me to understand, as I might want to do that one day. I have read Dean's posts, but still a little cloudy on it, and have not joined TUG yet, just to let you know.
Thanks for the help..
deerh

 

[Cruelladeville]

I'm not really clear on the trade thing, either, but it's my understanding that you cant trade IN unless someone who owns a certain resort wants to trade OUT. If you owned in Hawaii, would you really want to trade OUT? In the same vein, are there many DVC members who want to trade out? I don't think so, therefore no one can trade IN. I know that point-based programs like DVC operate differently from those programs that have deeded weeks, but, again, you can't get into a resort unless people from that resort want to trade out, and it doesn't matter if anyone is staying there during the week that you want or not, if the owners from a resort don't trade OUT, you aren"t getting IN. Have Marriott--or any other timeshare--traded into a DVC resort during Easter break, Christmas-New Year's, or other prime time? I would guess that all units are being used by members, therefore non-members can't in. And as for trading DVC into RCI or Interval, the amount of points we are being charged to get that week thru them is hugely expensive--as someone mentioned, it's around 400 pts. If you rented them, received $10 per pt=$4000, you could buy 1/3 of most timeshares offered for rent thru RCI, so it's not a good idea at all to trade in this manner. By the way, Marriott owners in other locations get first crack at Hawaii, just like HH, Vero, OKW, etc. get first crack at say, BWV. So, for us to trade in, we have to wait in line, just like everyone else, till the Marriott people have gotten their internal choices.

 

[CarolMN]

Originally posted by Cruelladeville
...(snip)..... By the way, Marriott owners in other locations get first crack at Hawaii, just like HH, Vero, OKW, etc. get first crack at say, BWV. So, for us to trade in, we have to wait in line, just like everyone else, till the Marriott people have gotten their internal choices.

IMHO, this is the main reason why it is very, very difficult to trade IN to a Marriott resort in Hawaii. By the time all the other Marriott owners have had a chance at the limited availability, there isn't much (if any) left for others, even those with "good traders" like DVC. If I ever want to "trade" to one of the Marriott resorts in Hawaii, I'd try to arrange a direct trade with an owner. IMHO, I'd have a greater liklehood of success than going through MS & II.

 

[Caskbill]

As you may have guessed, trading can range from anywhere between being simple to complex.

Variables include the Resort itself, the 'Value' of the time (Often called red time, etc), the type of program (fixed week, points), and the type of unit (1-B/R, 2-B/R), and whether the unit itself is fixed or variable.

In it's simplest terms, you own at "A", someone else owns at "B". You want to go and stay there, they want to stay at yours. You trade, done deal.

But in reality, trading is more of a round robin. You own "A" but want to go to "B". Someone in "B" wants to go to "C", someone in "C" wants to go to "D", and someone in "D" wants to go to "A". A complete loop is found and all those trades can take place. Now, instead of "A" through "D", imagine you have resorts "A" through "ZZ". That's a lot of combinations. It's almost like you "have a friend who's brother works with someone who is dating a person who's father works at....." and so on.

And it's dozens, or hundreds of potential loops.

The computers try to find the combination that gets you your trade, but also has everyone else get the trade they want.

Now the reality of it all: You want to go to Hawaii. The only way that can happen is if someone there trades OUT. So who gets that slot? The program's first priority may be to it's own members, such as at Marriott. Maybe there's 20 Marriott owners wanting to trade into Hawaii, They all come first before anyone else. If only one person trades out, then 19 of those Marriott owners don't even get in, never mind anyone else.

Now assume 21 Hawaii owners trade out. Those 20 Marriott owners get the 1st 20 spots, leaving only one left. That one is going to II. DVC owners would be among those near the top of the "desirability" list. But if there were 10 DVC owners, maybe 1 would get it, maybe it would go somewhere else, maybe a high end Hilton owner somewhere.

In any case you can imagine how far down the list someone would be who owned a $6000 timeshare at Daytona Beach for example, trying to get that Marriott Hawaii week.

Likewise, trading INTO DVC is similar. Someone at DVC has to trade out. But they probably don't want to go to that Daytona Beach unit. They want something better, and state it's item "A" or no trade at all. So the loop search begins. Someone in Hawaii, someone at South Seas plantation on Sanibel Island, and so on.

Maybe an anology will work: 100 people drive to this huge parking lot, and they all agree to swap cars. The BMW owner sees a Mercedes and swaps, but then he sees a Caddy and swaps for that. Meanwhile the Oldsmobile owner saw a nice Pontiac, and the Ford guy traded for a nice Mercury. That Mustang GT owner found an older, but nice Corvette.

Meanwhile, you brought your 1988 Honda. When all the trading is done, what chance is there that you'll wind up getting that 2002 Mercedes?

You'd be asking for this scenario: The Mercedes guy wanted the Cadillac, the Caddy owner wanted that Oldsmobile, the Olds guy wanted that older Corvette, the Vette owner wanted that classic Mustang, and the Mustang owner wanted a 1988 Honda. Basically EVERYONE in the loop had to trade down a little, and you got all of that by one big trade UP. Possible: Yes, Probable, NO. Remotely probably: NO

Does that make sense at all? Hope maybe this helps.

 

[deerh]

Caskbil,
Yes, thanks for the analogies. I think I understand now. As my principal of my school would say, the "bottom Line" is, forget an exchange, just go to Hawaii with the Concierge part of DVC-Is that what you are saying? Thanks for all the help, and I think I am clear on it now!
Deerh

 

[Lisa P.]

Here are a few bits of info that be of interest to some here:

1. DVC does not deposit Premier weeks on their members' behalf. They don't need to and don't waste their members' points this way. This is why it's truly impossible to trade into DVC WDW resorts during Christmas/Easter or DVC HHI during prime summertime.

2. DVC will try to use a lesser points week (in your unit size requested) to secure your exchange confirmation, wherever possible. A 2BR exchange should not cost 400 points, more likely 296 or fewer (by depositing a HHI or OKW week).

3. DVC offers internal trading via Member Services. OKW owners are permitted to book Vero vacations this way and II never sees any of this. By contrast, Marriott owns a small percentage of II and they use II for their internal trading option. So they have a special arrangement:

When a Marriott deposit is placed in II, it is initially put into a limited access spacebank pool. For (at least) the first 21 days, it is only available to be confirmed by another Marriott owner's Marriott week exchange. If it does not get taken by any Marriott owner, it is then made available to Marriott and Horizons owners during days 21-24. Still not taken, it's put into the general II spacebank pool and may be confirmed by anyone with a strong enough week to take it. At that point, a DVC member request may be confirmed. This all means that Marriott owners get first option to book the prime Marriott weeks, as available.

4. Marriott's Ford's Colony is highly rated but Williamsburg is becoming rather overbuilt with timeshares. So unless one owns a prime July week, they may not have the trade power that you'd expect from such a nice property.

5. We've traded an offseason Marriott week into DVC HHI, early March. We enjoyed our stay there and knew we would not get a summer trade in.

6. As recently as last week, there were several 1BR and 2BR weeks available in II for DVC OKW for this coming fall, early November, I believe. It's not impossible (and seems a little bit more available than it used to be). But it's kind of late for planning and these are quieter weeks. I've known of a handful of people on TUG's forums who've traded into OKW during summer. They used prime red 5 Star weeks to secure those trades and were very flexible in travel dates.

7. Trading into Hawaii can be hard. Demand exceeds supply. It seems easier in the last year with fewer people wanting to travel by air. Loads of last minute availability at some lovely properties.

8. Direct trades (between owners) can sometimes save you points & trade fees. It may get you what you are seeking with more certainty. See TUG's Direct Exchange Listings if you want to seek one of these.

Hope some of this helped someone understand it a little bit better.