Poll: Your Riviera Resale price

At what price would you buy Riviera on the resale market (Be limited to staying only at Riviera)?

  • $160

    Votes: 4 1.4%
  • $150

    Votes: 12 4.1%
  • $140

    Votes: 3 1.0%
  • $130

    Votes: 4 1.4%
  • $120

    Votes: 28 9.6%
  • $110

    Votes: 21 7.2%
  • $100

    Votes: 59 20.2%
  • Under $90

    Votes: 161 55.1%

  • Total voters
    292

Drewferin

Mouseketeer
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Just wanting to see at what you would personally pay for a resale contract for Riviera.
 
Last edited:

Smoknchip

Earning My Ears
Joined
May 4, 2019
$150. Resale restriction is overstated. You always hear buy where you want to own. Many people on this board have not seen the rooms at the preview center in person. I bet if they did, even though the resort is not finished yet, some opinionS would change. Skyliner, restaurants, amenities, 50 year life span, 5 different room types (with studios sleeping 5). There will be plenty of people that will want to own here.
 

Great3

Mouseketeer
Joined
Jan 20, 2015
Personally, I wouldn't even consider a resale purchase for Riveria unless it's at least $20 - $30 less per point than what SSR is going for, and even than I would probably just buy SSR over Riveria. So, in today's market, I would say that's $70 a point at best.

For anybody willing to pay more for Riveria, more power to them. That's why it's a free market, and I don't always get what want to pay :).

Great3
 
  • KAT4DISNEY

    Glad to be a test subject
    Joined
    Mar 17, 2008
    $150. Resale restriction is overstated. You always hear buy where you want to own. Many people on this board have not seen the rooms at the preview center in person. I bet if they did, even though the resort is not finished yet, some opinionS would change. Skyliner, restaurants, amenities, 50 year life span, 5 different room types (with studios sleeping 5). There will be plenty of people that will want to own here.
    I think a lot of people have been very positive about the rooms and some have had their minds changed but some are still held back by the restrictions. And in the first refurb that room could change quite a bit anyway. Once I heard about the restrictions I had no interest in buying. I did tour the rooms and fortunately it did not change my mind. They're fine and they don't have to be A#1 for me to stay there. I don't like what DVC is doing with the restrictions and allowing it to be part of the club as if there's no difference and I'm certainly not endorsing it with a purchase even if I had absolutely loved the rooms. And If I had loved the decor I could have redecorated a room at home instead. ;)
     

    Frederic Civish

    “I’m just here for the Ears.”
    Joined
    Apr 18, 2018
    Riviera Resale price will have to deal with the Restriction. It is a disadvantage, just like short contract length is a disadvantage at BC and Boardwalk. Yet, the price of those is doing quite well. Why? Because PEOPLE WANT TO STAY THERE. Well, resale buyers will want to stay at Riviera. The price of BC and Boardwalk is a bit lower than it would be if the contracts were longer, but it is still higher than many other resale properties.

    Logically, you would expect the same thing from Riviera. It is a disadvantage, but nothing that the resort can't overcome because people will WANT to stay there. Though I hope for less, realistically, being a new property with a 50 year contract, AND being a premium resort that people will WANT, I think it won't matter that much.

    Think of it this way. If resale purchasers at Grand Floridian or Grand Californian could only stay there, then would it drop their price very much? Riviera will be in a similar range, possibly.

    i also expect Riviera Resale to be quite popular among owners who already have other properties. Because they will already have other built in options.

    Now, will the same thing apply to Reflections in the future? I have my doubts about that.
     

    Disney Dad ADL

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 17, 2015
    In
    Riviera Resale price will have to deal with the Restriction. It is a disadvantage, just like short contract length is a disadvantage at BC and Boardwalk. Yet, the price of those is doing quite well. Why? Because PEOPLE WANT TO STAY THERE. Well, resale buyers will want to stay at Riviera. The price of BC and Boardwalk is a bit lower than it would be if the contracts were longer, but it is still higher than many other resale properties.

    Logically, you would expect the same thing from Riviera. It is a disadvantage, but nothing that the resort can't overcome because people will WANT to stay there. Though I hope for less, realistically, being a new property with a 50 year contract, AND being a premium resort that people will WANT, I think it won't matter that much.

    Think of it this way. If resale purchasers at Grand Floridian or Grand Californian could only stay there, then would it drop their price very much? Riviera will be in a similar range, possibly.

    i also expect Riviera Resale to be quite popular among owners who already have other properties. Because they will already have other built in options.

    Now, will the same thing apply to Reflections in the future? I have my doubts about that.
    I think the restriction will have some sort of effect on the price, maybe 10% discount? The average listing price of VGF is $160, so say the actual selling price is 10% lower = $144. Then another 10% off would give us $130 for Riviera.

    I personally think won’t be as popular as VGF, maybe closer to Bay Lake or Beach Club. If they are selling around $130, it would put Riviera around $117? I’m guessing maybe around $110.

    I think it’s unlikely to be anywhere near VGC which has an average listing price of $190. VGC is in its own stratosphere at the moment.

    Edit: also agree that Reflections will not be as popular as Riviera
     

    katandmouse

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Apr 26, 2019
    I think a lot will depend on how difficult it will be to stay at Riviera if you don’t own there. Once RIV is fully declared it will have somewhere around 6.7 million points (I can’t find my bookmark with the total points per resort right now). The only resorts bigger than RIV are SSR, AUL, OKW, and AKV. I don’t think it will actually be that difficult to trade into RIV. Easier than BLT, BWV, and the others. By the time there’s enough restricted resale owners, there will be that many more restricted L14 resales who can’t book RIV anyway.

    Now the point charts are much steeper at RIV, so I could see the Tower studios and standard views going fast so you’d need to own for those - in which case I think the smaller contracts will be even more popular and see more of a premium than the usual.

    Personally I just wouldn’t want to own a resort where if I can’t stay there for some reason, my only option is to rent my points out and then try to rent points at a different resort or pay cash. Plus if I’m past my banking deadline and past the 7 month window, my points are pretty much worthless. I get that owning DVC comes with its limitations, but that just seems like more of a hassle than I want to deal with!
     

    Jkarrows

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Apr 6, 2012
    I will be surprised with the restrictions if the value is not around 100 dollars a point the same as places like Saratoga, Old Key West point price.
     

    Frederic Civish

    “I’m just here for the Ears.”
    Joined
    Apr 18, 2018
    I think Riviera is almost always going to be one of the hardest to book, both for the Riviera Owners, and the Non-Owners.

    Why?

    Because of the restrictions. Let's say that 5 years from now it is sold out. Let's assume that people are starting to sell it and resale purchasers are coming into it. Let's assume that 3% per year is resold. This is not unusual compared to other resorts, and is probably just on the low end. So, in just about 3 years 10% and then at 7 years 20% of the owners will be Resale Owners.

    Now, the resale owners can go nowhere else. Riviera will be in demand, so they will know that if they don't make a reservation before the 7 month window, they get nothing. So, they will either reserve, or they will rent out the points and reserve for someone else. Either way, the points get used, and the reservations will be made. Now, what about the Direct owners? Probably at least 80% to 90% will also be scheduling at Riviera. Why? Because Riviera will be a Deluxe resort, very desirable, and they will have purchased it precisely to stay there. So, there will be an 'arms race' (or maybe we should call it a 'Walking Contest') between the Resale Owners and the Direct Owners. An unusually high number of people will be booking close to the 11 month window. The situation with the Tower Studios will be similar to the Value and Kilimanjaro Club Studios at Jambo House, where the only way you will get in is by trying right at the 6 AM opening bell, and then being luck, or start many days earlier and start walking. Which will also take inventory out, away from others.

    I have also noted that, currently, the Standard View Studios are completely booked out before the 7 month window and the Preferred View are disappearing instantaneously at 8 AM Eastern Time at the 7 month window. And this can only get worse as more and more people buy Resale in the future.

    In other words, I think Riviera is always going to be one messed up resort when it comes to booking.
     

    RaymOOOnd

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jun 14, 2015
    $150. Resale restriction is overstated. You always hear buy where you want to own. Many people on this board have not seen the rooms at the preview center in person. I bet if they did, even though the resort is not finished yet, some opinionS would change. Skyliner, restaurants, amenities, 50 year life span, 5 different room types (with studios sleeping 5). There will be plenty of people that will want to own here.
    Even if resale restriction is in fact overstated, I wouldn't rather stay there than VGF or Poly, which are essentially the same price as you've voted and have barely shorter contract lengths. Or BLT which I believe is actually still cheaper.
     

    Disney Dad ADL

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 17, 2015
    I think Riviera is almost always going to be one of the hardest to book, both for the Riviera Owners, and the Non-Owners.

    Why?

    Because of the restrictions. Let's say that 5 years from now it is sold out. Let's assume that people are starting to sell it and resale purchasers are coming into it. Let's assume that 3% per year is resold. This is not unusual compared to other resorts, and is probably just on the low end. So, in just about 3 years 10% and then at 7 years 20% of the owners will be Resale Owners.

    Now, the resale owners can go nowhere else. Riviera will be in demand, so they will know that if they don't make a reservation before the 7 month window, they get nothing. So, they will either reserve, or they will rent out the points and reserve for someone else. Either way, the points get used, and the reservations will be made. Now, what about the Direct owners? Probably at least 80% to 90% will also be scheduling at Riviera. Why? Because Riviera will be a Deluxe resort, very desirable, and they will have purchased it precisely to stay there. So, there will be an 'arms race' (or maybe we should call it a 'Walking Contest') between the Resale Owners and the Direct Owners. An unusually high number of people will be booking close to the 11 month window. The situation with the Tower Studios will be similar to the Value and Kilimanjaro Club Studios at Jambo House, where the only way you will get in is by trying right at the 6 AM opening bell, and then being luck, or start many days earlier and start walking. Which will also take inventory out, away from others.

    I have also noted that, currently, the Standard View Studios are completely booked out before the 7 month window and the Preferred View are disappearing instantaneously at 8 AM Eastern Time at the 7 month window. And this can only get worse as more and more people buy Resale in the future.

    In other words, I think Riviera is always going to be one messed up resort when it comes to booking.
    Short term though may be an interesting question. 3 years from now, you will mainly have the following groups of people:

    1. Riveria direct owners
    2. Legacy 14 owners with Riviera booking privileges
    3. Legacy 14 owners without Riviera booking privileges
    4. Non-Riviera direct owners

    Riviera resale numbers should be relatively low in the first few years.

    If this is the case, Riviera could actually be a bit easier to book at 7 months compared to the L14 because there will be a group of people (L14 owners with restrictions) that can’t book there in 7 months. However, all Riviera owners will still be able to book elsewhere.

    At the L14, you still have to complete with everyone, again assuming Riviera resales are low.

    However, I agree that a Riviera will still be a relatively popular resort, so it may still feel very hard to get a room there at 7 months. Maybe I’ll have a different opinion after we stay there in January.
     

    OneOftheB's

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Feb 5, 2015
    I would be willing to bet that Disney will help keep the resale value inflated. They don't want a newer property to significantly decrease on the resale market and if it is too low, I foresee them buying it back to be sold to direct buyers, thus eliminating the resale restrictions. Sure, in a few years, the point value might go down from current rates (and isn't that a risk with any property in all honestly-vacations and rental are always the first and hardest hit in a recession) but I don't think that Disney would allow the sales price to hit bargain basement pricing at a fairly new resort.
     

    Great3

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jan 20, 2015
    I would be willing to bet that Disney will help keep the resale value inflated. They don't want a newer property to significantly decrease on the resale market and if it is too low, I foresee them buying it back to be sold to direct buyers, thus eliminating the resale restrictions. Sure, in a few years, the point value might go down from current rates (and isn't that a risk with any property in all honestly-vacations and rental are always the first and hardest hit in a recession) but I don't think that Disney would allow the sales price to hit bargain basement pricing at a fairly new resort.
    It may not go down to the level of realistic Market Price, as you said, Disney ROFR may keep the price higher. But those Riveria contract will just stay on the market for much much longer until seller drop prices below ROFR levels, because I for one won't ever make an offer until it gets to be much cheaper than SSR. The question than is DVC budget big enough to ROFR every Riveria resale if they are trying to keep the price artificially high. I get that they can than turn around and sell at a higher price for profit, but if it doesn't sell out fast enough, I can see that aren't be much ROFR like Aulani, as they would have too many points to sale. One thing for sure, the future is going to be interesting in regards to what happens with DVC.

    Great3
     

    Frederic Civish

    “I’m just here for the Ears.”
    Joined
    Apr 18, 2018
    I would be willing to bet that Disney will help keep the resale value inflated. They don't want a newer property to significantly decrease on the resale market and if it is too low, I foresee them buying it back to be sold to direct buyers, thus eliminating the resale restrictions. Sure, in a few years, the point value might go down from current rates (and isn't that a risk with any property in all honestly-vacations and rental are always the first and hardest hit in a recession) but I don't think that Disney would allow the sales price to hit bargain basement pricing at a fairly new resort.
    It may not go down to the level of realistic Market Price, as you said, Disney ROFR may keep the price higher. But those Riveria contract will just stay on the market for much much longer until seller drop prices below ROFR levels, because I for one won't ever make an offer until it gets to be much cheaper than SSR. The question than is DVC budget big enough to ROFR every Riveria resale if they are trying to keep the price artificially high. I get that they can than turn around and sell at a higher price for profit, but if it doesn't sell out fast enough, I can see that aren't be much ROFR like Aulani, as they would have too many points to sale. One thing for sure, the future is going to be interesting in regards to what happens with DVC.

    Great3
    If it sells out within 3 to 5 years, and then they need to take a lot back through ROFR in order to keep the price up, they will be competing for sales with their newest property, Reflections (A Lakeside Resort). That means that they will constantly be offering two properties, Riviera and Reflections, and, since I think Riviera is likely to be MUCH more desirable, they will be selling more of it at Direct Resale.

    However, there is another problem, if Disney decides to pursue a strategy of keeping the Resale price up by ROFR. And that is this: Once people see that Disney is taking almost all the Resale contracts on ROFR, people will quit bidding for it. Why put in a bid, and tie up a couple of thousand dollars of your money, while you wait for them to take it out from under you. Heavy ROFR could well have the opposite effect of what they want.

    One more thing that I haven't heard anyone mention. It may be true that Disney will initially be selling Riviera to a bunch of inexperienced DVC Newbs, with pixie dust in their eyes, but that isn't what is going to happen on the resale market. The resale market is much heavier in the savvy, experienced DVC owners. No pixie dust allowed. And they won't be rushing to grab it, considering the restrictions, unless the price drops enough to warrant it.

    Sure, there will ALWAYS be some people who are going to buy it, regardless of the resale price, because they will just want to stay there. But an awful lot of the experienced DVC Owners just won't be interested, because they like the benefits of more options from resale purchase of the L14.
     

    Disney Dad ADL

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 17, 2015
    It may not go down to the level of realistic Market Price, as you said, Disney ROFR may keep the price higher. But those Riveria contract will just stay on the market for much much longer until seller drop prices below ROFR levels, because I for one won't ever make an offer until it gets to be much cheaper than SSR. The question than is DVC budget big enough to ROFR every Riveria resale if they are trying to keep the price artificially high. I get that they can than turn around and sell at a higher price for profit, but if it doesn't sell out fast enough, I can see that aren't be much ROFR like Aulani, as they would have too many points to sale. One thing for sure, the future is going to be interesting in regards to what happens with DVC.

    Great3
    Riviera resale may still be reasonable on the secondary market due to it's location and the reasonable buzz so far.

    On the other hand, I think Reflections on the resale market may get crushed. I think Reflections will really test how much resale value means to direct buyers. When people see it on the market for $50 per point resale, will it scare off direct buyers?
     

    Bing Showei

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Sep 10, 2017
    I would be willing to bet that Disney will help keep the resale value inflated. They don't want a newer property to significantly decrease on the resale market and if it is too low, I foresee them buying it back to be sold to direct buyers, thus eliminating the resale restrictions. Sure, in a few years, the point value might go down from current rates (and isn't that a risk with any property in all honestly-vacations and rental are always the first and hardest hit in a recession) but I don't think that Disney would allow the sales price to hit bargain basement pricing at a fairly new resort.
    I would take that bet. Historically, Disney has not bought back a property it is actively marketing (Riviera and Aulani now); if you found an owner willing to sell AUL for $40/point, I would bet Disney doesn't touch it.

    The flaw with expecting low Riviera resale prices is that owners will not want to lose their shirts on an elective sale. So if an owner chooses to sell, they could probably afford to be patient. If, on the other hand, they HAVE TO sell (because of financing, maybe), they probably can't afford to go too low without needing to bring money to the table. If anything, a desperate owner will just foreclose and walk away.

    Barring larger macro-economic factors, dirt-cheap Riviera resale in the near term is a pipe dream. And in a few years, $175/point for a Disney timeshare may be what's considered dirt-cheap.
     

    Disney Dad ADL

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 17, 2015
    I would take that bet. Historically, Disney has not bought back a property it is actively marketing (Riviera and Aulani now); if you found an owner willing to sell AUL for $40/point, I would bet Disney doesn't touch it.

    The flaw with expecting low Riviera resale prices is that owners will not want to lose their shirts on an elective sale. So if an owner chooses to sell, they could probably afford to be patient. If, on the other hand, they HAVE TO sell (because of financing, maybe), they probably can't afford to go too low without needing to bring money to the table. If anything, a desperate owner will just foreclose and walk away.

    Barring larger macro-economic factors, dirt-cheap Riviera resale in the near term is a pipe dream. And in a few years, $175/point for a Disney timeshare may be what's considered dirt-cheap.
    One other problem is that initially it's difficult to tell what the true resale value will be. Early numbers are inflated by low supply I think. Copper Creek resale for example seems to be at $150? I have a hard time imaging that CCV will maintain that price in the long run. IMO, it should be around $120 maybe, assuming of course the others stay flat.
     

    Frederic Civish

    “I’m just here for the Ears.”
    Joined
    Apr 18, 2018
    I would take that bet. Historically, Disney has not bought back a property it is actively marketing (Riviera and Aulani now); if you found an owner willing to sell AUL for $40/point, I would bet Disney doesn't touch it.

    The flaw with expecting low Riviera resale prices is that owners will not want to lose their shirts on an elective sale. So if an owner chooses to sell, they could probably afford to be patient. If, on the other hand, they HAVE TO sell (because of financing, maybe), they probably can't afford to go too low without needing to bring money to the table. If anything, a desperate owner will just foreclose and walk away.

    Barring larger macro-economic factors, dirt-cheap Riviera resale in the near term is a pipe dream. And in a few years, $175/point for a Disney timeshare may be what's considered dirt-cheap.
    I think that once Riviera sells out, and a few resale contracts change hands, Riviera will become a nightmare to book. It will get a reputation as one of the hardest, even for people who own there. I think that reputation will also tend to scare off resale buyers, which will also cause the price to drop.

    It is possible that none of these things will happen. Maybe, just like with the short contract remaining for Beach Club, people will be willing to pinch their noses and jump in, despite potential problems. But I still think it will have a bad reputation among knowledgeable resale purchasers.
     

    crvetter

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Nov 26, 2018
    One other problem is that initially it's difficult to tell what the true resale value will be. Early numbers are inflated by low supply I think. Copper Creek resale for example seems to be at $150? I have a hard time imaging that CCV will maintain that price in the long run. IMO, it should be around $120 maybe, assuming of course the others stay flat.
    I think they are listed around 150 but go for 140-145. I think 120 is way too low for CCV, which would put it only the slightly above AKV and OKW extended. I think CCV is about where it should be relative to the resorts, coming below PVB/BLT which is the cheapest of the monorail and Epcot resorts. I think the resale prices have risen quite a bit since the CCV started really hitting the market making it seem fairly high.

    As for DRR it really depends for me how the Skyliner works but I think I could see somewhere between 130-150. It really depends too how much the market already is pricing the DVC Reservation Component, personally I think it isn’t priced too highly.
     

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