Pete's view on ROL delay

[OhioStateBuckeye]

I'm very intrigued by Pete's thoughts on the rol delay. I hadn't even considered that possibility.
It kind of makes sense though, they'd save a lot of money by not debuting the show until the popular summer months.

I'm eager to hear how the media preview goes this weekend. If it goes off without a hitch I'm willing to believe Pete's theory.

 

[rteetz]

I'm not buying it. They are leaving potential revenue out there if they just delay this because they can. Yes of course Shanghai is a problem but they wouldn't test during the day if they weren't having problems.

 

[soniam]

I would believe what Pete says about the cost cutting at this point, but it makes me sad to think that someone thought it was a good decision. As for testing, they should continue to do that, even maybe after it starts running full-time at first. Problems don't always show up with just one test or a few. They need to be done over and over and in different circumstances. Every wonder why your phone seems to "act up" sometimes

 

[MikeTaylor]

I think Pete's second string of thought here is probably correct on this... the RoL dinner (or dessert?) packages have not filled up as expected and Disney was probably using that predictable income to offset some upstart costs and extra salary.

 

[pjweaver]

I'm still looking for these dining packages for RoL. I try to book it for our July trip, and get butkis. The most current hours are still showing AK to close at 5:00. Then again they still have MK hours set like it's February.

I'm not buying it. They are leaving potential revenue out there if they just delay this because they can. Yes of course Shanghai is a problem but they wouldn't test during the day if they weren't having problems.

What revenue does Disney get by staying open late, paying employees that time, and setting off the fireworks? At best they lower attendance at the other parks, but they could increase revenue by not having RoL to send more people to DS or ACDH. I fail to see how selling a few more hats and neon sticks could possibly offset the cost RoL involves each night.

If I were in Bobby Iger's shoes I would have Wishes 4-5 times a week and Illuminations only on days that had a T in them. The Disney company had record attendance at both their resorts and parks, record profits, yet will continue to cut corners. You may ask why, and the simple answer is THEY CAN. The technology and mechanics are fine, they just don't want to pay park employees to man it all and sell those crappy light up toys. Seating is limited and you would need to man some rides and concession stands, so say 120 man hours minimum in addition to the people working RoL in front of and behind the scenes. Now factor in the bussing for on site guests, the custodial staff, the potential overtime costs. Somewhere in the $35,000 range in all... How much revenue are you expecting?

River of Light is a beautiful concept, but economically flawed. Uncle Bob saw this and his cronies made some adjustments. You can't break some hearts without leaving some stab wounds. They have invested too much at this point to pull the plug, but since AK is the least attended park (ok HS may take that spot) why stay open late? Everyone leaves by 2:00 as it is. At this point I hope I misread that post, or missed the sarcasm.

 

[soniam]

I think Pete's second string of thought here is probably correct on this... the RoL dinner (or dessert?) packages have not filled up as expected and Disney was probably using that predictable income to offset some upstart costs and extra salary.

Like @pjweaver said, there were no packages released yet. There are probably thousands of people from this site and Facebook that have been stalking them since at least February 23. Don't go saying this over on one of those threads. They may turn into an even angrier mob than they are now.

 

[rteetz]

I'm still looking for these dining packages for RoL. I try to book it for our July trip, and get butkis. The most current hours are still showing AK to close at 5:00. Then again they still have MK hours set like it's February.


What revenue does Disney get by staying open late, paying employees that time, and setting off the fireworks? At best they lower attendance at the other parks, but they could increase revenue by not having RoL to send more people to DS or ACDH. I fail to see how selling a few more hats and neon sticks could possibly offset the cost RoL involves each night.

If I were in Bobby Iger's shoes I would have Wishes 4-5 times a week and Illuminations only on days that had a T in them. The Disney company had record attendance at both their resorts and parks, record profits, yet will continue to cut corners. You may ask why, and the simple answer is THEY CAN. The technology and mechanics are fine, they just don't want to pay park employees to man it all and sell those crappy light up toys. Seating is limited and you would need to man some rides and concession stands, so say 120 man hours minimum in addition to the people working RoL in front of and behind the scenes. Now factor in the bussing for on site guests, the custodial staff, the potential overtime costs. Somewhere in the $35,000 range in all... How much revenue are you expecting?

River of Light is a beautiful concept, but economically flawed. Uncle Bob saw this and his cronies made some adjustments. You can't break some hearts without leaving some stab wounds. They have invested too much at this point to pull the plug, but since AK is the least attended park (ok HS may take that spot) why stay open late? Everyone leaves by 2:00 as it is. At this point I hope I misread that post, or missed the sarcasm.

Disney has been late to change hours lately. They also aren't going to change AK hours until they are certain this show is ready to run.

You're going to see a increase in attendance when these new things debut. People are going to want to see the new show, Safari, entertainment etc. that's where they get the increased revenue.

If Disney ran wishes 4-5 times a night and illuminations a few times a week you would see people complaining up the wazoo. WDW used to only run things a few times a week and would cancel when it's raining etc. but we have a new type of culture at WDW. If a ride breaks down, FP doesn't work, person can't eat at BOG, they got o guest services and complain. Disney brought this on themselves. They can't go back to those days because it would bring outrage from the once in a lifetime travelers who spend the most money at WDW.

AK beat out DHS in attendance last year according to TEA. You also can't say everyone leaves at 2:00 because not everyone does.

 

[rteetz]

I think Pete's second string of thought here is probably correct on this... the RoL dinner (or dessert?) packages have not filled up as expected and Disney was probably using that predictable income to offset some upstart costs and extra salary.

The dining packages have never been announced. They showed up on MDE for a but were never bookable.

 

[ajbtv2]

I don't see how anyone can say something is "not filling up" when it has not been offered to the public yet to even get filled up.

Here's my take on everything based on all the information I've gathered:

1. The media event is a single show. It doesn't need everything to run like clockwork to have 3 shows run every night. They could even switch to "B show" mode if needed during the media event without anyone knowing.

2. The tech issues which are being shared provide insight to the issue of consistency, which turns into keeping up with show schedule demands.

3. Shows are expected to be scheduled with a number of items happening at optimum level:
a. The sets cannot ever run long, if they do that impacts schedule.
b. All set pieces must be able to reset, without fail, within a specified time, if not - they impact schedule.
c. Crowd control must happen within a specified time, if they cannot get the stage cleared and refilled in a specified time, they impact schedule.
d. Projectors and other equipment cannot overheat with the demand request, this environment is extremely different than any other location where this has been placed before, the equipment may work fine for 1-2 performances in it's current locations, but not be able to support the nightly demand of full swing runs.


It's possible that the issues could be any combination of dining staff, CM crowd control, show performers, tech staff, and/or technology are not prepared for the demand that's needed for full steam ahead 3-shows per night, 7 days per week, with little/no chance of having to cancel/delay shows.


Another thing to keep in mind is that with RoL, there will be few "tangibles" like fireworks being completed with this event. Nearly all (if not all) features of this show are to be re-usable (lights & water screens). You're not going to see 100s of fireworks being set off in the middle of an animal park. Those tangibles (fireworks) equate to 70%+ of the cost of other nighttime shows at WDW.

 

[Princess Jes]

Why would Disney even bother creating the RoL show, the nighttime safari and the light up ToL if they were worried about the running costs?
It doesn't add up that it's purely a cost cutting move.
Also, why announce it only a month or two ago to cancel so soon after that?
Somethings not right here, but I'm not convinced it's running costs savings.

 

[Vernie822]

So, I just wanted to add to this thread by sharing my recent experience with Disney guest relations.

I think it's good feedback to let Disney know when something is amazing (food, service, fantastic CM's, etc) and when you're disappointed (for example, with ROL).

My disappointment with ROL wasn't necessarily that they pushed back the show. It was that I called, every single day for 2 (maybe even longer?!) weeks straight, trying to get info on preview packages, dinner packages, etc. I stayed up late and woke up early with everyone else that was looking for some info! Every single CM I spoke with told me to "check the blog, it will be out ASAP!" and many even told me "check tomorrow, we should hear something really soon." I was told there would be special preview events we could purchase tickets to as well. Every single CM I spoke with was exceptional. Unfortunately, they knew about as much info as we all did.

So earlier this week, I sent WDW Guest Relations an email. I expressed my frustrations nicely. I explained what I mentioned above, that I called every day for 2 weeks straight and was told we'd have opportunities to book preview packages, dining packages, etc. very soon. I explained to them that it's difficult, when Disney puts so much pressure on us to book our vacations 180/90/60 days in advance, to plan for a show, and have it be postponed.

In my email, I did NOT mention or demand that I receive compensation. That's not how I am. I just wanted Disney to know how I felt, whether it was good or bad. It's not a big deal, I can see the show in November when I return. I thanked them for their time and let them know I had great experience with CM's over the phone, and that I couldn't wait to see the show next time I visit. This doesn't ruin my trip whatsoever.

Less than 24 hours later, I received a phone call from Olivia at Guest Relations. I returned the call and spoke with John (who was OUT OF THIS WORLD FANTASTIC). He expressed that he's just as frustrated as the rest of us. He told me that he would love to make it up to me and insisted that we either accept his offer of a Ferrytale Wishes Dessert Cruise, or a Star Wars Symphony in the Sky Dessert Party. I told him I felt really bad taking something away from someone else, but he insisted. He also offered us 3 extra FP's for our Magic Kingdom day.

I personally can't stand when people think Disney "owes" them something for ruining their vacation, whether it's bad weather, 7 Dwarfs Mine Train being down, etc. Actually I read in a FB group the other day, a woman saying if her room at Pop Century was not up to her standards, she would demand to be moved to a monorail resort for convenience (REALLY?!).. Anyhow, I just wanted to share my experience. I didn't expect anything more than a standard "Thanks for your email...." response, but I'm once again impressed by the type of company that Disney continues to be.

 

[KingLlama]

Um, not to be overly critical, Vernie, but you kind of did it wrong.

You're not supposed to be reasonable when calling and expressing your disappointment with Disney. You're supposed to start screaming about Walt turning over in his grave and then threaten to set yourself on fire while standing on the Main Street U.S.A. train platform.

I'm glad you get those FastPasses and desserts and all, but you went about it all wrong.

 

[mick1229]

Disney is going to be testing a new revenue stream soon "Disneys atmospheric oxygen and nitrogen intake charge"....but don't worry the charge only applies while you breathe on property

 

[Vernie822]

Um, not to be overly critical, Vernie, but you kind of did it wrong.

You're not supposed to be reasonable when calling and expressing your disappointment with Disney. You're supposed to start screaming about Walt turning over in his grave and then threaten to set yourself on fire while standing on the Main Street U.S.A. train platform.

I'm glad you get those FastPasses and desserts and all, but you went about it all wrong.

That was going to be my tactic, but because John was so nice I got a little nervous and just cried and begged for free dessert instead.

 

[KingLlama]

That was going to be my tactic, but because John was so nice I got a little nervous and just cried and begged for free dessert instead.

Atta girl. I cry and beg for free dessert every single day of my life.

 

[Flyerjab]

I was very interested in Pete's take on what is happening with this debut for RoL. It really isn't just the postponing of a show for a month+, but rather the postponing of the extension of park hours and associated operational costs for however long.

What will interest me is if this debuts slightly after Shanghai opens. If a lot of operational costs have been cut due to Shanghai, it won't surprise me if the debut of this is pushed back after Shanghai debuts. I don't doubt that there are lingering technical issues, but maybe Shanghai also plays into it. Who really knows?

 

[SorcererHeidi]

So, I just wanted to add to this thread by sharing my recent experience with Disney guest relations.

Good for you, Vernie - you're very much like me int that respect - just wanted to beard and validated, and/or didn't want it to happen to anybody else - I'm totally the same way, and would have done/have done that same thing, at Disney, and other places. And you know what? Somebody like you that does something like that, with just that motive, and in just that frame of mind and "voice" is somebody I say/think DESERVES some "pixie dust", and I'm happy for you, and happy to hear about it. Good for you - enjoy - so - what did you pick?

 

[Vernie822]

Good for you, Vernie - you're very much like me int that respect - just wanted to beard and validated, and/or didn't want it to happen to anybody else - I'm totally the same way, and would have done/have done that same thing, at Disney, and other places. And you know what? Somebody like you that does something like that, with just that motive, and in just that frame of mind and "voice" is somebody I say/think DESERVES some "pixie dust", and I'm happy for you, and happy to hear about it. Good for you - enjoy - so - what did you pick?

Thank you! We chose the Ferrytale Wishes Dessert Party. I'm not big on Star Wars (gasp) and we thought the Ferrytale cruise sounded fun.

 

[SorcererHeidi]

Thank you! We chose the Ferrytale Wishes Dessert Party. I'm not big on Star Wars (gasp) and we thought the Ferrytale cruise sounded fun.

Awesome - would love to hear about it when you come back (if you post it on the Dining Reviews Forum, let me know, since I do lurk there) - FairyTale Wishes is the one where you get desserts on the MK ferry during Wishes, right? (I've done the dessert party outside Tomorrowland Terrace, which was just called Wishes Dessert Party, I think - about 4 years ago). And I'm not a Star Wars fan either, so, good choice!!

 

[EastYorkDisneyFan]

They did the same thing with the seven dwarfs mine train. Opened it for the media but waited for almost a month for the general public to begin soft openings.