Park Themes

[YoHo]

Kay guys, After reading a couple of threads I've noticed a trend has devloped that is a debasment of the parks themes.
For instance, MGM is no longer Hollywood as it never was and always will be, it is now, the park for the grownup and live action rides.
Epcot is no longer a World's fair atmosphere and is instead the palce where the simulator rides go. Magic kingdom is the kiddiepark, not a realm of fantasy and imagination.

Why do we talk about the parks in such simple terms? why has Disney allowed this to happen?

Alien Encounter doesn't not fit in MK because it's too scarry. It doesn't fit, because the theme is retro future and AE isn't that. Buzz doesn't fit Either. AE isn't about any movie or television or music related them. It has no buisness in MGM... Of course, DL throws you for a Loop. Star Tours has nothing to do with Retro future either unless you accept that Lucas was strongly influenced by Flash Gorden Serials and so Star Wars is a modern retro future thing. Indiana Jones however fits perfectly in Adventureland, because Indiana Jones is a syntesis of everything that Walt wanted Adventureland to be about. They are at their root the same thing.


What do you all think?

 

[KNWVIKING]

I don't feel Epcotis the World of Simulators - at least not yet - simply because of M:S. Other then Body Wars, what other simulator is there ?

AE and Tomorrowland weren't a terrible fit IMO. The rides in TL weren't based on movies and neither was AE. L&S on the otherhand is another story. Yes, Buzz is based on a movie but if I had to pick a "Land" for it, TL would be my choice. Is MGM a better option for it ? Possibly, but it doesn't offend me where it's at.

I'm not sure what the original intent of MGM was, but in some regard it's the most family friendly park there is, a little something for everyone. Great shows, two great thrill rides, couple kick back and relax types. Well themed walkways and restaurants. Only thing really out of place is that %^&# hat.

Maybe I'm missing the point you're trying to make. Oh well, back to the real world.

 

[YoHo]

My point is that the "Themes" for the park have gone from thoughtfully inspired to synergy run amok. AE and even Stitch should not exist. They both violate the theme of the land they are in. Stitch exists, because there is a spreadsheet that says they need more stitch in the park. That isn't the way it's supposed to work. MGM was supposed to be about old Hollywood, the movies, a romantic look at how entertainment is produced. instead it's the world of cross promtion starring every and any program Disney is currently trying to sell. As for Epcot, Test Track isn't a very good fit either. It isn't about simulations. Simulations are fine. It's supposed to be about innovation and imagination. technology of the future and World Showcase is supposed to highlight the contributions of world culture.

Instead, we're getting What a test dummy goes through which is I suppose informative, but hardly looking to the future or showcasing innovation.
Body Wars at least takes a futuristic approach to the subject. M:S actually isn't so bad in context. I've heard that it isn't all that it could be, but I haven't made it to Florida to see what it IS, so I won't comment on that.

I feel that across the park, Theme is being subverted for synergy and that makes me mad.

 

[KNWVIKING]

Hollywood is about movies,music and over the top shows. RnRRC and ToT may be stretching the envelope a bit, but i don't see it as synergy being subverted. I don't see a "money grab" link to those rides other then as a way to entice people into the park, which is a good thing.

 

[OnWithTheShow]

I really do not see how any of the Future World attractions of old could have entitled the name Future World. At best they offered brief glimpses of what the future would be like (with the exception of horizons). Spaceship Earth, World of Motion, Universe of Energe, Imagination, Living Seas, are all more expositions of the past or present than of the future. Mission Space is really the only future looking attraction left.

 

[YoHo]

It's not the E-tickets in MGM that are the problem.
It's the overpromotion of Disney assets. DL and MK have tons of ride outside fantasyland that have nothing to do with cross promoting another part of the company. WWTBAM is crosspromotion, Bear in the big blue house or whatever it is now? Voyage of the little mermaid? Why is that there? Heck, why are the muppets there? It's like they use a dartboard to pick where attractions go.

OWTS, history is important to this as well. most of classic Epcot Centertook a where we were, where we are, where we're going approach.

Can you honestly say the same about attractions like TT?

 

[exDS vet]

Star Tours fits perfectly in Tomorrowland at DL. After-all, it did not go retro future until 1998 and Star Tours was there long before that. But couldn't Star Wars the movie be considered "retro future" anyway. "A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away."

Or is Star Wars a "modern" film? If that's the case, it probably should not be at MGM, since it's only supposed to pay tribute to the classics. Hell, I just say move it to Main Street and forget about it. Wait. It's practically on Main St. at DL anyway.

 

[YoHo]

Like I said in my First post, Star Tours can fit and it IS a classic, a Modern classic. Star Wars is about Space Opera. Space Opera is what Tomorrowland redesign was all about.

 

[JIMINOCCHIO]

If all of these attractions don't "fit" where they are YoHo, where do you suggest they put them? Some constructive criticism here would be helpful. Maybe they should take out all the Fantasyland attractions and put them at MGM, they are all based on movies after all.

 

[Magix]

Originally posted by YoHo
Space Opera is what Tomorrowland redesign was all about.

 

[YoHo]

Originally posted by JIMINOCCHIO
If all of these attractions don't "fit" where they are YoHo, where do you suggest they put them? Some constructive criticism here would be helpful. Maybe they should take out all the Fantasyland attractions and put them at MGM, they are all based on movies after all.

Come on now. I'm talking about motivation and theory not about reality. If Disney had really cared, they wouldn't have built those rides in the first place. Not with those incorrect themes.


As for fantasyland, I'll take the hyperbole and treat it like it deserves.

In any case, I never said MK couldn't have Movie based rides. You've missed the point. You've completely missed the point.

MGM isn't The park where we put all the movie rides. That's dumb. MGM is the park ABOUT movies. The park about how movies are made, the park about Hollywood. That's completely different from Mk where it is about the fantasy that the movies create.
It's actually the coruption of 'MGM's theme that says put Fantasyland their. That's what would need to happen if we toook the current *******ization to its ubsurd and extream conclusion.





Magix,

Space opera is subgenre of science fiction that emphasizes romantic adventure, faster-than-light travel and space battles where the main storyline is interstellar conflict and character drama.

"Space opera" was originally a derogatory term, a variant of "horse opera" and "soap opera". Wilson Tucker suggested the term in 1941. It meant action-oriented tale of space adventure instead of "respectable" science fiction story that concentrated on effects of technological progress and inventions. However there is no sharp dividing line and many authors manage to combine the space adventure and the respectable elements, ensuring that the best written space opera is represented among the best of science fiction generally.

Space Opera as opposed to straight science fiction. Character driven stories. Serials. Buck Rogers, Star Wars. The technology is overlooked. It isn't explained. It merely is.

Tomorrowland is themed to early and mid 20th century SciFi which is very much in the Space Opera vein. It is about the adventure in space.
As such, Star Wars fits right in.

 

[OnWithTheShow]

The Studios opened with the theme of movies but it has grown into the theme of SHOW BUSINESS. That is its current theme. And everything there fits the theme actually the best of any of the parks except Animal Kingdom.

 

[YoHo]

Well, I would suggest that Showbiz is exactly what Hollywood as it never was and always will be means.

And I still disagree fundimentally. Showbiz isn't about look what were pushing out to your kids everymorning. Showbiz isn't about look at the only thing ABC has going for it.
These are the end results of Showbiz. Showbiz is about The hows of movie making. Yes, there is a lot in the Studios that "fits" but it is a loose fit, not a tight fit. DL and MK have traditionally been highly integrated Tight fit parks. Things are there for a reason and if they don't fit they don't go in. At least that's the way it used to be.

Also, don't forget that one of my initial concerns was the public preception. The Public preceives that MGM is where all the scary adult rides go. MK has kiddie rides. Can't have AE in MK, it's too Scary. Not, AE doesn't fit in with the THEME of tomorrowland. Which it doesn't.

 

[crusader]

DL and MK have traditionally been highly integrated Tight fit parks. Things are there for a reason and if they don't fit they don't go in. At least that's the way it used to be.

This is a major overstatement.

Never were the "themes" so critical to the attraction they put a straightjacket on installment and/or placement. Otherwise, "If You Had Wings" really wouldn't have been "housed" anywhere. The same goes for the Matterhorn and Small World.

AE fit just fine. As an "alien encounter", it either belonged at the Studios or in Tomorrowland where Sci-Fi attractions can be found.

 

[DisneyAddict_M]

You think too hard.

 

[YoHo]

Originally posted by DisneyAddict_M
You think too hard.

What can I say, I want to be an Imagineer when I grow up.





//I'm 30 days from 29 years old.

 

[OnWithTheShow]

Why is the Studios where all the scary adult rides go? They only have two attractions I would consider "intense" and hardly only for adults. And in the same time that they have added those two, they have added One Man's Dream, Playhouse Disney, Doug Live (came and went), Millionaire, and Fantasmic!. Two attractions hardly justifies the label. Mission Space, Everest, Alien Encounter, Primevel Whirl, Dinosaur, and Kali can all fit into the same category.

Again working in the Theatre industry I must agrue that it is part of Show Business to say otherwise is foolish. And as much as you think millionaire is just a synergy ploy it does give an inside look into how a television show is created. Lets break it down.

Rock and Roller Coaster - Music Industry
Tower of Terror - Television (celebrates the greatness of something non Disney)
Great Movie Ride - Film (many non Disney films)
Indiana Jones - Film (non Disney)
Star Tours - Film (non Disney)
Muppetvision - Film/Television (formerly non Disney)
Millionaire - Television
Little Mermaid - Film
Playhouse Disney - Television/Theatre (also helps balance your so called scary adult rides)
Sounds Dangerous - Television/Film (no Disney synergy)
Beauty and the Beast - Film/Theatre
Backlot Tour - Film
Haunted Mansion Sets - Film
Fantasmic - Theatre/Film

 

[YoHo]

It's just a refrain I hear around here and other Disney websites.
Alien encounter is scary, it should be in MGM, that's where the scary adult rides go. I agree it shouldn't be that way and maybe it isn't really that way, but there is a perception that it is that way and that's what I'm all on about. People THINK that MGM is where the more adult rides go, that it exists so there can be more adult rides.

Sounds Dangerous Stars Drew Carey, that's the synergy.
It used to star Chevy Chase, Martin Short and Steve Martin, you know, funny real actors. And that's my point, WWTBAM is a great attraction, you can't however tell me that they even had plans to add a TV gameshow type attraction till after WWTBAM made it big. That's synergy. Same with Playhouse Disney. There is plenty of other Theater tie-ins throughout the parks. This was a ploy at getting more kiddies to watch the show.

It's not about whether you can see a connection to entertainment making and therefore it fits. It's about intentions and goals. Many of these attractions were imagineered wrong.

We need to put in a big rollercoaster for the tweens, what's a good theme that fits?
Instead of we need to put in something that deals with music, how can we best tell this story?


There is an important and fundimental difference.