Language Learning

[Colleen27]

Did any of you try to pick up some basic/conversational Japanese before visiting TDR? What methods or programs have you been successful with? I know travelers can get by without any Japanese in Tokyo and most other cities/tourist areas, but since we're going to be doing some rural traveling and a bit of driving, I'd like to have some grasp of the language.

 

[kbmartin]

I haven't gone yet, but I felt that Duolingo was helpful. I did it for a couple of months and felt like I had picked up on some basic pieces. I definitely learned what sounds some of the Japanese characters stand for.

 

[Haley R]

Did any of you try to pick up some basic/conversational Japanese before visiting TDR? What methods or programs have you been successful with? I know travelers can get by without any Japanese in Tokyo and most other cities/tourist areas, but since we're going to be doing some rural traveling and a bit of driving, I'd like to have some grasp of the language.

We have been using Japanese pods 101. We paid 65% off of $10/month which came out to around $78 for the year and it’s the premium subscription. It’s probably way more in depth than we needed but Dh really wanted to learn Japanese. I really like my app called drops. It’s a lot more fun than duolingo because it’s almost all games. You do have to wait every so often for the energy to “reset”.

In all honesty, I don’t see us needing to know that much Japanese but we are glad we learned some. We can read all of the katana and hiragana symbols. Kanji is too hard because there are so many of them.

 

[gelatoni fan]

If your goal is simply to learn enough to travel, I recommend the "survival phrases" or "travel phrases" or w/e it's called series on Japanesepod101. If you think you'll actually learn the language properly, I think Japanese from Zero is good for beginners (lessons on youtube for free, textbook sold separately). Once you get familiar with the basics, Nihongonomori is the only good intermediate resource I have found. I found Duolingo too slow and Rosetta Stone even more obnoxiously slow.

With google translate, I don't think it's necessary to learn a language to get by even in the most rural of areas. Just type what you want and show the translation to people. The image recognition isn't as developed but you'll usually be able to understand the gist of things. Even if you rely on google translate, knowing some of the language can help you get more out of your experience in Japan.

That said, most English speakers vastly underestimate the amount of time it will take them to learn Japanese. According to the Japanese Language Education Center, after 600 hours of study a student should be able to understand "typical expressions and sentences" and after 1000 hours should be able to "comprehend conversations encountered in daily life and generally follow their contents, provided that they are spoken slowly". For comparison, 600 hours is what the US Foreign Service Institute considers necessary to have "general professional proficiency" in French and be able to take a college program taught entirely in French.

 

[Agent 86]

This is the extent of my language skills: https://tdrexplorer.com/17-basic-japanese-phrases-for-tokyo-disney-resort/

Maybe supplemented with: https://tdrexplorer.com/20-japanese-phrases-for-dining-at-tokyo-disney-resort/

TDR Explorer recommends: https://tdrexplorer.com/50-easy-japanese-words-tokyo-disneyland/

The few times we've had local guides in Japan, they've mentioned than many Japanese people do understand English. But, they're often reticent to "speak" English because they're concerned they'll make mistakes and it won't be looked upon favourably by a native English speaker. Basically, we generally manage with the beginner phrases and a combination of English, gestures / movements and pointing at pictures / photos.

 

[OldSchoolReasons]

I learnt beginners Japanese - i.e basic phrases including numbers up to the thousands, transportation phrases, shopping, time of day, ordering at a restaurant, greetings, hotel phrases, directions, money phrases, questions. I took 18 months roughly, and I used a Spotify playlsit where you repeat the phrases until they stick (artist is Henry Raymond Jr.). I had really good feedback from it, with several people complimenting me (and oddly my partner) on my elocution. Japanese people speak very good American English, occasionally in a US accent (which I found odd as a Brit haha) and will also correct your Japanese - I had a barman explain I was asking for a "Cylindrical container i.e. cup" of beer when I wanted a bottle.

I'm doing the same for my China trip but am finding Mandarin much harder.

 

[MKTokyo]

I will say I think it's impossible to achieve fluency without full immersion. The language is too situational with too many nuances & levels of politeness. You can't learn that online or in a classroom.

But, I don't think you want to take it that far & any combination of Google Translate, basic phrases, Duolingo etc will be fine. Nobody is going to expect you to speak a single word of Japanese & if you can haltingly say "hello" to someone, they will be delighted, and tell you how good your Japanese is. They will then immediately switch to English (if they can) to save everyone the trouble of you stumbling around with Japanese.

This extends to you doing basically anything "correctly," such as using chopsticks. Any effort at all is appreciated.

I don't know where you're going when you say "rural" but it's incredibly unlikely that as a tourist, you would be visiting a place where you cannot get by with English & Google Translate.

 

[Colleen27]

Thanks all! I do have a semester of college Japanese under my belt (using the textbook TDRExplorer recommends, actually), so the very basics like on the TDRExplorer list I do know and I know the hiragana and most of the katakana characters. And I've spent a bit of time on Duolingo but struggle with its pace and my attention span.

@Haley R Drops is fun! Thanks for the tip. I downloaded it last night and really like the format.

@gelatoni fan I would like to learn the language properly, at least to a conversational level. I'll have to look into Nihongonomori because I agree with you about Duolingo being slow. My kids' elem uses it for their world languages class and my 10yo likes the pacing, but I get bored with the repetition. Though I do like that it introduces more kanji than other apps I've tried.

@OldSchoolReasons I wouldn't ever have thought to look at Spotify. I'll have to check that out.

@MKTokyo My daughter's second host family from her summer exchange lives in a small town in Shimane prefecture, and we're going to be spending a chunk of our time in Japan there. It is rural enough that driving is a must, and some of the places she wants to show us seem like they're pretty off the beaten path. She probably speaks more than enough Japanese herself to get us by, and we're probably going to have her host mother and/or siblings with us for some of the outings, but I'd like to have a bit of the language myself just in case.

I find it fascinating anyway, so the challenge of learning and the time I've spent on it so far is enjoyable.

 

[gelatoni fan]

You should ask your daughter how much the local places use the local dialect vs. standard Japanese that you would see in most textbooks. I'm somewhere between N3 and N2 level and find Hiroshima dialect fairly intelligible but I cannot understand Izumo dialect at all. Obviously, it'll help if you look foreign but from my friend who did JET in rural Iwate, a lot of older people don't realize that some of their common words are not standard Japanese.

 

[Colleen27]

You should ask your daughter how much the local places use the local dialect vs. standard Japanese that you would see in most textbooks. I'm somewhere between N3 and N2 level and find Hiroshima dialect fairly intelligible but I cannot understand Izumo dialect at all. Obviously, it'll help if you look foreign but from my friend who did JET in rural Iwate, a lot of older people don't realize that some of their common words are not standard Japanese.

DD said that she did notice a different dialect used when they went to the northern part of the prefecture to visit Izumo-taisha, but that where she stayed in Gotsu, in the southern part of the prefecture, even the older generations who had no English at all used fairly standard Japanese.

On the bright side, we will definitely look foreign - Americans of Irish descent, two redheads and a blonde - so people will know right away not to expect much of our Japanese skills.

 

[afan]

That said, most English speakers vastly underestimate the amount of time it will take them to learn Japanese. According to the Japanese Language Education Center, after 600 hours of study a student should be able to understand "typical expressions and sentences" and after 1000 hours should be able to "comprehend conversations encountered in daily life and generally follow their contents, provided that they are spoken slowly". For comparison, 600 hours is what the US Foreign Service Institute considers necessary to have "general professional proficiency" in French and be able to take a college program taught entirely in French.

I took 2 years of Japanese in high school and a semester in college. Most of the college semester was a repeat. The reason it takes so much longer, aside from the various alphabets is you learn Japanese differently than French or Spanish because you have to learn the verbs and all the different ways they end, tenses, negative, question etc. I don't think we learned how to ask where the bathroom is until sometime into the 2nd year. While I don't remember a ton, since it was over 20 years ago, I think I could get by now but will definitely do some refreshing before we go in a couple of years.

 

[SeanSD]

Just refreshing an old post if anyone has new tips. Have started watching TDR Explorer vids for phrases (and his shirts lol). And just downloaded Drops. Thanks!

 

[nono]

Just refreshing an old post if anyone has new tips. Have started watching TDR Explorer vids for phrases (and his shirts lol). And just downloaded Drops. Thanks!

I use as many methods as possible. Duolingo & First 1000 Words in Japanese for vocabulary, Japanese Handwriting Workbooks because it has dramatically helped my reading, YouTube for Japanese language videos, Genki Textbooks, YouTubers whose shows are in Japanese, Japanese shows on Netflix, and cheap reading books that are for 4/5 year olds.

 

[ZSNO]

If you have limited time, and want to learn how to read at least a little, would recommend learning katakana. Almost everything written in katakana is just English words in Japanese characters so you can sound it out and figure out the English.

 

[dcasea]

If you've studied it formally, you will be surprised at how much comes back. I had 4 years in high school and a year in college, forgot most of it, but then when I have gone it all kind of comes back - unfortunately just about when I'm headed home.

 

[dunkindonut]

Bunpro and kanji study are great apps to aid with learning Japanese. There's plenty of online resources for Japanese though