I need some advice - ebay and pins

[enchantingodin]

I just bought 4 pins off of langdonnicholas on ebay. His starting bids were only a penny. But he wanted $4 to ship. Ok fine. I've seen many other sellers do something similar to this. Usually it's $3 for the first pin $1 for each additional pin. No problem.

I asked for a combined invoice with my shipping discount once the auctions were over. Revived an invoice for $16.04 and got a note back saying, "I don't offer a combined shipping on disney pins."

So I sent him a note back saying, "May I ask why not? I won't coast you $16 to ship these to me. Maybe $5 at most. You should really post this in your auctions. I feel like I'm being taken advantage of..."

The seller then resent my invoice to 14.04. Really?

I feel this is still WAY too high of a shipping charge. I don't feel like I'm being unreasonable. And I am unwilling to pay such an exorbitant price. Can I ask him to just go ahead and re-list his items? What would you do?

 

[Broncobilly83]

So he is trying to charge $16.04 ($14.04 resent) for shipping? Then I really really hope he is sending it express since Priority for 4 pins would be $5-$6 tops if regular Priority is used, and $4.95 if it fits flat rate small. First class is usually $1.50-$2

You might ask him how he is going to ship, and if you still want the pins, and he is charging 300%+ of what shipping actually costs, you might want to alert E-Bay to it, as they do allow for small overages for things like ink, labels, boxes, packing, etc, but not $16 for an item that should be $2-$5 to ship on average.

 

[Spiffie]

So he is trying to charge $16.04 ($14.04 resent) for shipping? Then I really really hope he is sending it express since Priority for 4 pins would be $5-$6 tops if regular Priority is used, and $4.95 if it fits flat rate small. First class is usually $1.50-$2

You might ask him how he is going to ship, and if you still want the pins, and he is charging 300%+ of what shipping actually costs, you might want to alert E-Bay to it, as they do allow for small overages for things like ink, labels, boxes, packing, etc, but not $16 for an item that should be $2-$5 to ship on average.

While I agree that it is too much to pay, his listings didn't indicate that he offered combined shipping, so I am not sure what could be done. I am not sure about eBay policy but I wonder what they will do because they can't MAKE him offer combined shipping.

Best of luck finding a solution. Keep us posted! At least we are aware of his name and how he does business.

 

[enchantingodin]

So he is trying to charge $16.04 ($14.04 resent) for shipping? Then I really really hope he is sending it express since Priority for 4 pins would be $5-$6 tops if regular Priority is used, and $4.95 if it fits flat rate small. First class is usually $1.50-$2

You might ask him how he is going to ship, and if you still want the pins, and he is charging 300%+ of what shipping actually costs, you might want to alert E-Bay to it, as they do allow for small overages for things like ink, labels, boxes, packing, etc, but not $16 for an item that should be $2-$5 to ship on average.

Well kinda - the starting bid for his pins was 1 cent. I won 4 of them at a penny since no one else had bid. So he wanted $16 (then $14) to ship the normal sized pins using "Standard Flat Rate Shipping Service". To me that is just outrageous. Where should I report this to on ebay? I kinda did a little hunting around on the site earlier and didn't find what I was looking for...

While I agree that it is too much to pay, his listings didn't indicate that he offered combined shipping, so I am not sure what could be done. I am not sure about eBay policy but I wonder what they will do because they can't MAKE him offer combined shipping.

Best of luck finding a solution. Keep us posted! At least we are aware of his name and how he does business.

I will. I'm thinking of emailing him in the morning after my anger over the situation has subsided some and tell him thanks, but no thanks.

 

[Ashton7]

I had a look at some of his prior listings for pins. Nowhere does he say that he will combine shipping. So, hopefully, lesson learned, yes? If the auction doesn't say the seller will combine shipping and you are interested in bidding on more than one item, simply send them a question before buying and ask if they will combine shipping on multiple purchases.

Ebay can not and will not force your seller to combine the shipping for you. The seller is under no obligation to combine the shipping for you. You made a contract to buy the items at the seller's price for the item and shipping when you bid on them and the sad fact is that if you want to back out of the sale, the seller can now file with Ebay against YOU. If you don't pay, Ebay will put "strikes" on your account.

What it comes down to in this situation is that the seller is charging $4.01 per pin. He could have just as easily priced the pins at $2 and shipping $2. Or the pins at $1 and the shipping at $3. So on and so forth. The bottom line is, he's expecting to get $4 per pin. Surely no one expects that a seller on Ebay could possibly sell a pin for a penny and then charge *actual shipping* and stay in business? There are set Ebay fees for just listing the item that come to more than a penny, not to mention the commissions and Paypal fees. In some cases, Ebay considers selling an item really cheap only to charge large shipping fees as "fee avoidance" on the part of the seller. In this case, I doubt they will do so since $4 is a) a small amount and b) not outside the realm of reason for a shipping and handling charge. There are sellers on Amazon who will sell books for a penny but the shipping charge is a set $3.99 per transaction and collected by Amazon as a shipping and handling charge. The only way those sellers make any money at all on the transaction is by sending the books at media rate and pocketing a buck or two as the handling charge.

I don't know what's happened with your situation in the last few days but if you haven't already done so, you could try asking the seller to let you do a mutual cancellation of the transaction.

 

[Broncobilly83]

Ebay can not and will not force your seller to combine the shipping for you. The seller is under no obligation to combine the shipping for you. You made a contract to buy the items at the seller's price for the item and shipping when you bid on them and the sad fact is that if you want to back out of the sale, the seller can now file with Ebay against YOU. If you don't pay, Ebay will put "strikes" on your account.

What it comes down to in this situation is that the seller is charging $4.01 per pin. He could have just as easily priced the pins at $2 and shipping $2. Or the pins at $1 and the shipping at $3. So on and so forth. The bottom line is, he's expecting to get $4 per pin. Surely no one expects that a seller on Ebay could possibly sell a pin for a penny and then charge *actual shipping* and stay in business? There are set Ebay fees for just listing the item that come to more than a penny, not to mention the commissions and Paypal fees. In some cases, Ebay considers selling an item really cheap only to charge large shipping fees as "fee avoidance" on the part of the seller. In this case, I doubt they will do so since $4 is a) a small amount and b) not outside the realm of reason for a shipping and handling charge. There are sellers on Amazon who will sell books for a penny but the shipping charge is a set $3.99 per transaction and collected by Amazon as a shipping and handling charge. The only way those sellers make any money at all on the transaction is by sending the books at media rate and pocketing a buck or two as the handling charge.

You are correct, however, then E-Bay will expect it to be shipped in 4 different packages since combined shipping was not utilized. E-Bay is pretty strict about this, regardless of the dollar amount, as they realize that people are avoiding their fees because of this.

 

[Ashton7]

Actually, Ebay will not require the package(s) to be shipped separately. They have nothing to say about it. Paypal, however, can be a problem ... but only if the package goes missing and delivery confirmation can't be provided. Here's the problem with that situation ... if the seller puts everything into one package, ships it and has delivery confirmation and that delivery confirmation shows it was delivered, the buyer could claim that they only received one package and that, that package didn't contain everything they ordered. But if it truly did contain everything they ordered, then they'd be lying. Since the seller has indicated right upfront that they don't intend to offer combined shipping and the buyer chose to buy with full knowledge of the fees in question, I think that I, personally, would say it was morally wrong for the buyer to then try to scam free product by lying and saying they didn't receive something. And that's really the only way that Paypal would get involved in *that* dispute.

Just my opinion, but if something is evident and disclosed whether it be on Ebay or elsewhere, I believe that the buyer should take personal responsibility for having read the terms of the sale.

 

[Ashton7]

You are correct, however, then E-Bay will expect it to be shipped in 4 different packages since combined shipping was not utilized. E-Bay is pretty strict about this, regardless of the dollar amount, as they realize that people are avoiding their fees because of this.

Let me add that, as I said before, Ebay is not going to consider a postage charge of $4 per item "fee avoidance." If the seller were charging $50 per item for a lightweight pin or even $20, they would probably look into it. $4? Priority shipping, no matter the weight, would cost $4.90 at pure cost with no handling fee. Even first class shipping with delivery confirmation (which is required by Paypal) is going to cost close to $2 so a $2 handling fee would not be considered out of line at all.

 

[Broncobilly83]

Let me add that, as I said before, Ebay is not going to consider a postage charge of $4 per item "fee avoidance." If the seller were charging $50 per item for a lightweight pin or even $20, they would probably look into it. $4? Priority shipping, no matter the weight, would cost $4.90 at pure cost with no handling fee. Even first class shipping with delivery confirmation (which is required by Paypal) is going to cost close to $2 so a $2 handling fee would not be considered out of line at all.

True, $4.00 on a $2.00 package does not seem a lot, but if the buyer was charged $16.00 for shipping for 4 auctions, and then the seller combined the auctions for a $2.00 package, that is $14.00 E-Bay did not charge fees on. A Seller does that on say 50 buyers of 4 auctions each in a month, like the OP, and that is $700 worth of "Income" that E-Bay did not get to charge fees on.

No, E-Bay might not catch it, but if buyers point it out to E-Bay, they will then start looking into that.

 

[enchantingodin]

An update:

After the $14 invoice I sent him another email, "I'm sorry but $14 is still an outrageous price to pay to have 4 pins shipped to me. If I would have know that I would have never wasted either of our time and bid. I had purchased these for traders in the parks, since I thought I was gonna end up paying around $7 ($4 for the first $1 for each additional like most sellers do) to have them shipped. So I have no real attachment to them. If you do not wish to come down on the shipping fees, then please go ahead an re-list the items. Again I would encourage you to clearly state in your auctions that you do not combine shipping in the future. As it is the norm on ebay, and every other seller I have dealt with does. I Hope we can work this out so we both end up happy."

I got an email back from him a few minutes later that said, "Unfortunately I will have to issue non paying bidder strikes against you. Here is why, because there are all kinds of fees that I pay even if you don't. As the buyer it is your responsibility to understand the details of the auction before bidding."

This to be honest pissed me off BIG time. How many fees is he actually gonna end up paying if the item only sold for 1 cent? **fumes** I mean I get it - he's trying to avoid fees by charging higher shipping. Most other sellers charge a 1.50 - 3.00 range. With the average at I'd say 2.50. And if this was for one pin... well maybe ok. But for 4 pins combined in a package. I don't think so. Ebay does actually have rules about charging unreasonable fees for shipping. Because, of course, this means they don't get their cut if people do this.

So I email him back with, "Since you are unwilling to compromise I have contacted ebay. Again - I hope we can work this out so we are both happy."

I then got on ebay's live chat. Huge waste of time. I'm not sure WHO or more importantly WHERE ebay is hiring people, but it is OH so obvious that English is not their first language.

The live chat agent directed me to the "my account has been suspended and I need more info" email link... ok...? The email I sent them was as follows,

"I was directed to this page by Allwyn C. via live chat. My
account has not been suspended. But there seems to be no other way to
contact the ebay team for my particular problem.

I have recently purchased 4 disney pins from the seller langdonnicholas.
I asked for a combined shipping total. The seller refused stating he
does not combine shipping. He is attempting to charge me $16 for a
package the will ship for less than $5. I thought it was against ebay
rules to "to charge unreasonable fees". I have contacted him several
times and he is unwilling to compromise on the shipping price. Please
Help."

The next day I got 4 requests to cancel the items from the seller. Imagine my shock... /sarcasm

But the best part I must admit is the response I got from ebay... If anyone can translate the underlined part for me - that'd be great.

"Thank you for contacting eBay. To better serve our members, we're
changing the way we work with you when you have a question. If the information below doesn't answer your question, a Customer
Service agent can assist you more quickly by chatting with you online.
To chat with an agent about this issue, go to ..... (website)
To ask a different question, go to..... (website)

If you think the seller will not go ahead and work out for you as a
buyer of the item of course you are on the right position to request for
a combined shipping. you can go ahead and report the item first for that.

If you need further assistance, please don't hesitate to reply to this
email and let us know.

Ummm - WHAT?

But I'm kinda 'whatever' about it now. He was trying to skirt the system. And got caught by someone who won't back down. I have learned that while there is a standard that doesn't mean everyone follows it. And he has learned... nothing it seems. Since I had a peak at a few of his items today and looks like he's still doing the same thing.

 

[DizneyDogs]

since the seller has offered to cancel the auctions you have no obligation to pay now if you agree. However you do still have the option if you cancel teh transactions to leave feedback in this case warning other buyers of his tactics as a negative or neutral comment as you so choose

 

[Spiffie]

since the seller has offered to cancel the auctions you have no obligation to pay now if you agree. However you do still have the option if you cancel teh transactions to leave feedback in this case warning other buyers of his tactics as a negative or neutral comment as you so choose

Seriously?? Leave negative feedback for what? Because he doesn't offer combined shipping? It is not like he offered it and then wouldn't allow it. He doesn't offer combined shipping! In my opinion, the buyer is the flake here. The buyer wants out of transactions which they did not thoroughly read the description of before bidding!

I am not an eBay seller, so I have nothing to lose or gain in these practices, but to file a complaint against someone because they won't do what YOU want is ridiculous!

 

[LuvSulley]

Seriously?? Leave negative feedback for what? Because he doesn't offer combined shipping? It is not like he offered it and then wouldn't allow it. He doesn't offer combined shipping! In my opinion, the buyer is the flake here. The buyer wants out of transactions which they did not thoroughly read the description of before bidding!

I am not an eBay seller, so I have nothing to lose or gain in these practices, but to file a complaint against someone because they won't do what YOU want is ridiculous!

I agree. The seller doesn't deserve a negative. A PP said that the seller didn't say he combined shipping on his listings. By placing a bid, you agreed to his terms and shipping charges. Even if his shipping was ridiculously high, you were wrong to try to get him to lower his shipping after the fact. If you thought shipping was too high, you shouldn't have placed a bid or asked before bidding if he combined shipping.

 

[enchantingodin]

since the seller has offered to cancel the auctions you have no obligation to pay now if you agree. However you do still have the option if you cancel teh transactions to leave feedback in this case warning other buyers of his tactics as a negative or neutral comment as you so choose

Thank you for telling me - I didn't know that. I'll think about how I should proceed...

Seriously?? Leave negative feedback for what? Because he doesn't offer combined shipping? It is not like he offered it and then wouldn't allow it. He doesn't offer combined shipping! In my opinion, the buyer is the flake here. The buyer wants out of transactions which they did not thoroughly read the description of before bidding!

I am not an eBay seller, so I have nothing to lose or gain in these practices, but to file a complaint against someone because they won't do what YOU want is ridiculous!

I agree. The seller doesn't deserve a negative. A PP said that the seller didn't say he combined shipping on his listings. By placing a bid, you agreed to his terms and shipping charges. Even if his shipping was ridiculously high, you were wrong to try to get him to lower his shipping after the fact. If you thought shipping was too high, you shouldn't have placed a bid or asked before bidding if he combined shipping.

Ebay has a policy on overcharging for shipping. Doesn't really matter if either of you agree or not. I knew I would easily win this since the seller is obviously trying to avoid paying fees by jacking up his shipping price. So please, Spiffie, call me some more names. It shows how classy you are.

In the end what he was doing was against ebays rules. Thus I won. Have a great day!

 

[Spiffie]

Thank you for telling me - I didn't know that. I'll think about how I should proceed...





Ebay has a policy on overcharging for shipping. Doesn't really matter if either of you agree or not. I knew I would easily win this since the seller is obviously trying to avoid paying fees by jacking up his shipping price. So please, Spiffie, call me some more names. It shows how classy you are.

In the end what he was doing was against ebays rules. Thus I won. Have a great day!

Let's see, YOU back out on FOUR eBay purchases for which you clearly did NOT read. I said that made you a flake. You said I called you names and I should call you some more because it shows how classy I am. Hmm. My class is not the one in question here! Laughable!

As an experiment, why don't you go purchase a bubble envelope and place a reasonable sized pin in it. Take it to the post office and mail it first class with delivery confirmation. Figure in the cost of your gas to and from the post office and see what figure you come up with. Now, since your seller does not combine shipping, I would have expected 4 envelopes. And IF he happened to send you 4 pins in one envelope, THEN you would have had a reason to file a complaint because you didn't get what you paid for. But since you never got that far, you won't know, will you?

And, now, you have a great day, too!

 

[enchantingodin]

Let's see, YOU back out on FOUR eBay purchases for which you clearly did NOT read. I said that made you a flake. You said I called you names and I should call you some more because it shows how classy I am. Hmm. My class is not the one in question here! Laughable!

As an experiment, why don't you go purchase a bubble envelope and place a reasonable sized pin in it. Take it to the post office and mail it first class with delivery confirmation. Figure in the cost of your gas to and from the post office and see what figure you come up with. Now, since your seller does not combine shipping, I would have expected 4 envelopes. And IF he happened to send you 4 pins in one envelope, THEN you would have had a reason to file a complaint because you didn't get what you paid for. But since you never got that far, you won't know, will you?

And, now, you have a great day, too!

I DID read the listing. Wanna know what it said? "Disney pin" Yep - that's it.

I wouldn't have backed out if the seller had acted reasonably. That means the seller would do what anyone else would do. Pack the items into ONE envelope and sent it to me. Which AGAIN ebay agreed with me about. And as a FYI - The USPS have ones that they give you for FREE and have a flat rate shipping coast of $4.90 up to 4lbs, which includes a tracking number. So, ok, to be fair lets add another dollar for the coast of getting it to the post office. $6 vs $16 is a big fat $10 profit. None of which ebay sees because the seller has decided to do things in a back handed manner to avoid fees.

The funniest part though is how you agreed with me in your first post, then all the sudden changed your mind after another poster let me know that I could still leave feedback as I saw fit. And I'm the flake?

 

[Spiffie]

I DID read the listing. Wanna know what it said? "Disney pin" Yep - that's it.

I wouldn't have backed out if the seller had acted reasonably. That means the seller would do what anyone else would do. Pack the items into ONE envelope and sent it to me. Which AGAIN ebay agreed with me about. And as a FYI - The USPS have ones that they give you for FREE and have a flat rate shipping coast of $4.90 up to 4lbs, which includes a tracking number. So, ok, to be fair lets add another dollar for the coast of getting it to the post office. $6 vs $16 is a big fat $10 profit. None of which ebay sees because the seller has decided to do things in a back handed manner to avoid fees.

The funniest part though is how you agreed with me in your first post, then all the sudden changed your mind after another poster let me know that I could still leave feedback as I saw fit. And I'm the flake?

Yes, I AGREED that $16 was too much to pay to have 4 pins shipped. I DID NOT AGREE, however, that the seller should HAVE to combine shipping OR offer to allow you out of the purchase. The seller did not advertise combined shipping, so I think you should have chalked it up to a lesson learned. I DO NOT think you should leave NEGATIVE feedback because the seller wouldn't give you something YOU thought YOU should get. I will say AGAIN that I am not an eBay seller. I am a buyer though, and I have learned my share of lessons from not asking questions before I bid on an item. But I have NEVER asked a seller to change or alter their listing whether it be price, shipping,etc. And I will say AGAIN, that IF you received a combined package, THEN I would have asked for a partial shipping refund and/or filed a complaint with eBay. I DO think if the seller is charging you for individual shipping, you should get individual packages.

Hopefully, you are no longer

 

[enchantingodin]

Yes, I AGREED that $16 was too much to pay to have 4 pins shipped. I DID NOT AGREE, however, that the seller should HAVE to combine shipping OR offer to allow you out of the purchase. The seller did not advertise combined shipping, so I think you should have chalked it up to a lesson learned. I DO NOT think you should leave NEGATIVE feedback because the seller wouldn't give you something YOU thought YOU should get. I will say AGAIN that I am not an eBay seller. I am a buyer though, and I have learned my share of lessons from not asking questions before I bid on an item. But I have NEVER asked a seller to change or alter their listing whether it be price, shipping,etc. And I will say AGAIN, that IF you received a combined package, THEN I would have asked for a partial shipping refund and/or filed a complaint with eBay. I DO think if the seller is charging you for individual shipping, you should get individual packages.

Hopefully, you are no longer

I've not . But I think you are. I NEVER said I was going to leave him negative feedback. Nor did the PP tell me I should. They simply let me know that even though the auction was canceled I still COULD leave feedback as I saw fit.

And AGAIN not only I "thought I should get" combined shipping - but so did ebay. Because they, like me, really don't know why anyone would send 4 separate packages. It makes NO SENSE at all. Who does that?

So really I'm not even sure why you're still arguing with me about it. Ebay says I'm in the right and he's in the wrong. Plain. Simple. DONE!

 

[Broncobilly83]

Actually in all likeliness, you would not be able to leave feedback if the seller did indeed cancel the auction via E-Bay and requested a final credit fee, since once a seller does that, whether it was a mutual cancellation or a non paying bidder, the ability for the buyer to leave feedback should be blocked out by E-Bay.

 

[Ashton7]

I've not . But I think you are. I NEVER said I was going to leave him negative feedback. Nor did the PP tell me I should. They simply let me know that even though the auction was canceled I still COULD leave feedback as I saw fit.

And AGAIN not only I "thought I should get" combined shipping - but so did ebay. Because they, like me, really don't know why anyone would send 4 separate packages. It makes NO SENSE at all. Who does that?

So really I'm not even sure why you're still arguing with me about it. Ebay says I'm in the right and he's in the wrong. Plain. Simple. DONE!

You seem much more interested in being "right" and everyone else being "wrong" than anything else. I'm sorry, but you are indeed "wrong" that Ebay would agree that the seller should combine the shipping. I have been selling on Ebay since 1998. I am a Top Rated Seller. I do combine shipping and I absolutely agree with you that the seller should have done so and that $16 is an outrageous amount to have to pay for the shipment of four pins that could be sent in a padded envelope first class -- even with cost of supplies, the amount for shipping and handling should be $3-4 or so. Total.

However, what I tried to point out to you earlier and others have tried to explain as well, is that the seller in question has his own policies. He did not offer combined shipping in the auction and on Ebay you are dealing with individual sellers. Ebay is not Amazon. Ebay is, as they like to say, "just a venue." They cannot and will not force a seller to combine shipping, for instance. Sellers are free to set their own shipping rates and shipping policies. The only thing Ebay cares about is fee avoidance -- they aren't trying to protect YOU the buyer in that instance, but themselves. And they aren't going to give a flying flip if a seller is charging $4 shipping.

You're lucky the seller agreed to cancel the sales for you instead of hitting you with four unpaid item disputes. As others have said, chalk it up to a lesson learned and next time if there is any doubt, ask questions before bidding. You might also want to just have a look at their feedback if you aren't sure about the seller. This guy has really low DSR's for shipping fees which would have told you something right there. I don't blame you for being disappointed or upset that the pins you thought were a great deal, really weren't -- I don't think anyone does.