I did something stupid.....

Discussion in 'runDisney' started by mtnmjd, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. mtnmjd

    mtnmjd Earning My Ears

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    Fresh off our Dopey high, fueled by a few Blood Orange Margaritas and a couple Tipsy Ducks.....two friends and I signed up for a 50 miler. :worried:

    Now after doing a bit of thinking, I feel our alcohol induced bravado may have gotten us in over our heads.

    Any tips for a bunch of first timers? Longest run? Miles per week? Drop bag contents?
    At least this event has a generous 24hr time limit, which gives me confidence we will finish....but at what expense to our bodies.
     
  2. garneska

    garneska DIS Veteran

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    When is your race? Is it road or trail? Obviously you just did dopey so if you are not hurting should not be an issue.

    I have a 50k in two weeks, only issue is I got sick this past week so no running this week since the marathon but I should be ok it’s trail. @camaker he is running 50 mile road race in feb so he might be able to help. Also @FFigawi and @BikeFan they have ultra experience to help with training. All I got is good luck!
     
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  4. OldSlowGoofyGuy

    OldSlowGoofyGuy DIS Veteran

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    I'm certainly not an expert, as I only have one 50 miler under my belt. Mine was a spur of the moment decision about a month before the race.

    Before signing up, my training was in the 30-35 mile range, with long runs in the 12 mile range. In the weeks leading up to the 50M, I did 52, 65, 77, 52, 45. Long runs were 15, 23, 30, with 20 the next day, and 12.

    I also did a lot of walking, not included in those totals. To me the important things were: time on your feet, practice run/walk intervals, practice slow pace, and practice your nutrition. Since you're going slower, your body is burning fat rather than carbs. I used half turkey and jelly sandwiches, with a touch of ginger for its anti nausea properties, washed down with plain old Gatorade. I know: it sounds disgusting, but it worked for me.

    I started off running 8 minutes (or 10, not sure) and walking 2 minutes. I quickly realized it made more sense to always walk the hills even if it wasn't time. I ended up walking most of the last 12 miles, running whenever I could.

    Tips: go SLOW! Walk before you need to and eat before you're hungry.

    My experience won't be much help on the drop bag. My 50M had a nice format: 6.5 mile loops, meaning every 6.5 miles you were back at the aid station and your car. I had so much gear, it looks like a family of 4 was camping. I changed socks, shirts, and hats at some point. I had plenty of Body Glide, sunscreen, and chap stick.

    I finished in 11:36:##. My weak link was my feet. Legs felt OK, stomach felt OK, mind was OK, feet wanted to stop. I had one small blister that I was able to pop. My foot problems were not friction related; they just hurt. I ended up with about 4 black toes and lost a big toenail a couple of weeks later. Until the 50M, I never had toenail problems. I suspect my feet swelled from all that time upright and started banging against my shoes. The next day, I felt better than after a marathon.

    (Edited to clarify foot problems.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2019
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  5. camaker

    camaker Anything worth doing is worth overdoing

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    I don’t know that I can add too much meaningful to the discussion, as my race isn’t until next weekend and I’m far from confident in how it’s going to go. My intention is not really to race it, but to slow down and just focus on finishing.

    I’m typically a fairly low mileage trainer, as I tend to get injured when I get up over 40 mpw for any length of time. When I started thinking about doing the race, I started running increasing back to back long runs on the weekend based on advice from @FFigawi. I peaked with Goofy at Marathon Weekend, Running the two races at training paces.

    My 50 miler is flat and on pavement, which I’m looking forward to, but is not as aid station friendly, since it’s a point to point course rather than a loop course. There are only 4 aid stations, at 17, 29, 37 and 44 miles. I’m going to have to be a lot more self-sufficient carrying water and food. Right now I’m hoping a combination of gels, gummies and Kind bars supplemented with whatever is at the aid stations will get me through. The rule of thumb I’ve read is to shoot for 200-400 calories per hour intake. My wife will be crewing, driving from aid station to aid station, and I plan to have the car fully stocked with clothes, gear, and food so I can adjust on the fly.

    Good luck finding your path to 50 and I’ll post about my experience next weekend so you can hopefully learn from the mistakes I’ll inevitably make.
     
  6. FFigawi

    FFigawi DIS Veteran

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    Congrats on signing up for your first 50! It's a far different experience than a marathon, and well worth the extra training and suffering. Some tips off the top of my head:

    - run when you can, walk when you must
    - start slow, and run slower
    - eat real food. You can't live on sugar/gel for 12-15 hours. Salted potatoes are the bomb!
    - when you get to your peak training, it's all about time on your feet. Several weekends of 4-5 hours on Sat and 3-4 hours on Sun is needed to learn to run on tired legs.
    - have spare shoes and socks in your bag and hope to never need them

    Feel free to DM me with more questions if you want
     
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  7. lilmc

    lilmc Mouseketeer

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    [/GALLERY]
    Agreed! Granted I only have one 50k under my belt, but I love eating food when trail running. I love the Skratch lab Portables cookbook for ideas.
     
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  8. BikeFan

    BikeFan DIS Veteran

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    First, congratulation on signing up for your first 50M! You've gotten a lot of great advice so far, so there's little to add. I just want to repeat a few points from above on two of the most important things - gear and nutrition. Make sure you select shoes/socks/shorts/etc. that can take the miles comfortably. You're going to be in that gear a long time, so make sure it's broken-in and tested in training. Also, depending on your race, anticipate any changes in temperature and weather. My first 50M had rain, snow, hail, and some serious temperature swings as the day progressed. I was adding and shedding layers frequently. Put as much as you can into your drop bag, because it's better to have it and not need it rather than need it and not have it. Most ultras, especially if I have to cross water or it's raining, I'll try to change socks at least once. It always feels like heaven, putting on a clean, dry pair of socks! Your feet will definitely thank you. Also, nutrition is so important. Find out what works for you in training and stick with it. Keeping a steady flow of calories is important.

    As for training for a 50M, I mostly kept to my usual 40-50 MPW routine, but with some additional long runs thrown in. I did two marathons and a shorter ultra (36 miles) in the months beforehand for endurance training. Most decent 50M plans I've seen for recreational runners don't suggest a long run beyond 30 or so. With ultras, it's as much a mental test as a physical test - control your pacing, pay attention to your gear and nutrition, and stay positive, and you should be fine. Good luck!!
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
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  9. garneska

    garneska DIS Veteran

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    So I managed a few runs after the marathon but have been down a week with sickness. I was supposed to do a 3 hour trail run tomorrow but am going to switch it up for hiking the trail rather than run get the time on my feet. I think I will be ok just slow. My big concern is nutrition. I just suck at it. I have one drop bag at mike 17. I think 4 or 5 aid stations.

    On the flip side my hamstring hurt from the marathon and with the time off from being sick my hamstring feels normal again. Guess I am just wigging out a little. It’s two weeks away. I can do it.

    @camaker good luck. I thought your race was end of month, I did not realize it was before me. Good luck!
     
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  10. garneska

    garneska DIS Veteran

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    Oh something I love for after hiking is Pringles. I am thinking of putting the can in my drop bag and another can for after. Will carry uncrustables with me. My problem I don’t like to eat until I am done so as everyone says real food, I hope I can do it. Of course am expecting to be out there a lot longer than a trail run so hoping I want real food.
     
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  11. camaker

    camaker Anything worth doing is worth overdoing

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    Thanks! The best thing about the timing is that I’ve got less time to agonize over what I’ve gotten myself into. You’re going to do great. You’ve done so much recon and practice on your race route, you know what to expect when and that’s a big piece of the puzzle!

    I’m in a somewhat similar boat here. I can’t stand chewing while I’m running, which makes the whole “real food” thing problematic. I’m tentatively planning to work the Kind bars into walk breaks to see if that helps with the issue. I’ll be fine chowing down while stopped at the aid stations, though.
     
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  12. BikeFan

    BikeFan DIS Veteran

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    I love uncrustables! They seem to be popular in the ultra world, as I see them at a lot of aid stations. Anything with peanut butter is usually part of my pre-race routine, and during ultras, if I can get it. You may just want to 'graze' at the aid stations - a few chips, an uncrustable, maybe some M&Ms or chews/gels. That's how I usually do, depending on what my body is craving at the time. Good luck!
     
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  13. OldSlowGoofyGuy

    OldSlowGoofyGuy DIS Veteran

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    One more tip: 'P' foods work well: Pringles, pretzels, pickles, potatoes.
     
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  14. BikeFan

    BikeFan DIS Veteran

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    You're going to do fine. Just focus on maintaining forward progress, and you'll get there eventually. While my 50M was definitely longer than any other ultra I'd done, I don't know if it was really any harder. At around Mile 35, I was tired and sore, but it stopped getting any worse, physically. I just focused on one foot in front of the other, and eventually got to the finish line. Most people's physical limit is well beyond what they think it is. Good luck and can't wait to hear about it!
     
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  15. Baloo in MI

    Baloo in MI DIS Veteran

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    It’s an Ultra conversation! Good luck to you @mtnmjd

    Looks like you have already gotten lots of great advice on gear, nutrition and training. Here are the only things that I would offer in addition:

    - 50 miles is a long run in terms of time. Know that you will experience a low point (or two). Have a couple tricks in your bag, so to speak. If you listen to music, have a go to mix to turn to in the tough time. Find someone you can run with for awhile, chatting helps the miles slip past. Or maybe keep a snack item you absolutely love in one of your drop bags for later in the race that you can pull out. (I usually keep some Oreos and salted peanuts in baggies in my drop bags - two items I love).
    - One of my mantra’s was always CFM - continual forward motion. Running, shuffling, walking just keep going forward and you will get to the finish line. On this note, don’t get stuck in an aid station. Sometimes there are chairs to sit down or it maybe an area where you have friends/family meeting you. Don’t stay long. Get done what you need to - change out shoes, resupply, grad food and then get out of there. That time can really aid up and later in the race a side effect can be a stiffening up that makes the next few miles pretty hard (at least it is for me).

    Have a great race!
     
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  16. mtnmjd

    mtnmjd Earning My Ears

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    Wow, thank you all for such amazing information!!!!
    This will be such a great help, especially the nutrition tips.

    I felt really good after Dopey and could have probably ran the next day if I didn't have plans to tour Epcot with my wife and friends. Much, much better than I felt after my first marathon a few years back.

    My race is trail course with lots of elevation change but thankfully has 10 aid stations with drop stations at 24 and 38. I am "running" with 2-3 other guys and I'm probably the fittest of the bunch. We plan to do a relatively slow run/walk pace with a initial goal to just complete and secondary goal of being done before sunset if possible.
    I plan on putting shoes, socks and additional layers in the drop bags as well as carrying an extra layer and possibly rain gear if the forecast calls for it. I love the idea of real food and not having to consume too many gels as they tend to affect my stomach after awhile.

    good luck @camaker and @garneska with your upcoming races, I look forward to hearing how it goes!

    Thanks again to everyone for the help and encouraging words!
     
  17. lilmc

    lilmc Mouseketeer

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    I have issues with dry mouth, chewing, and breathing at the same time. What I mean is I’m panting due to exertion so how am I supposed to chew and breathe at the same time? And then there’s no extra saliva with all the panting, so things like pretzels just gum up and take forever to swallow. My favorite are rice, scrambled eggs, bacon chunks, lots of soy/Braggs aminos, with maple syrup bites. They’re super tasty, easy to chew and swallow, and give me simple carbs, fat, protein, and salt.
     
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