Help, discipline question

[poohpooh2u]

Here's a little story I will share. 34 year old Disney fan has always wanted to go to Disney World. Plans trip with 12 and 10 yo children. Everyone very excited except......

12 year old acting up in school. Won't do assignments, bringing home 2 D's and an E on progress report. Has been grounded for a month--no TV, no music, still problems with homework (not getting in any other trouble at school just won't turn in assignments) not telling the truth about doing assignments, took away posters, purse, fun books, warning her that she will stay home if grades not brought up. Trip is now 8 days away, looked at planner last night 2 assignments not turned in and has another 1hr detention after school (4th this month). Went to school with her and sat with her all day on my one day off last week. Don't know what to do......

Got in fight this morning after seeing planner told her she's not going. My mother says I can't do that.

So I'm asking advice from other parents. Leave her behind while I take her sibling? We are going with Aunt and cousins. I am soooo frustrated.

 

[Lulu's Mom]

Is there a reason that she is doing poorly??? Does she understand how to do the work? Of is it just an issue of not doing it? Also is this a new problem or has it always been a problem? Is it possible to get tutoring or help for her with these classes?

IMHO if it is a laziness factor.... just not wanting to do it... then I would not take her.... if there is an underlying issue though, like not understanding it or some other good reason for not getting it done then I would work through that and I would take her.

Ultimatley it is your decision and you need to stand by what you think is right. I would also ask myself... would it be Disney without her??

Good luck and I hope you have great trip no matter what you decide.

 

[ToTLaugher]

I'm with LuLu's Mom. Is this new for her? If so I would seriously look at possible underlying causes.

Also, regardless of the reason, will she be missing school for the trip? If so the trip could put her further behind and make things worse. I would play it by ear until you figure out what is behind this.

Missing a trip to Disney is a big consequence so you want to be sure it fits the behavior, if you know what I mean.

Hang in there, phases really come and go at this age. Hopefully this will all be a distant memory for you real soon!

 

[malibuconlee]

I have a friend who left her 12 yo boy at home because he wasn't keeping up with his schoolwork (laziness involved here). I agree if she's having that much trouble taking her out of school won't help matters.

 

[babytrees]

We are having a similar problem with our 9 year old....increasing in intensity of homework not in...I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that there is a LOT of tension in our house right now.....so having a hard time punishing it as it is a reaction to stress.

Look at the possible reasons other than just plain laziness: has she changed friends recently, extra stress at home? I would say don't leave her at home, it may be she is just looking for any reaction(even negative) from you, and time you spend with her on vacation focusing on the positive may just be the ticket. But I would also check at school with the counselor and see the school's reaction espescially if she would be missing school to go.

 

[TommyTutone]

When you say assignments, do you mean homework or in-class assignments? If you mean in-class, then I would think taking her out of school for the trip would be a mistake. My son is only three, so please take my thoughts with a grain of salt, but although a Disney trip is a BIG THING, your daughter only has one chance to succeed in school. The fact that she is not making the effort to do well so that she can go on the trip (you made this point clear to her) tells me that either she doesn't care about the trip or she thinks you will cave and bring her anyway.

If you are referring to homework, which I have to believe you are not, I would ask why you are not checking her homework before bed or sitting with her while she works on it to make sure it gets done.

 

[rt2dz]

Whether or not you take your child to Disney or not is YOUR decision. But my first thoughts are that there is something going on (new problem or not) if your child isn't doing school work. And my first thought is that you need to get to the bottom of that first and foremost.

What makes me think that there is another problem, rather than just laziness, is that you have been grounding with no effect. Grounding usually stops laziness. This isn't working, and not only do you need to find a new tatic, but you need to assume it is something more than "I just don't feel like it" without any other reason.

Maybe the work has gotten too hard? Need a tutor? Less competitive school (if private)? Maybe there is something socially that is upsetting 12 yo? Change in friends? Losing friends? Is your child being bullied? New to middle school/junior high? Are there problems with teachers? Uncomfortable with puberty? Is there something going on at home? Is this a cry out for help? Could there be some medical reasons/learning disabilities? This was the case when my nephew went through the same thing at about the same age; dealt with that and the problem disappeared.

Maybe a long talk in neutral ground when things are going well (not in the middle of a fight or right after) will help you truly figure out what is wrong. Maybe you could write up a contract if it is plain laziness on what each of you expect/want from each other. I've had lots of friends be HIGHLY successful with that approach. You also just need to ask yourself if taking away the vacation will solve the problem, leave it in neutral ground, or make things worse. I'm sure there is many other things that you could do to help work out the problem.

I do want to recommend a book (warning: written from a christian perspective, but not at all "preachy"; non-christians would find it very useful also): Boundries with Kids by Drs. Cloud and Townsend.

 

[justhat]

Well, my issue would be that you told her she can't go, so by taking her you're showing her that you don't really mean what you say. Of course, if it is the case that there is actually a problem, then you'll just feel mean for leaving her home. But if it is just laziness then leaving her home would be the right thing to do since that was your 'threat.

Aside from that, my BIL was a very poor student-failed 5 out of 7 classes the 1st semester of 10th grade. That spring they got him psychological testing and it turns out he has ADD. He went on medication and was on the honor roll 1st semester of 11th grade. It made a huge difference in his academic career, so this maybe something you want to look into.

 

[Laurajean1014]

How about sitting down with DD12 and explain that what you said earlier today was out of fustration and that you sincerely want her to come with you and DD. However, it will depend on her if she is "ready" for the trip.

Ask her about school, 6th grade and even 7th is a big difference from the undergrades and she maybe dealing with the extra work. Or, kids are "changing" both physical, mental and hormonal, during this time. Social skills are very important during this age group. Chat with her about her favorite friend and how they get along, (try doing this in a more friendly carefree attitude) - I tend to get more information that way then when it seems that I am asking, 'cause I care.

This is a tough time for her, and for you. But the closeness and love that you share will eventually get this out.... Even laziness is caused by something other than being lazy.

Please let us know how things progress. We all go through these types of things...

 

[indigoxtreme]

Have you had you DD tested for ADD or Dyslexia? At her age my DS started doing similar things and we wondered what was going on. This was different for him. Come to find out after many meetings and test he was ADHD and actually would forget about the assignments even when they were written down and then would be imbarrassed to tell me he forgot his books etc so assignments could be done. If this is new for her to behave this way something is going on, it may be hormonal as well. I would make an appt with her physician and tell them about this with DD in attendance. Tell your DD you understand she is having a problem and you and she are going to talk to the MD to see if it can be figured out what is goiong on. Also there may be something else going on in school that you are not aware of and this is her way of letting you know.

 

[Mom to Jordan]

I bet there is not one parent of a child over twelve that has not over steped the discipline line at least once. I once told DS he was grounded for a month when he really deserved a week-end. I appoligized to him for getting too emotional and reset the time for 3 days!
The teachers at DS school tell me is that 7th grade is when many kids start to loose it. They become unorganized and very forgetful. It last about a year or so and they start to come around.
First, I would not leave her at home. This is the critical time where they start to define the roles and family and friends and you want family to still win out. I would talk to the teachers, the administration, and your child to try to get some sort of idea where this might be comming from. Bully at school?? Boyfriend???
I would be concerned if she is missing time from school for the trip, but I would change the dates for the trip rather than leave her at home if that is the case.
It sounds like you are going to have to be very proactive in making sure the work is done. Excelent communication between you and the teachers is important!!!

Good luck and hang in there. A trip might be what you all need!!!

Jordans' mom

 

[LaraK]

I would also throw out that when I was teaching I had a family with a similar sudden change in participation. She would "forget" her homework, her book, her pencil...anything she could do to get out of participating in any way with schoolwork. Turned out she needed glasses but didn't want to tell anyone because she didn't want the stigma of wearing glasses (that is SUCH a hard age!) I'm going to have to agree though that if she pulled such poor grades in the first quarter, you don't want her to miss class and potentially fail the second quarter causing the year to have to be repeated. Hang in there!

 

[MrsNick]

Whether or not you take your child to Disney or not is YOUR decision. But my first thoughts are that there is something going on (new problem or not) if your child isn't doing school work. And my first thought is that you need to get to the bottom of that first and foremost.

What makes me think that there is another problem, rather than just laziness, is that you have been grounding with no effect. Grounding usually stops laziness. This isn't working, and not only do you need to find a new tatic, but you need to assume it is something more than "I just don't feel like it" without any other reason.

Maybe the work has gotten too hard? Need a tutor? Less competitive school (if private)? Maybe there is something socially that is upsetting 12 yo? Change in friends? Losing friends? Is your child being bullied? New to middle school/junior high? Are there problems with teachers? Uncomfortable with puberty? Is there something going on at home? Is this a cry out for help? Could there be some medical reasons/learning disabilities? This was the case when my nephew went through the same thing at about the same age; dealt with that and the problem disappeared.

Maybe a long talk in neutral ground when things are going well (not in the middle of a fight or right after) will help you truly figure out what is wrong. Maybe you could write up a contract if it is plain laziness on what each of you expect/want from each other. I've had lots of friends be HIGHLY successful with that approach. You also just need to ask yourself if taking away the vacation will solve the problem, leave it in neutral ground, or make things worse. I'm sure there is many other things that you could do to help work out the problem.

I do want to recommend a book (warning: written from a christian perspective, but not at all "preachy"; non-christians would find it very useful also): Boundries with Kids by Drs. Cloud and Townsend.

ITA

This sounds like more than just "laziness." If she just transitioned from elementary to middle school, it could be that she is having difficulty adjusting to the increased responsibility and work load. She could be overwhelmed with having multiple classes and teachers, rather than just one classroom. She simply may need help on how to organize herself at school: when the teacher has assigned homework, is she noting it down, or does she even know to note it down? For example, does the teacher write down the homework assignment on the chalkboard every day and expect students to just notice it, or is the teacher actually telling kids, hey, this is your homework assignment today.

For your daughter's sake, you will need to get to the bottom of the root of the problem. Both of you will be so much happier when you do. I'm sure that your dd doesn't like the poor grades and negativity at all.

 

[poohpooh2u]

Thank you everyone. It helped so much just to share the story with people who aren't involved and therefore not "judging".

To fill in some details this has been an ongoing problem for years but has gotten worse. She has been tested and has ADD type behavior. There is a lot of stress in the home, not a great environment, working on changing. That's what this trip was-something for the 3 of us.

She is a major Drama Queen. Recently having a problem with being left out by her group of friends. Also has been clashing with BF. She will be missing 3 days of school.

I am really concerned with the whole I said no and now I say yes you can go. We've been trying to make the punishments fit the crimes and stick with them. Hard thing to do.

Will think some more about this. Thank you again.

 

[staci]

To fill in some details this has been an ongoing problem for years but has gotten worse. She has been tested and has ADD type behavior. There is a lot of stress in the home, not a great environment, working on changing. That's what this trip was-something for the 3 of us.

QUOTE]


Because of what you just said, it seems to me that it is likely that the problem is not schoolwork, that is just a side effect of what is really going on. Not knowing your family situation personally, I'm just making a prediction based on personal experiences, it sounds like you and your two children could really benefit from some alone time in the most stress free happy place on earth.

I totally understand not going back on a punishment, and I am ususally all for that. But in this case, I would suggest sitting down with DD, and having a one on one 'adult' conversation. Explain how much this trip was to mean to your family, and how much you want her to be a part of it. Work together to come up with a compromise that will work for both of you (think of what would be acceptable to you before hand, whether that be a homework routine once you get home, a contingency management strategy with her teacher once she returns, some type of assignment based on her trip, etc). Help her be part of the solution, not the problem. I would also consider arranging a three way meeting BEFORE the trip with you, the teacher, and DD so that she knows that EVERYONE is involved.

I feel for you, I dread the days my children have to go through that age. I student taught in 6th grade and while they were so thoughtful and insightful at that age, they have to go through alot learning to 'grow up' and I dont envy them or the parents!

 

[Nancyg56]

I would like to share my own experience with my oldest son, now 30 years old. He had the same issues in middle school. School in general was traumatic for all of us, and I really think that we are all lucky he is alive today. I spent more time with him, working on schoolwork, behavior issues on and on! WE had him tested, as a counselor (sp) in school felt that he was low IQ, and felt that I saw him thru rose colores glasses. Turns out that his IQ was in the sky! He was totally bored. We did get councelling for hm, as well as DH and I in order to handle the entire thing appropriately. I really do understand the overreaction in regards to punishment. Better to adjust the punishment and explain that you were just disappointed than to over punish and show the child that it is better to follow thru than to make punishment fir the action.

You know your family situation better than all of us, and are in the best position to gage how to handle it. Having said that, in my family, if I had left my DS out of a family vacation the situation would have gone from bad to worse. If missing school will make the situation worse, maybe reschedule when all of you can go. I will tell you that he never finished college, but is brilliant in his field, and very successful at work. Best of luck to you and your family.

 

[poohpooh2u]

Thank you again everyone. And STaci, thank you for the idea of adult conversation. Thank you to those who have pm'd me. I can't tell you all how much this forum has helped to give me new perspective. This Sunday will be family meeting time. Wish me luck, no actually, wish me good judgement and patience!

 

[shaylahc]

I agree with the person who said the 3 of you need some alone time.

I really feel for your DD...I grew up in a "not so great home environment" and I also struggled with poor grades and bad behavior. The truth of the matter was, I was very depressed. I started cutting myself at 13 to deal with the pain. My mom had no idea what I was doing, or how I felt. Sometimes when a child is very troubled, it isn't always obvious.

I would take her on vacation, and when you get back try and get to the bottom of what is really bothering her. It could be depression or hormones or a reaction to a stressful home environment. Sounds like she could use someone to talk to. I hope you can get this worked out, the teen years are right around the corner and the time to work things out is NOW, it only gets harder and harder the older they get.

HUGS OP

 

[ladyariadne]

Puberty is tough. The body goes through a lot of changes. It is possible that her eyes are changing. Talk to her about her vision and then have it checked. If she doesn't want glasses, it is possible that she would not be honest with you about poor vision.

Good luck!

Elizabeth

 

[solgent]

I have similar issues with one of my daughters, who is in 6th grade. Not as bad as what OP describes, but I share the frustration.

I think the vacation is too much to lose. Love and family time should be available regardless of any school or behavioral issues. It is all the other privileges that must be earned.

OP, you have given a lot of consequences/punishments. I agree with that-- a child who doesn't turn in assignments shouldn't be able to watch TV, etc. But have you talked to your child and put together a plan of rewards? What does she get for good behavior? It should be very specific, something that she chooses, and she should get a reward for every little thing. E.g., if she has assignments in 4 classes, then for each assignment she does turn in she gets a point and then on the weekend the points are converted to TV time or whatever. Arrange it so that she does get something meaningful even if a week doesn't go perfectly.

You want her to feel that it's not too late. That would discourage her from change.

As others have said, talk to her about what's going on. Try to get her to buy into the system, make sure she understands why we complete assignments to the best of our ability and turn them in on time.

Give lots of praise and positive reinforcement to everything and anything that either child does right. The trip is a good time to do this because you'll be together all the time and hopefully there will be lots of occasions to praise. They were patient, they shared, they got along, they were polite, they tried something new, they helped you find or carry something, they maintained a good attitude, they walked a long way, etc. This way you show the kids that it's better to get attention for good behavior than for bad behavior.

Best wishes. You're not alone!