Do you have a problem with this? I don't. FBI related.

[Papa Deuce]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,179630,00.html

 

[RobinMarie]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,179630,00.html

What part, specifically, are you ok with?


http://apnews.myway.com/article/20051223/D8EM8IQO0.html

FBI Official Defends Radiation Monitoring


WASHINGTON (AP) - A classified radiation monitoring program, conducted without warrants, has targeted private U.S. property in an effort to prevent an al-Qaida attack, federal law enforcement officials confirmed Friday.

While declining to provide details including the number of cities and sites monitored, the officials said the air monitoring took place since the Sept. 11 attacks and from publicly accessible areas - which they said made warrants and court orders unnecessary.

U.S. News and World Report first reported the program on Friday. The magazine said the monitoring was conducted at more than 100 Muslim sites in the Washington, D.C. area - including Maryland and Virginia suburbs - and at least five other cities when threat levels had risen: Chicago, Detroit, Las Vegas, New York and Seattle.

The magazine said that at its peak, three vehicles in Washington monitored 120 sites a day, nearly all of them Muslim targets identified by the FBI. Targets included mosques, homes and businesses, the magazine said.

The revelation of the surveillance program came just days after The New York Times disclosed that the Bush administration spied on suspected terrorist targets in the United States without court orders. President Bush has said he approved the program to protect Americans from attack. Reagan and George H.W. Bush."

Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Washington-based civil rights group, said Friday the program "comes as a complete shock to us and everyone in the Muslim community."

"This creates the appearance that Muslims are targeted simply for being Muslims. I don't think this is the message the government wants to send at this time," he said.

Hooper said his organization has serious concerns about the constitutionality of monitoring on private property without a court order.

Brian Roehrkasse, a Justice Department spokesman, said Friday that the administration "is very concerned with a growing body of sensitive reporting that continues to show al-Qaida has a clear intention to obtain and ultimately use chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear" weapons or high energy explosives.

To meet that threat, the government "monitors the air for imminent threats to health and safety," but acts only on specific information about a potential attack without targeting any individual or group, he said.

"FBI agents do not intrude across any constitutionally protected areas without the proper legal authority," the spokesman said.

In a 2001 decision, the Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that police must get warrants before using devices that search through walls for criminal activity. That decision struck down the use without a warrant of a heat-sensing device that led to marijuana charges against an Oregon man.

Roehrkasse said the Justice Department believes that case does not apply to air monitoring in publicly accessible areas.

Two federal law enforcement officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because the program is classified, said the monitoring did not occur only at Muslim-related sites.

Douglas Kmiec, a professor of constitutional law at Pepperdine University, said the location of the surveillance matters when determining if a court order is needed.

"The greatest expectation of privacy is in the home," said Kmiec, a Justice Department official under former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. "As you move away from the home to a parking lot or a place of public accommodation or an office, there are a set of factors that are a balancing test for the court," he said.

Despite federal promises to inform state and local officials of security concerns, that never formally happened with the radiation monitoring program, said an official who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information.

The official said that after discussions with attorneys, some state and local authorities decided the surveillance was legal, equating it to air quality monitors set up around Washington that regularly sniff for suspicious materials.

"They weren't targeting specific people, they were just doing it by random, driving around (commercial) storage sheds and parking lots," the official said.

Asked about the program's status, the official said, "I'd understood it had been stopped or significantly rolled back" as early as eight months ago.

Such information-sharing with state and local officials is the responsibility of the Homeland Security Department, which spokesman Brian Doyle said was not involved in the program.

I have a problem with government spying on people's privacy. The word monitor is heavily used, and I can't help but substitute spying
instead.

While declining to provide details including the number of cities and sites monitored, the officials said the air monitoring took place since the Sept. 11 attacks and from publicly accessible areas - which they said made warrants and court orders unnecessary.

The fact is, we do not know all of what was looked at so it's hard to discern.
KWIM? More information is needed.

 

[DawnCt1]

What part, specifically, are you ok with?


http://apnews.myway.com/article/20051223/D8EM8IQO0.html


I have a problem with government spying on people's privacy. The word monitor is heavily used, and I can't help but substitute spying
instead.



The fact is, we do not know all of what was looked at so it's hard to discern.
KWIM? More information is needed.

The fact is, no individual, citizen, visitor, person, is permitted to have in their possession ANY RADIOACTIVE MATERIAL. Al Qaeda has made it very clear that there is nothing they would like better than deploying a dirty bomb, a suit case bomb or any other weapon of mass destruction. Given the threats, the promises, and attempts to procure such, our government would negligent NOT to monitor for radioactivity. So perhaps you can tell what privacy was violated. If there were a gyger counter outside of my door step, I wouldn't bat an eyelash. In fact,l I would feel relieved.

 

[Pugdog007]

They ran a spot on this story tonight on World News Tonight. I just had to roll my eyes. Give me a break. No I don't have a problem with it and no reasonable person would. If black pugs had been the perpetrators on 9/11, I'd expect the shakedown at my house and wouldn't have a problem with it either.

 

[Miss Jasmine]

I have a HUGE problem with this. First of all it involves profiling. Second, of all I am so tired of people rolling over and giving up all of their personal freedoms by saying they don't have a problem with this. I am so ready to change my voting card from Republican to Libertarian. I would really do it if it didin't exclude me from primaries.

 

[DawnCt1]

I have a HUGE problem with this. First of all it involves profiling. Second, of all I am so tired of people rolling over and giving up all of their personal freedoms by saying they don't have a problem with this. I am so ready to change my voting card from Republican to Libertarian. I would really do it if it didin't exclude me from primaries.

Profiling?? Oh no? Your kidding? Well I would hope that they would look. What "personal freedoms" are you giving up if there is a gyger counter outside of your apartment? Your right to have uranium??? A dirty bomb exploded in a populated area would make that area uninhabitable for decades. This isn't a Republican issue or a Democratic issue, its a self preservation issue. Its time to realize that there is a Jihad and we are in the cross hairs. That is NOT to say that most Muslims feel that way, its a small minority that would act on an opportunity to do harm to the United States. There is a larger minority that would look the other way. That is the way it is. I would suggest that you read Tony Blankley's book, The West's Last Chance. I would also suggest that you reflect on what happened in France just a few short weeks ago.

 

[RobinMarie]

Why not monitor other religious groups as well?

You can't tell what privacy was violated because specifics were not disclosed.

 

[Papa Deuce]

What part, specifically, are you ok with?


All of it. I don't feel like people's rights are being taken away in this. And it really isn't intrusive. I'm fine with all of it.

 

[DawnCt1]

Why not monitor other religious groups as well?

You can't tell what privacy was violated because specifics were not disclosed.

I haven't heard that Congregationalists were contemplating destroying an American city.

 

[djcruz4fun]

Profiling?? Oh no? Your kidding? Well I would hope that they would look. What "personal freedoms" are you giving up if there is a gyger counter outside of your apartment? Your right to have uranium??? A dirty bomb exploded in a populated area would make that area uninhabitable for decades. This isn't a Republican issue or a Democratic issue, its a self preservation issue. Its time to realize that there is a Jihad and we are in the cross hairs. That is NOT to say that most Muslims feel that way, its a small minority that would act on an opportunity to do harm to the United States. There is a larger minority that would look the other way. That is the way it is. I would suggest that you read Tony Blankley's book, The West's Last Chance. I would also suggest that you reflect on what happened in France just a few short weeks ago.

I agree, if people don't wake up we will be in alot of trouble

 

[Miss Jasmine]

Some of you would be willing to just scrap our Bill of Rights in favor of national security, wouldn't you? It's "just" happening to muslims, but being of middle-eastern heritage this is alarming to me. It starts here and it keeps growing. Sure it's just radioactivity being monitored, but that is just the beginning.

And Dawn, I'll reflect on the bible and the end times. It talks about people giving up personal freedoms in the name of security.

 

[RobinMarie]

I haven't heard that Congregationalists were contemplating destroying an American city.

So you are ok with spying on muslims?

 

[DawnCt1]

So you are ok with spying on muslims?

Did you have a problem infiltrating White Supremacy groups when blacks were being prosecuted? We have done that for years. What about FBI investigations of the Mafia and La Cosa Nostra? What do you think undercover cops do? We know that certain Mosques and madrasas teach jihad. We know that the 19 hijackers in the country were part of a large organization that has tenticles extending into our country. How does one give up any personal freedoms if there is a gyger counter outside of their door? If Mosques are open to the public, just as churches are, how is it a denial of civil liberties if an undercover agent walks into that space with a detection device looking for radio active material. Wouldn't you want to know if it were there?

 

[transparant]

I don't have a problem with it at all.

 

[DawnCt1]

Some of you would be willing to just scrap our Bill of Rights in favor of national security, wouldn't you? It's "just" happening to muslims, but being of middle-eastern heritage this is alarming to me. It starts here and it keeps growing. Sure it's just radioactivity being monitored, but that is just the beginning.

And Dawn, I'll reflect on the bible and the end times. It talks about people giving up personal freedoms in the name of security.

You have yet to tell me what civil rights are being lost or what personal freedoms anyone is giving up if the government monitors certain areas for radioactive material. There are lots of people of middle eastern heritage that hate terrorism, and mass murder, and want to live in peace as much as you do. Then there are those who thrive on our destruction. If you have a better idea I would love to hear it. One does not need a search warrant to monitor public areas for radioactivity. What do you wnat the government to do?

 

[RobinMarie]

Did you have a problem infiltrating White Supremacy groups when blacks were being prosecuted? We have done that for years. What about FBI investigations of the Mafia and La Cosa Nostra? What do you think undercover cops do? We know that certain Mosques and madrasas teach jihad. We know that the 19 hijackers in the country were part of a large organization that has tenticles extending into our country. How does one give up any personal freedoms if there is a gyger counter outside of their door? If Mosques are open to the public, just as churches are, how is it a denial of civil liberties if an undercover agent walks into that space with a detection device looking for radio active material. Wouldn't you want to know if it were there?

Is that a yes?

 

[Miss Jasmine]

You have yet to tell me what civil rights are being lost or what personal freedoms anyone is giving up if the government monitors certain areas for radioactive material. There are lots of people of middle eastern heritage that hate terrorism, and mass murder, and want to live in peace as much as you do. Then there are those who thrive on our destruction. If you have a better idea I would love to hear it. One does not need a search warrant to monitor public areas for radioactivity. What do you wnat the government to do?

It's not just public areas being monitored.

The magazine said that at its peak, three vehicles in Washington monitored 120 sites a day, nearly all of them Muslim targets identified by the FBI. Targets included mosques, homes and businesses, the magazine said.



"The greatest expectation of privacy is in the home," said Kmiec, a Justice Department official under former presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush. "As you move away from the home to a parking lot or a place of public accommodation or an office, there are a set of factors that are a balancing test for the court," he said.

There is NOTHING and I mean NOTHING we can do to stop another attack. It isn't a question of if but when. I know this and I accept it. I am not willing to let the slippery slope of taking away personal freedoms to begin. I find it pathetic that people think that it is okay for this and the tapping of phones to occur without warrants.

I want the government to go through the proper channels, Dawn. I don't think that is asking too much.

 

[JimB.]

As I understand it, the monitoring is done from outside any & all structures. Vehicles riding around town with monitoring devices searching specifically for radio isotope emissions (IMHO) does not infringe on my freedoms or rights.

If they come INSIDE my house, or scan for conversations held inside my house, that's another matter. If emissions are leaking out side my house and picked up, that's my tough luck. The principle seems (again, IMHO) the same as not needing a warrant to rifle through someone's trash on the street. Once it's outside your domicile, it's free game.

There is NOTHING and I mean NOTHING we can do to stop another attack.

With all due respect, I heartily disagree.

I want the government to go through the proper channels, Dawn. I don't think that is asking too much.

I agree here also. Just a question: If someone outside your house smells smoke, is it a violation of your rights for that person to call the fire department??

 

[vivilasvegas]

Did you have a problem infiltrating White Supremacy groups when blacks were being prosecuted? We have done that for years. What about FBI investigations of the Mafia and La Cosa Nostra? What do you think undercover cops do? We know that certain Mosques and madrasas teach jihad. We know that the 19 hijackers in the country were part of a large organization that has tenticles extending into our country. How does one give up any personal freedoms if there is a gyger counter outside of their door? If Mosques are open to the public, just as churches are, how is it a denial of civil liberties if an undercover agent walks into that space with a detection device looking for radio active material. Wouldn't you want to know if it were there?

.

That's a mighty wide brush you are painting with, don't you think?

If you really believe what you are saying...every Muslim should be considered a terrorist, every white person should be KKK, every black person should hate whites...guess what, every Mosque isn't promoting terrorism.

sorry, but your post makes no sense.

 

[N.Bailey]

I have no problems at all with this. If it's going to keep this country a bit safer, I say "DO IT."