Do Political Commentators Really Believe What They Say?

[Mugg Mann]

T_M, here's an audio clip of O'Reilly promising to "bring horror into the world of people" who "diminish and denegrate" the Christmas holiday.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200512070010

Note that the clip is not taken out of context, and that Media Matters in fact lets the clip start well before those words are uttered to insure that the words can not be misconstrued. I hope that you will not try to argue that the clip is not real or cannot be valid because it appears on a website whose political philosophy differs from yours. And please don't cop out by moaning that since the word "target" was not specifically used that somehow this is invalid or can be dismissed.

So now that President Bush has, by O'Reilly's definition, diminished and denegrated the Christmas holiday by sending out plain old holiday cards, I now ask two rhetorical questions...

1) If he is serious and does in fact mean what he says, what will Bill O'Reilly now do to "bring horror into the world" of President Bush?

2) If he does, will the secret service take notice and take the appropiate action against someone who by extension has threatened the President of the United States?

This is an excellent example of why I don't believe that many popular political commentators (on both ends of the political spectrum) don't believe much of what they say, and instead are just trying to promote themselves.

 

[Laugh O. Grams]

What is confusing is how you leap from this to demanding he condemn the WH over their greeting card?

You're right T_M...he should take every secular business or municipality to task for losing touch with the true meaning of Christmas, but definitely not the White House, and George Bush's choice of a secular "Holiday" card, because that would be wild and weird!

 

[What the Heck]

Cardaway, the difference being that Howard Stern says things tongue in cheek (so to speak) and for shock value while Ann and Rush have loyal fans that quote things as if they were real 100% of the time.

True.

There are also some that are not considered political commentators who can quickly become such. How many people here and in the world believe that Katrina was primarily blown by the federal government? Reporter after reporter on all the channels were spewing about how the feds should be doing more, etc., etc., etc. One magazine (I can't remember which one, I think Newsweek) had this huge article on "How Bush Blew It". At that point it's political commentary, not a news article.

How often do we hear about the "16 word lie" in the State of the Union? You know the "lie" that said that the British Government said Hussein was looking for Yellow Cake, the same thing the British Government still says to this day? And when this is brought out, it's pointed out how Wilson "showed us how it was false". Wilson could have been 100% truthful (which is a whole debate in itself since source after source keeps saying he lied) and he still would not be able to prove that the British Government did not say that.

 

[What the Heck]

Well , Chrismas is included in the "hollydays" in "happy Hollydays" ! It Happy Hollydays as in , all the Hollydays. It is very simple to understand !

And, according to the column that is quoted, someone saying Happy Holidays isn't in question. From what I read in the article:


"Well, the giant has awakened. Millions of Americans are now aware that the traditions of Christmas are under fire by committed secularists, people who do not want any public demonstration of spirituality. The situation is, of course, absurd. Department stores refusing to post Merry Christmas banners, Denver having a holiday parade that bans a float honoring Jesus, a school in Maplewood, New Jersey (search), forbidding any song that mentions Christianity, even "Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer."
(love using the banaman for quotes)

Bill mentions places where Christmas is not allowed. The point of the story that I read wasn't against saying Happy Holidays or showing other holidays involved, but it was against not allowing Christmas in the mix. A school not allowing any holiday song that mentions Jesus is definately anti-Christmas and not pro-holidays. Denver not allowing a holiday parade that honors Jesus - how is that not anti-Christmas? Imagine the uproar there would have been if the float had been about Hanauka? (sorry for the spelling if incorrect) We would have heard all about what the conservatives are doing to the Jewish faith. Sorry, Laugh-O-Gram, but I'm reading the stuff you are using as your backup and it isn't saying to me what it says to you.

 

[eclectics]

And, according to the column that is quoted, someone saying Happy Holidays isn't in question. From what I read in the article:


"Well, the giant has awakened. Millions of Americans are now aware that the traditions of Christmas are under fire by committed secularists, people who do not want any public demonstration of spirituality. The situation is, of course, absurd. Department stores refusing to post Merry Christmas banners, Denver having a holiday parade that bans a float honoring Jesus, a school in Maplewood, New Jersey (search), forbidding any song that mentions Christianity, even "Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer."
(love using the banaman for quotes)

Bill mentions places where Christmas is not allowed. The point of the story that I read wasn't against saying Happy Holidays or showing other holidays involved, but it was against not allowing Christmas in the mix. A school not allowing any holiday song that mentions Jesus is definately anti-Christmas and not pro-holidays. Denver not allowing a holiday parade that honors Jesus - how is that not anti-Christmas? Imagine the uproar there would have been if the float had been about Hanauka? (sorry for the spelling if incorrect) We would have heard all about what the conservatives are doing to the Jewish faith. Sorry, Laugh-O-Gram, but I'm reading the stuff you are using as your backup and it isn't saying to me what it says to you.

On this question I've come to the conclusion that there is no answer. No matter what anyone does it will offend somebody. It boils down to the old separation of church and state. Any public displays that have anything at all to do with schools and local, state, and federal government (and throw in public retail establishments also) are going to get scrutinized nowdays. Everybody seems to be drawing a line in the sand and itching for a fight. Sad because this time of year should be about peace. How come we didn't have this uproar say 40 or 50 years ago? I don't know. I guess people are more emboldened nowdays to speak their mind then they were back then. I wish that sense of power would extend to the voting booth though. The percentage of registered voters who actually vote in this country is appalling. If it were up to me, all these holiday parades and displays and retail stores should have displays of the three major celebrations (Christmas, Hannukah, and Kwansa (sp?)). If you can't manage that in a 'being fair to all fashion', don't have them at all. If you don't know someones religious affiliation, saying Happy Holidays should not be construed as a curse. How about just smiling at someone you pass on the street or in the store? Hold the door open for them. You don't have to say a word.

 

[chobie]

On this question I've come to the conclusion that there is no answer. No matter what anyone does it will offend somebody. It boils down to the old separation of church and state. Any public displays that have anything at all to do with schools and local, state, and federal government (and throw in public retail establishments also) are going to get scrutinized nowdays. Everybody seems to be drawing a line in the sand and itching for a fight. Sad because this time of year should be about peace. How come we didn't have this uproar say 40 or 50 years ago? I don't know. I guess people are more emboldened nowdays to speak their mind then they were back then. I wish that sense of power would extend to the voting booth though. The percentage of registered voters who actually vote in this country is appalling. If it were up to me, all these holiday parades and displays and retail stores should have displays of the three major celebrations (Christmas, Hannukah, and Kwansa (sp?)). If you can't manage that in a 'being fair to all fashion', don't have them at all. If you don't know someones religious affiliation, saying Happy Holidays should not be construed as a curse. How about just smiling at someone you pass on the street or in the store? Hold the door open for them. You don't have to say a word.[/QUOTE]

I agree with that. However, unless you say Merry Christmas, how does someone know you're a Christian and therefore superior? Just kidding.

 

[Mugg Mann]

I can't say that I agree that the only one's who are hurt are the misinformed. I think that it's a deliberate attempt to manipulate the misinformed into supporting political canidates who in turn will certainly hurt all of us.

Well put Puffy. It's not only deliberate, but well-organized. When you start really paying attention, you notice just how often the exact same catch phrases denegrating a person or idea from the left are used on virtually all of these shows.

 

[Mugg Mann]

It's odd that people keep throwing out this alleged quote that O'Reilly never said. After doing some research, I believe this is the quote that has everyone up in arms. It is from O'Reilly's December 2nd radio show.
Quote:
I am not going to let oppressive, totalitarian, anti-Christian forces in this country diminish and denigrate the holiday and the celebration. I am not going to let it happen. I'm gonna use all the power that I have on radio and television to bring horror into the world of people who are trying to do that. And we have succeeded. You know we've succeeded. They are on the run in corporations, in the media, everywhere. They are on the run, because I will put their face and their name on television, and I will talk about them on the radio if they do it. There is no reason on this earth that all of us cannot celebrate a public holiday devoted to generosity, peace, and love together. There is no reason on the earth that we can't do that. So we are going to do it. And anyone who tries to stop us from doing it is gonna face me. .

It was my pleasure to help you with the "research" you took credit for on the other O'Reilly thread currently going on. Consider it my holiday present to you! My only hope would have been that you addressed the point here after chiding different posters here for misquoting Bill O'Reilly instead of disappearing to another thread to take people to task there as you seemingly have.

Tsk tsk........

 

[AMcaptured]

I Love Ann Coulter. I have seen her at a local University twice now and enjoyed her both times. She has even emailed me back after both lectures and thanked me for taking the time to comment. The only bad thing I have to say about her is that she is VERY thin, I mean, the thinnest person I have ever met in person. She needs to gain about 10 lbs and she would look more attractive but in person, she is very beautiful.

I believe it is very hard for personality's to advance on television without being inflammatory, unfortunately. The left is full of attack dogs too, James Carville, Al Franken, Michael Moore, Molly Ivens, plus every reporter at Times, Newsweek, the NY Times.

 

[Puffy2]

Yes, that "attack dog", Al Franken! Have you actually heard his show. The man couldn't be more polite to his callers - all of them. So is Jerry Springer, polite that is.

 

[Puffy2]

Originally Posted by Tigger_Magic
I wonder how many people who are saying this have actually listened to or read what O'Reilly actually said. And I mean listened to or read the entire message, not a slanted synopsis posted on a leftie web site. If one did take the time to listen or read, you'd understand how way off base this allegation is.

I've actually listened to man - so I got his words right from his lips. He's actively manipulating the public into thinking that Christians are being persecuted against because certain retail stores have instructed their employees to wish customers a "happy holiday" instead of "merry Christmas". Last time I checked, this was America and private businesses could conduct their business anyway they wished - and usually do so in order to increase profits. If a store thinks "happy holidays" will bring in more cash than "merry Christmas" then they have every right to instruct their employees to act accordingly.

In my town, to increase their profits the stores tell their employees to wish their customers a "merry Christmas" - I don't see Bill complaining about that.