Disneyland’s DAS is denying the severely disabled now.

[disneychrista]

I feel like the DAS is a distraction to what the woman is actually asking for, which is an annual G+ subscription as an add-on to a Magic Key. Not only disabled people would benefit from that. But I think Disney WANTS MK holders to pay for G+ every time they go (or at least every time they want shorter lines for the headliners). Otherwise the place would primarily become a locals park again, which would be a detriment to the big-spending once-in-a-lifetime (or at least once-a-year) tourists who are more likely to buy G+ but who will stop doing so if those lines become ridiculously long.

Honestly though do those with MK and visit weekly, like the girl in the video does, really need LLMP? They are there so frequently, there is always next time if they miss out on an attraction this time?

As to the girl being denied DAS, there as nothing in here video that tells me she can not wait in the stand-by line or utilize the wheelchair return time for those lines that are accessible. Yes she is disabled, no denying that. But if I am giving my honest opinion, she has seemed a little entitled.

 

[LKing]

Good point, Iceman. Locals are a very mixed blessing for DL. They love the parks and are happy to shell out for Magic Keys, so that's a good source of steady revenues for Disney. But after they buy those passes, their spending habits are very different from occasional visitors, and not to Disney's benefit. Why pay $35 for dinner at the parks when you can get takeout on the way home or just eat at home?

I think the assumption is that everyone visits the parks for the same reason - that is to go on rides. There are many locals who rarely go on rides. They go to the parks for dinner and a show. Or to try every variety of churro. They have a LoungeFly and mouse ears to match every outfit. They build bookshelves to display their collection of themed popcorn buckets.

Regardless, everyone has their own reason to visit the Disney parks and Disney knows how to make money off of them. For example, do they sell guests Genie + at $30/day or a MK Dug popcorn bucket at $32?

 

[gardenrooms]

The problem with doctors notes is they are easy to forge. Disney is in a tough spot right now. If people are willing to fake things to get DAS passes they are willing to fake doctor notes.

And some doctors are willing to write fake notes. Just like any other profession, there are bad apples.

 

[irlandaise]

I think the assumption is that everyone visits the parks for the same reason - that is to go on rides. There are many locals who rarely go on rides. They go to the parks for dinner and a show. Or to try every variety of churro. They have a LoungeFly and mouse ears to match every outfit. They build bookshelves to display their collection of themed popcorn buckets.

I suspect the merchandise part of that scenario varies greatly by MK holder. I have some friends who used to go to DCA a couple times a week after work. They would get dinner at Smokejumpers and then walk the circumference of DCA for exercise. Maybe they'd go on a ride or two. But they weren't there all day eating multiple meals and browsing the shops. Maybe they bought a t-shirt once in a while, but basically, they got one counter-service meal and then went home. I suspect there are more MK holders who just want to swing by DL for a few hours than those who keep running over to buy new merchandise.

I had a Cedar Fair annual pass one year, which I used one day at Knott's and a few times at Great America in Santa Clara. I never bought anything except food. Because I was local to GA, I only had lunch at the park, so they only got the cost of one meal from me. Oh, and same thing the year I lived in San Diego and had a DL AP.

 

[irlandaise]

As to the girl being denied DAS, there as nothing in here video that tells me she can not wait in the stand-by line or utilize the wheelchair return time for those lines that are accessible. Yes she is disabled, no denying that. But if I am giving my honest opinion, she has seemed a little entitled.

You've hit the nail on the head, Christa. Does equal access mean simply being able to get on the ride, or does it also include being able to wait for the ride with your family?

 

[JerrodDragon89]

Except that same system is used for Rider Swap. It seems like Disney could say that the separation is no different than Rider Swap and thus makes the meet up with family the same or comparable. So if it's not right as an ADA accommodation then should Rider Swap be ended because it separates members of families/friends?

Disabilities you are born with or happen to you

Children are a choice and even if I agree on child swap would not matter anyway because this is not for people choosing a life style and coming to the park, its something the person has

 

[obsesseddisneyfan]

Disabilities you are born with or happen to you

Children are a choice and even if I agree on child swap would not matter anyway because this is not for people choosing a life style and coming to the park, its something the person has

Children are no longer a choice.... It's your choice to take them to Disney. Same with a Disability.

 

[JerrodDragon89]

Children are no longer a choice.... It's your choice to take them to Disney. Same with a Disability.

Agree to Disagree but you have to do something to make children and Disability are things you are born with or gain unwilling through no action on your own to me there is a clear difference

 

[nalababybear]

Annual G+ would address much of many folks issue. It was $150 for that option in the past for maxpass and folk would buy that in droves if offered again even in current G+ configuration without rerides. No clue why Disney doesn't do that. If they fear.overutilization, crank the price up. Or offer only at the highest tier as the add on option for $300. Whatever to price out for that superaccess.

The hard part of reasonable accommodations is that ADA is about accessibility, and in these cases, to rides with queues. It does nothing about the equity of waiting together with the entire party.

ADA does have a clause for a caretaker and many venues do expand this to a companion to attend with the person under ADA. Disney has been inconsistent with this application of its determination though and does lead to uncomfortable decisions like Disney suggesting a child over 7 can wait in the queue alone while an ADA adult accommodation with AQR needed, which is a nonstarter for many folk....yet that is the letter of the law and applicable....while sometimes a different solution would be applied by the ride CM.

I feel for the person on the video. She has a point with the MK holders not having a G+ option attached. Disney still is following ADA with the AQR accommodation, and if they consistently allow a companion and not force a child left in the queue situation most folk will find those sufficient nice things that Disney does beyond ADA requirements.

 

[lanejudy]

Disney has been inconsistent with this application of its determination though and does lead to uncomfortable decisions like Disney suggesting a child over 7 can wait in the queue alone while an ADA adult accommodation with AQR needed

I would say Disney Accessibility Team video CMs have been somewhat inconsistent in suggestions of how alternate accommodations work. Guests are told to ask at each attraction how to make that work, and I honestly haven’t seen a single real report where an adult was leaving a queue and was told the 7-yr-old had to stay and hold their place in the queue.

Video CMs, or even the in-person Accessibility Team at DLR, do not necessarily know how things work in the park. I understand that frustration on the guest part, but the whacky stories seem to come from the CM being pushed for an answer they literally don’t have. Ask at the attraction is the answer.

 

[joseph821]

I would say Disney Accessibility Team video CMs have been somewhat inconsistent in suggestions of how alternate accommodations work. Guests are told to ask at each attraction how to make that work, and I honestly haven’t seen a single real report where an adult was leaving a queue and was told the 7-yr-old had to stay and hold their place in the queue.

Video CMs, or even the in-person Accessibility Team at DLR, do not necessarily know how things work in the park. I understand that frustration on the guest part, but the whacky stories seem to come from the CM being pushed for an answer they literally don’t have. Ask at the attraction is the answer.

This situation is in flux. I suspect what will happen fairly soon will be a lawsuit against Disney Parks either from a tourist in FL or CA or both or a class action suit of guests being denied DAS. The case will be in federal court and Disney will have to suspend what it is doing now and revert to a "new" set of rules which will be the old way of doing things prior to the changes in May for WDW and June for DL.
Any litigation will bring major publicity to Disney which they will not like. After the litigation Disney will adopt new rules dealing with DAS.

We all know Disney did ths to cut down on the abuse of people using DAS that should not be which I agree with. Disney also wants people to buy G+.

I personally believe people with disabilities other then development should get DAS. For example, People with cancer, diabetes (type 1 and 2), severe medical diseases should be allowed access to DAS and be able to apply for DAS.

I personally think DIsney should do what Universal does with disabilties and have a private entity screen and issue decisions on disabilities PRIOR to a guest's trip to the Parks.

 

[Genie+]

Its not on Disney or any company to approve these, if they have a doctors note thats it

That being the sole criteria would not work. Probably why it is not a legal requirement.

Knowing their patients is where they are trained, not in park operations/accommodations.

 

[disneychrista]

I personally believe people with disabilities other then development should get DAS. People with cancer, diabetes (type 1 and 2), severe medical diseases should be allowed access to DAS.

My dad has diabetes. There is NOTHING about his condition that would make him unable to wait in a line.

 

[joseph821]

My dad has diabetes. There is NOTHING about his condition that would make him unable to wait in a line.

Understood. But that is your father. I know diabetics that have severe attacks of low blood sugar that could prevent them from waiting in a line. I also know diabetics that are solo travelers as well. When my late mom suffered from cancer she could wait in line and did but that was her and not everyone.
Das should be Guest specific.

 

[nalababybear]

I would say Disney Accessibility Team video CMs have been somewhat inconsistent in suggestions of how alternate accommodations work. Guests are told to ask at each attraction how to make that work, and I honestly haven’t seen a single real report where an adult was leaving a queue and was told the 7-yr-old had to stay and hold their place in the queue.

Video CMs, or even the in-person Accessibility Team at DLR, do not necessarily know how things work in the park. I understand that frustration on the guest part, but the whacky stories seem to come from the CM being pushed for an answer they literally don’t have. Ask at the attraction is the answer.

Yes, I agree that the reports we have seen at more 'what if' scenarios posed. Iirc there were reports of this at the line entrance too. But that was a month ago during then rollout.

The CMs both on the disability team and rode entrances have had a month now, and reports of these inconsistencies have indeed diminished thankfully.

Usage of confusing terms like rtq is lessened.

Understood. But that is your father. I know diabetics that have severe attacks of low blood sugar that could prevent them from waiting in a line. I also know diabetics that are solo travelers as well. When my late mom suffered from cancer she could wait in line and did but that was her and not everyone.
Das should be Guest specific.

And that's why it is a NEED specific accommodation, not a diagnosis based one.

A call to the team and review of the need to see what reasonable accommodation is available.

 

[joseph821]

Yes, I agree that the reports we have seen at more 'what if' scenarios posed. Iirc there were reports of this at the line entrance too. But that was a month ago during then rollout.

The CMs both on the disability team and rode entrances have had a month now, and reports of these inconsistencies have indeed diminished thankfully.

Usage of confusing terms like rtq is lessened.
And that's why it is a NEED specific accommodation, not a diagnosis based one.

A call to the team and review of the need to see what reasonable accommodation is available.

Agreed. But I think Disney should hire a private business like UNiversal to do this screening. And Disney would be out of the decision process making entirely. And I would not be surprised if the State of California does not get involved. CA can regulate DL via change in disability law and regulations and DL would be forced to comply.

I do think litigation will occur and force Disney to change its program and Disney needs to be very careful and prudent especially in California where the state would not hestitate to regulate theme parks. Florida is a different situation.

 

[lanejudy]

I personally believe people with disabilities other then development should get DAS.

Das should be Guest specific

DAS is guest specific, and more precisely, it is need specific based on each individual guest. DAS is not limited to developmental diagnoses and some with developmental disabilities will not receive DAS; DAS is not only for ASD and some with ASD will not receive DAS. DAS is granted for physical disabilities based on the needs presented.

 

[lanejudy]

hire a private business like UNiversal to do this screening. And Disney would be out of the decision process making entirely.

Universal only adds an extra layer with the third-party marketing firm. Universal TMs still make the determination of what accommodation is granted.

 

[joseph821]

DAS is guest specific, and more precisely, it is need specific based on each individual guest. DAS is not limited to developmental diagnoses and some with developmental disabilities will not receive DAS; DAS is not only for ASD and some with ASD will not receive DAS. DAS is granted for physical disabilities based on the needs presented.

From what I am seeing and hearing that is not the universal experience.
As for Universal, they yes determine the accomodation but they do not determine the disability and or eligibility. Disney determines eligibility and the accomodation.
As an attorney, this situation is not exactly perfect. And Disney is subjecting itself to liability. Disneyland's website does emphasize development disabilities as the trigger point.

https://accessibilitycard.org/

Who is Eligible to Register?​

Any Individual asking for accommodations can register for the IBCCES Accessibility Card. Examples of needs or accommodations requests include but are not limited to:​

Examples of Needs or Accommodations Requests

• Cannot stand in line for a long period of time
• Requires ride harness or other supports
• Sensory sensitivities
• Wheelchair access
• Physical or mobility restrictions
• Require visual assistance or guidance
• Special dietary needs

 

[nalababybear]

From what I am seeing and hearing that is not the universal experience.
As for Universal, they yes determine the accomodation but they do not determine the disability and or eligibility. Disney determines eligibility and the accomodation.
As an attorney, this situation is not exactly perfect. And Disney is subjecting itself to liability. Disneyland's website does emphasize development disabilities as the trigger point.

I

Disney cited it As an example, yes. It is not exclusive diagnosis by any means for DAS accommodation.

As you know, by relying on an outside diagnosis driven system, Universal and those theme parks are opening themselves to litigation by denial of access which ADA and other smiliar Federal.laws covering.

Yes. California can adopt more stringent regulations. It hasn't.