DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[sarahk0204]

I’m sorry but my mind is still blown that this is an all encompassing all rides all day pass I legitimately thought it was three rides and then the rest standby as I find that “reasonable” yeah I guess changes are on the way fast.

Maybe this is why. From Disney's website about Genie+

"Make the Most of Your Visit with Disney Genie+ Service"​

"Disney Genie+ service lets you use Lightning Lane entrances at select attractions and experiences. On average, Guests can enter 2 to 3 attractions or experiences per day using Lightning Lane entrances if the first selection is made early in the day."


I believe that the "2-3" language wasn't there originally when Genie+ rolled out, but was added later to temper guest expectations, especially since Genie+ is a paid service.

 

[Madteaparty001]

Maybe this is why. From Disney's website about Genie+

"Make the Most of Your Visit with Disney Genie+ Service"​

"Disney Genie+ service lets you use Lightning Lane entrances at select attractions and experiences. On average, Guests can enter 2 to 3 attractions or experiences per day using Lightning Lane entrances if the first selection is made early in the day."


I believe that the "2-3" language wasn't there originally when Genie+ rolled out, but was added later to temper guest expectations, especially since Genie+ is a paid service.

The fact that Disney has to put such low expectations on a paid service is what's mind boggling to me. I wonder what the average FP+ usage was per guest per day, that would be a very interesting comparison.

 

[lowlight]

You can cancel DAS, but it doesn't "open it up for someone else."

Is it possible it opens up a Genie+ spot?

 

[ajollyholidaywithjo]

I have not read all 160+ pages of this thread, so apologies if this has been mentioned. How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over? I heard they would offer that for people with GI disorders (I have one myself which is why I'm curious).

The way people get super upset at regular line jumpers, or people who leave and get back, I don't see this going over well...I once had to leave the standby line, because I had a flare-up and needed to run to the bathroom, and people were pissed at me when I met my party in line again. Someone even tried to refuse to let me pass. I'm wondering how Disney will handle that.

 

[CT Disney]

Do people who hold a Genie reservation say for Haunted Mansion not ride BTMRR or Pirates, etc. else even if there is a short standby line for another ride?

It’s not really fair to compare DAS with Genie+ since the latter is a paid upgrade. You really need to compare DAS with people simply using standby.

This is such a good point, I think a large portion of people think people of DAS are literally hopping from DAS time to DAS time at its earliest return times. Listen, sometimes it works out that, yes, you ride a ride and your get to your next DAS return time either just before or just after (also that shows more skill on ability to plan than anything, not abusing; but as lanejudy has said, there is times when I have a DAS time that has sat around for over an hour because I was in my Genie+ attraction at the moment, or went shopping for a bit, or I was unable to ride at the moment in a UC moment and party had to wait for me or they went into a short standby while I was unavailable.

I will add that this flexibility may be another perceived advantage of DAS over standby, and even over the paid Genie+ upgrade. People who purchase Genie+ have a strict return window. Many people miss their Genie+ window when they’ve been held up elsewhere.

 

[Gentry2004]

This is just my own opinion, but it’s based on 30+ years of observation and usage as a WDW regular… FP wasn't significantly better. FP+ was about on par with G+. All 3 created issues with crowding and congestion, as people who previously would have been steadily moving (as in, not standing in place for 20 mins at a time) through Standby lines were instead milling about in other areas. During busy times, the FP/FP+ lines backed up, just like LLs do now. As attendance increases, both Standby and LLs increase proportionately.

I fully admit to bias on this topic, but it’s informed bias - I’ve used every system they've had, and good ol’ Standby and Standby only was superior in every way, IMO! Problem is, people in lines don't spend as much money as people waiting outside of lines - hence FP/FP+. But what brings in even more money? Charging people to wait outside of the lines - enter G+.

We got WAY more FP+ return times in a day than G+. Refresh worked better, you could moved rides up, repeat rides, etc. so much better than G+!

 

[lanejudy]

Is it possible it opens up a Genie+ spot?

Doubtful because it never took a Genie+ spot. They are separate programs.

 

[lanejudy]

How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over?

There have been several hypotheses floated, but until Disney releases more information we really don't know.

 

[ajollyholidaywithjo]

There have been several hypotheses floated, but until Disney releases more information we really don't know.

True, I'm just here for people's hypotheses!

 

[starlite_]

I have not read all 160+ pages of this thread, so apologies if this has been mentioned. How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over? I heard they would offer that for people with GI disorders (I have one myself which is why I'm curious).

The way people get super upset at regular line jumpers, or people who leave and get back, I don't see this going over well...I once had to leave the standby line, because I had a flare-up and needed to run to the bathroom, and people were pissed at me when I met my party in line again. Someone even tried to refuse to let me pass. I'm wondering how Disney will handle that.

There has been lots of speculation and guesses but nothing is known. Until more info comes mods have asked everyone to stop speculating because it can be confusing for folks looking for real info.

 

[lanejudy]

True, I'm just here for people's hypotheses!

You're welcome to delve back through the prior 160 pages. We have asked posters to stop with hypotheticals because it was getting out of hand and divisive.

 

[sprem96]

I have not read all 160+ pages of this thread, so apologies if this has been mentioned. How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over? I heard they would offer that for people with GI disorders (I have one myself which is why I'm curious).

The way people get super upset at regular line jumpers, or people who leave and get back, I don't see this going over well...I once had to leave the standby line, because I had a flare-up and needed to run to the bathroom, and people were pissed at me when I met my party in line again. Someone even tried to refuse to let me pass. I'm wondering how Disney will handle that.

I have not read all pages either, but as the way it is written for now, seems like the intention is to possibly lump other disabilities into like everyone else. Hopefully this wont be the case, and they take the severity of the disability into account and offer some DAS or close to it. Nevermind, the issue of guests getting mad at you returning, I feel that there is 1 point that could be more concerning.
Every Joe Blow could take "bathroom breaks" then because it will be easier to acquire a pass for everyone to leave and come back which will be a CM nightmare, and abusers could potentially wait in other shorter lines (effectively building in their own DAS system and raising wait times across the board).

 

[lanejudy]

Every Joe Blow will take "bathroom breaks" then because it will be easier to acquire a pass for everyone to leave and come back which will be a CM nightmare

We don't know how Disney actually plans to institute whatever changes they have in mind... but I wanted to point out that "accommodations" do not need to be limited access to only those with disabilities. If there is an option available to all guests, that can be the accommodation. For example a ramp is there as accommodation for guests with mobility devices, but in most places using that ramp is not restricted to just the mobility devices. Another example is something that has become common at elementary schools -- students with IEPs may have had "breaks" periodically during the day as an accommodation; it was decided all kids could benefit from such and most classrooms now have some kind of "get up and get the wiggles out" for 1-2 minutes a few times a day (depending on the schedule). If Disney puts into place a plan or policy that allows guests to leave the line for the bathroom, that doesn't necessarily have to be restricted to only individuals with disabilities. It may be restricted, depending on how they implement it, and if it gives an extended return it may well be restricted. But everyone needs bathroom breaks and there have been several reports just on this thread of folks who have been allowed breaks to leave the line for the bathroom and then return. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that the "accommodation" may be more mainstreamed than restricted to disabilities.

 

[Tatebeck]

I think the large variable is the open-ended return time of DAS. You might obtain a DAS Return Time that allows you to return to the LL in 1 hour -- but in reality it could be 1.5 hours that you return or 3 hours later that you return.

This is such a good point, I think a large portion of people think people of DAS are literally hopping from DAS time to DAS time at it's earliest return times. Listen, sometimes it works out that, yes, you ride a ride and your get to your next DAS return time either just before or just after (also that shows more skill on ability to plan than anything, not abusing; but as lanejudy has said, there is times when I have a DAS time that has sat around for over an hour because I was in my Genie+ attraction at the moment, or went shopping for a bit, or I was unable to ride at the moment in a UC moment and party had to wait for me or they went into a short standby while I was unavailable.

I know the extended return makes it harder, it sounds like they just need to tweak it a bit if they are having the LL fill up too much with DAS users specifically. Instead of for example having their system expect 50% of the available return times to be used in the first hour after they are eligible to enter the LL, maybe bump it to expect 75%. Extending the wait time and spacing out DAS returns.

I'm sure they have the data for average tap in time for each ride after becoming LL eligible

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The fact that Disney has to put such low expectations on a paid service is what's mind boggling to me. I wonder what the average FP+ usage was per guest per day, that would be a very interesting comparison.

But keep in mind that with FP+ every park ticket came with 3 pre-booked FP+ options. And keep in mind that different strategies were at play with FP+ more so with park hoppers. And keep in mind that there were guests who did not realize they had 3 FPs included in their park ticket.

With Park Hoppers for example:

1) Pre-book for earlier in the day meant a higher likelihood of getting additional FPs beyond that
2) Pre-book for later in the day meant a lower likelihood of getting additional FPs beyond that

Typically speaking if you did option 2 it was because you were going for rides that had a higher wait time due to the time of day.

Most of the posters on this Board seem to feel more that the language written later on with Genie+ was because the playing field for guests was more level since you didn't pre-book anything. People were suddenly finding that they were not able to get many rides in OR they were conflicting with ADR plans. And with more guests utilizing (a HUGE part of the conversation) there were overall less return times available for a given guest. And this frustration from guests about how little rides they may have gotten with Genie+ occurred with "never been to Disney before" and veteran guests alike.

 

[nalababybear]

We don't know how Disney actually plans to institute whatever changes they have in mind... but I wanted to point out that "accommodations" do not need to be limited access to only those with disabilities. If there is an option available to all guests, that can be the accommodation. For example a ramp is there as accommodation for guests with mobility devices, but in most places using that ramp is not restricted to just the mobility devices. Another example is something that has become common at elementary schools -- students with IEPs may have had "breaks" periodically during the day as an accommodation; it was decided all kids could benefit from such and most classrooms now have some kind of "get up and get the wiggles out" for 1-2 minutes a few times a day (depending on the schedule). If Disney puts into place a plan or policy that allows guests to leave the line for the bathroom, that doesn't necessarily have to be restricted to only individuals with disabilities. It may be restricted, depending on how they implement it, and if it gives an extended return it may well be restricted. But everyone needs bathroom breaks and there have been several reports just on this thread of folks who have been allowed breaks to leave the line for the bathroom and then return. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that the "accommodation" may be more mainstreamed than restricted to disabilities.

Exactly. This is also a possible way forward to address the folk pushing through the line to 'rejoin' a party that they never were together while entering the line.

Party needs to enter the line together, some matter of virtual pass issued if need to leave, and a rejoin is allowed when virtual pass is presented at reentry.

This would be a welcomed change for general line management if deployed and available to all.

 

[Madteaparty001]

But keep in mind that with FP+ every park ticket came with 3 pre-booked FP+ options. And keep in mind that different strategies were at play with FP+ more so with park hoppers. And keep in mind that there were guests who did not realize they had 3 FPs included in their park ticket.

With Park Hoppers for example:

1) Pre-book for earlier in the day meant a higher likelihood of getting additional FPs beyond that
2) Pre-book for later in the day meant a lower likelihood of getting additional FPs beyond that

Typically speaking if you did option 2 it was because you were going for rides that had a higher wait time due to the time of day.

Most of the posters on this Board seem to feel more that the language written later on with Genie+ was because the playing field for guests was more level since you didn't pre-book anything. People were suddenly finding that they were not able to get many rides in OR they were conflicting with ADR plans. And with more guests utilizing (a HUGE part of the conversation) there were overall less return times available for a given guest. And this frustration from guests about how little rides they may have gotten with Genie+ occurred with "never been to Disney before" and veteran guests alike.

That's why having the numbers would be so interesting. What was the FP+ power users to those that didn't realize FP+ existed ratio? And what was the average usage number of FP+ among those that did use it. Comparing that number to G+ could very well show that G+ is a vastly inferior upcharge product. It reminds me of 'temporary' toll roads to help pay for the building costs of a new road, the costs are recouped but the toll never seems to go away. Now they're building rides with the anticipation of G+ revenue.

 

[SueM in MN]

Agreed, it's honestly the biggest boon about the whole thing for DD but I've seen how bad the lines get when a ride has to temporarily shut down. This happened on our last trip, SDMT went down at some point and when we went to check-in they warned us LL was an hour wait (standby was 2-3 hours posted wait) so we ended up doing something else but didn't give up the reservation. Came back later and it was still bad. Left the park for a break and dinner, came back and rode it when things had finally gotten back to normal.

Then there's the nightmare of how often Rise goes down. That went down while we had a reservation but had gone back up for something like 5 minutes than down again. Well that 5 minutes is enough for the app to say you could have redeemed it so it doesn't roll over into an anytime pass so you can't select a new ride unless you cancel. Had to go to a blue umbrella for that one and she said we fell into a 'crack in the system' that can sometimes happen before kindly giving us the anytime pass so we could move on with our day.

The biggest backups in the Lightning Lanes that I've seen have been related to attractions that go down frequently

Maybe this is why. From Disney's website about Genie+

"Make the Most of Your Visit with Disney Genie+ Service"​

"Disney Genie+ service lets you use Lightning Lane entrances at select attractions and experiences. On average, Guests can enter 2 to 3 attractions or experiences per day using Lightning Lane entrances if the first selection is made early in the day."


I believe that the "2-3" language wasn't there originally when Genie+ rolled out, but was added later to temper guest expectations, especially since Genie+ is a paid service.

I don't remember exactly when the 2-3 attractions language was added, but I think it was well over 6 months ago. I do know it was to temper expectations - because of how it was marketed, many people expected to use it to get on any attraction all day without waiting. Many 'power users' who understand how it works are able to use it on WAY, WAY more than 2-3 attractions. But, many guests don't understand how to use it effectively are only getting 2-3.

I have not read all 160+ pages of this thread, so apologies if this has been mentioned. How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over? I heard they would offer that for people with GI disorders (I have one myself which is why I'm curious).

The way people get super upset at regular line jumpers, or people who leave and get back, I don't see this going over well...I once had to leave the standby line, because I had a flare-up and needed to run to the bathroom, and people were pissed at me when I met my party in line again. Someone even tried to refuse to let me pass. I'm wondering how Disney will handle that.

We don't have any facts about that yet.
We don't know if it will be the same process for 'general guests' needing to leave the line as for guests who need to leave the line due to a disability.
We also don't know if processes people said they followed in the past will be the same or different

 

[audrey2580]

I have not read all 160+ pages of this thread, so apologies if this has been mentioned. How do we think the "return to line" option is going to go over? I heard they would offer that for people with GI disorders (I have one myself which is why I'm curious).

The way people get super upset at regular line jumpers, or people who leave and get back, I don't see this going over well...I once had to leave the standby line, because I had a flare-up and needed to run to the bathroom, and people were pissed at me when I met my party in line again. Someone even tried to refuse to let me pass. I'm wondering how Disney will handle that.

This exactly. Now trying being a teen with Crohns and see how this flies. We had a group of men at Disneyland refuse to let my son pass after he left to use the bathroom. They told him his party should come back to him.
There are endless post on Dis about people refusing to let people pass them to join their party. People proud of it.

My speculation is that the person will not reenter the regular line to find you, but will reenter through the lightning lane and wait for their party.
Similar to this: https://attractionsmagazine.com/star-wars-galaxys-edge-bathrooms/

 

[Wojodis]

Not sure if anyone has run into this--If you have an active DAS from the end of March and have plans to return in the beginning of May--do you have to re-register? I'm assuming we should be ok as we still have access to the little window for in park selections through the app.