Central Park “Karen”

There seems to be some confusion here, as I am not sure you are 'correcting' what was said by the PP. The PP did not say Hitler started the war because he hated Jews.

The Nazis did not did not plan on the Final Solution at first. That was at the Wansee Conference of January 1942. It came about because they were so successful. Germany was something like 4% Jewish, so rounding up Jews posed little logistical problem. But once they were rounding up most of the Jews of Europe, they were inundated. Auschwitz I was a former Polish army base and was not designed as a death camp, though certainly people were executed there. Later, they had to purpose-build Auschwitz II (Birkinau) as a POW/work camp, and they made it into a death camp in March of 1942 (two months after Wansee) in order to gas Jews immediately upon arrival. So anti-semitism absolutely did lead to the Holocaust. The PP is correct.

You are correct if you say it was not only Jews as their targets. The Nazis planned to enslave all Poles and build factories around Auschwitz where the Poles would perform slave labor.

I was saying that it was not Hitler's racism that caused him to try to take over the world. BTW, Hitler hated pretty much everyone, not just the Jewish people. His goal was to get rid of anyone the was not his ideal race. That is just one of his many issues. And what the problem is that everyone seems to think that it was only the Jews that were sent to the camps and killed. It was EVERYONE. Many members of my family included. My grandma(who is 93) was actually a slave for the Germans. She would gladly tell people what it was really like. Over the years when I have told people my family's story, 100% of people thought that we were Jewish because they had been taught that ONLY the Jews were targeted. The more times that truth is told, the more people realize that they have not learned the whole story.
 
And the Germanic people that they liked had to be perfect. No abnormalities at all or else they would be gassed as well.
Quite true and Germans, imperfect in body, spiritual or political beliefs by Nazi standards, were the first people they killed.
 
And the Germanic people that they liked had to be perfect. No abnormalities at all or else they would be gassed as well.
Of the 1.3 million people exterminated at Birkneau, 1.1 million were Jews. So yes, other people died, but it was not a factor in creating the death camps in the first place. That came from the Wansee Conference specifically aimed at the Jews.
 
I was saying that it was not Hitler's racism that caused him to try to take over the world. BTW, Hitler hated pretty much everyone, not just the Jewish people. His goal was to get rid of anyone the was not his ideal race. That is just one of his many issues. And what the problem is that everyone seems to think that it was only the Jews that were sent to the camps and killed. It was EVERYONE. Many members of my family included. My grandma(who is 93) was actually a slave for the Germans. She would gladly tell people what it was really like. Over the years when I have told people my family's story, 100% of people thought that we were Jewish because they had been taught that ONLY the Jews were targeted. The more times that truth is told, the more people realize that they have not learned the whole story.

You're seriously overestimating your ability to know what "everyone seems to think". Many people have an understanding of the horrors of the Perfect Solution, for some of us it's also personal, sometimes including pruning on multiple branches of family the family tree, for a variety of reasons.
 


Quite true and Germans, imperfect in body, spiritual or political beliefs by Nazi standards, were the first people they killed.
German that were not Jewish were indeed vicitimized, but mostly by fear. In fact, an initial protest in Berlin by Aryans stopped the Nazis from rounding up Jews married to Aryans.
 
Even Germans were vicitimized, yes, anyone who opposed the Nazis.

But we should not lump Nazi 'lack of regard' for Hungarians (as one example), with the rounding up of Jews. Hungarian Christians were not rounded up, and they were able to save some Jews through conversion. Germany had a lesser military presence in Hungary (as opposed to Poland and Slovakia), and approximately half of Budapest's Jews were saved. The only Slovak Jews that survived went to places like Budapest where there was some hope for survivial.
A fascist political party called the Arrow Cross or maybe Iron Arrow deposed the existing Hungarian government towards the end of the war and killed outright or deported many Hungarian Jews and gypsies as well as others who did not agree with their rule and beliefs. Those who were deported generally wound up in exterminating camps under German rule.
There is hardly any European country that I can think of were some Jews were saved by Christians or Muslims. The country with the best record in % of population is Denmark which under cover of night shipped most of the country's Jewish population to Sweden rather than turn them over to the Nazis.

I view WW2 as the beginning of modern day genocide although the Armenians would surely and rightly dispute that since they were decimated with purpose by the Turks during WW1. Many thought that their extermination was an anomaly at the time.

As Shakespeare said: "What a piece of work is man.."
 
German that were not Jewish were indeed vicitimized, but mostly by fear. In fact, an initial protest in Berlin by Aryans stopped the Nazis from rounding up Jews married to Aryans.
Going to respectfully disagree with you. Yes, there were loud criticisms and protests by Germans of different mindsets and they won some skirmishes at the start but that ended quickly when Hitler became the head of the government, consolidated power, and the Nuremberg Laws were enacted. Those laws codified who was a German citizen and who was not. There is a reason why after the Allies conquered Germany major war trials were held in Nuremberg.
 


I agree that the protests stopped and the Germans themselves were victimized by Hitler. Still, those gassed were (by far) the Jewish population.
 
You're seriously overestimating your ability to know what "everyone seems to think". Many people have an understanding of the horrors of the Perfect Solution, for some of us it's also personal, sometimes including pruning on multiple branches of family the family tree, for a variety of reasons.

Almost every single person that I have talked to has said that they did not realize that non-Jewish Polish people were also sent to the camps or were just outright slaughtered. Many have no idea that people were taken as slaves. NOT ONE PERSON has known this. I am sure there are some who do know it, probably because, as you say, they have a personal family connection. My saying that other's were also targeted does not take away from those who were, only that there was not just the 1 group of people that were victimized in this.
 
Almost every single person that I have talked to has said that they did not realize that non-Jewish Polish people were also sent to the camps or were just outright slaughtered. Many have no idea that people were taken as slaves. NOT ONE PERSON has known this. I am sure there are some who do know it, probably because, as you say, they have a personal family connection. My saying that other's were also targeted does not take away from those who were, only that there was not just the 1 group of people that were victimized in this.

I have no idea where you’re from, but I don’t know anybody that doesn’t know this. It boggles my mind that you don’t know anyone that knows that the Nazis killed people other than Jews. And no, most of the people I know don’t have a “personal family connection” to people who were killed.
 
Almost every single person that I have talked to has said that they did not realize that non-Jewish Polish people were also sent to the camps or were just outright slaughtered. Many have no idea that people were taken as slaves. NOT ONE PERSON has known this. I am sure there are some who do know it, probably because, as you say, they have a personal family connection. My saying that other's were also targeted does not take away from those who were, only that there was not just the 1 group of people that were victimized in this.
I know mostly because I've done a lot of reading about WW2 particularly the European theater. As well I watch a lot of films based on the war and visit museums whose exhibits tell the full story. The US Holocaust Museum documents all victims, not only one.
Poland was between a rock and a hard place during the war with Germany on one end and the USSR the other. When the Poles rose to drive the Nazis out of Warsaw the Russians waited just outside the city and killed in mass many of the surviving partisans and army personnel. The German army also razed the city before they withdrew.
 
Update from Minneapolis:
We are all now on curfew. The rioting continues in the city proper but now the looting and violence has been speculated to move to the suburbs, based on social media.
Very scary here.
Not sure what the violence and destruction of fellow citizens property has to do with the issue with the LE.
Prayers are appreciated.
Thank you!
 
Update from Minneapolis:
We are all now on curfew. The rioting continues in the city proper but now the looting and violence has been speculated to move to the suburbs, based on social media.
Very scary here.
Not sure what the violence and destruction of fellow citizens property has to do with the issue with the LE.
Prayers are appreciated.
Thank you!

It doesn't really have much to do with protesting per se. I've seen the beginning of a riot before, and there are basically people who just want an excuse to cause mayhem when they feel that the chance of getting caught is lower when they have numbers.
 
Update from Minneapolis:
We are all now on curfew. The rioting continues in the city proper but now the looting and violence has been speculated to move to the suburbs, based on social media.
Very scary here.
Not sure what the violence and destruction of fellow citizens property has to do with the issue with the LE.
Prayers are appreciated.
Thank you!
The violence will not move to the suburbs. That's always the threat, but it doesn't happen.

Stay OUT of the affected areas.

Hopefully, authorities have perimetered those areas and are not allowing innocent victims to enter. If they haven't, it's going to get really ugly.

The violence and destruction don't have much to do with the police. The looting is just opportunism. The violence and arson are just blind rage with an opportunity to act out.

If the police don't go in and stop the rioting, it will continue and get worse for several days. Only law-abiding people obey curfews, and they're not the problem.
 
Almost every single person that I have talked to has said that they did not realize that non-Jewish Polish people were also sent to the camps or were just outright slaughtered. Many have no idea that people were taken as slaves. NOT ONE PERSON has known this. I am sure there are some who do know it, probably because, as you say, they have a personal family connection. My saying that other's were also targeted does not take away from those who were, only that there was not just the 1 group of people that were victimized in this.
like I said before, 1.1 million of 1.3 million who died in Auschwitz were Jews. Which is not to say that is the totality of the slaughter, but it does mean that the existence of the gas chambers is directly related to the extermination of Jews.

Many people know little about history... in case you haven't seen it, this is actually a pretty darn accurate snl sketch:

 
It doesn't really have much to do with protesting per se. I've seen the beginning of a riot before, and there are basically people who just want an excuse to cause mayhem when they feel that the chance of getting caught is lower when they have numbers.
When you talk and are ignored, you shout. When you shout and are ignored, you scream. And when you scream and are ignored, you start throwing things. Rioting has to do with not being listened to.
 
When you talk and are ignored, you shout. When you shout and are ignored, you scream. And when you scream and are ignored, you start throwing things. Rioting has to do with not being listened to.

I've seen enough riots to know there are people just thrive off of anarchy. But it's not just that, but for many it's just and excuse to start stealing things when it seems that the chances of being caught are slim.
 
The violence will not move to the suburbs. That's always the threat, but it doesn't happen.

Stay OUT of the affected areas.

Hopefully, authorities have perimetered those areas and are not allowing innocent victims to enter. If they haven't, it's going to get really ugly.

The violence and destruction don't have much to do with the police. The looting is just opportunism. The violence and arson are just blind rage with an opportunity to act out.

If the police don't go in and stop the rioting, it will continue and get worse for several days. Only law-abiding people obey curfews, and they're not the problem.
Not true, it moved to the suburbs.
This is not about protesting and honoring Mr. Floyd, it is blind rage without any rationale. Any form of LE is being blamed for anything that is going on. We know the majority of our LE is great.
The issue is that any semblance of trying to control the rioting is viewed as what is viewed as the initial problem.
The media is not helpful at all.

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2020...-at-minneapolis-police-5th-precinct-building/
 
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No excuse for the rioters. They might be frustrated and understandably so but most people don't hurt innocent people to express that frustration. At least that's what I choose to believe.
 

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