Can someone talk me OUT of purchasing a DVC membership???

[ToddyLu]

They need to make this thread a sticky for a thoughtful look into reasons not to purchase DVC.

DH and I do not have children. After my first trip in 2002 at the ripe age of 34 I was hooked on WDW.. DH was happy to go along because he does not like to travel and WDW is only about a 9 hour drive for us. I have been to NYC, Wash DC, Grand Canyon, multiple countries in Europe, etc. I have found that at WDW DH gets a little relaxation, I get my "trip around the world"...yada, yada, yada. What I didn't realize going in was how much owning DVC would change our trips. Now we enjoy AKV for the amenities and just having a drink looking out over the pool or savanna. We do not have to go to a park....which is an awesome way to enjoy WDW actually. Our situation is completely different from yours. I love our DVC points now as much or more than I did when we purchased them.

This has been one of the best conversations against DVC that I have read on the DIS. Continue to enjoy your trips, continue to enjoy finding new ways to vacation with your family...I have a feeling....WDW and DVC will be available for many years into the future should you change your mind.

 

[Brian Noble]

Why Brian, that's the most charitable post I've ever seen you write about DVC.

You missed the one last month where I told someone that they should buy Poly direct.

 

[minnie45]

Nope....I absolutely love my DVC membership!!!

 

[codina818]

You can never have enough points.. so always buy more than u think you need

 

[pbarager]

There's also a big wide world out there, and WDW is just a part of it. We've had fantastic vacations to Alaska, Rocky Mountain NP, Smoky Mountain NP, Sedona/Grand Canyon, the Outer Banks, and Paris. Over the next year and a half we also have plans to visit Hilton Head and Hawaii. Farther in the future we expect to visit Italy. You can do some of those with DVC, but not very efficiently in most cases.

Well said. We came very close to purchasing DVC in 2012 but we paused and did some research. Our family loves Disney but there was the chance the kids would like to see other great places. We ended up purchasing Wyndham points resale so we could see Disney every year or a ton of other awesome destinations. We have so little money invested in Wyndham and great flexibility if things change.

 

[suebeelin]

Well said. We came very close to purchasing DVC in 2012 but we paused and did some research. Our family loves Disney but there was the chance the kids would like to see other great places. We ended up purchasing Wyndham points resale so we could see Disney every year or a ton of other awesome destinations. We have so little money invested in Wyndham and great flexibility if things change.

Just wondering... If you buy resale at Wyndham or marriot, what are the perks vs restrictions? In a few years the kids will be old enough to travel, and we may do Disney every other year. Our destinations would be LA, Bay Area/SF, New Orleans, Seattle/Portland and the like. Would a hotel timeshare via resale work? Just curious. I only know about dvc.

 

[Dizduke]

You missed the one last month where I told someone that they should buy Poly direct.

Do you have a link to that thread?

 

[pbarager]

Just wondering... If you buy resale at Wyndham or marriot, what are the perks vs restrictions? In a few years the kids will be old enough to travel, and we may do Disney every other year. Our destinations would be LA, Bay Area/SF, New Orleans, Seattle/Portland and the like. Would a hotel timeshare via resale work? Just curious. I only know about dvc.

We can't use our points for cruises ( not worth it anyway) and resale points do not count towards VIP status. We have just under 300,000 points every year that we paid under $1000, compared to the tens of thousands it will cost from a developer. 7 nights in a 2 bedroom deluxe at Bonnet Creek in December runs about 112,000 points! Check out www.tugbbs.com it is a great place to get true info on all timeshare systems.

 

[suebeelin]

We can't use our points for cruises ( not worth it anyway) and resale points do not count towards VIP status. We have just under 300,000 points every year that we paid under $1000, compared to the tens of thousands it will cost from a developer. 7 nights in a 2 bedroom deluxe at Bonnet Creek in December runs about 112,000 points! Check out www.tugbbs.com it is a great place to get true info on all timeshare systems.

Do you have to do bonnet creek? We have 2 dvc properties already (200pts each BLT and BWV). Wanted to branch into other timeshares.... If it's worth it. I'll check out the site! Thx

 

[pbarager]

Do you have to do bonnet creek? We have 2 dvc properties already (200pts each BLT and BWV). Wanted to branch into other timeshares.... If it's worth it. I'll check out the site! Thx

You can stay anywhere in the Wyndham system. We have stayed in Nashville, Great Smokies Lodge, Myrtle Beach and Vegas so far.

 

[Brian Noble]

Do you have a link to that thread?

My mistake: it was GFV, not PVB
http://www.disboards.com/threads/be...-am-i-making-a-mistake.3372086/#post-52942558

You can stay anywhere in the Wyndham system. We have stayed in Nashville, Great Smokies Lodge, Myrtle Beach and Vegas so far.

There are very few places where home-resort priority really matters in the Wyndham system: Daytona for race weekend, New Orleans for Mardi Gras or Sugar Bowl, Glacier Canyon and some of the Myrtle Beach resorts in the summer, etc. I even managed to get a 2BR for Easter Week at Old Town Alexandria in Washington DC.

 

[heb]

your other questions were well covered.
we originally bought in 1999, and have found the flexibility of DVC one of the most important parts.
we used to stay every late august in a BWV 1bdrm (family of 4 - 1 week). fast forward 16 years: now 30yo DD & i go every may for the F&GF, staying in a bw view studio for 11-14 days, and DH & i meet up with friends every October for the F&WF, BW view studio (yup, we found our happy place) for another 11-14 days. our villa sizes & times of year have greatly changed since 1999 - and DVC's point (vs fixed week/unit) system have accommodated our changing travel. a very few times, we have "rented" some of our points, & made a small profit; we've also gifted a few wonderful vacations for loved ones.
so yes, 19 years later, & we still enjoy our DVC points, staying longer, relaxing, enjoying the resort more with the parks just an added attraction.
btw, we just added more BWV points, with DD on this one .

Laurie, thank you for this answer! This sounds so much like our family - we go for 6 nights each year in late August (though this year will do a shorter trip in October so our youngest can finally have his chance to be the birthday boy at Disney). As our boys (11, 14 and almost 15) get older, I foresee the days when DH and I will take multiple "honeymoon" trips per year to WDW, and the years beyond that when we can take our grandchildren. For exactly the reasons you outlined, we are considering DVC. It seems like the points system will give us the flexibility to change our Disney vacations as our family grows.

 

[Ashlotte]

This is an old thread, but I just wanted to thank the people that wrote such thoughtful answers. I have been toying with the idea of DVC for a few weeks now. We have a WorldMark timeshare and were lucky enough to be able to trade into DVC via RCI with it three times in one year- SSR, OKW, and Aulani. The Aulani trip was absolutely amazing (and very unlikely to pop up as a trade again), and the real reason I am toying with the idea of DVC. Realistically, though, DVC doesn't make logical sense for us, as much as I want it to. The kids are turning 11 and 13 this year and we are mostly Disneyland people, due to the much shorter (and less expensive) flight, so locking in to a WDW property (we would buy an SSR resale contract, if we were to buy) is not good planning. Sigh.... I REALLY loved Aulani. I would like to just live in the lazy river there.

 

[bwvBound]

This is an old thread, but I just wanted to thank the people that wrote such thoughtful answers. I have been toying with the idea of DVC for a few weeks now. We have a WorldMark timeshare and were lucky enough to be able to trade into DVC via RCI with it three times in one year- SSR, OKW, and Aulani. The Aulani trip was absolutely amazing (and very unlikely to pop up as a trade again), and the real reason I am toying with the idea of DVC. Realistically, though, DVC doesn't make logical sense for us, as much as I want it to. The kids are turning 11 and 13 this year and we are mostly Disneyland people, due to the much shorter (and less expensive) flight, so locking in to a WDW property (we would buy an SSR resale contract, if we were to buy) is not good planning. Sigh.... I REALLY loved Aulani. I would like to just live in the lazy river there.

Hey, Ashlotte -- we live near'ish Disneyland, have owned Worldmark since 2000 (truly love our WM!), have traded into BWV ~8x through RCI or II over the years, purchased SSR in 2004 and have used our DVC points at Aulani. It is all good ... go for it!

 

[gluestickgirl]

I wanted to add our story, because we approached our decision to buy from a different direction than most. Our kids are older (8, 12, 15), and we didn't make our first trip till 2013. We can already see a future without the long Disney trips we've enjoyed over the past few years. We want to travel to other places, the older kids are going on school trips, we're forced into the busier season as school gets more challenging - and working w/ their schedules is more challenging too! On top of that, we tend to stay in moderates. Yes, we're the crazy people who don't mind 5 in a hotel room, because all we do is sleep there.

So why the heck did we buy DVC?

DH and I love WDW, and plan on taking a short trip alone each year - and we're totally going deluxe for that. We also like the idea of adding a couple of days at a deluxe to the end of a trip w/ our kids - we did it in March, and it was a great way to wind down a long vacation. We spent a lot of time at the pool and taking advantage of the resort and pool and just popped into the parks for "one more time" rides on our favorites. So we felt comfortable saying that for the next 10 years (and likely beyond, but that's where our break even fell), one of those two scenarios would be sure to happen.

We bought (or, really, are not so patiently in the process of buying) a small resale contract at the Poly, because it's our hands down favorite resort. We have enough points to take care of a long weekend or a couple days w/ the kids each year. No, it won't take care of all of our lodging - but it won't put us in a position where we're looking to downsize in a few years when our kids start college.

At least for now, being a DVC members lets us buy discounted annual passes - and with a family of 5, that can be a significant savings. And that AP lets us get discounts on the moderate room we'll book for longer trips with the kids. I realize that nothing is guaranteed with these discounts, and we didn't take them into account when we were running numbers. We're viewing them as a bonus, and will certainly take advantage while we can. Oh, and let's not forget the TiW card - even with last year's price increase, we more than break even with it.

Admittedly, we are new to this. In 5 years we might think it was the worst decision we've made. But we've done everything to hedge our bets towards it working for us and our situation, and I think we're going to enjoy it.

 

[Disneybuckeye]

My two cents on how and why we did buy.

We bought a small resale at VWL when our youngest was a junior in HS. My family owns a house near the beach by Naples, and we thought DH and I would just tag some Disney time on the end of those vacations.

Fast forward 8 years, 4 contracts, and a whole lot of vacations later. We now own at VWL and BWV. We have taken short trips with all three of kids in two bedrooms. Long trips with just DH and I in studios (Boardwalk view for Food and Wine coming up this fall), and this past December an extended family trip in multiple rooms at SSR. Dh just told me he thought we should add on SSR points so we can do that again and stay longer. We spend minimal amount of time at Naples as we have plenty of water time at our lake house in the summer and when we go to Hilton Head every other year.

Some years we do multiple trips with one AP, and some years we do minimal park days and lots of resort time. I have adult beverages delivered by Garden Grocer. We own a separate time share that we alternate years between Hilton Head and skiing in Colorado, so Disney is not our only vacation destination to bore us. We also spend a long weekend every year in CA, Boston, NY, DC, Chicago, or some other large city as my husband travels a lot for work and I tag along.

I love our DVC and have no idea if we save money or not. I also don't care. I enjoy our time there and that is what is important to me.

 

[ziravan]

My family and I just got back from a fantastic vacation at WDW and since we stayed in a 2 bedroom villa at OKW for approx. $2,900 for a week (that was with 40% off--my brother has a connection who was able to give us a discount), I decided to do some research into owning DVC points to see if it would make sense for our family. We have 4 children, ages 3, 6, 9 and 11 and they had never been to Disney before; it would be an understatement to say that they were blown away! I was too!!!! My husband and I grew up in Orlando and of course, Disney had no attraction for us as we got older and moved away, but wow a lot has changed in the 20 years since we've last been there. It was all very familiar but a lot more amazing than what I remember... I couldn't believe Downtown Disney!

Anyway, my children have already planned that they want to go back in 2016, 2018 and 2019 (we can't go in 2017 because my husband won't have enough time off). As my older son remarked, "How could we go anywhere else?". I totally agreed with him. We all had a blast from the 3 year old on up.

So since we already know that we'd like to go back 3 more times in rapid succession, I decided to run the numbers and based on what I have, owning DVC points SORT OF makes sense. I say "sort of" because the numbers weren't bad (not a huge win for DVC but I can definitely see how it makes sense for long term usage), but it's the commitment to a Disney vacation that's the issue and I'm trying to get more clarity on that.

I compared purchasing 220 points for a 2 bedroom villa at OKW to paying cash each year for the same through renting points at David's (both the rental cost at David's and the 40% off rack rate discount that I got end up being about the same, and I can't always assume I'll get that 40% off). By year 8, we will start to see a savings over what we're paying but based on my numbers, those savings aren't huge. For instance, in year 8 of owning the DVC we will have spent $25,984 total for our DVC ownership (this is assuming a 3.5% increase in annual fees). If we pay cash and assume a 3.5% increase each year in room rates, then on our 8th visit to WDW we will have spent $27,499. In year 9 of owning our DVC we will have spent $27,588; if we paid cash as free people we would have spent $31,499. Here are my questions:

1. Is that $1,500 savings after 8 visits or $4,000 after 9 visits really a savings when it comes with the cost of inflexibility and uncertainty with where life will take you? Maybe looked at differently, for just $5,500 you can vacation wherever you want (or not at all) for the next 9 years! Is it a big savings for a vacation or a small price to pay for freedom?

2. Are there people out there who totally regret it? I'm assuming there are many of those of who do because they're the ones selling their points on the resale market I've been looking at!

3. What about selling if we decide it's not for us? I know Disney has ROFR but will they exercise that option as much as contracts get closer to the exp. date? For instance, if we purchase an OKW contract that expires in 2042 and we decide to sell in 10 years because it doesn't suit us anymore...we're selling a contract that only has 16 years left on it. Do you think there will be any buyers for that? Should we assume we're in it for the long haul after 10 years and our only option would be to recoup annual fees by renting out points? Maybe that's just a guessing game since there's no history to refer back to.

Anyway, I'm looking for opinions to help me gain some clarity. I'm so intrigued by the idea but I feel like I haven't been convinced that it's a great idea or that it's a terrible idea. I'm not looking for platitudes like "It worked for us, but it may not work for everyone." I need real opinions! Did you crunch the numbers and wonder if you were really going to love it after 10 years and it turns out you did? I'm using 10 years as my base number because by that time my youngest will be 13 and my oldest will be 21...will we still want a Disney vacation? What about people who went for it and were totally surprised at the use they got out of it? Will it be great to own to give as a gift to our adult children when they want to take their children or we take the grandchildren...should I really be thinking that far out??? I also don't agree with comparing the money we'd spend on a DVC to what we could make if we invested the money because that argument assumes that no vacations will be taken, DVC or otherwise so to me it's just not a logical argument to make. I'm basing my calculations on the fact that money will be spent each year on a family vacation...the big question is: Should it be at a DVC resort????

Didn't realize this was an older thread until after I posted:

I own BCV, Poly, and Wyndham points. I'm a huge fan of DVC and I recommend it if it fits.

I would suggest given your situation to look at Wyndham points to stay at Bonnet Creek:

1. You can find points for next to nothing on eBay. We bought 287,000 points in 2 contracts for $500 total and that included closing and transfer fees. MFs are $1600 and it's enough points to stay in a 2BR for a week and have points left over depending on when we go.

2. Bonnet Creek is on Disney. If you drive/rent and buy APs (good for two years if timed right, ex. 3rd week of Mar one year, 2nd week of Mar next) then parking is covered as well.

3. You don't have to buy Bonnet Creek to stay there. Wyndham has 13 month/10 month windows and Bonnet Creek is a large resort. We own points at other resorts, and we don't have problems staying at BC. Buy were MF are cheaper.

4. Wyndham allows other stays in other places as kids get older. We just stayed at Wyndham National Harbor in D.C. Great trip. There are more than 50 Club Wyndham locations.

I know this isn't the right forum for discussing other timeshares. I usually don't for that reason. Given your kids' ages, your need for 2brs, and other things you've said, I got the idea that going back to Disney was more important than being on site.

 

[pmaurer74]

I think you have done the financial research. You aren't planning to buy direct, so the Disney financing (rip off) isn't an issue.

The biggest complaints are (1) you have to book 6-11 months in advance (Probably 2-3 at OKW) (2) you have to pay for your park tickets (Which you have already figured out) (3) No free dining (You already figured this out) (4) It's hard to trade into certain resorts at certain times (If you are happy with OKW then you will be ok). You say you just got back. If you went in January, you should have no problems staying at most places. If you were there over Christmas, it will be a bit tougher to trade. (5) There is no value in trading it out (You look like you are staying onsite at a DVC property so that isn't an issue) (6) Some people are not comfortable renting points. You are somewhat responsible for your renters even though you don't know them. (7) You are paying for MFs every year. These can be thought of as pre-paying your hotel room in January, but for those that don't plan as well, they can sneak up on you.

Note that there are two expiry dates for OKW 2042 and 2057. It is really unknown what is going to happen to the 2042 contracts when they expire. The resale value in 10 years is an unknown but as you can see a value in a 10 year window, there is still that option for someone else with 16 years left. Actually, there might not be a drop in value as someone might see only committing to 16 years as a benefit. My gut feeling (and mine only) is that you should be safe to think you will recoup 50% of what you paid in 10 years (assuming you don't overpay now )

I have not written this to try to talk you out of anything or into anything, just providing the facts I can. You will find most people in this forum like (or love) their DVC and those selling did so for financial reasons (It's nice to say you will take annual vacations for the next 10 years, but life changes).

I think if the contract was worth 50% of its value in ten years, I would be tempted to not sell. In my case, just having spent 17k six months ago, if my contract was worth only $8,500 in ten years, I would still have 16 years of trips for only $8,500! (of course plus MFs)

 

[jerseyduke]

No need to even do the math really. DVC will not save you money. Look at it from the simplest way: for you to save money, that would mean spending less at the House of Mouse, correct? Do you think Disney is going to enable that????

Talking with someone from a large department store, i was told that market data tells them when people use a gift card, they on average spend 50% more than the value of the gift card.

Retailers pay 2 to 3 percent or more for credit card transactions. Yet they do so willingly. Why? Because people will spend more money on a CC than they will when using cash.

Everything done is to make more money not less.

That being said, a few notes:
1. 40% off rack rate is optimistic. Disney has been lessening the savings since the economy has improved. 30% seems to be the max, and most off the time I check, rooms are not available. This was not the case in 2010, 2011 etc.

2. Sure some people totally regret it. but that is only one reason to sell your points. and if i had to guess i would say the minority of the cases.

3. Someone probably has data on this, but i do believe rack rates have gone up faster than maintenance fees. Also remember if both MFs and rack room prices increase at 3.5%, then the rack room rate really increases 3.94%, don't forget the 12.5% tax that goes onto rack room prices and not MFs! (that always gets overlooked)

4. Say MFs are 1000 this year. Rack Rate is 2700. a 1700$ difference in dollars. next year the dif is 1759.50. after 15 years it is a difference of 2848$ Include the hotel tax and the difference next year is 2108. 15 years from now it is 3413. That hotel tax is an important part of a calculation!

5. As a potential seller, disney's approach to ROFR has ZERO significance. it only matters to the buyer.

6. As contracts near their end of life, they will still have value. Go back to #4. Let's say that is a beach club contract (that would be a low starting rack rate!!!) Anyway, it is now 2032, 10 years left on the contract. The difference between dues and rack is 3414$ keeping that the same for 10 years (even though it should widen even more), that contract 'saves' someone $34,140 over the next ten years. Someone will surely pay 15K to 20k for that.

 

[Ashlotte]

Hey, Ashlotte -- we live near'ish Disneyland, have owned Worldmark since 2000 (truly love our WM!), have traded into BWV ~8x through RCI or II over the years, purchased SSR in 2004 and have used our DVC points at Aulani. It is all good ... go for it!

I would love to hear more from you! We have owned WorldMark since 2006 and really love it (especially when we have used it to trade into DVC!). I'm wondering what a good balance of each timeshare would be? We have 20,000 points at WM (started with 7,000, added to 12,000, and now are at 20,000 (for non-WM people, 20,000 is enough typically for two weeks in a two-bedroom, or two week long exchanges into two-bedrooms)). I think if we bought into DVC, we'd only be using it every other year for Aulani or WDW. Historically we've been to Disneyland every year (that we didn't go to WDW), but the WorldMark Anaheim (or even cheaper, WorldMark Dolphin's Cove) are easier and cheaper to stay at than VGC, even if I were a DVC owner. Although if VGC were open, I'd jump on it in a heartbeat! So maybe 150 points of DVC would be right? We've been spoiled by condos over the last year and I don't think any of us would happily stay in a studio, so a one-bedroom would be right, every other year.