After seeing Atlantis for the third time, I have some thoughts...

[All Aboard]

We saw Atlantis for the third time last night. (Well, I had to see it at LEAST as many times as I saw Shrek, right?) After reading so much about the turmoil at Disney Animation recently, I watched it from a slightly different perspective. This time I wanted to follow the story, look past the action, look past the color and visual splendor and focus tightly on the story. Too bad I did this, because I was disappointed.

Early we see just a hint of Milo's passion for seeking Atlantis, we get just a flavor for how we admired his grandfather. But that's it. Sure he's excited about the possibility of going on a voyage to Atlantis, but are we excited for him? Not really, because we were never really given the chance to see how much it meant to him. We saw just a snipit of the frustration he endured at the museum, and just a taste of the preparation he had gone through.

I wanted to feel so happy for Milo when he finally made it to Atlantis, but it was no big deal. Just happened too fast. In contrast, remember the feeling you had for Alan and Ellie when they first saw the dinosaurs at Jurassic Park? How they stood there in utter amazement at what they saw. You could feel the years of study and theories crashing into the reality (or near fantasy) of the moment. You joined two folks finally realizing a life long dream. You followed them as the suddenly blocked out everything around them and raced to see more.

We didn't get this in Atlantis, and we should have. Instead, Milo was left to make sudden decisions about what to do next, we never got to get inside his head and experience the joy he must have been feeling. Even on final arrival, it just didn't happen.

And, the love story element was also brushed over so harshly and rapidly. We didn't get any of the feelings so well portrayed in previous Disney animated masterpieces.

Those were the two big opportunities in telling what could have been a great story. But, they were lost. The story suffered, and miserabley in my opinion. It's too bad, this one could have been great.

 

[BRERALEX]

Only saw it twice so please dont kill me here.

I agree with you in the story department part of it being to quick

It started out at a good solid pace in the beginning. Alot was being said about Milo's grandpa. And then not much more is mentioned when he actually gets to Atlantis. The love story definatly went by too fast. They touched on alot but didnt fully develop anything all the way. And the man who paid for the expedition they never really showed if he was surprised how crazy james garners character became. At the end of the film I wasnt sure if Milo would be mad at the old rich guy for thinking he was in on the madness or not. They just go through so quickly(like this post)

Most movies i see recently are doing this. They want to get to the action and speed things up. They want the story of a three hour movie or two hour movie in 90 minutes. Tombraider should have been longer they just didnt develop alot of details. Shrek same thing no good solid story. Swordfish did a pretty good jobof it.

Atlantis just didnt explain enough. didnt develop enough but surprisingly it was still a good film.

The animation was good in some parts but still it look like they were cutting corners with the characters fingers as in how easy it is to draw a rectangle for a finger instaed of oval like, rounded edges like a real persons finger. It looked rushed.

I still wanna know mole's story

 

[Sarangel]

The square fingers are a trademark of the artist they designed Atlantis around: Mike Mignola. Mignola has been a comic book artist for years, and his characters all look like that. You'll notice that it's only the men whose fingers are square, the women have tapering rounded fingers, which make them look more delicate.

Disney was going for a more styleized look in Atlantis, which I (as a long time comic reader) didn't find nearly as jarring as Berelex. They've done this before - think of the shapes in Sleeping beauty. The difference is that sleeping beauty used Ervand Earle for a base & Atlantis used Mignola.

Sarangel

 

[BRERALEX]

Oh..thanx for the info i ddint know that. I did notice the blonde girl ooked really different. I keep saying she was drawn by the same people who did AEON FLUX.

BUt wait if most people dont know that about the fingers wont they think its cheap? Crap now i have to like correct myself with like everyone i told atlantis about darnit! lol

 

[Another Voice]

Gcurling – a great story analysis, it’s a rare talent to be able to peel back the movie screen and see what’s really going on inside. I completely agree with you. I haven’t said anything about ‘Atlantis’ because movies tend to be subjective and, frankly, I don’t think I need to add to my reputation as The Lord of Darkness and Negativity.

I still can not figure out what ‘Atlantis’ is ABOUT. I’m not talking plot, but what the real story is. ‘Dumbo’ is about turning one’s differences into advantages, ‘Beauty and The Beast’ is about allowing someone to love you, ‘The Lion King’ is about accepting responsibility. That’s the part of a movie that touches people and what they remember. Everyone had to suffer with themes and context and the like in high school English class, but they actually are important when creating a story.

The reason ‘Shrek’ is the summer’s biggest movie has nothing to do with the quality of it’s animation, Eddie Murphy, round fingernails, or the Vast Anti-Disney Conspiracy. It’s that ‘Shrek’ has a story and a moral that people appreciate. Disney used to be the master at this – and it’s loss is being felt.

 

[Sarangel]

I thought Atlantis was about following your dreams, regardless of what it may cost. Something Disney himself was pretty good at.

This showed up for me in a lot of little ways, but most prominently when Milo chooses to try and stop Rourke from destroying the Atlanteans despite the fact that (initially) he's the only one willing to try and the odds are against him.

Just my $0.02

Sarangel

 

[DisDuck]

My turn to jump in. My daughter who saw Tomb, Shrek and Atlantis(twice) thought Atlantis had the best story line of all 3. My wife who generally does not like Action/Adventure liked the pace and story since to her it did not drag. I felt the pace a little too fast but not because they didn't develop the characters, it was ALL ACTION. The storyline itself was very good and several of the characters drew my attention quite easily.

 

[Another Voice]

Persevering after your dreams is an excellent theme (and has been used in a lot of good films), but the script for ‘Atlantis’ just doesn’t pull it off. As Mr. Gcurling points out, there is no sense that Atlantis is such a overpowering focus of Milo’s life that he’d risk everything for it. And Milo himself doesn’t really struggle all that hard to obtain his goal: what does he persevere against? He’s handed the Sheppard’s Journal, he’s handed the jumbo-sized box of action figures that actually get him to Atlantis, Princess Malibu Barbie instantly falls in love with him, and the supporting cast decides between Milo and the just-add-water villain Rourke faster than my son chooses between vanilla ice cream or chocolate ice cream. All Milo seems to do is to read instructions (“turn the crystal to the left!”) and stand in awe as Iron Giant saves Atlantis.

Sorry for the soap box speech, but I’m extremely dismayed that a script as weak as this was ever considered the “salvation” of Disney animation. The script lacks some of the fundamental elements of good story telling or anything that will be memorable in four months. Knowing that ‘Atlantis’ is to become a Saturday morning cartoon series may explain a lot, this wasn’t a film but a TV pilot.

 

[ScroogesNephew]

You have a valid point.

 

[tiggerstheman1]

Yep, it's an action-adventure flick alright. And while I enjoyed it and will probably see it a second time I have to agree that the script is weak. But hey, there are plenty of weak-scripted action-adventure films that I have seen more than once.

What I find, from a storytelling perspective, is that Milo lacks growth. I don't see that much change in him. While it could be said that he changes from a bookworm into a hero, I really don't see it. I agree with A.V. that he has no reason from risking everything and that everything that the character gets is handed to him on a silver platter.

As a comparison to a classic, I rewatched The Lion King last night looking specifically at the story structure. You have plenty of character growth which makes Simba a likable character. You have a goal that we all care about - saving the pridelands. Why? Because the story set that up so well for us with the Circle of Life bit. So when Scar destroys the pridelands, we feel bad. You have to have a set up in order to have a payoff.

Now back to Atlantis -- did we really care about Atlantis? I can't say that I felt one way or another about it. Of course, I understood the story was to save Atlantis by retrieving the crystal, but I didn't get the same emotions from it. It lacked the setup in order to have the payoff of me feeling happy that Rourke was defeated and Atlantis saved.

Then who saved Atlantis? Nobody. The Crystal saved Atlantis so we missed the payoff there. I think the story focusing on the crystal was misguided where it should have focused on a character. I can care about a character, I can't care about a crystal.

Did I care about the Princess? Not really, I would have needed more setup to be emotionally attached to her. Instead, the crystal saved the city in the beginning, and it did it again in the end.

While there were some fun comedic characters, they really were lost.

In the end, when you compare the structure of Atlantis against a properly structured story, Atlantis comes up short. Not enough setup to make you care about the payoff.

That said, I will see it again because I enjoyed the artwork and like to see things blown up

 

[Jackie H.]

I expect to be fully plumpted, but here goes:

I think the whole crystal went too far. Just like I thought the priest (sorry, name escapes me just now) lusting after Esmerellda in Huntchback went too far.

Let's remember that Disney is targeting these movies to children - at least they used to. They target children and make a good enough movie that adults longed to see as well.

A crystal being their "life force", basically their god with healing powers and complete control over their minds and bodies seemed to me to be a little much to lay on children. Especially when there are plently of folks out there who are willing to sell our children a crystal that they claim can heal them. (I did wonder why, if the crystal was so powerful, it couldn't get itself out of the hole in the ground.)

I agree that it would've been more enjoyable to me to have a bondafide hero or heroine that saved the people and city.

Just as in other areas, Disney I am afraid lost their focus in this movie. But I thought that with Huntchback and they came back with some very good movies after that. I hope I am wrong again.

 

[ScroogesNephew]

I think you are right.

 

[All Aboard]

JackieH, interesting angle, I had not really thought of that. I don't think Disney has lost focus, I just think they dropped the ball on this film. I don't, however, think they missed the mark with HoND though. That film is very powerful, the music is passionate and consuming, the story is great. We really feel the frustrations of Quasi and Esmerelda. And, we have a great villain in Frollo (who is actually a judge, not a priest). He posses no super natural powers, just the powers of corruption and moral manipulation and control, yet he's a very weak man beneath his exterior.

As for both films being incorrectly targeted at children, you may be right. I have wondered how HoND was rewarded with a G rating, cuts it pretty close in my opinion. Both are undoubtedly departures from the Disney formula, but Atlantis is far more of a departure.

 

[Ocean]

For me the most telling aspect of the story's underlying weakness was the vast number of secondary characters who were present throughout the movie while contributing nothing of substance. It seems that these extraneous characters were mainly put there so that their humorous lines would distract our attention from the weak storyline.

Many of the great Disney movies have only one or two "sidekicks" who feature prominently throughout the story: Baloo and Bagheera in the Jungle Book, Timon and Pumba in the Lion King, Tinkerbell in Peter Pan (although I really like Tink, I do relegate her to sidekick status). Disney has very successfully used larger numbers of secondary characters: Grumpy, Sleepy, Doc, Happy, Sneezy, Bashful, and Dopey; or Lumiere, Cogsworth, Mrs. Potts, and Chip. But it seems to me that the great stories with several characters were far more carefully crafted than Atlantis was.

My two cents.

 

[tink30]

Although was touched on briefly I have to mention it again, it REALLY bothered me that the ALL POWERFUL CRYSTAL couldn't save itself from being captured in a little rinky dink box. Then when it iso released from the box it shows its power immediately again by saving Atlantis from the volcano...which just reinforced the question with me...why was it ever captured to begin with?? After that the rest of the movie was a washout for me because it just didn't even make sense. Also, where exactly was Atlantis, (o.k., I had my two yr. old with me so I missed a part or two) was it above water??It certainly looked like it, ith the sky and everything...and if it was above water, why was it never seen from the air? Did they ever explain that?? And how did Milo hold his breath for so long under water? (the part where he reads the secret writing) I'm not trying to pick every little thing apart but even a movie based in fantasy should explain why it works...

 

[MerryPoppins]

I think that Atlantis was good. I intend to see it again and we'll probably buy the DVD. Having said that, let me add my take on the problems with this movie.

Disney has been so successful in the past with it's animated features. Why do they keep messing with a system that works by trying new things? I feel like they should stick with a good thing until it stops working for them. Why did they need to try a new style of animation based on comic books? I found the animation beautiful but rather flat. People will think that Disney cut corners.

I think main characters need to be ones that we get to know really well. You can't be very sympathetic with characters that you don't identify with or don't know. Look at Belle or Simba . . . we were pulling for them 100%. Disney characters are LOVED. Just look at kids at WDW and see them interacting with characters. Did anyone out there really LOVE Milo? I liked him, but I didn't feel like I knew him very well. I was happy for him, but not overjoyed.

Singable music has been something Disney is known for. The broadway sound in some of their recent movies was great. I bet there isn't a kid out there today who couldn't sing part of one of the Little Mermaid songs, or The Lion King, or Beauty and the Beast. Where have the songs been lately? They cut them from The Emperor's New Groove and they were missing again this time. Those songs move the story along and keep you thinking about the movie after you go home. They also help sell merchandise in my opinion.

Come on Disney. Wake up and smell the coffee. You don't have to fix something that isn't broken. Go back to what has worked in the past. I just want a good plot, good characters (that I can feel for), good music, and the stunning animation that you are famous for. Try new and innovative after these are in place.

Now, I'm off my soapbox. What do you guys think?

 

[iamleia2]

Wow, now I have lots to talk about...

First of all, I really really liked the movie... but I was confused by a few parts so I'll start with my questions... Why is it that when the girl's mother was taken up into the crystal she stayed there forever, but when her daughter is taken up into it she comes back down? Didn't get that. I was also confused by the location of Atlantis... but I finally decided that it was underground like in a massive cave and the Crystal created air and water and whatnot for them in it's bubble. (maybe that's just wishful thinking...)

Now I'll move on to what I liked about it. I thought there was a moral... not only to follow your dreams, but that we should preserve the way of life of those who were there before. Whats-his-face tried to destroy Atlantis for want of money... just like we destroyed the land of the Indians because we wanted it... and the same thing still happens so I think that's another lesson. Also, just plain choosing to do the right thing. The other characters could have left and probably led fine lives... but they chose to stay and help the Atlantians. Maybe it's just because I am going to major in archaeology this coming year... but I thought it was emotional when they finally found Atlantis. They showed the beautiful scene with the music and... Yay! I liked that part. I didn't feel it was wanting for emotion at all. But maybe that's just because I was imagining what it would really be like to find something like that that you've been dreaming about your whole life. I also loved all the other characters. I thought they were funny and cute and I enjoyed them a lot. I also just liked the whole cultural feeling of the movie. I thought they did a wonderful job portraying Atlantis itself.

Now, for what I didn't like. I am getting really ticked off that it seems as though Disney has completely abandoned having the characters sing! The last time characters sang was in Mulan, three movies back. Unless you count Rosie O'Donald's thing in Tarzan. Am I the only one who cares about this? We have countless Disney CD's, but we don't listen to them over and over again because there are popular groups singing or great orchestral music (not that I don't appreciate orchestral music..) but because we can sing along with them! And we know all the words cuz we've seen the movies 1500 times! I am really really worried that I will never hear another Disney character sing! And to me the music is a HUGE part of Disney. I mean.. what would Beauty and the Beast be like without Tale as Old as Time? Or Snow White without "Hi Ho." Come on! The characters have to sing! Think how much more real the love story between Milo and whats-her-face would have been if they had sang a love song... or what if they had showed Kida's mother singing her a song before she was taken away? Hello! I am so mad about that. Anywho... I also didn't think the love story was developed very well at all. And I already stated all the questions I had about the story and the top. There were loose ends and that is bad. I did still think it was a good movie... but music and plot could have enhanced it so much! Oh well... I wish Disney would listen to us... they should have the DIS people pre-screen the movies and tell them what's wrong with it so they can fix it before they put the movie out. Thanks for listening!

 

[MerryPoppins]

I am with you there iamleia2! We on the DIS Board could give them a few pointers.

Please don't get me wrong. I don't hate Atlantis. I just think it could have been better if they had tightened it up a little, added music, and let us get a little closer to the characters.

I am all for progress, but I think Disney is leaving behind what the fans go to the movies to see. Disney magic is all about making us feel like anything is possible and that we can be kids again, if just for the span of the movie. I found the movie to be exciting and fun, but it just lacked the spark I had hoped for.