Vent-DD got college financial aid summary

[OhMari]

3. Not attend college until after the parents accountability is over (I think the age cut-off is 23). I know this option stinks, but it may be the only option if their heart is set on the expensive college and it cannot be financed.

It is very expensive, and yes the FAFSA does take parents income into account. If he/she was married, it takes the spouses in, even though they may not contribute to the cost. That is FAFSA simply the rules.

I wish they would reconsider this rule. Especially if parents don't claim their kid on their taxes.

 

[KelNottAt]

In addition to Sallie Mae, there's also http://myrichuncle.com/index.aspx?adv=tpr-mtl.

Also, like the other poster said, I'm pretty sure there are 2 types of federal loans:

Subsidized Stafford loans are need-based, and interest does not accrue on these loans while you are in school, during a six-month grace period immediately preceding repayment, and during authorized deferment.

Unsubsidized Stafford loans are not need-based, and you are responsible for all of the interest that accrues on the loan, including while you are in school.

I believe there are dollar limits, but at least the unsubsidized is not need-based.

Good luck.

 

[taitai]

Has she applied to any private schools? Typically, they give lots more financial aid as they are flush with cash from their massive endowments. As I am sure you are aware, all the Ivies are now basically giving a free ride to accepted students with family incomes below a certain threshold ($100K?) and then a sliding fee scale (never more than 10% until another, higher threshold).

taitai

 

[Lisa_M]

Well, I wrote a huge long post but then I felt silly. I used to be a financial aid counselor until this past August, so if you have any questions, feel free to pm me.

I read your post before it was deleted,it was EXCELLENT. So informative and a good representation of the school's prospective. If you have it saved, please re-post. No need to feel silly. Anyone could benefit from your knowledge

 

[Chicago526]

If you go the CC route, just be sure that the credits will transfer to the college of choice, they don't always! The CC counselors can help you figure that out, but be sure you or your kid talks to them about it. Here in IL the CC credits in gen ed will transfer to any state school, but private schools or specialized courses, they may not. Nothing worse thank taking (and paying for) the same course twice!

 

[Toby'sFriend]

College pretty much has to be saved for over a period of years and years.
I guess I look at it a little differently

$14k -
Room and board at the dorms is probably $6 to $7k of that

So tuition is what? roughly - $8,000

If the student could pay $3,000 from a summer job, which my 17 year old easily made last summer bagging groceries
Mom and Dad are left with $5,000 in tuition. That is more than reasonable for a Higher education. It is less than what I will be paying to send my son to High School next year.

Then you have to decide about Dorm Living. If you do not have the money, I guess you finance it or make a plan for the student to live at home.

It sounds like your kid has an awesome GPA, it is certainly worth a try to go back to the school and see if there is any more money to be had.

My oldest son is a High School Senior this year and I'm just shocked by the number of times I've heard this conversation of the past month and shocked by the number of pretty solid middle class parents I know that have saved nothing at all for their kid's college.

I think all the articles that have been published lately about places like Harvard and Yale making school "free" for the middle class have really skewed expectations.

 

[girli565]

Maybe you could look into private student loans through citibank and chase. They have reasonable rates.

And scholarships?

 

[aka-mad4themouse]

Unfortunately, the application deadlines for Ivy League schools has passed for Fall 2008 admissions. And qualifying for admission to those schools is rigorous. Most require unweighted GPAs of 3.8 and above with a heavy load of honors and AP courses, SAT scores of 1400+ and active community service records. Being an outstanding student is not enough. You have to be outstanding among the best students in the country.

I do agree that the private schools do have a lot of money to offer students. However, they also have higher tuition costs. The scholarships mostly make it just as affordable to attend the private school as it is to attend a state university.

DD was offered $20K/year at her 3rd choice school. Tuition is $29,500. Room & Board is another $10K+. So, even with the very nice scholaship, we still have to come up with another $20K every year to cover college costs. And that's only if she doesn't get into college #1 (we're still waiting).

I don't have any words of wisdom for the OP. I live in PA, too and I envy my DSis's kids who live in NJ. In NJ, if you graduate in the top 20% of your high school class, you can attend your local community college for free for up to 5 semesters. After that, if you've kept your grades up, you can apply to any state university and the NJ STARS scholarship will cover your tuition there as well. My neice will be applying to Rutgers next fall for the Spring 2009 semester. And all of her GCCC credits will transfer completely.

 

[mominwestlake]

My oldest is a freshman in college so I am just beginning to look at all of this. I understand filling out the FAFSA and they send you your EFC. Let's say your EFC is $14,000 but the school is $20,000. What will happen if anything? How can you get money that doesn't have to be paid back? Sorry if this sounds silly but I've heard 2 types of stories- people who get these great packages and people who got nothing. And what, if anything (besides saving, saving, saving) can we do now to help my dd get money from the college that won't have to be repaid?

 

[daughtersrus]

We're in a similar situation.

Our oldest DD (21) is a junior at ISU. She transferred there this fall from the Community College. She wanted to go away to school for all 4 years but we couldn't afford that. (I have a DD with a rare genetic disease so we have a TON of medical expenses). We told the girls that if they go to CC, we will pay for the first 2 years. If they want to go away, we will give them the amount of CC but they will have to find a way to cover the extra costs.


We didn't even fill out the FAFSA forms the first two years because we knew that she wouldn't qualify for anything. We did fill them out when she transferred and her EFC was $17,000. Luckily, she was selected for a tuition waiver through our state for Special Education majors. They will cover the costs of tuition only but the catch is that she has to teach at least 2 out of 5 years after graduation in IL in the field of special education. She has a Federal Student Loan for $5,000 to cover her roam/board and she is on a monthly payment plan for about $100.00/month. We paid for books. We've filled out a ton of scholarship applications but most of them say that the money can only be used towards tuition so she can't get them even if chosen.

I just filled out the FAFSA for this coming year and her EFC is now $13,000 and DD(18 who will go to CC) has a EFC of $9,000. So basically, they are saying that as a family we can afford $5,000 more this year than last! I have no idea where they get that from since our income is about the same and DD(18) made about $3,000 last year. She will also transfer to ISU after her AA but we hope work better with the CC to be sure that she can graduate on time. Although DD(21) transferred with her AA, she can not graduate until Jan 10 because of the observation, practicum and student teaching hours that are needed. We're also hoping that she will also be selected for the tuition waiver.

We're keeping our fingers crossed.

 

[Tigger1]

At my childrens school, the majority of the cost was Room and Board. Both of my children shared an apartment really close to campus for about half the cost of a dorm room. They had small grants to help pay books and tuition and loans and part time jobs to cover the rest. My daughters student loans will be less than 15,000 for 4 1/2. The college she is at is well over 10,000 year living on campus. She also has many years of job experience. My son has similar situation but is out of school and working full time where he did his internship during his full college life.

Several of my coworkers purchased a house for thier children at this University. I could not afford to do this, but it worked well for them.

The Tuition at this University is about $200 per credit or $3000 per Semester.
(including fees).

Room and board, sharing a small dorm room $3500 per Semester.

Two bedroom apartments $300 To $600 per month + food and Electricity.

 

[luvdzny]

I feel your pain! I am not sure how the arrive at those figures, but I wish they would come and pay my bills for me and show me where the "extra money" is!!!

DS lives in Oregon, he works full time, goes to school full time and has his own apartment. We live in Wisconsin and only help him out occasionally. He provides 90% of his support. When I filled out the FAFSA for him he was still considered a dependent. (This was in December, he just started school in January.) DD took a year off of school due to illness, she would like to attend college in fall if her health permits. When I filled out the FAFSA for her I could not include DS as a dependent!!! Talk about a catch-22.... Right now I am not sure where the money will come from. DD is only able to work part time and once school starts will not be able to work at all because of her illness.

Good luck, I hope you can find a a way to finance your DD's schooling.

 

[Kimberly Hill]

My son attends a state school on scholarships and a small loan that he is responsible for, since he chooses not to work heavily during the summer. About 6 weeks into the fall semester the school took the scholarship funds not used by kids who'd chosen other schools and divvied it up among the kids who had received scholarship money and attended the school. Only a few hundred dollars but it was a nice surprise.

 

[Amy Epcot]

I work in Financial Aid and this is definitely a hot topic but if you have issues with the aid package that the school sent, go in and speak to a FA counselor! Financial Aid is calculated by completing the FAFSA and some schools also require another form called the CSS Profile which goes a bit deeper than the FAFSA. A note of caution about the FAFSA; it is a government form not a school form. When you have complaints that you don't qualify for anything it is because the government has determined this; not the school.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but this is the analogy I always come back to; you want to buy a BMW but you can't afford it. Do you go to the dealership and demand that they give you one? Do you complain to your friends about the "audacity" of the dealership to deny your request? No, you investigate cars that are more affordable and that fit into your budget. Same thing with a college, there are plenty that are affordable (especially community colleges) and they may not be your child's first choice but in the end, they'll do the trick and you child will not graduate with $85,000 in debt nor will you be re-paying a PLUS loan well into your 80's.

 

[Mocharilla]

If you go the CC route, just be sure that the credits will transfer to the college of choice, they don't always! The CC counselors can help you figure that out, but be sure you or your kid talks to them about it. Here in IL the CC credits in gen ed will transfer to any state school, but private schools or specialized courses, they may not. Nothing worse thank taking (and paying for) the same course twice!

Oh, yeah! Definatly!

Otherwise, they'll have to retake the classes, and that sucks.

Just make logical decisions, and ask a counselor if you're wondering. I was thinking about taking "The History of Grand Rapids" because I was like "Wow, that sounds dumb ", but realized it'd be a waste, and took a regular history class so that it'd transfer.

 

[phragmipedium]

Okay, here's my original post. I just felt silly because it's so darn long.

I used to be a financial aid counselor for a public university until recently. I can tell you that no one understands their family's expected family contribution - if it helps, it's equally unfair to everybody. Unfortunately, with skyrocketing tuition and slowly increasing federal aid programs, it's very difficult for all but the lowest of incomes and highest of student achievers to finance an education without debt. Unless families have been planning and saving for college since their children were small, loans generally make up the bulk of college financing for those who are quite lower-middle-class and up.

The most important thing you can do to try to help yourself is file as early as possible - you can file in January with estimates, and make updates in February after you've gotten a clearer picture. Make sure your FAFSA is *complete* and has been signed by parent and student; read the notes they give you in your Student Aid Report to see if there is conflicting information or something else needed, because as long as your application is "unofficial" you have not met the school's deadline. If your Student Aid Report does not have an Estimated Family Contribution number, it is still unofficial. Contact FAFSA if you are unsure what's wrong with your application or what else you need to do. It's also important to be honest - many schools have edits in place to detect information that seems "off" and select a family for verification, which is a request for taxes and other information to verify FAFSA reportings. Some schools require this information for every student, no matter what. Also keep in mind that your Estimated Family Contribution is not necessarily what the school expects you to write a check for - it's simply an indicator of need that helps the school determine what kind of aid your student qualifies for. Beyond that, it's a pretty meaningless number for practical purposes.

I can also tell you that we *never* increased someone's aid just because they wrote us a letter and asked. We almost always *over* awarded our funds because we had a very good idea from statistics how many of our students would not accept their offers and would go elsewhere. I recall only one instance when we determined in September that we would have significant-enough extra funding in one program to raise the eligibility requirement and award more students; we did this without them asking us as long as they were newly eligible and had accepted their original aid offer.

In other cases, families requesting more aid needed to have information to provide that was not reflected in the FAFSA, because we had to treat everyone equally by FAFSA's determination of need. Because FAFSA doesn't consider "consumer debt," credit card debt was not something we could factor into aid determination. But a family *could* contact us in writing and request that we review their situation if something had changed or something catastrophic had happened.

As you know, the FAFSA asks for information from the prior year - so if something's significantly changed, it's worth it to write a letter requesting review along with documentation. Depending on what has changed in your circumstances, the financial aid office may be able to make an immediate decision, or ask that you wait until later in the year to get a better picture of your total income for the current year (they may do a "base year change" and consider the current year income rather than the prior year income that FAFSA has considered). If you're asked to wait until later, potential changes may not happen until school has already started or sometimes, if the circumstances are particularly complicated or uncertain, you may even be asked to wait until you've filed your 2008 taxes so they can see exactly what changed from from the 2007 information reported on the FAFSA. If a change results, it would be retroactive to the beginning of the year and any additional aid would disburse at that time, but of course it's not something to count on when selecting a school. If they ask that you wait until later in the year, it's generally a good idea to only go with that school if you can handle the aid package as originally offered and treat any potential changes as nice surprises.

Each financial aid administrator has the power to make a "professional judgment" and the scope of that power is pretty far-reaching if it can be justified within the laws, but consistency in the office is what's most important - so a lot depends on the philosophy within your school's financial aid office, their interpretation of the regulations, and how strictly or loosely they adhere to them. They are not required to make professional judgments, and do face having their decisions audited, so their decisions need documentation and justification and must be consistent with similar cases in the office. Some schools make many professional judgments for things that are IMO questionable within the federal guidelines, and others are much more stringent. However, it can never hurt to talk to the office and at least run your situation by them, and follow it up with written requests and documentation if they believe it will might make a difference in your situation.

I do have to say that frequently, even if a request would have been approvable, it still didn't make a big enough impact in the Estimated Family Contribution to make a difference in the amount of aid at all and make the family grant-eligible. Even more painful, sometimes it would have made a big difference if the family had applied by our priority deadline of March 1 (after which all need-based programs except the Pell Grant and Oregon Opportunity Grant were no longer available), but they didn't, so the only additional aid was perhaps a $400/year Pell Grant when it could have been potentially about four thousand more in grants that go along with pell-grant-eligibility if they'd applied earlier. All states have different priority deadlines, so apply early and ask with your office - they usually need to have *received* the processed, complete application from FAFSA by that date. You might not think you need aid, but circumstances change within families all the time - file by the priority deadline just in case something happens and you need aid. Even if your special-circumstances request doesn't make you grant-eligible, it may change the loan offered to the student from an unsubsidized loan (accruing interest while they are in school) to a subsidized loan (interest will not accrue while they are in school). The parent loan is always unsubsidized. I should also mention that in many cases that a family's circumstances change and they do suddenly become grant-eligible, it often still leaves a gap in need that would have to be covered by parent loan, private loan, or other means of payment.

Work study is also considered a need-based program, and while the limits are generally slightly higher than the Pell-Grant and accompanying possible grant programs, it's generally not a large sum - perhaps $1500-2500 per year. It can also sometimes limit students because some employers cannot allow them to work beyond their work study dollars due to their budgets; sometimes students can earn more money if they work a non-work study job, or at least find one that can afford to keep them on after their work study funding runs out. One benefit to work study is that when filing the FAFSA, students report the income they earn as a work study student, but then report it again later in the FAFSA as work-study earnings so they are "protected" and the student is not punished for having earnings that were made available to them on a need-basis. At least at the school I worked at, work study funding failed to grow but the number of students qualifying for work study did grow, and we had to reduce the eligibility level and the dollar amount in order to still provide a reasonable allotment to students.

If your child is set on attending a four-year university from the start, you will probably have to finance part of their education with a loan outside of the Stafford loan offered in their name, as you've recognized the relatively low loan limits for federal loan soffered to students. As others have mentioned, you can do this in several ways. You can apply for the parent PLUS loan and see if you qualify. It's a fairly lenient credit check - the few denials we saw were generally for being 90 days delinquent on a credit account or having a bankruptcy in the last 7 years. If you are turned down for the loan after applying, contact your school's aid office because they can make more UNsubsidized Stafford loan available to your student. Not a whole lot, but they can provide for them the same level of Stafford loan funding that they could if the student were independent - an additional $4000/year for a freshman or sophomore, or $5000 for juniors or seniors. You must contact your school to pursue this option if you've been denied the PLUS loan, and ask them their procedure. The school cannot make this additional amount available simply because a parent refuses to apply for the loan, and the additional amount is only unsubsidized even if their original Stafford loan was subsidized. Your student also will not qualify for additional grant aid because this has happened; your information stays as part of the FAFSA calculations even though you do not qualify for the loan. Keep in mind each PLUS loan begins repayment 60 days after the final disbursement for the year; they are *not* deferred payment until the end of college or separation from school like the student loans are.

If you choose not to apply, the student can also apply for a private student educational loan. Most lenders like federal banks offer these loans, as well as lenders like Sallie Mae. These are based on credit for the student and they can generally borrow this amount: cost of attendance - all other accepted aid. Often, students need a cosigner. They may be more likely to be approved by someone like Sallie Mae without a cosigner, though they will likely pay for this leniency with higher interest and more fees. These loans should be deferred until they are separated from school. These lenders generally send the funds directly to the school to pay off any remaining charges and then are disbursed to the student for their expenses for the term. There are private lenders out there who do not contact the school to find out what the student is eligible for and simply lend them whatever the student asks for and send it directly to the student, not the school - these loans are generally not federally backed and will have interest and/or fees out the wazoo. In addition, your aid office will *not* want to know about them because a student is legally not supposed to receive more aid than the cost of attendance (though there are exceptions for students fully-funded by scholarships who also qualify for "entitlement" programs like the Pell grant). These loans are sort of murky water. I would highly recommend your student not try to go that route, and try to live within the means of the cost of attendance in their financial aid statement. If for some reason they have higher expenses, they can go to the financial aid office and talk about increasing their cost of attendance and their private loan certification.

One final option I saw a lot of families taking was to take out a home equity loan because it was better interest than the PLUS loan. I'm no financial advisor and am not suggesting this over other options, especially given the current housing and mortgage situation, but do want to make it known that a significant portion of families went this route and you have to determine if this is the best option for your family.

Please also have your student (and yourself) use a repayment estimator with whichever lenders you choose. Have your student estimate the amount of loans they would take over the life of their education and see what kind of monthly payments they would be able to expect. Will they be able to afford them? Would it be better to take a year off and save some money? To go to a community college for a year? To go to a college in a hometown or a town with relatives and live at home or with family? To go instate instead of out of state? Go part time and work while in school? To consider private schools, which may look more expensive but might have more funding available to award your student? Have your student think carefully about the amount of debt they will accrue, and also consider yourself whether you will be able to make payments on four separate, potentially large parent loans by the time the student is finished with a bachelor's degree.

One final note - this is a busy and stressful time of year in financial aid offices. I can pretty much guarantee you that they are doing the best they can to offer your student what's available to them. Certainly make them aware of situations you think might change your circumstances, but also realize that in most cases their hands are tied by federal regulations and numbers, and try to be respectful even if you are unhappy with your aid package (providing whoever you are speaking with is respectful as well, of course). I started out answering phones in the office before I became a counselor, and I cannot tell you the amounts of obscenities that were hurled at me or the accusations that were made. The state of federal financial aid funding is extremely frustrating for financial aid administrators as well, so try to work with them toward any possible changes that can be made, rather than against them.

Hmm...guesss I wrote a book. Guess I miss my job a little bit since we relocated for hubby's career. It's a tough job, but occasionally someone would tell me that I was helping them realize their dreams of higher education, and that they'd never thought it would be possible. Getting a hug from a stranger suddenly crying happy tears was pretty cool!

 

[meandtheguys2]

I work in Financial Aid and this is definitely a hot topic but if you have issues with the aid package that the school sent, go in and speak to a FA counselor! Financial Aid is calculated by completing the FAFSA and some schools also require another form called the CSS Profile which goes a bit deeper than the FAFSA. A note of caution about the FAFSA; it is a government form not a school form. When you have complaints that you don't qualify for anything it is because the government has determined this; not the school.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for this but this is the analogy I always come back to; you want to buy a BMW but you can't afford it. Do you go to the dealership and demand that they give you one? Do you complain to your friends about the "audacity" of the dealership to deny your request? No, you investigate cars that are more affordable and that fit into your budget. Same thing with a college, there are plenty that are affordable (especially community colleges) and they may not be your child's first choice but in the end, they'll do the trick and you child will not graduate with $85,000 in debt nor will you be re-paying a PLUS loan well into your 80's.

 

[kimsuenew]

Thank you "phragmipedium" for such a valuable post! It explained a lot. All of us, ecspecially "newbies" to this whole FAFSA/financial aid "thing" appreciate it!

 

[Todd&Copper]

I know this doesn't help your situation, but it just blows my mind that it's just ASSumed by nearly every college out there that parents are able and WILLING to contribute to their children's education. That just blows my mind. Sheesh. My parents couldn't even be bothered to fill out the FAFSA....they say it wasn't worth their time. Guess who had a REALLY rough time going to college because of it?

Seriously, most parents do help their kids rather than making the kids save up their own money for YEARS (which mine did - I never got to spend any birthday or Xmas money, it all went into the college fund) or suggesting Comm. Coll. to keep costs down, or helping their kids apply for grants and loans. It actually bothers me quite a bit, and it contributes to the "me first" sense of entitlement lots of young adults have now.

 

[leahjade]

That's why parents are urged to start saving as soon as their kids are born for college. We scrimped and saved and did without on our lower middle class income to buy savings bonds for our kids. So it really wouldn't be fair to give financial aid to someone who has made more money than us over the years, but never saved for their kids' education. Of course we still don't have the whole thing covered, so our kids will work summers to pay half and will still have to take out some loans. I think people appreciate things more when they have to help pay for them!