Should I Buy?

Discussion in 'Purchasing DVC' started by markmcalear, Dec 19, 2013.

  1. markmcalear

    markmcalear Mouseketeer

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    Today I have spoken with Disney about buying into AKL.

    I am looking at 600 points for $83,000.

    We are a family of 7 (5 children) who would like to visit Disney most years for 2 weeks at the end of August or maybe one week near end of October or over Xmas.

    What are your thoughts?
     
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  3. com_op_2000

    com_op_2000 DVC Member since '93

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    Make sure you checkout buying resale before spending that amount of monies on a direct purchase.
    Buy some smaller contracts rather than one large contract.
     
  4. disneynutz

    disneynutz DIS Veteran DIS Lifetime Sponsor

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    Why do you want to buy?

    :earsboy: Bill
     
  5. Msmithmd

    Msmithmd DIS Veteran

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    You can have the same amount of points and a NICE new car, for the same net money, if you buy resale. (Or put the money in another investment and use the annual proceeds to cover most or all of your annual dues...)

    There's no way I would buy at AKV direct in your situation. It gives no advantages that amount to anything, and you're literally looking at a $30-35k difference when buying direct from Disney. That in my opinion would be true insanity.
     
  6. tbonge

    tbonge Earning My Ears

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    Here is AKV direct vs resale. I make some estimates that may or may not be valid, but it gives you an idea...

    Assuming:
    3.5% MF/Room Rate increase per year
    Resale costs $75 (you can find better though)
    Direct looses 45% of value immediately
    Sell at 50% of current value in 20 years or 0 in 40 years.
    Values based on 600 pts
    Not including closing/broker fees

    MF Costs
    20 yr MF cost $101,055
    40 yr MF cost $285,097

    Direct
    Upfront cost: $83,000
    Total cost if sold in 20 years at $37/pt $161,855
    Total cost if never sold $368,097

    Resale
    Upfront cost: $$45,000
    Total cost if sold in 20 years at $37/pt $123,855
    Total cost if never sold $330,097

    Cash Rooms
    Cash cost of rooms for 20 years $507,816
    Cash cost of rooms for 40 years $1,432,648
     
  7. disneynutz

    disneynutz DIS Veteran DIS Lifetime Sponsor

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    Maybe the OP is wealthy, doesn't care about the cost and likes zebras.

    :earsboy: Bill
     
  8. dbs1228

    dbs1228 DIS Veteran

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    I would not buy a 600 point contract. I would start with a smaller contract maybe (2 )- 100 or 150 point contracts which if buying direct and get a early UY (Feb example) you will get 2013 points and 2014 points as of Feb 1st 2014. This would give you 400 - 600 points to use the 1st year and really see where you are at. With the smaller multiple contracts you can more easily sell 1 or 2 of the contracts if and when you may decide you do not need that many points. If you need more points you can always add on! With that being said I personally would go resale and for 600 points it would be broken into 3 -4 contracts (or more) and I would have 2 different home resorts - 1 resort would be close (walking distance) to my families favorite park. Good luck and do as much research as possible.
     
  9. nd43

    nd43 Disney Fan

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    Hi Mark,

    Whether you buy resale or direct, I would emphasize a prior post and encourage you to break down that amount of points into several smaller contracts. It will make it much easier to downsize your ownership later and sell off your points. You can only resale full contracts (you cannot sell just a portion of a single contract).

    This can be done while buying direct by simply requesting the purchase be broken into smaller contracts (for instance qty 6 100 pt contracts). You pay a slightly higher closing cost for this option.

    If buying resale, you will need to find multiple contracts with the same UY that total your needs.

    AKL is a very large DVC resort with a selling history that had many buying pts direct below current pricing. This will work against you in resale. If future value is a large concern and you prefer direct you might consider buying VGF. However, you would need to love staying at that resort just as much as AKL.
     
  10. darbry

    darbry Mouseketeer

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    Shazammm! That's a lot of money. With resale I just bought akv at $65/point. I agree with others about smaller contracts.
     
  11. Dean

    Dean DIS Veteran<br><a href="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis

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    I concur with Bill's intent, make sure you know what you're getting and not getting. It doesn't make sense to buy retail and more points to use those points for cash type items that you could get as cheap or more cheaply directly. In other words, ONLY buy the points you'd use at DVC resorts and do not buy to use for exchanges including cruises or ABD if that's in the back of your mind. Assuming you wanted 600 points total and can afford to write a check for that amount, I would agree with buying resale else I wouldn't buy or would buy less. For 600 I would either buy somewhat less and/or buy two contracts at 2 different resorts. Maybe one AKV if that's where you want to stay most trips plus something else. If you can find someone selling multiple contracts you might be able to work a deal to save a little extra AND get the other options. If you just want into the system, there may be better home resorts that would be cheaper short and long term like OKW or SSR. SSR is usually the best value to get points in the system AT WDW.

    IF you decide to buy and break it down, I'd suggest you buy part now if DVC is right for you then look later to add the other once you have more system experience.
     
  12. markmcalear

    markmcalear Mouseketeer

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    Thanks for the input.

    So let me summarize what I have been told so far...

    1. Buying resale is far better value than direct.
    2. Buying direct offers no additional benefits over buying resale, it just costs more.
    3. I should buy multiple contracts, so say 4x150 points?
    4. I should buy contracts at multiple resorts.
    5. I should only ever use my DVC points for stays at Disney, not against Disney cruises or anything else.

    A few people have said "UY" I am not sure what that means.
     
  13. Dean

    Dean DIS Veteran<br><a href="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis

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    Let me qualify slightly. I think buying retail has it's place but only if you're getting something important that you can only get retail, GF or GC for example. As for the rest it depends on your personal wants/needs and plans. I personally, for 600 pts, would not buy 4 times 150 because you'd add roughly $5000 OR MORE to the total price compared to all 600 at one resort. However, I wouldn't go from 0 to 600 at one time either. If I were in your shoes thinking I needed to buy 600 points, I would select 2 home resorts and buy one now then one later if I still thought I needed all of that. Truthfully if you think you need 600 long term for the years you go, you likely only need 400-450 per year since it didn't sound like you'd go every year. Plus, I think 600 is too large for 2 weeks unless you'll routinely go over christmas (where home resort will matter). UY means Use Year and for your situation as described, August is likely the best if you'll go both Aug and Dec. And I do believe that UY matters for most people enough to make a $$$ difference.

    ETA: Even 350 points in a loaded contract could give you right at 2 weeks for 2 of 3 or 3 of 4 years. I think many have found that they don't go quite as much over time as they did the first few years. I'd suggest you do all of your investigation then consider buying far less than 600 initially, even 220-250 would be reasonable. Then after a couple of trips, you'll be in a far better situation to do otherwise if it still makes sense. IMO, the only people who would have enough info to make this decision up front are those that have been investigating AND renting for several years and have decided to buy rather than rent. Also, don't forget there are other options that are cheaper and for some, maybe better. You can get VERY nice timeshares off property for pennies up front and less yearly than DVC. You are in essence buying the on property right. If it's worth the extra tens of thousands to you, that's fine, I just wanted you to know there were very good options in resorts at least as nice as DVC within 2-3 miles and in some cases, far closer.
     
  14. markmcalear

    markmcalear Mouseketeer

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    Thanks Dean.

    We havent gone every year but we do plan to. We have had 5 children born in the last 8 years so travelling from UK has not always been possible. There will be no more kids though!

    I am in a position financially where I can treat my family to a WDW holiday every year. Due to there being 7 of us, I worked it out on the last 2 weeks in August costing me 317pts per week for a 2 bed villa savannah view at AKL.That was how I got to 600pts being required.

    So I think I have already decided to buy resale, although I am thinking maybe buy 400 resale (maybe split between 2 resorts) and wait to buy 200 retail for Poly. How does that sound?

    There is of course always the option to buy say 350pts split over 2 resorts and plan to visit Disney every other year and just go elsewhere on those "inbetween" years.
     
  15. CarolMN

    CarolMN DVC Co-Moderator Moderator

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    Not exactly true.

    If you buy direct, you will be able to use points to pay for selected non-DVC options. Among others, those options include non-DVC Disney resorts, cruises on DCL, and Adventures By Disney. Most believe that using points for those options are a poor economic value (including me). None of those choices are guaranteed to you by the contract and generally, the points required to use them are quite high and increase annually. That said, using DVC points to cruise on the Disney Cruise Line is a very popular choice. Sometimes, it's not about the $$, I guess.

    Here is a thread that will help you with "UY" - an abbreviation for use year.

    Understanding Use Year

    My best advice is to do as much research and learning as you can before you make a decision. There is no need to hurry - DVC will be around for many years to come. Good luck!
     
  16. browniemtb

    browniemtb DIS Veteran

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    Mark I am happy your here asking questions. The Dis is a great resource of very knowledgeable people. My input may echo what others have posted but I'll post anyways...
    1. Buying resale at the contract size you are speaking of will save thousands, so yes a better value.
    2. Buying direct offers trade benefits with in Disney, no biggie. Also you get the points right away for booking.
    3. Definitely buy multiple contracts, as others have said it gives you the flexibility to down size. We broke up our 310 points just in case...
    4. For me I do not understand the multiple resort theme. If AKV is your resort, buy there. If you want to stay elsewhere, you can, just book AKV at 11 months and change at 7 months. 1 resort
    5. With 600 points, using your membership outside of Disney may not be the best value, but you own the points so why not use them. Again this is another theme I don't get.

    Good Luck!
     
  17. markmcalear

    markmcalear Mouseketeer

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    Thanks browniemtb.

    Another question...

    I am not sure how the booking process goes for a DVC member, I assume its an online login or membership number system. If I had say 3 contracts, do I still just have one central way of booking?

    Like if I had 300pts AKL and 300pts VGF, could I book at AKL 11 months out and use all of my collective 600pts?
     
  18. Nabas

    Nabas Mouseketeer

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    Some random thoughts:

    There's no right or wrong answer on buying all your points at one resort or splitting them among multiple resorts. It depends on how you plan to vacation.

    You Home Resort is important primarily because you can book 11 months in advance there vs. 7 months everywhere else. This is important because, unlike regular WDW rooms, DVC rooms booked via points fills up quickly. The most popular rooms at the most popular resorts are nearly always gone by 6 month and 29 days. :)

    If you always stay at the same resort, then just buy at that resort.

    If you have 2 or 3 favorites, then you can use DVC's "banking" and "borrowing" to alternate which resort you stay each year.

    Alternatively, you mention that you might visit for 2 weeks at a time. For longer stays, we like to split resorts. Stay at one resort for the first half of the trip and in a second resort for the second half of the trip.

    Disney will transfer your luggage for you. Let them know you are transferring, pack up in the morning, leave the luggage in the room, and your luggage will be at your second resort by the late afternoon.

    Like you, we are a larger family and there's a world of difference between 2 connecting rooms and a 2-bedroom villa. You should love it!

    We own at 3 DVC resorts and added on at AKV earlier this year for $60/point using resale. That's less than half the direct price.

    We tend to stay at different resorts and always stay in a 2-bedroom villa. Depending on our plans, we sometimes bank points in one account and borrow from another.

    We also have 2 different UY because I like always having points available to use without worrying about the banking deadline. Suggest you read the link about UY to better understand it. The most important point, "Use year only matters if you have to cancel a vacation that was scheduled to occur late in your use year."

    Finally, everyone is right. Whether you buy direct or resale, split it up into smaller contracts. A 600 or even 400 point contract could be a pain to resale if you ever decide to sell. Besides, smaller contracts allow you to sell off pieces as the kids grow up and your needs decrease. Or you could just give them to your children. :)
     
  19. browniemtb

    browniemtb DIS Veteran

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    You can book online or by phone with member services. When you call you will need a member number and when you log into mydvc your membership is all there. Now the question....the only points you can use at 11 months would be the AKV.... the VGF, could be used at AKL at the 7 month mark. That is why I don't get the multiple resort theme. If you own at 1 resort, you can book at 11 months....everywhere else at 7.
     
  20. Nabas

    Nabas Mouseketeer

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    No, you can book at 11 months at your "Home Resort" only using the points at that resort.

    You would use banking and/or borrowing if you needed more than (in your example) 300 points at a specific resort for a specific year.

    You then could repeat the process the next year at a different resort and alternate which resort your are staying at and booking 11 months in advance.

    We've done this a couple of times.

    In theory, it's possible to do this using a 3-year cycle using banking and borrowing, but we've never tried it.
     
  21. chalee94

    chalee94 <font color=green>I thought all sand was ground up

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    as stated, if you have a 300 pt AKV contract and a 300 pt VGF contract and want to book VGF at 11 months out, you would only have access to pts from the VGF contract. it's like you don't even have an AKV contract for the purposes of booking VGF at 11 months (which is fair to people who paid specifically for VGF) - you can only use the AKV pts to book VGF at 7 months out, if rooms are still available.
     

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