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Old 11-09-2013, 02:38 PM   #691
clsteve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPCummerbund View Post

The only thing I can think in Disney's defense is that FP+ is, as they have explained, still in a "test phase". They're going to continue to tweak it, and may not even know what it's going to look like next week. For example, one wonders how far in advance they know about the tiered system. Sure, they could have expected most guests to choose Soarin' and Test Track, but they probably had no idea of the exact percentages, how many people would actually use the FP+, what the lines would look like, etc.
Sorry to disagree but this is not a test - this is a full-fledged, phased, production rollout. Tens of thousands are using MDE daily to make reservations, manage FP+ on-line, etc., while 100's of thousands will and are using it at the parks now through the holiday season. On-site are the 1st phase of this production rollout.

All phases of a production rollout have massively detailed project plans. Disney knows exactly when and what are the next milestones, whether that is inactivating KTTW cards for FP- for onsite, tiering the next Park, opening FP+ to AP, etc. The only thing that is being tested now is load balancing and throughput, for which they have decided to use actual guests. Milestones for the project may shift a week or 2 because of load balancing, but that's about it. Calling it a "test" is, unfortunately, Marketing Spin.
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Old 11-09-2013, 02:51 PM   #692
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The parks and the resorts are one company. If they could make more profit by making it a one-price, all-inclusive experience, they would.
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Old 11-09-2013, 02:53 PM   #693
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Originally Posted by clsteve View Post
Sorry to disagree but this is not a test - this is a full-fledged, phased, production rollout. Tens of thousands are using MDE daily to make reservations, manage FP+ on-line, etc., while 100's of thousands will and are using it at the parks now through the holiday season. On-site are the 1st phase of this production rollout.

All phases of a production rollout have massively detailed project plans. Disney knows exactly when and what are the next milestones, whether that is inactivating KTTW cards for FP- for onsite, tiering the next Park, opening FP+ to AP, etc. The only thing that is being tested now is load balancing and throughput, for which they have decided to use actual guests. Milestones for the project may shift a week or 2 because of load balancing, but that's about it. Calling it a "test" is, unfortunately, Marketing Spin.
Yep. They are hiding behind "testing." At one point, it was testing, but not anymore. But they can just keep saying that. Makes me wonder if they will ever stop "testing."
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Old 11-09-2013, 03:01 PM   #694
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Originally Posted by PeterPanic View Post
It's hard to express this next thing without sounding a little weird, but, I can afford to stay in the most expensive thing on Disney. I choose not to as a matter of my not wanting to be robbed at mouse point. It's just a personal decision, as is staying onsite.
I don't think "I can afford to stay in the most expensive thing on Disney" sounds weird, or bragging, snobby, or anything else for that matter. I'm glad that your family is in the position to do so and I also don't think there is any problem with saying so.

However, it seems to me (again my thoughts/opinion) is that some of the most heated discussion around here lately is a result of how things are said.

Following up that sentence with "I choose not to do so because I don't want to spend that much of my money.... etc." is very different from saying "I choose not to as a matter of my not wanting to be robbed at mouse point." Whether intentional or not, the second sentence has implications, implications that get people riled up.It changes the tone from - this is a "personal" decision, to - this is the "right, reasonable, logical... " decision.
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Old 11-09-2013, 04:11 PM   #695
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Originally Posted by Aunt Michelle View Post
I don't think "I can afford to stay in the most expensive thing on Disney" sounds weird, or bragging, snobby, or anything else for that matter. I'm glad that your family is in the position to do so and I also don't think there is any problem with saying so.

However, it seems to me (again my thoughts/opinion) is that some of the most heated discussion around here lately is a result of how things are said.

Following up that sentence with "I choose not to do so because I don't want to spend that much of my money.... etc." is very different from saying "I choose not to as a matter of my not wanting to be robbed at mouse point." Whether intentional or not, the second sentence has implications, implications that get people riled up.It changes the tone from - this is a "personal" decision, to - this is the "right, reasonable, logical... " decision.
I do understand what you are saying, but in the context I used, the idea that I don't want to spend that much of my money implies that I am just cheap. I used that phrase because I feel that spending that much of my money on something that I don't feel is of equal value is being robbed at mouse point. Others that don't feel that way need not equate what I said as something less then flattering. It was an expression of my personal feelings about it. Didn't need to say it that way, sure, but expressing my deep down feelings is, I think, more honest then just letting everyone try to guess my motivations.
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Old 11-09-2013, 04:32 PM   #696
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Originally Posted by CanadaJulie View Post
where were we complaining about about onsite guests getting what we (offsite guests) don't ? The onsite perks as I see them are: EMH, the 10 extra days of the ADR+10 , the ability to pay for the DDP (or get it free with a full rate room) and free parking at your resort.

Where has ANYONE complained that the offsite guests aren't allowed these things ?

The Disney transportation is available to everyone, not just resort guests so that's no an onsite perk.

As on off-site guest, I can go see the outdoor movies at your resort, I can eat in your resort restaurants, I can pop over and visit them, have a drink, chill in the lobby... I can't swim in your pool but then you can't swim in an off-site resort pool so that's not a perk.

Unless I am missing something - the above mentionned perks are just not worth the 7X price increase over what I am paying for my 5BDR/3BATH house.

No complaining here !

The only issue RIGHT NOW is the way Disney is doing their testing of the FP+. This is not an onsite perk as it has been stated that all guests will have access to FP+ once it rolls out. We are complaining about the lack of info from Disney about the testing/roll-out for FP+ but again, that is not an onsite perk.
Not you specifically maybe. But there are a multitude of posts here crying that Disney is screwing over offsite guests.

Disney can make their own decisions about what they offer to offsite guests. Personally, I feel that Disney doesn't have to offer anything to offsite and that people should be happy they get to use FP at all if they're off site.

Heck, Disney could decide tomorrow to do away with FP altogether, for everyone. Sometimes I think they should. They've created an army of the entitled.
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Old 11-09-2013, 04:52 PM   #697
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Originally Posted by Angel Ariel View Post
I haven't seen most people complaining about the current perks onsite guests get. I've seen people take issue with the idea that those who stay on site will get more access to the attractions during regular park hours, when everyone pays the same admission to enter the park. yes, yes, I know "onsite guests spend more." Yes, they do. And they get perks accordingly. Access to attractions during public park hours, for which every WDW guests pays the exact same admission fee, is not the same thing as EMH/dining plan/free parking/transportation/immersion
I didn't say most people. But there are plenty of complaints. I know it's not the same as what you listed. But IF that happens to be the case, it IS a perk that people are complaining about. Universal guests get the same perk for staying onsite. I still don't see why anyone choosing to stay offsite can complain. It's all a choice.

ETA... Let me fix that statement. I get why you're upset. But it does still come down to a choice. Disney wants people to stay onsite. They might be tailoring fp to entice more on site visitors.

I totally see (speculation only) the final product of this all being fp+ for everyone, but certain perks going to onsite guests. Like more advanced reservations, being able to schedule 4 or 5 instead of three. Jmo.
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Old 11-09-2013, 04:54 PM   #698
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Originally Posted by CanadaJulie View Post
Not sure where you've read that but it is not consistent with anything that Disney has said. RIGHT NOW (in testing mode), it certainly favors onsite guests *IF* they can get FP+ and still access FP-. Of course, rumour has it that soon, if you have a MB, you won't be able to access FP- (there's a whole thread on it on the 1st page) and THAT has the onsite guests in a tizzy !!
I know it's not. But read all over the DIS and people are either assuming or worried that it could be this way. Personally I don't think it will. I never said that this is what I thought. This is what others think based on what I've read on here.

ETA... Fwiw I'm an onsite guest and I'm not in a tizzy over that.
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Old 11-09-2013, 05:44 PM   #699
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Originally Posted by ArwenMarie View Post
Yep. They are hiding behind "testing." At one point, it was testing, but not anymore. But they can just keep saying that. Makes me wonder if they will ever stop "testing."
Maybe not. Google considered gmail to be beta for around 5 years.
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Old 11-09-2013, 06:20 PM   #700
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I totally see (speculation only) the final product of this all being fp+ for everyone, but certain perks going to onsite guests. Like more advanced reservations, being able to schedule 4 or 5 instead of three. Jmo.
And that kind of benefit, I don't take an issue with. I'm totally fine with onsite guests having +10 days access to prebooking, like they do for ADRs, or being able to book 4 or 5 FPs instead of 3 (though I would have an issue with them developing a "class" system amongst the onsite resorts).

I do, however, have an issue with offsite guests having *no* ability to prebook, as that has been THE major marketing factor of FP+, AND Disney has said that everyone will be able to use FP+. Prebooking is what puts the + in FP+. If that part wasn't ever going to be available to offsite guests, then Disney has a very poor marketing department.
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Old 11-09-2013, 06:38 PM   #701
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Maybe not. Google considered gmail to be beta for around 5 years.
But, Gmail is not a Customer Management System (CM), nor is it a Point of Sale System (POS). A major corporation does not put either of these into production as beta. MDE is both, of which FP+ is a major component.
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Old 11-09-2013, 07:25 PM   #702
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I think that some of that resentment comes from offsite guests worrying that they'll lose the perks that they've always had. I don't think that most expect to get the perks they never had such as EMH and so on but they've always shared in the fastpass perk and it appears that that might change now. No one likes to move in reverse.
Planogirl, I think you stated this so well and I agree with you.
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Old 11-09-2013, 07:45 PM   #703
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I do feel that the vacationy feel is gone for me. I'm really glad we squeezed in a great trip in August. I do have a set of 5 day tickets I bought before the price increase and I imagine we will use them someday but not until all this settles down and I know how to best manage our vacation with the least stress. I may end up selling them one day.

The way I could really tell I'm not that into Disney since this MB, FP+ thing is that I've stopped using my Disney Visa and have been using two of my other cards a lot more for the cashback, points, etc. I used to use my Disney Visa a lot so I'd have Disney Reward dollars to pay for food, etc. at Disney. Now I'll start to pull it out and then end up switching to another card that can be used on more general things.

Hopefully things will settle down and a Disney World vacay will seem relaxing again in the not too distant future.
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:23 PM   #704
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Originally Posted by luvthemouse71 View Post
Not you specifically maybe. But there are a multitude of posts here crying that Disney is screwing over offsite guests. Disney can make their own decisions about what they offer to offsite guests. Personally, I feel that Disney doesn't have to offer anything to offsite and that people should be happy they get to use FP at all if they're off site. Heck, Disney could decide tomorrow to do away with FP altogether, for everyone. Sometimes I think they should. They've created an army of the entitled.
Entitled? No I wouldn't say that. Well trained, absolutely. They used fp for their purposes, people learned the procedures and were rewarded for their behavior.

you think you are "entitled" to more because of your behaviors also. No difference.

Lol, really. Telling people what they should be happy with?
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Old 11-09-2013, 09:27 PM   #705
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I don't really complain...with one exception. If you stay in the most expensive accommodation on WDW and I sleep in my car, the cost for us to get into the theme parks is based on the same grid. If anything, the onsiters might get a discount price on their tickets, if there is a promotion going. What that means is that I paid the same to get into the entertainment and should be able to have the same perks. I will give a pass on Extra Park hours, because I can see that as a separate thing and as long as I can stay as long as the park is open to the rest of the public, I'm OK with that.

Even if it comes to denying offsite people FP, as long as they offer a way to purchase one, then I will be fine with it because heaven knows that onsiters have more than paid for that with the additional cost for lodging. If they don't offer us a way to participate that is when I will take the advice of others and just not go. Not as a protest, not as an arm twisting way for Disney to see my way, but as a matter of principle and being true to myself. I will not be treated as second class by Disney or anyone else. Never have and I see no reason to start now just to see a bunch of make-believe things.

It's hard to express this next thing without sounding a little weird, but, I can afford to stay in the most expensive thing on Disney. I choose not to as a matter of my not wanting to be robbed at mouse point. It's just a personal decision, as is staying onsite. I love the much discounted cost of a hotel room offsite, I love having my or a car to drive in and out whenever I want with no standing in line waiting or standing on a bus tired and short of patience, no having to make ADR's (I do occasionally, but not often), walking into an offsite restaurant based on my food craving of the day and sitting down almost immediately. I love having a good time, at a reasonable rate, I love not lugging around water all day because I'm trying to save money. I love, beyond that how easy it is for me to explore other areas of Florida. Go to Seaworld or Universal or Kennedy Space Ctr and others without having to figure out how I'm going to get there. Those are my habitual ways of touring and including WDW. Not everyone feels the same way, but I shouldn't be punished because I don't see the value in staying onsite.

I have never stayed offsite and do not plan to, but I wanted to comment that your post makes perfect sense and I agree wholeheartedly.....especially with your first paragraph. Bravo!
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