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Old 07-05-2013, 03:27 PM   #16
DCTooTall
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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
Are all the points charged the same maintenance fee per point across the board?

If you don't mind me asking how much is the monthly or annual maintenance fees for 500,000 points?

And thanks for the info and link.
Different resorts can have different MF costs. Some of the cheaper resorts will have a MF around $4.00-$4.50/1k, while others could run upwards of $7/1k. The cheaper the MF costs, the higher the resale purchase price tends to be.

You should also make sure you look into if you are looking at annual or every-other-year contracts. With Annual contracts you get your points renewed each year, while with the every-other-year contracts you only get points on the Odd or Even years, depending upon your contract. The Biennial contracts can also get you on the MF's since your program membership fee (basically your annual Wyndham Membership cost) is charged every year based off your total contract value..... IE, for a 150,000 Biennial contract, Your contract may show as getting 75,000 annually, but you'll be charged your program few for 150,000 annually.

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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
For anybody else who has any helpful advice or words of wisdom for me. I am looking into buying some Wyndham points and know nothing about it so far.

And tips and tricks?

Is there a chart someplace that shows you how many points it takes to stay certain amounts of time in certain resorts?

Do you need to buy points from a specific home resort or does it matter? Can you use the points at any resort?
Points are points, for the most part, but there are a few exceptions.

Any wyndham owner can book any wyndham resort at the 10month mark. However, from 13-10months you get an "Advanced Reservation Priority" at your home resort. This means that if you want a specific unit size/type, or want to book at a popular time at a resort, Sometimes you may need to factor in the ARP window in which resort you buy your points at.

Examples might include Bonnet Creek during Christmas/New Years week.... or 4bdrm Presidentials.... Or New Orleans resorts during Mardi Gras.... Or even sometimes a Presidential unit in some of the resorts that only have 2 or 3 Presidential units in their inventory.


Something else, depending upon how you plan on using your points, which you'll want to keep in mind is your Reservation Transactions and Housekeeping points. depending on the size of your ownership, you will get so many free "reservation Transation Points", and so Many Housekeeping points. once you run out of either you'll incur some extra expenses. I'm sure the TUG articles will probably go over these in a bit more details.

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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
We would never travel during holidays or summer to Orlando. Maybe to some place else like Tennessee or Las Vegas but I can't deal with peak Disney crowds.

If I were to buy a contract some time soon and it still had 2013 points left on it what would my options be for those points? Use them or lose them? Or is there another option to keep from losing them?
Honestly... I'd personally not count on getting access to any of the 2013 points still on a contract. You won't get any access to the contract as an owner until it goes thru the whole title transfer and Wyndham transfer processes. Wyndham can sometimes take months to complete the transfer on a contract, so those 2013 points could expire before you'd get access to them. If the transfer completes however before the end of the [use]year, then you can look at them as bonus points that you could try and bank with RCI if there isn't a resort nearby you could use them at.

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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
I want to buy a contract with about 230-250,000 points on it because that would get me 3 different weeks at different places (not during high season) and the maintenance fees would only be about $1000 a year. That works out to $333 per week for 3 weeks at my choice (if there is availability) at any Wyndham location.

I looked up completed sales on Ebay and all the contracts under 300,000 points seem to be going for less than $500.

You may be able to rent points for less than $50 a day (which is about what you pay by owning) but I think I would have more control and availability if I had control over my own points.

I looked into DVC for several months. I researched it and researched it and almost bought on two different occasions but something kept me from doing it. I decided I might not want to be tied down to 40 years of Disney vacations. That there are a lot of different locations I would like to see.

And buying Wyndham points is an easy way to do that. They have about 50 (?) resorts in the US to choose from and they all seem to be nice locations. I have been looking at the pictures and none of them seem to be in bad shape.

The maintenance fees for Wyndham points works out to be a little cheaper than DVC for what you get (Points wise) and the initial investment in buying your points is dirt cheap. So I haven't found any down sides yet.

I am mainly searching for info and details on buying and owning. But the actual timeshare boards they don't really want you to ask too many questions. They think you need to find your own info like they had to back when they decided to buy.

There are some downsides to owning at wyndham, such as the fact they are easy to get, but hard to get rid of (hense some of the virtual give aways of the contracts). They also have a tendency to change the program rules in their favor on a semi-regular basis.

You also have to keep in mind the Reservation and Housekeeping points and how to manage them.

And of course... the sales side of the company can be a nightmare to deal with at times.

Honestly, It's a great system to own in if you are prepared and know what you are getting yourself into, but it's something you should definitely take some time to get familiar with before you take the plunge. Timeshare ownership can be a great thing for some people, but for others, maybe not so much. Only you can really make that determination however since so many of the criteria can be subjective to your own situation.

Both the TUG forums and the Wyndham Owners forums would be good location to research and learn about the system. There is information readily available for you to research and learn about the system, but because of it's flexibility, nuances, and complexities, It's really hard for someone else to give you any real specifics or try and teach you about the system without a real sitdown one-on-one classroom type situation.
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Old 07-05-2013, 06:06 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
The maintenance fees for Wyndham points works out to be a little cheaper than DVC for what you get (Points wise) ...
Or WAY cheaper...depending on which resort you own at DVC and Wyndham.

Two years ago, I had a split reservation -- a couple of weekdays at Disney's Old Key West using my OKW points, followed by a couple of weekdays at WBC using my Wyndham Smoky Mountains points. Both were in one-bedroom deluxe villas during the same week. (For those who don't know, OKW is among the lowest cost/lowest MF DVC resorts, and Smoky Mountains is among the lowest MF resorts for Wyndham).

The OKW points cost was 27 points per night. My OKW cost per point (acquisition cost + MFs) was $7 per point. So 27 X $7 = $189 per night at Old Key West.

My actual cost was lower (9K), but the normal points cost per night at WBC for that week was 15,000 points. I'm using the normal points cost so that a fluky break we caught doesn't skew the example.

My Smoky Mountains cost per K is $4.48. 15K X $4.48 = $67.20 per night...$122 per night less.
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Old 07-05-2013, 07:02 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by JimMIA View Post
Or WAY cheaper...depending on which resort you own at DVC and Wyndham.

Two years ago, I had a split reservation -- a couple of weekdays at Disney's Old Key West using my OKW points, followed by a couple of weekdays at WBC using my Wyndham Smoky Mountains points. Both were in one-bedroom deluxe villas during the same week. (For those who don't know, OKW is among the lowest cost/lowest MF DVC resorts, and Smoky Mountains is among the lowest MF resorts for Wyndham).

The OKW points cost was 27 points per night. My OKW cost per point (acquisition cost + MFs) was $7 per point. So 27 X $7 = $189 per night at Old Key West.

My actual cost was lower (9K), but the normal points cost per night at WBC for that week was 15,000 points. I'm using the normal points cost so that a fluky break we caught doesn't skew the example.

My Smoky Mountains cost per K is $4.48. 15K X $4.48 = $67.20 per night...$122 per night less.
Yeah you are right it is way cheaper. I forgot that when I was looking into DVC contracts I was looking at buying enough points where we could stay 5 nights 2 times a year or one time in a bigger unit for 7 nights. The maintenance fees were going to be around $800 a year.

With a big Wyndham contract I can get 3 weeks@ 7 days vacation a year for around $900 in maintenance fees.

And when you factor in the low initial buy in for the Wyndham points it really works out so much cheaper per night.

I have never stayed at OKW (although I have really wanted to. We eat there a lot and it is my fav resort on property) So I don't know how the quality of the rooms compares to the Wyndham resorts...but you have to get a one bedroom there to have a full kitchen and the points for a one bedroom are double what it costs for a studio. From what I see in the Wyndham directory the one bedroom deluxe rooms have a full kitchen and it is still much cheaper per night.

I appreciate all the helpful info y'all are giving me. It helps a lot.

I read the Wyndham Primer on the Wyndham owners message boards but it all still seems like Chinese right now.

I have found out that 2 of the 6 contracts I am watching on Ebay do have the 2013 points on them. So if it takes a couple of months for closing and transfer to happen I really wouldn't have much time to use those 2013 points so I would need to deposit them into RCI correct? And then I can use them at RCI resorts during the next 2 years?
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Old 07-06-2013, 02:56 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
Yeah you are right it is way cheaper. I forgot that when I was looking into DVC contracts I was looking at buying enough points where we could stay 5 nights 2 times a year or one time in a bigger unit for 7 nights. The maintenance fees were going to be around $800 a year.

With a big Wyndham contract I can get 3 weeks@ 7 days vacation a year for around $900 in maintenance fees.

And when you factor in the low initial buy in for the Wyndham points it really works out so much cheaper per night.

I have never stayed at OKW (although I have really wanted to. We eat there a lot and it is my fav resort on property) So I don't know how the quality of the rooms compares to the Wyndham resorts...but you have to get a one bedroom there to have a full kitchen and the points for a one bedroom are double what it costs for a studio. From what I see in the Wyndham directory the one bedroom deluxe rooms have a full kitchen and it is still much cheaper per night.

I appreciate all the helpful info y'all are giving me. It helps a lot.

I read the Wyndham Primer on the Wyndham owners message boards but it all still seems like Chinese right now.

I have found out that 2 of the 6 contracts I am watching on Ebay do have the 2013 points on them. So if it takes a couple of months for closing and transfer to happen I really wouldn't have much time to use those 2013 points so I would need to deposit them into RCI correct? And then I can use them at RCI resorts during the next 2 years?
I think you have underestimated the fees involved. For example, the 2012 annual fees at Bonnet Creek are $1,521 for 300K points. This is according to the fee calculator at http://forums.atozed.com/index.php

In addition, Wyndham has other fees you may run into including housekeeping, reservation, credit pool, etc.

Anyhow, there is a ton of material about timeshares out there and all that info can be daunting. Perhaps there is a secret formula to doing it cheaper than renting, but I haven't found it.
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Old 07-06-2013, 05:45 AM   #20
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I sold my disney DVC timeshare a few years ago at a profit (yay) and have never looked back. We go on ebay and get great deals at bonnet creek for whenever we want to go. I don't know how the point system is with wyndham but with disney it could be very limiting. Mostly you could only get what you wanted when the 11 month window opened up at your home resort, not sure if that has changed. It was very rare to be able to book a last minute trip, and sometimes even well in advance nothing is available. I feel like now, we can always book near the last minute regardless of time of year, stay whenever we want and we are saving a ton of money. I would never buy a timeshare again, even if I won the lotto!! I know people with timeshares that cannot give them away.
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Old 07-06-2013, 08:48 AM   #21
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The LAST place you want to buy points is directly through Wyndham! They will charge you hundreds of times more than you can buy them elsewhere.

You can go to WBC and request a tour with a sales pitch if you'd like Wyndhams POV. I'd not recommend that though. The sales staff is very, very shady. We are RCI owners and went to one of those "seminars" last February at WBC when we were staying and I nearly had to threaten physical violence to get away. It's just not worth it. Plus they wanted to charge $20,000 for something I could buy on ebay for less than $500.

Tread carefully. Very carefully. BTW we love the timeshares, just not the sales tactics. It's not for everyone though.
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Old 07-06-2013, 10:48 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by MinnieLovesMickey12 View Post
I have never stayed at OKW (although I have really wanted to. We eat there a lot and it is my fav resort on property) So I don't know how the quality of the rooms compares to the Wyndham resorts...but you have to get a one bedroom there to have a full kitchen and the points for a one bedroom are double what it costs for a studio. From what I see in the Wyndham directory the one bedroom deluxe rooms have a full kitchen and it is still much cheaper per night.
Both resort's 1 BR's have a full bedroom, living room/dining area, full kitchen, and washer/dryer. I would rate the WBC 1 BR as a little better any DVC 1 BRs I've stayed in with the exception of OKW. The kitchens at WBC (and most Wyndham resorts) are somewhat better equipped than DVC kitchens.

OKW 1 BRs are substantially larger, laid out better, and the balcony is bigger than WBC. (For comparison, the OKW 1 BR is 1005 square feet, the WBC 1 BRs range from 812-902 sq ft, and most other WDW DVC 1 BRs range from about 700 - 800 sq ft.) Not that it matters, but the OKW washer and dryer are full-sized stand alone models; WBC and the other DVC resorts have stacked.

Downside with OKW is that with the exception of a few buildings, there are no elevators. So if you are on the second or third floor, you will have to lug your luggage up and down the stairs -- or pay to have someone do it for you.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:36 AM   #23
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I think you have underestimated the fees involved. For example, the 2012 annual fees at Bonnet Creek are $1,521 for 300K points. This is according to the fee calculator at http://forums.atozed.com/index.php

In addition, Wyndham has other fees you may run into including housekeeping, reservation, credit pool, etc.

Anyhow, there is a ton of material about timeshares out there and all that info can be daunting. Perhaps there is a secret formula to doing it cheaper than renting, but I haven't found it.
I have read up on most of the fees. Fees for making a reservation, fees for transferring points to RCI, etc.

And the maintenance fees for all the different resorts are different.

In some of the listing there might be a 300,000 point contract with monthly maintenance fees of $165 but a contract I found with 250,000 had maintenance fees of only $90 a month.

But the ones with low maintenance fees are selling for more money up front.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:37 AM   #24
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The LAST place you want to buy points is directly through Wyndham! They will charge you hundreds of times more than you can buy them elsewhere.

You can go to WBC and request a tour with a sales pitch if you'd like Wyndhams POV. I'd not recommend that though. The sales staff is very, very shady. We are RCI owners and went to one of those "seminars" last February at WBC when we were staying and I nearly had to threaten physical violence to get away. It's just not worth it. Plus they wanted to charge $20,000 for something I could buy on ebay for less than $500.

Tread carefully. Very carefully. BTW we love the timeshares, just not the sales tactics. It's not for everyone though.
I'm not looking to buy directly through Wyndham. I am looking at buying resale through either a broker or through Ebay.
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:16 AM   #25
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Just so you know, some of the info in the Wyndham Primer on Tug is outdated. Not all of it, but some of the specifics. If you have questions you should ask on Tug. I recently started going there for Wyndham info (I'm a new owner) and the Bonnet Creek questions come up every other week.
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:21 AM   #26
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But the ones with low maintenance fees are selling for more money up front.
I've been following ebay sales since January and I doubt you can get 300K points with low maintenance fees for under $500. Prices have been going up.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:05 PM   #27
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Just so you know, some of the info in the Wyndham Primer on Tug is outdated. Not all of it, but some of the specifics.
YES! Especially the info about RCI exchanges. There are also a couple of newer programs that you will hear about (especially from timeshare sales weasels) that are not mentioned either.
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Old 07-09-2013, 01:33 PM   #28
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I have read up on most of the fees. Fees for making a reservation, fees for transferring points to RCI, etc.
I think most of those fees get more mention than they really deserve. For example, you get reservation transactions and housekeeping credits each year. In 2 1/2 years, we've done about 10 stays and never had to pay for reservations or housekeeping, despite several very short trips. We also have not had to pay for guest confirmations. We've given two short trips to friends, but used our one free GC for those.

We did pay a small fee for credit pooling, but doing so extends the use of the points to three years from the date of the pooling, so I thought that was a great bargain.

We have also done one RCI exchange (2 units for a week on Cape Cod). We were very happy with that exchange because it was only 3 miles from relatives we were visiting. We currently have an ongoing request for an exchange into DVC, but I don't think we are going to get it. If not, we may just extend those points for a year and go next spring. The $199 RCI exchange fee is not cheap, but you only pay it if you actually get the exchange, and we only put points into RCI as a last resort.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:55 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by DCTooTall View Post
The Biennial contracts can also get you on the MF's since your program membership fee (basically your annual Wyndham Membership cost) is charged every year based off your total contract value..... IE, for a 150,000 Biennial contract, Your contract may show as getting 75,000 annually, but you'll be charged your program few for 150,000 annually.
This isn't really true anymore. I think at one time it was true, but currently a 150k biennial contract is equivalent to a 75k annual contract with regards to fees.

I'm a happy Wyndham owner. Glad to see some other Tuggers have already directed you that way. Over the past year I've purchased 245k points for $1500 total (including fees/closing costs) and I got about a full years points included with the MF already pre-paid. My husband says we now have a moratorium on Wyndham points....

As far as remaining 2013 points, are you sure you won't be able to book a last minute getaway? Wyndham always has specials where the points needed for a stay get reduced up to 30-40% when you are booking something within about 60 days. Availability isn't usually too much of a problem for most of the resorts. You'd be surprised at what you can get!
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Old 07-10-2013, 06:16 AM   #30
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I have read up on most of the fees. ... fees for transferring points to RCI, etc.
One other minor clarification -- there is no fee for depositing points into RCI. An RCI deposit uses one "reservation transaction," but there is no cost unless you have used all of that year's RTs (which I've never come close to doing).

Once you deposit points to RCI, there is a fee for either booking an exchange or for starting an ongoing search. That fee is $199 online, $209 if you do it by phone. However, if you don't get an exchange, that fee is fully refundable.
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