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Old 05-22-2013, 08:34 PM   #241
DMMarla07860
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Originally Posted by justmestace View Post
In the State of Florida, as in most states, the family of the victim or the victims themselves, aren't the ones who press charges. The State makes that decision. DCL didn't give this girl and her grandmother the option of talking to the Florida police. Any time there is an accusation of molestation, the police should be called, if the people are in the United States, and they were.

It's impossible to say "what if...this, or what if...that..." because whoever the girl and her grandmother talked to onboard didn't follow the law.
here's something new I have been thinking. So this went down around 3:00pm on boarding day right. I know the video said like 2:55, so give or take? Well to actually make a case it does take time I'd guess. I thought I had read they went to Guest Services, correct me if I am wrong. So could it have been that maybe they didn't have enough facts at the time the ship was going to sail to actually make a call to the cops. Again I'm not good with law and won't pretend to be good with it, just something I was thinking. I mean even someone who does something should get credit to be innocent to proven guilt, maybe at time of sailing they didn't have enough to prove him of doing anything. This is not directed right to you. Your What if...this or what if...that had me thinking. If I missed any facts correct me since I'm not law enforcement
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Old 05-22-2013, 08:43 PM   #242
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Originally Posted by DMMarla07860 View Post
here's something new I have been thinking. So this went down around 3:00pm on boarding day right. I know the video said like 2:55, so give or take? Well to actually make a case it does take time I'd guess. I thought I had read they went to Guest Services, correct me if I am wrong. So could it have been that maybe they didn't have enough facts at the time the ship was going to sail to actually make a call to the cops. Again I'm not good with law and won't pretend to be good with it, just something I was thinking. I mean even someone who does something should get credit to be innocent to proven guilt, maybe at time of sailing they didn't have enough to prove him of doing anything. This is not directed right to you. Your What if...this or what if...that had me thinking. If I missed any facts correct me since I'm not law enforcement
The only fact anyone needs to know before calling authorities in the case of child molestation in Florida is that a child says someone did it. There words alone are enough. I posted a link awhile back on the laws in all 50 states.
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Old 05-22-2013, 08:44 PM   #243
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the child is a victim. to suggest that she bears any responsibility for what transpired ...
All I was responding to was the question that she was "kidnapped". Boy people can misread things here. I never said anything else and I thought I made that clear when someone asked if this would be considered some form of restraint. I was commenting more on the idea that for a predator he sure liked to be out in the open and I was surprised by that. He left himself quite vulnerable if you think about it and maybe he was looking to get caught (he had to know there were cameras everywhere on the boat).

Do I think DCL should have called the authorities in Florida, yes. Is there a lot of information left to speculation, yes. Is the child responsible in any way,no and neither is the grandmother or any other family member. The real person to blame is the perpetrator and only him because what he did was wrong. If you want my opinion on required reports on child sexual assault I can write a paper on the pros and cons of this... I have met too many individuals (both male and female) who did not report being victims of sex crimes, did not tell anyone in a position of authority, and stewed in the trauma of their experience for years because they did not want to deal with either confronting their abuser, going to court , or having to deal with the shame of others knowing. This girl told her grandmother who reacted appropriately, validated her experience and reported it- that response alone is more healing and therapeutic than anything anyone else could have done.
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:05 PM   #244
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Food for thought... I searched sexual assault on Disney Cruise and there is a report from USA today about a man (passenger) sexually assaulting a 13 year old girl on the Disney Wonder several years ago. He was taken to the Bahamas, charges were pressed and he went to jail. It is interesting how two similar events can play out so differently.
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:24 PM   #245
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And the rest of the story

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Originally Posted by flyinglizard View Post
Wow! Just saw the report and the video and documents on the channel 6 report. The incident was immediately reported to Disney but they delayed calling local authorities till the ship sailed. Once the ship reached the Bahamas, the perv was put on a plane back to India. Seems like everything was just swept under the rug till they were out of U.S. jurisdiction. Not very magical for that little girl or her family...
u

Thank god for one smart grandmother, said did not want to press charges. She did not want to tramitize the girl and ruin vacation.
The serever was not ID until ship sailed around 7:00 pm. He confessed DCL fiered, police deported to india. If arrested in US he would be citizen by now.

Statement by PC police tells you were the whole thing would have gone. We the tax payers would have been paying for three hots and a cote for 25 years. The gril would still be in the country missed her cruise of a life time repeating over and over her story.

Mickey is not perfect just a mouse trying to make people happy.

The gril and grandmother were from South America
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:46 PM   #246
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Like Chocolate Milk, question asked and answered. We are now so far from facts that its time to end.
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:49 PM   #247
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Like Chocolate Milk, question asked and answered. We are now so far from facts that its time to end.
I second that.
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:52 PM   #248
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Like Chocolate Milk, question asked and answered. We are now so far from facts that its time to end.
agreed
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:55 PM   #249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linkandclover View Post
Food for thought... I searched sexual assault on Disney Cruise and there is a report from USA today about a man (passenger) sexually assaulting a 13 year old girl on the Disney Wonder several years ago. He was taken to the Bahamas, charges were pressed and he went to jail. It is interesting how two similar events can play out so differently.
I'd be willing to bet this man was not a Disney employee. Such an incident being public would not reflect as badly, given that Disney couldn't ensure that every passenger is an angel.

On a side note, not only do many children who are molested not scream (in fact some suggest a majority) do not report the abuse for years (if ever) because often (more often than not in fact) the abuse comes from someone they know or trust, or think they should be able to trust, like football coaches, priests, men dressed in what could appear to be (to a child in a foreign country) a ship's officers uniform? Many don't scream because they are threatened, scared or confused about the situation. The fact that she immediately told an adult shows a great deal of bravery. Perhaps, the grandmother decided not to press charges fearing that the disgusting and inane questioning of her granddaughter vs the accused, as we have seen on these boards, might cause even more damage to this young girl and snuff out her brave light?

If a child reports abuse, law states you are to immediately call the local authorities (then if you wish to self investigate, go ahead) 11+ miles out at sea Disney would have been this authority, but they weren't when it was reported and for several hours after. If the girl were American, they would have been required, by law, to call the FBI (not just the local police)...even at sea.

I've been a finalist for the mom's panel...I may have jeopardized that dream by speaking out here...but, I like to think that I am big enough to admit when, even something I am so entirely passionate about and committed to, has made a mistake. I will not abandon my love of Disney and its mission as a corporation, but I will reach out to them and ask for an explanation and what they have done to ensure this can never happen again.
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Old 05-22-2013, 10:39 PM   #250
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Originally Posted by GoofyTwinDad View Post
If there are any lawyers or police reading this thread, does forceful restraint such as the CM demonstrated by not letting the girl out of the elevator give rise to kidnapping or some other higher charge than molestation?

I'm an Ohio police officer. I can't speak for Florida but in Ohio, absolutely.

In fact, the kidnapping charge that could stem from this incident if committed in Ohio is a more serious offense than the fondling itself. The fondling in Ohio would be called Gross Sexual Imposition. It is a felony of the third degree and carries 1 to 5 year sentence because of the victim's age.

Because he restrained her liberty with the purpose to engage in sexual activity (i.e. he held her on the elevator, blocked her escape, so that he could touch her breasts) and because she was only 11 years old this would be a felony of the first degree kidnapping. Because she was safely released from his custody, the kidnapping could carry an indefinite sentence of 10 years to life if I am not mistaken.

I loved reading this thread. Not because of what happened to the poor girl (and I have NO doubt that what she disclosed really happened exactly how she said it happened). I enjoyed reading this thread because of the very passionate responses from most of you. I love it. You are the kind of people I want on juries for crimes that I investigate.

I don't know maritime or port law and jurisdiction so I'm not qualified to rush to judgement against DCL. Respectfully, I also don't take the word of anonymous posters who claim to be experts (nor do I expect any of you to take mine just because I claim to be a police officer).

That being said, there are several reasons why the grandmother could possibly have chosen not to pursue charges in this matter. We don't know what motivated her decision.

The first most obvious reason IMHO is that the victim and her family were from Brazil and may not have wanted to have to come back to the US for investigation and prosecution. Unless Florida law is different, the victim would have to be present to testify as to what happened.

Another reason tied to the fact that the family was from Brazil which may explain why they didn't want to pursue charges: They may not trust law enforcement or criminal justice systems due to corrupt institutions in their own country (which are reportedly widespread).

In any case, if this case were assigned to me I would jump at the chance to investigate this. I'd take the video evidence combined with a good disclosure from the victim and lock this guy away for 10 to life. To the poster who said he would be read Miranda and not confess...I would take that challenge gladly and get him to sing like Chunk from the Goonies. He confessed in the Bahamas; we'd get him to confess here. Miranda is just as irrelevant here as it was with the Boston bombing suspect. It is not always required (depending on custodial nature of interview) and it is not as big as an obstacle as some make it out to be when it is required.

That's a moot point though. The video and the victim's disclosure would be enough to convict this guy even without a confession, IMHO.

Again, I'm not second guessing DCL nor would I cancel my upcoming cruise because of this incident. I'll reserve judgment and see what their response is now that this incident has gained some serious attention.

I will, however, use this video as a valuable teaching tool for my children as to safety on the ships during our vacations. I also will now have to do some mental rehearsals on what I would do if I were ever placed in a situation where one of my children disclosed something like this happened on a DCL cruise. It would take a lot of restraint not to throw that guy overboard (especially seeing the outcome of this case).
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Old 05-22-2013, 10:45 PM   #251
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Still don't understand the family not wanting to press charges here - I smell some 'incentives' coming from DCL in order to keep it under wraps and if the store was not 100% solid, then more of a reason to keep quiet.

...
The family was in a foreign country. I'm sure, that was a huge factor in their decision, not to pursue the incident. Possibly...they believed, that pressing charges would be more traumatic.

I'm not saying, I agree or disagree, but I can understand.
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Old 05-22-2013, 10:52 PM   #252
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Originally Posted by ColonFamilia View Post
.

That being said, there are several reasons why the grandmother could possibly have chosen not to pursue charges in this matter. We don't know what motivated her decision.

The first most obvious reason IMHO is that the victim and her family were from Brazil and may not have wanted to have to come back to the US for investigation and prosecution. Unless Florida law is different, the victim would have to be present to testify as to what happened.

Another reason tied to the fact that the family was from Brazil which may explain why they didn't want to pursue charges: They may not trust law enforcement or criminal justice systems due to corrupt institutions in their own country (which are reportedly widespread).

.
I agree.
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Old 05-22-2013, 11:14 PM   #253
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here's something new I have been thinking. So this went down around 3:00pm on boarding day right. I know the video said like 2:55, so give or take? Well to actually make a case it does take time I'd guess. I thought I had read they went to Guest Services, correct me if I am wrong. So could it have been that maybe they didn't have enough facts at the time the ship was going to sail to actually make a call to the cops. Again I'm not good with law and won't pretend to be good with it, just something I was thinking. I mean even someone who does something should get credit to be innocent to proven guilt, maybe at time of sailing they didn't have enough to prove him of doing anything. This is not directed right to you. Your What if...this or what if...that had me thinking. If I missed any facts correct me since I'm not law enforcement
Regardless, they should have confined him (yes, the ship has a "brig") and released him to Florida authorities upon return. Instead, this was a cover up, and it is quite disheartening.
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Old 05-22-2013, 11:25 PM   #254
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i agree.
+2
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:03 AM   #255
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Has anyone pointed out what would have happened if DCL had reported it to FL and the family had refused to file a complaint and get off the ship to talk the cops? Nothing can happen if no one steps forward to say a crime has been commited.
Not true. Was involved in a case of a 13yo who "willingly" had sex with an 19yo. It was prosecuted because a 13yo cannot give consent. As physician had to report to CPS, and it went from there...Believe me, she did not want it reported.

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I've been a finalist for the mom's panel...I may have jeopardized that dream by speaking out here...but, I like to think that I am big enough to admit when, even something I am so entirely passionate about and committed to, has made a mistake. I will not abandon my love of Disney and its mission as a corporation, but I will reach out to them and ask for an explanation and what they have done to ensure this can never happen again.
I admire your bravery for speaking out for what is right, and would gladly endorse a mom who puts children's safety before the financial interests of corporate America. I also am a lifelong fan of Disney, but am not willing to give them a pass for a horrific decision = pedophile aided by sending home. He's out there, maybe even visiting WDW. Because no charges, he could waltz right back into the US.

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I'm an Ohio police officer. I can't speak for Florida but in Ohio, absolutely.

In fact, the kidnapping charge that could stem from this incident if committed in Ohio is a more serious offense than the fondling itself. The fondling in Ohio would be called Gross Sexual Imposition. It is a felony of the third degree and carries 1 to 5 year sentence because of the victim's age.

Because he restrained her liberty with the purpose to engage in sexual activity (i.e. he held her on the elevator, blocked her escape, so that he could touch her breasts) and because she was only 11 years old this would be a felony of the first degree kidnapping. Because she was safely released from his custody, the kidnapping could carry an indefinite sentence of 10 years to life if I am not mistaken.

In any case, if this case were assigned to me I would jump at the chance to investigate this. I'd take the video evidence combined with a good disclosure from the victim and lock this guy away for 10 to life. To the poster who said he would be read Miranda and not confess...I would take that challenge gladly and get him to sing like Chunk from the Goonies. He confessed in the Bahamas; we'd get him to confess here. Miranda is just as irrelevant here as it was with the Boston bombing suspect. It is not always required (depending on custodial nature of interview) and it is not as big as an obstacle as some make it out to be when it is required.

That's a moot point though. The video and the victim's disclosure would be enough to convict this guy even without a confession, IMHO.
Thank you for your public service! And for restoring my faith in a system that has people who care about justice.

Why can charges not be brought now in absentia? Why does DCL not get charged with aiding and abetting his getaway? I have no proof, but can't believe that the Captain of the ship did not make the decision to pull out of port before he called authorities who could have delayed his departure. If they find he did so, he needs to be FIRED immediately. I don't want him making decisions about my family's welfare on any cruise.

Maybe someone who goes to the Platinum & Gold reception could ask him?
Hoping there is some brave investigative journalist willing to take this on.

Is there any chance this whole scenario can be investigated by US officials?

I guess I'd like more clarification on the laws and legal implications before I get on my next cruise - if it happens at all now.
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