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Old 05-20-2013, 02:01 PM   #16
skier_pete
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Quick point:

Universal having the rights to Marvel means Disney gets a portion of the revenue generated by Universal Florida/IOA. That means when Universal adds new attractions such as Harry Potter to boost their revenue, they also boost Disney's revenue directly. So Disney makes money without having to lift a finger.

I think you lose that argument with BOTH Disney and Universal.

A much wiser petition would be for Disney to add Marvel to DisneyLAND. Not that it would do any good either, but at least you might have a shot at somebody listening to it.

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Old 05-20-2013, 02:49 PM   #17
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I am a Disney fan and would really like Disney get back the rights for Marvel attractions. In all honesty it may happen 20 years from now . But it will happen. Eventually there will be a new investment for Uni to build and once the land that they have in USF is gone then it will make sense to bargin with Disney.
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Old 05-20-2013, 02:54 PM   #18
jrtoastyman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr X View Post
Since Disney acquires Marvel in 2009.

Disney Parks should bring all Marvel Superheroes to the Park.

The Only Problem is: Marvel Super Hero Island at Universal's Islands of Adventure.

With this area at Universal, There will be no Marvel Superheroes at Walt Disney World. This will upset Disney fans at Florida.

But with major refurbishment of The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man opened, this upsets more to the Disney fans at Florida.

It's okay that Monorail is decorated with Marvel Movies such as Avengers and Iron Man 3, but don't pass through Epcot.

I Started the petition to Talk to Universal Orlando Resort to get rid of Marvel Super Hero Island. sign here:

http://www.***********/es-LA/peticion...er-hero-island
I think we'd all love to see those characters in the parks, but respectfully, I agree with those that suggest that this is the wrong way to go about it. Universal has absolutely no incentive to cater to Disney fans at all -- if anything, lots of signatures from Disney fans saying they would like to see the Marvel characters at Disney parks just gives Universal more leverage to dig in their heels and refuse to release them or command a higher price to do so.

Think of it this way -- while there are plenty of people that prefer the Universal parks, the numbers would reflect that most people come to Orlando for WDW and spend a day or two at Universal rather than the other way around. With that being the case, why would Universal want to surrender one of the things that gives Disney-goers a reason to go to Universal? Give them a long list of people that they might interpret as Disney fans that like their characters, and they become even less eager to relinquish those characters.
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Old 05-20-2013, 05:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pilferk View Post
Universal would probably want something close to a billion dollars to cancel the contract.

And then Disney would have to further invest in actually building new attractions at WDW.

OR they can just collect checks on a regular basis from Universal.

Petitions aren't going to work. You're going to need to somehow come into a majority of the stock either at Disney (because very few stockholders, looking at the above scenarios, is going to choose the one that costs more than a billiion dollars for very little relative return) or at the Universal Theme Parks and Resorts parent company (so you can force them to take a much lower figure in terms of buyout).

Because, otherwise, chances are slim and none that this happens.

And if you can't afford a majority of Disney Stock.... I doubt you'd be able to get a majority of Comcast Stock either.


Here's another take on why it would be a lose/lose/lose situation for Disney to get the Marvel rights.

1. They'd AT A MINIMUM need to pay Universal to completely retheme the existing Marvel Island into something else. [Universal holds all the cards here, so if anything is going to happen and it's intiated by Disney, You can Bet Universal is going to get SOMETHING for the deal.]

2. Disney would then pretty much be forced to invest and build something in Florida with the rights they just paid Universal to regain. [Otherwise you end up with doubley pissed investors who just saw you pay to get something back that was making them money.... and then putting it on a shelf to waste away]

3. No matter WHAT Disney ends up building in Florida with the Marvel rights, They'll forever be forced to deal with people doing a direct comparison between what Universal has had in their parks with the property since 1999 and what Disney just built and opened over 15yrs later [padding a bit since it'd obviously be a couple years before disney could get something opened even if they started ground breaking tomorrow]. As it is, There are theme park fans who are still waiting for ANYTHING as advanced as the Spiderman attraction to emerge from the house of the mouse.



So despite any wishful thinking, There's just too much going against Disney to bother trying to chase after those theme park rights. The investments they'd have to make would make it too difficult to get a return on that investment in any sort of realistic timeframe. Especially if you factor in the lost income from the existing deal.



(And as it is, There is NOTHING keeping disney from doing something in their other parks today.... in fact, I'm pretty sure I recall Iger mentioning a little while ago about bringing the Avengers to California...)
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Old 05-20-2013, 05:50 PM   #20
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It might be interesting if Disney does a great job with Marvel in California. Fans will be clamoring to clone the Marvel attractions in WDW. Consequently Universal is likely to hold out for even more $$$.
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Old 05-20-2013, 06:03 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewisc View Post
It might be interesting if Disney does a great job with Marvel in California. Fans will be clamoring to clone the Marvel attractions in WDW. Consequently Universal is likely to hold out for even more $$$.
...And at the Same Time, Disney may have extra reason to hold off on bringing it to Florida since they've been making a concerted effort into turning the DL Resort from a "Locals park" into a Destination Resort like WDW (only on a smaller scale, obviously). That's one of the reasons they are in no hurry (Or shown any realistic signs beyond mostly fan-based wishful thinking rumors) of bringing Carsland to the east coast.
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Old 05-21-2013, 12:18 AM   #22
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I'd love to sign the petition, but I don't know the language it is in. Could you please translate what the petition says in English? Thanks.No I'm not trying to be obnoxious, I seriously don't know what it says.
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Old 05-21-2013, 12:20 AM   #23
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I'm talking about the signing part of the petition.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:57 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewisc View Post
It might be interesting if Disney does a great job with Marvel in California. Fans will be clamoring to clone the Marvel attractions in WDW. Consequently Universal is likely to hold out for even more $$$.
This is the real catch 22 of this situation, the more popular Marvel becomes, the more Universal would charge Disney to get out of the contract. If the popularity of Marvel drops, the cost might go down, but then there is less reason for Disney to build an attraction for it.
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Old 05-22-2013, 01:55 AM   #25
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I might well be in the minority but I like the way IOA have set up Marvel Island and would NOT like to see it at Disney world. I don't think it would fit. Sure I'd love to mingle with Spidey at DHS but it just wouldn't be the same interaction. No way. Spidey was all over the place having fun in his shop and checking out the photos, I've never seen character interaction like that. I love Disney world MUCH more than IOA but I think Marvel Island is much more suited to Universal.
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Old 05-22-2013, 01:43 PM   #26
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They just need to build a Marvel Resort and have character meals, with the resort being a back entrance to DHS. If they want to push the envelop a bit in the terms of the contract, maybe have the resort include an arcade, DisneyQuest style, with all things themed to Marvel.

Marvel Resort as back entrance, plus future Star Wars Galaxy at DHS would do wonders for the aged 5-45 male demographic.
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Old 05-22-2013, 02:07 PM   #27
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Quote:
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They just need to build a Marvel Resort and have character meals, with the resort being a back entrance to DHS. If they want to push the envelop a bit in the terms of the contract, maybe have the resort include an arcade, DisneyQuest style, with all things themed to Marvel.

Marvel Resort as back entrance, plus future Star Wars Galaxy at DHS would do wonders for the aged 5-45 male demographic.
Not sure it would work.

It's been awhile since I read the SEC filing that is generally considered to be the best source of information on the contents of the actual final licensing agreement, But I recall there being some stipulations that could torpedo that idea.

SPECIFICALLY.... When the deal was signed, Marvel was in the process of considering opening up a potential DisneyQuest/Dave&Busters/etc style entertainment/shopping chain of Marvel themed locations. The SEC filing specifically created an exemption within the Exclusive Theme Park rights for these mini-entertainment locations. The Idea being that Universal would have exclusive rights in a major themepark, But a Restaurant/Arcade in NYC or Charlotte, NC wasn't going to create a direct conflict with the Theme Park attractions in Orlando, and wouldn't be competing for the same public spending.

HOWEVER.... It was understood that placing one of these Restaurant/Arcade attractions in the Orlando area would directly compete with the Universal attractions for those looking for a Marvel experience. Therefore, there is language that states that if Marvel does create their own mini-Marvel entertainment chain, That Within a certain radius of Orlando they could not do anything more than open a store selling Marvel goods (Think "World of Disney", only with Marvel stuff exclusively inside) and could not include any sort of entertainment or character meet options which could be seen as competing with the items offered under the exclusive theme park rights of the Universal parks. Again.... I don't remember the exact details, but I almost want to say that the radius included all of Florida, and maybe even all the way up to the Atlanta, GA area. [Since Orlando is close enough to Atlanta, Ga to be considered a primary vacation destination for those who live in the area.]



I'm pretty sure that a Marvel Resort, and DEFINATELY Character meals, would be covered by those clauses.....assuming it was even a grey enough area to be able to get out from under the primary Theme park Exclusivity agreements.
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Old 05-23-2013, 12:13 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCTooTall View Post
Not sure it would work.

It's been awhile since I read the SEC filing that is generally considered to be the best source of information on the contents of the actual final licensing agreement, But I recall there being some stipulations that could torpedo that idea.

SPECIFICALLY.... When the deal was signed, Marvel was in the process of considering opening up a potential DisneyQuest/Dave&Busters/etc style entertainment/shopping chain of Marvel themed locations. The SEC filing specifically created an exemption within the Exclusive Theme Park rights for these mini-entertainment locations. The Idea being that Universal would have exclusive rights in a major themepark, But a Restaurant/Arcade in NYC or Charlotte, NC wasn't going to create a direct conflict with the Theme Park attractions in Orlando, and wouldn't be competing for the same public spending.

HOWEVER.... It was understood that placing one of these Restaurant/Arcade attractions in the Orlando area would directly compete with the Universal attractions for those looking for a Marvel experience. Therefore, there is language that states that if Marvel does create their own mini-Marvel entertainment chain, That Within a certain radius of Orlando they could not do anything more than open a store selling Marvel goods (Think "World of Disney", only with Marvel stuff exclusively inside) and could not include any sort of entertainment or character meet options which could be seen as competing with the items offered under the exclusive theme park rights of the Universal parks. Again.... I don't remember the exact details, but I almost want to say that the radius included all of Florida, and maybe even all the way up to the Atlanta, GA area. [Since Orlando is close enough to Atlanta, Ga to be considered a primary vacation destination for those who live in the area.]



I'm pretty sure that a Marvel Resort, and DEFINATELY Character meals, would be covered by those clauses.....assuming it was even a grey enough area to be able to get out from under the primary Theme park Exclusivity agreements.
Here is the relevant section on the contract:

To the extent and in the territories that MCA has exclusive theme park rights, such shall not prohibit (except for the limitations described below) Marvel from itself developing or licensing its planned Retail concept which may include interactive elements as a major or minor element (presently intended to be called “The Marvel Action Universe” and referred to as such herein, but which may also be called “The Marvel Universe” or another name chosen by Marvel). The Marvel Action Universe will consist, inter alia, of the sale of comic books, trading cards, software, licensed or Marvel produced merchandise, the use of electronic games and/or pinballs or other coin operated games, and may include one or more virtual reality and/or simulator ride using Marvel characters or other themes. The following restrictions shall apply to The Marvel Action Universe (or elements thereof whether owned or licensed by Marvel).


a. Restrictions as to the geographic location of The Marvel Action Universe in areas where MCA has exclusive rights hereunder.


i. The Marvel Action Universe will not be within 60 miles of any Universal Theme Park with a THE MARVEL UNIVERSE


ii. Mini-theme parks, recreation centers, game centers and the like designated with the Marvel name or the name of any Marvel characters or any major entertainment component of a Marvel Action Universe such as a motion based film ride shall not be within 60 miles of any Universal Theme Park with a THE MARVEL UNIVERSE.


iii. Within the ADI market of the city containing a Universal Theme Park (even to the extent such ADI exceeds a 60 mile radius) there shall not be a Marvel themed simulator ride.

b. Restrictions as to elements of The Marvel Action Universe in areas where MCA has exclusive rights hereunder.


i. Within 300 miles of any Universal Theme Park with a THE MARVEL UNIVERSE, no The Marvel Action Universe shall contain more than one simulator, nor shall such simulator hold more than 20 people. Motion based or virtual reality attractions which are coin operated and hold no more than 4 people shall not be deemed a “simulator” subject to the above restriction. Any such rides which are interconnected so as to create a simultaneous experience among multiple units exceeding an aggregate of 4 people shall be deemed simulator rides and the number of people in such interconnected rides shall be counted toward the 20 person limit above.


c. Restrictions as to affiliations or marketing of The Marvel Action Universe or elements thereof, in areas where MCA has exclusive rights hereunder.


i. The Marvel Action Universe will not be within any theme park, nor marketed in conjunction with any theme park. For purposes of these restrictions, an area of 10 acres or less will not be deemed a theme park. An area in excess of 10 acres may or may not be deemed a theme park based on its overall characteristics.


ii. No The Marvel Action Universe will be marketed so as to infer or imply that such THE MARVEL ACTION UNIVERSE or one of its components (x) constitutes a theme park or (y) is a component of a theme park.


iii. No The Marvel Action Universe shall be in or marketed in conjunction with any themed entertainment areas owned, operated or marketed by Disney, Time-Warner, Six Flags, Sony, Paramount or Busch. As used herein, “theme park” and “themed entertainment areas” shall not include, inter alia, facilities or complexes where at least 70% of the revenues generated on the premises are derived from retail sales or whose primary source of revenue is lodging (which may include food, beverage and gaming revenues).
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Old 05-23-2013, 03:33 PM   #29
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Does anyone have a part of the contract regarding the up keep of the Marvel Attractions? Last time we went to Uni hulk was down and they were having issues with spidy. I was wondering how strict the contract is.
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Old 05-23-2013, 03:35 PM   #30
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The only way to force Uni's hand on giving up its current Marvel hold would be for Disney to build based on any character that Uni does not currently use. this could blur the brands enough that Uni might want to be bough out. Disney would be getting the best of both worlds, their own Marvel attractions, and money from Uni for other Marvel attractions. In fact the best thing Disney could do is put a whole land at Disneyland and hype it like there is no tomorrow. Carsland and a Spiderman web-based ride? Sold!

However a Florida Marvel attraction would have to be filled with mostly B and C heroes. Instead of a Thor ride, Disney can give us a Beta Ray Bill ride, since he has a hammer and red cape. That's not the real Wolverine, that is his son, notice the blades are different? Iron Fist and Luke Cage anyone? The wonderful world of the Black Panther, not to be confused with the the Black PantherS.
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