Ths DIS is a great place to ask Disney Cruise Line questions and share tips.
Dreams Unlimited Travel - The official sponsor of the Disney Cruise Forums Dreams Unlimited Travel - the official sponsor of the Disney Cruise Forums  

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Cruise Line > Disney Cruise Line Forum
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS UpdatesDIS email updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 03-24-2013, 09:12 AM   #31
MrsScooby
DIS Veteran
 
MrsScooby's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Virginia
Posts: 4,402

We have 3 tours booked with RIL this summer (Florence, Rome and Naples) and I just checked our confirmation emails and none of them offer an option to pre-pay for the tours.

Is the prepayment option only for tours that are not shared with another family

I would love to prepay so as to not have to carry around the euros.
__________________
Laurie (Wonder July 2002, Wonder August 2006, Magic PC Repo August 2008, Wonder July 2009, Magic Baltic July 2010, Dream June 2011, Fantasy June 2012, Magic Med June 2013, Wonder Alaska 2014)
MrsScooby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 11:07 AM   #32
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsScooby View Post
We have 3 tours booked with RIL this summer (Florence, Rome and Naples) and I just checked our confirmation emails and none of them offer an option to pre-pay for the tours.

Is the prepayment option only for tours that are not shared with another family

I would love to prepay so as to not have to carry around the euros.
Maybe that's why. We aren't doing a group tour, well, like the ones they offer through thieir website. It's just my family of 4 and my parents though I handled all the arrangements and just said we're a party of 6.

It would be complicated if it were different families from all over.
They also accept travelers checks. If you belong to AAA, there's no charge if you get them there. I've never had to get them in Euros before but I do know it's an option there. That was my original plan. I was going to make 3 envelopes labeled for each city and keep them in the safe on the ship and only take out the one I need. It seems a bit easier than trying to keep tapping ATMs &/or changing cash on the ship, worrying about daily limits and a lot of planning ahead once on vacation.

hth
__________________
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 03-24-2013, 11:21 AM   #33
MrsScooby
DIS Veteran
 
MrsScooby's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Virginia
Posts: 4,402

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruadisneyfan2 View Post
Maybe that's why. We aren't doing a group tour, well, like the ones they offer through thieir website. It's just my family of 4 and my parents though I handled all the arrangements and just said we're a party of 6.

It would be complicated if it were different families from all over.
They also accept travelers checks. If you belong to AAA, there's no charge if you get them there. I've never had to get them in Euros before but I do know it's an option there. That was my original plan. I was going to make 3 envelopes labeled for each city and keep them in the safe on the ship and only take out the one I need. It seems a bit easier than trying to keep tapping ATMs &/or changing cash on the ship, worrying about daily limits and a lot of planning ahead once on vacation.

hth


We kept money in envelopes for our Baltic cruise as there were so many currencies to keep track of. The only time we carried it all at once was when we went from airport to hotel and hotel to ship. Kept in travel wallets under our shirts. Otherwise kept it all in room safes.

I do have one of those pacsafe bags that I can wear crossbody, but not going to rely on that for too much.

I didn't know that AAA had travelers checks for no charge
I'll probably go that route. Thanks
__________________
Laurie (Wonder July 2002, Wonder August 2006, Magic PC Repo August 2008, Wonder July 2009, Magic Baltic July 2010, Dream June 2011, Fantasy June 2012, Magic Med June 2013, Wonder Alaska 2014)
MrsScooby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 11:32 AM   #34
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anal Annie View Post
I WISH our rate had been that low when we went. It was running 1.51 on the ship the week we went (they adjusted it weekly to keep up with the current rates - so if you needed to exchange USD for Euros for example that was the exchange rate that DCL used.) If it were ME I would pre-pay to get the better rate and to not have to carry all of that cash with me on the trip. You never know what the rate might do - if you wait it could go UP and you'd be stuck paying even MORE. It's a bit of a gamble but that's JM2C.

It might be a good idea for you to start a thread about tipping in Europe if you'd feel better to get some more responses on it but from the research I did back when we went it sounded like tipping in Europe is much less than in the US. Seems most of we would consider tipped positions are paid a higher regular wage (including servers in restaurants). In fact a lot of the restaurants we ate at in Paris included the tip and we just had to look on the receipt to see if it was added on. They love to get naive American tourists who don't know this and who then tip 15-20% again on top! I spent some time on the Cruise Critic Boards too when I was planning. Between here and there the general tipping range I found for just about anything in Europe was 10%.

BTW just to further back up this tipping difference on the Med cruises, when we went, DCL started automatically including the suggested tip amounts to the CM's on peoples onboard accounts. This was because the Med cruises are primarily European customers and they just don't tip like we do. The CM's on the cruises were being stiffed on their tips and were basically working for half of what they were accustomed to. The only way to get the CM's close to their regular gratuities was for DCL to add them in automatically. The day after the letter was handed out about the automatic gratuities I went down in the afternoon to guest services to ADD more money to our gratuities and there was some older Spanish gentleman down there raising all kinds of heck, yelling VERY loudly in both English and in Spanish, waving his arms wildly and just causing a huge scene over the tips being added on. In HIS COUNTRY they don't tip like that and he was making sure everybody knew how angry he was as he was saying and he didn't feel he should have to tip. It was quite uncomfortable and I felt badly for his servers and cabin attendant because they were about to get stiffed...
Thanks. While I know tipping is not such a big custom there, I feel so cheap to tip such a low amount. Dh is a very generous tipper cuz his mom was a waitress so he knows how much tipped positions rely on tips, here anyway.
__________________
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 11:33 AM   #35
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsScooby View Post


We kept money in envelopes for our Baltic cruise as there were so many currencies to keep track of. The only time we carried it all at once was when we went from airport to hotel and hotel to ship. Kept in travel wallets under our shirts. Otherwise kept it all in room safes.

I do have one of those pacsafe bags that I can wear crossbody, but not going to rely on that for too much.

I didn't know that AAA had travelers checks for no charge
I'll probably go that route. Thanks
The US$ ones are free. I can't say for certain of that for getting Euros but I know you can.
They also sell a Visa debit card that works like an ATM debit card but it's preloaded so you're not tapping into your regular bank accounts.
__________________
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 12:21 PM   #36
MrsKP
Mouseketeer
 
MrsKP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Lexington SC
Posts: 281

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruadisneyfan2 View Post
Has anyone prepaid for their tours? We booked RIL for all 3 Italian ports. Shortly after confirmation, we were offered 2 ways to prepay for a small discount:
1. Wire cash to a US bank in Miami (where RIL is based)by the end of March for a 5% discount.
2. Pay in full by cc and still pay full price but avoid the usual 5% cc surcharge. (otherwise pay driver in cash or TCs in Euros)

No change in cancellation policy.

I know people highly recommend this company but our total for 3 tours is over $2400. I had a bad vibe in wiring this much $. I've never wired $ before & I'm assuming banks charge a fee for this anyway, maybe wrongly assuming.

To me, this isn't such a great discount to make me jump through hoops.
For our Alaskan excursions that we booked privately, (helicopter w/glacier trek & Misty Fjords sea plane tour) we were given the option to prepay but we could use a cc and the discount was 20%. That seemed a no brainer to me.


With the RIL deal, the savings would be $123.33 which would be split with my parents.

We can get TCs in Euros for free through AAA so I don't mind making up 3 envelopes, 1 for each port, with the TCs in the exact amount, keeping in the cabin safe, and pulling one envelope out as needed, then tipping with Euros. At least we wouldn't be carrying so much cash and we'll have a money belt until we get on the ship.

Also my mom signed up for the Capital One visa which has 0% international fees so we could pay by cc now and not have to deal with it at all during our trip except tipping.

WWYD?
I didn't want to carry that kind of cash. We used Capital One and pre-paid. No problems. I would have wired but didn't want to have to juggle everything at work/kids and then figure all that out! They emailed me a form to compete & I scanned it back to them. Very easy!
__________________
Kerry

DH-Kevin Kerry DS-Jared (14) DD-Ellison (3)

Disney Wonder 2006
Disney Magic Mediterranean 2013

MrsKP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 04:23 PM   #37
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsKP View Post
I didn't want to carry that kind of cash. We used Capital One and pre-paid. No problems. I would have wired but didn't want to have to juggle everything at work/kids and then figure all that out! They emailed me a form to compete & I scanned it back to them. Very easy!
We may end up doing this. I went to our local TD Bank to wire the US$ equivalent of 1520E. They should easily be able to tell me this based on their current exchange rate. The clerk was so clueless I had to walk out. I really try to be patient & explain it to her but it just wasn't sinking in.
I know they have a simple calculator web page & even if that's not the one they need to use, it would still give her a ballpark figure. She kept plugging #s in, then saying, "no that's not it." then enter another.
She came up with $1100-something. When I explained that Euros are worth more than US$ so this figure MUST be well over $1520, she still didn't get it. Then I told her the calculator on their website gave me around $1900, she looked even more clueless.
sigh....
It's a sad situation when health care workers know more about banking than people who work at a bank.
__________________
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 04:34 PM   #38
Anal Annie
....at least I KNOW I'm a kook...I just can't stop it....
 
Anal Annie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: MD (DC suburbs)
Posts: 11,695

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsScooby View Post
We have 3 tours booked with RIL this summer (Florence, Rome and Naples) and I just checked our confirmation emails and none of them offer an option to pre-pay for the tours.

Is the prepayment option only for tours that are not shared with another family

I would love to prepay so as to not have to carry around the euros.
When we booked with RIL back in 2011 they didn't offer the pre-payment thing up front to us - I emailed them and asked if we could. Jany was very responsive to emails. We did Rome privately and shared our Naples tour to the Amalfi Coast & Pompeii with another couple from our meet thread. I handled all of the arrangements with RIL and pre-paid up front and then the other couple just paid us their portion when we met up on the cruise. I can't remember 100% now if they gave us Euros or USD but I remember she ASKED me which I wanted (they were from the UK). I think I told her to give us Euros then I just figured that in as funds we didn't need to convert ourselves. So you can certainly ask RIL to pre-pay if you want, regardless of whether you're sharing or not. You just need to have 1 person/family who agrees to actually DO the paying up front I think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ruadisneyfan2 View Post
Thanks. While I know tipping is not such a big custom there, I feel so cheap to tip such a low amount. Dh is a very generous tipper cuz his mom was a waitress so he knows how much tipped positions rely on tips, here anyway.
OK, so you want to be one of "those" American tourists they love to see coming!? I sort of felt the same way but my research said 10% was sufficient and the standard amount in Europe so that's the way I went. I prepared tip envelopes before we left on the trip - I had them already done up & labeled for our transfers in Paris and Barcelona, our RIL drivers and our private tour guides. Made everything so easy to have it prepared already. Then I didn't need to worry about having the right amount of change (and the single Euros are coins not bills BTW).
__________________
Sadly, no countdown tickers at the moment.

Come join me for my 2nd ever trip report now in progress for DisneyLAND and Aulani and Maui 2014. http://www.disboards.com/showthread....7#post52179607

My first ever trip report - Disneyland Paris and our DCL Med cruise: http://thewhitehouseblog.weebly.com/ (ALMOST but not quite finished)

August 2014 - 3 n @ VGC & DL followed by 7 n @ Aulani follwed by 3 n on Maui / Jan 2014 - 5 n @ AKV Jambo House / Aug 2013 - 9 nights @ SSR / Aug 2012 - 9 n @ Boardwalk Villas and HRH / Mar-Apr 2012 6 n @ Bay Lake / August 2011 Disneyland Paris and DCL MED cruise / August 2010 Disney's DVC resort at Hilton Head Island, SC / March 2010 Kidani Village at AKV / August '09 BCV & Vero Beach / May '09 SSR / July '08 AKV & B2B Cruises on The Wonder/ January '08 VWL / August '07 OKW / July '06 Offsite - Waikiki, Kona & Ka'anapali, Hawaii / July '05 Disneyland & Disney Magic West Coast Cruise to the Mexican Riviera / Summer '04 CSR / May '03 Offsite - St. John, USVI / Summer '02 AKL & O.C., MD


















[/url]IMG]http://photopost.wdwinfo.com/uploads/21406/ssrgroup.jpg[/IMG] [url=http://www.myvacationcountdown.com/]


[url=http://www.myvacationcountdown.com/]
Anal Annie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2013, 04:51 PM   #39
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anal Annie View Post
When we booked with RIL back in 2011 they didn't offer the pre-payment thing up front to us - I emailed them and asked if we could. Jany was very responsive to emails. We did Rome privately and shared our Naples tour to the Amalfi Coast & Pompeii with another couple from our meet thread. I handled all of the arrangements with RIL and pre-paid up front and then the other couple just paid us their portion when we met up on the cruise. I can't remember 100% now if they gave us Euros or USD but I remember she ASKED me which I wanted (they were from the UK). I think I told her to give us Euros then I just figured that in as funds we didn't need to convert ourselves. So you can certainly ask RIL to pre-pay if you want, regardless of whether you're sharing or not. You just need to have 1 person/family who agrees to actually DO the paying up front I think.



OK, so you want to be one of "those" American tourists they love to see coming!? I sort of felt the same way but my research said 10% was sufficient and the standard amount in Europe so that's the way I went. I prepared tip envelopes before we left on the trip - I had them already done up & labeled for our transfers in Paris and Barcelona, our RIL drivers and our private tour guides. Made everything so easy to have it prepared already. Then I didn't need to worry about having the right amount of change (and the single Euros are coins not bills BTW).
Jany is still there! and still responsive as ever. Is Jany a he or she?

You're right. I will try to leave our American customs at home. "When in Rome..." and all that.
__________________
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2013, 10:10 AM   #40
WDW Princess 71
DIS Veteran
 
WDW Princess 71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Posts: 1,831

Can someone please explain to me how traveler's checks work, specifically with using them to pay for a tour? The company I'm using allows prepayment via credit card but they charge 10% for that, so I'm definitely not going that route. Our choices are to pay at the end of the tour in Euros cash or Euros traveler's checks, no charge for either. I am interested in the traveler's check option so as not to have to carry around so much cash, but I've never done them before. Can someone please explain how they work and how you pay for a service with them?
__________________
Nicole


September 2014: 14 Night WB Transatlantic on the Magic! November 2013: WDW & 3 Night Dream Mother/Daughter TripJuly 2013: 12-Night Eastern Med Cruise w/Greece & Turkey, then Disneyland Paris! January 2013: 7 Night Western Carib on the Fantasy May 2012: 5-Night Double Dip Dream Cruise for Mom & Dad's 30th Anniversary! February 2012: Solo Valentine Cruise Treat to Get Me to Gold! January 2011: 3 Week Ultimate Disney Vacation- WDW then 15 Night Disney Cruise Through Panama Canal then DL in California!May 2010: celebrating at WDW for graduating my MBA program! January 2010: 3rd Disney Cruise, 1st on the Magic, prefaced by New Years Eve in WDW! November 2009: Return to DL at Disney's Grand Californian Resort, May 2009: WDW Summer Kickoff, January 2009: 2nd Disney Cruise- Sisters Cruise 4 Night Wonder, March 2008: WDW Spring Break, February 2008: WDW ESPN Weekend with relatives, April 2007: WDW Spring Break, March 2006: WDW Spring Break, March 2004: Land & Sea Graduation Present 4 Night Wonder (1st Cruise!) and 3 Night WDW, April 2003: WDW Spring Break, November 2002: Florida College Road Trip, Stopover in WDW, June 2002: California College Road Trip, Stopover in Disneyland, November 2001: WDW Mom’s Birthday Celebration, April 2001: WDW Spring Break, October 2000: Millennium Celebration WDW, November 1996: 1st Trip WDW Hooked For Life, 2004-2007: MANY trips up to Disneyland, CA (including 50th Anniversary Happiest Celebration on Earth!) while in college at University of San Diego
WDW Princess 71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2013, 11:30 AM   #41
Anal Annie
....at least I KNOW I'm a kook...I just can't stop it....
 
Anal Annie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: MD (DC suburbs)
Posts: 11,695

Quote:
Originally Posted by WDW Princess 71 View Post
Can someone please explain to me how traveler's checks work, specifically with using them to pay for a tour? The company I'm using allows prepayment via credit card but they charge 10% for that, so I'm definitely not going that route. Our choices are to pay at the end of the tour in Euros cash or Euros traveler's checks, no charge for either. I am interested in the traveler's check option so as not to have to carry around so much cash, but I've never done them before. Can someone please explain how they work and how you pay for a service with them?
I take it you mean you've NEVER used ANY Travelers Checks before? You order them from your bank. They are not used as often these days as they once were so your bank may or may not have them on hand especially since you need them in a foreign currency (ie they may have to order them the same way they order in Euros). There is probably some sort of a % fee there as well to buy them. I don't have AAA so I don't know for sure but you may be able to get them from them too (maybe) if you have AAA. Never hurts to ask. Anyway, you pay for them at the time you buy them with cash. So that ensures that they are "good". So if you need say 1,000 euros worth you would need to have enough USD cash equivalent to pay for them. They are duplicates so you keep your copy separate from the real checks (as proof of purchase in case they are stolen) and you use them sort of like personal checks except they are for set amounts ($50's, $100's etc.). You need to order them in Euros rather than in USD to use them in Europe. So say you need 1,000 Euros worth to pay for your tour then that's what you order. If the current exchange rate is at 1.30 for example then they would cost you $1,300 in USD. You could order them in $100 denominations and then you make them out to your tour operator and sign them when you pay the driver. I haven't used them in years & years so I don't know for sure but they may be available in larger denominations than $100's.
__________________
Sadly, no countdown tickers at the moment.

Come join me for my 2nd ever trip report now in progress for DisneyLAND and Aulani and Maui 2014. http://www.disboards.com/showthread....7#post52179607

My first ever trip report - Disneyland Paris and our DCL Med cruise: http://thewhitehouseblog.weebly.com/ (ALMOST but not quite finished)

August 2014 - 3 n @ VGC & DL followed by 7 n @ Aulani follwed by 3 n on Maui / Jan 2014 - 5 n @ AKV Jambo House / Aug 2013 - 9 nights @ SSR / Aug 2012 - 9 n @ Boardwalk Villas and HRH / Mar-Apr 2012 6 n @ Bay Lake / August 2011 Disneyland Paris and DCL MED cruise / August 2010 Disney's DVC resort at Hilton Head Island, SC / March 2010 Kidani Village at AKV / August '09 BCV & Vero Beach / May '09 SSR / July '08 AKV & B2B Cruises on The Wonder/ January '08 VWL / August '07 OKW / July '06 Offsite - Waikiki, Kona & Ka'anapali, Hawaii / July '05 Disneyland & Disney Magic West Coast Cruise to the Mexican Riviera / Summer '04 CSR / May '03 Offsite - St. John, USVI / Summer '02 AKL & O.C., MD


















[/url]IMG]http://photopost.wdwinfo.com/uploads/21406/ssrgroup.jpg[/IMG] [url=http://www.myvacationcountdown.com/]


[url=http://www.myvacationcountdown.com/]
Anal Annie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2013, 07:05 PM   #42
ruadisneyfan2
DIS Veteran
 
ruadisneyfan2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 11,914

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anal Annie View Post
I take it you mean you've NEVER used ANY Travelers Checks before? You order them from your bank. They are not used as often these days as they once were so your bank may or may not have them on hand especially since you need them in a foreign currency (ie they may have to order them the same way they order in Euros). There is probably some sort of a % fee there as well to buy them. I don't have AAA so I don't know for sure but you may be able to get them from them too (maybe) if you have AAA. Never hurts to ask. Anyway, you pay for them at the time you buy them with cash. So that ensures that they are "good". So if you need say 1,000 euros worth you would need to have enough USD cash equivalent to pay for them. They are duplicates so you keep your copy separate from the real checks (as proof of purchase in case they are stolen) and you use them sort of like personal checks except they are for set amounts ($50's, $100's etc.). You need to order them in Euros rather than in USD to use them in Europe. So say you need 1,000 Euros worth to pay for your tour then that's what you order. If the current exchange rate is at 1.30 for example then they would cost you $1,300 in USD. You could order them in $100 denominations and then you make them out to your tour operator and sign them when you pay the driver. I haven't used them in years & years so I don't know for sure but they may be available in larger denominations than $100's.

Good points. I just wanted to add a few things:
We used to use them for WDW trips to make sure we don't overspend what we set aside for spending $. The last time I used them was probably 5 or so years ago. At that time, they were still free from AAA. There are certain minimums to buy since they come in packs. So let's say you want to buy 20s, it's something like ten $20 checks, for a value of $200. They won't separate each pack but you can mix & match between 20s, 50s, & 100s to get the total you want.
There are 2 signature lines on each check: one near the bottom, similar to a regular check then another smaller one in the upper left corner, unlike a reg check.
They require that you sign each & every check before you walk out the door. The first signature at time of purchase goes in the upper left, smaller line. Then when you actually use it, you sign again near the bottom and make the check out to whomever you're giving it to: Publix grocery store, DCL, Rome in Limo, etc. It's important that your signatures match or the payee might feel they're stolen since they can witness you sign and see that it matches the original signature done in AAA (or bank) office. This is why they're so critical that you don't walk out without signing them.

They also came out with TCs for 2 people. This has 2 original signature lines and one regular line so either person can use them. Prior to that, I'd have to sign some, then have dh sign some (yes driving home with blanks) so he could use his, then I could use mine. So TCs for 2 are more convenient.

I don't know if they have TCs for 2 in Euros. Even when I went to Italy, it was long before ATMs. We bought TCs in US$ and stopped in banks where we could or could exchange at a hotel though a crappier rate.

What's a pain about TCs is that the most accurate way to be able to report them stolen, is to keep track of the serial numbers (usually consecutive in a pack) then cross them off the list once you use it so you don't accidentally report it stolen also. So many times we'd use some then want to quick get out of the cashier's line, & forget to cross them off so we weren't very good at recordkeeping.
__________________

Last edited by ruadisneyfan2; 03-25-2013 at 08:18 PM.
ruadisneyfan2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:46 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.

You Rated this Thread: