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Old 01-16-2013, 12:11 PM   #16
Bnb0627
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrapquitler

Or the parents of the struggling children could have talked to other parents. I know that among the kids in my DD dance class we always talked about how our kids were doing in school. So I knew that kids at XYZ school were doing one type of work and kids at my child's school (in the same district and the same grade) were doing something different.

It sounds like what you hear was general information, why would there be a problem with that? Now if you said "The 3rd grade math teacher said that Tommy Jones is failing math", that's different. And here, the standardized test grades are published in the newspaper by class/grade/school, so I would know that minority race children in third grade at ABC school did better on the math portion of the CMTs than white children in third grade at LMNOP school. Again, it's kind of specific, but not really identifiable.

I don't see the problem. Why are you asking?
Thank you for your interest but I don't really see the need to explain this any further when all I wanted was a simple yes or no or ideas where people could have gotten certain information and people have answered those questions so I am satisfied with that
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:39 PM   #17
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All I did was ask the question how else would they know? And many people have answered that questioned for me. Thank you. The teachers know about the kids grades before even the parents so naturally I would question that, especially when I hear a conversation by a group of teachers that seems childish.
Sorry...the phrasing of your question sounded like the start of teacher-bashing which we all know is rampant on the DIS.
My apologies for misunderstanding the tone of your post.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:48 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disney Doll

Sorry...the phrasing of your question sounded like the start of teacher-bashing which we all know is rampant on the DIS.
My apologies for misunderstanding the tone of your post.
That's ok and precisely why I don't want to go further!
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:37 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by aprilgail2 View Post
It doesn't have to be a teacher talking- I could tell you all through my daughters school years which kids were "struggling" simply by my daughter coming home saying "I got a A on my test and missed one word, joey missed 20 words, tommoy missed 3 words and mary got them all right etc" "Joey, Sue, Myron and Calen get taken out of the room for testing because they need extra help" kids are a wealth of information.
Not only that but PARENTS talk....I have children that have IEPs for various reasons...it was actually kind of comical in grade school when I KNEW who they were talking about but obviously they couldn't name names since our boys were friends and pretty much in the same class/same aid for many years since they had similar problems. It was more of a general issue on "he will be with others who also struggle and the aide will help them" since it was a shared aide...I knew EXACTLY who he was sharing the aide with. I think *I* probably mentioned the other boys name while in my meetings with the school about my son since well...I'm a parent and not bound by any legal stuff, they of course, couldn't confirm anything but we all knew it.

I could tell you who has speech with my son just because my son would tell me who was in class with him for it. In this case, I don't know the parent at all but know their child has speech and the school didn't say a word about it to me.

I can also bet there could be a parent who asked another parent about XYZ private school and there could be a parent that does the "if I had to do it all over again, I would have just started them HERE because I find now they are struggling" or they could know each other from dance class, little league, have older siblings and have heard it from the parent grapevine, etc...
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:44 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Bnb0627 View Post
I have nothing against teachers. The simple fact is I overheard a group of them talking how they were going to bring down the charter school and they have to get the community on board and who can we get to point out their flaws. So basically that person was given a script to repeat at a community meeting.
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Originally Posted by Bnb0627 View Post
All I did was ask the question how else would they know? And many people have answered that questioned for me. Thank you. The teachers know about the kids grades before even the parents so naturally I would question that, especially when I hear a conversation by a group of teachers that seems childish.
So, you overheard teachers talking and deemed their conversation childish.

To answer your question, yes, the conversation you overheard as you stated it is perfectly legit.

The teachers were talking about a group (not an individual) of children coming from the charter school and sharing they are struggling.

They want to make sure the board knows that the charter school is not teaching up to standards. It is perfectly ok to rehearse amongst others how you are going to present the information.

It is not childish at all.
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:06 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hrhpd

So, you overheard teachers talking and deemed their conversation childish.

To answer your question, yes, the conversation you overheard as you stated it is perfectly legit.

The teachers were talking about a group (not an individual) of children coming from the charter school and sharing they are struggling.

They want to make sure the board knows that the charter school is not teaching up to standards. It is perfectly ok to rehearse amongst others how you are going to present the information.

It is not childish at all.
Thank you for assuming to know the whole conversation from just the piece I posted here. I am a person and I am allowed to have an opinion even if you don't agree. Yes my opinion of their behavior and conversation seemed childish. Was it also important for the board to know that they wear hideous green shirts and Frankenstein shoes? That was another comment.

Your need to take this further makes me think you are just looking to make conflict something I do not wish to do. I am not here to bash teachers they have my utmost respect and perform a job I do not have the patience to do!
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Old 01-16-2013, 04:19 PM   #22
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While I am not an expert on school privacy laws, and know of no reason a teacher can't say:
" Johnny is down to a C in Science" to anyone they want to.

Now, if they say "Johnny is down to a C in Science because he is no longer on Ritalin"...........then you have a MEDICAL privacy issue which there are laws about.

A student in public school has no expectation of privacy in regards to their academic performance.
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Old 01-16-2013, 04:26 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by tvguy View Post
While I am not an expert on school privacy laws, and know of no reason a teacher can't say:
" Johnny is down to a C in Science" to anyone they want to.

Now, if they say "Johnny is down to a C in Science because he is no longer on Ritalin"...........then you have a MEDICAL privacy issue which there are laws about.

A student in public school has no expectation of privacy in regards to their academic performance.
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Grades are not public information due to FERPA.
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Old 01-16-2013, 06:38 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Bnb0627 View Post
Thank you for assuming to know the whole conversation from just the piece I posted here. I am a person and I am allowed to have an opinion even if you don't agree. Yes my opinion of their behavior and conversation seemed childish. Was it also important for the board to know that they wear hideous green shirts and Frankenstein shoes? That was another comment.

Your need to take this further makes me think you are just looking to make conflict something I do not wish to do. I am not here to bash teachers they have my utmost respect and perform a job I do not have the patience to do!
That is why I clarified "as you stated it." You have now added more info.

Back to your original question if it was appropriate for teachers to discuss children. If children are coming into a school from another school behind, they need to discuss it amongst themselves. They need to figure out how they are going to address the issue together. It is important for all teachers to be on board.

And children that are behind need additional resources to catch them up. The teachers need to discuss how to best pool and best accommodate the needs of the children together. In these days of budget cuts, if the number of children moving to the school is more than just a couple, the teachers will most likely need to ask for more resources. And the board needs to know this to budget correctly.

Now, if they really did discuss Frankenstein shoes, then that was inappropriate. However, that is not discussing the children, but the dress code of the school, one they are apparently not a fan of. And while negatively discussing a school dress code in front of parents may be a bit unprofessional, it has nothing to do with school privacy.

The other factor on how inappropriate their conversation was would be to know how close you were standing to overhear this conversation and were the teachers aware that you were eavesdropping on their conversation? Were they aware that parents may be able to overhear them? If they were aware parents could overhear them, then it was unprofessional. If they thought their conversation was private amongst themselves, then discussing their views on the dress code is just that, stating their opinions amongst colleagues.

Last edited by Hrhpd; 01-16-2013 at 06:50 PM.
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Old 01-16-2013, 06:43 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvguy View Post
While I am not an expert on school privacy laws, and know of no reason a teacher can't say:
" Johnny is down to a C in Science" to anyone they want to.

Now, if they say "Johnny is down to a C in Science because he is no longer on Ritalin"...........then you have a MEDICAL privacy issue which there are laws about.

A student in public school has no expectation of privacy in regards to their academic performance.
Absolutely NEVER, EVER is a teacher to divulge grades to anybody but the legal guardians of child.

Teachers cannot even divulge information to non-custodial parents (ones without any kind of legal guardianship) unless the legal guardians ok it.

I have a relative who has legal custody of his children. The courts severed all legal rights of the mother. Even though she tries, she cannot get information from the school without my relative's permission.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:24 PM   #26
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Wrong, wrong, wrong. Grades are not public information due to FERPA.
FYI, FERPA only applies to students who are age 18 or older. And certainly states can have local laws.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:44 PM   #27
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FYI, FERPA only applies to students who are age 18 or older. And certainly states can have local laws.
Not true.

I am required to sign a new FERPA agreement every year, since the public school district I teach in receives federal funding.

According to the US Department of Education:

The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law that protects the privacy of student education records. The law applies to all schools that receive funds under an applicable program of the U.S. Department of Education.

FERPA gives parents certain rights with respect to their children's education records. These rights transfer to the student when he or she reaches the age of 18 or attends a school beyond the high school level. Students to whom the rights have transferred are "eligible students."

Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA)
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:06 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by HsvTeacher View Post
Not true.

I am required to sign a new FERPA agreement every year, since the public school district I teach in receives federal funding.

According to the US Department of Education:

The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law that protects the privacy of student education records. The law applies to all schools that receive funds under an applicable program of the U.S. Department of Education.

FERPA gives parents certain rights with respect to their children's education records. These rights transfer to the student when he or she reaches the age of 18 or attends a school beyond the high school level. Students to whom the rights have transferred are "eligible students."

Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA)
Okay, officially color me confused. We were up at the Jr. High School last week, and teachers had posted their semester grades in the classroom windows for all to see.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:07 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvguy View Post
FYI, FERPA only applies to students who are age 18 or older. And certainly states can have local laws.
Wrong on all parts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by official government FERPA website

The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law
Federal Law trumps State Law

Quote:
Originally Posted by official government FERPA website
FERPA gives parents certain rights with respect to their children's education records. These rights transfer to the student when he or she reaches the age of 18 or attends a school beyond the high school level. Students to whom the rights have transferred are "eligible students."
FERPA is for parents of children under 18. The rights under FERPA transfer to the student when they turn 18.

Quote:
Originally Posted by official government FERPA website
Generally, schools must have written permission from the parent or eligible student in order to release any information from a student's education record. However, FERPA allows schools to disclose those records, without consent, to the following parties or under the following conditions (34 CFR § 99.31):
  • School officials with legitimate educational interest;
  • Other schools to which a student is transferring;
  • Specified officials for audit or evaluation purposes;
  • Appropriate parties in connection with financial aid to a student;
  • Organizations conducting certain studies for or on behalf of the school;
  • Accrediting organizations;
  • To comply with a judicial order or lawfully issued subpoena;
  • Appropriate officials in cases of health and safety emergencies; and
  • State and local authorities, within a juvenile justice system, pursuant to specific State law.
Here is the official law:
http://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/f...rpa/index.html
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:17 PM   #30
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Okay, officially color me confused. We were up at the Jr. High School last week, and teachers had posted their semester grades in the classroom windows for all to see.
If grades were posted next to names, then they are in violation of FERPA, and if I were you, I'd notify an administrator. That's a lawsuit waiting to happen. Grades are never to be shared with anyone other than the student and his/her parent.
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