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Old 01-18-2013, 07:41 PM   #31
mort1331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilpooh108 View Post
David,

As an owner, I am only hesitant to use your service to rent out points because your payments to owners have not increased in the last 3 years (at least from memory).

While $10/pp may have been sufficient 2 or 3 years ago, dues have gone up so much that $10/pp is a loss for most owners, especially those who bought direct.

I have points that are much in demand ~ Aulani, BWV & AKV points, which also happens to pretty high dues. It is not worth it to rent out points for $10 if I can't even cover dues + $ for the initial buy in spread over the life of the contract. Although I'd love to use your service I think perhaps there should be consideration given to the increase in dues lately in terms of the $ per point given to owners.

That way, you won't have a backlog of renters "waiting" for availability.

If you clear your backlog, you make more money too.

Just my 2 cents.
Lilpooh, although I have not rented my points ,,YET, its coming,, I think renting to recoup your inital buy in is not fair. Having your dues covered for sure, couple of dollars for your time, but not to cover your inital buy. That is what you call a professional renter, or just be a broker yourself.
Yes I would like to see the price go up, but only because they have stayed where they are for awhile. This is true on the rent/trade board too.
I feel people rent their points because they cant use them, not to have a business with them.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:23 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilpooh108
David,

As an owner, I am only hesitant to use your service to rent out points because your payments to owners have not increased in the last 3 years (at least from memory).

While $10/pp may have been sufficient 2 or 3 years ago, dues have gone up so much that $10/pp is a loss for most owners, especially those who bought direct.

I have points that are much in demand ~ Aulani, BWV & AKV points, which also happens to pretty high dues. It is not worth it to rent out points for $10 if I can't even cover dues + $ for the initial buy in spread over the life of the contract. Although I'd love to use your service I think perhaps there should be consideration given to the increase in dues lately in terms of the $ per point given to owners.

That way, you won't have a backlog of renters "waiting" for availability.

If you clear your backlog, you make more money too.

Just my 2 cents.
I'm glad that David's has so many good comments! I think he keeps his price point where it is because the private rent boards usually sell for $11-12 (sometimes even $10). If David goes much higher, then he would have fewer customers and a hard time competing. While David's service helps to ensure a good exchange, renters have a great disadvantage in renting points in that they don't have control of the reservation at all, and they can't adjust it or talk to Disney about it, not to mention risks like the owner defaulting on dues. Also, renters typically have to front the entire cost of the trip upon confirmation of reservation, which is often 7-11 months from the trip rather than having the extra 6-10 months to save/invest that money.

Because of these risks and inconveniences in the rental market, points need to sell at a greater discount than what Disney offers for the same type of stay (usually 20%-30% off rack rates).

As an example, renting for a peak week Beach Club Villa Studio from David's in March would cost $1742. Cost from Disney is $3898.16 including taxes. That's 55% off, a great value for the renter! However, upon closer inspection, Disney is giving daily maid service and is offering 30% off at that time. So apples to apples, you need to add $210 to the rental price for daily cleaning. $1952 to rent, $2728.67 from Disney (with only a $389.81 deposit).

28% is the actual savings, and is still quite significant, but as you creep up the cost and get closer to Disney's Pricing, renters may decide for the the convenience and flexibility of booking direct.

I myself would love to rent in September, but my plans aren't firm enough yet to commit to a set time right now. Also, while I have the money now to pay for the rental, I don't really want to do that, so I will likely end up booking direct as what I want will probably be full through DVC 5-6 months out. However, I hope to book a vacation through David's service in the future, and reading threads here gives me peace of mind that I will likely rent from an honest, responsible owner, if I'm not one myself.
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:28 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Belle & Ariel
We have been cruising a lot the last couple years and have accumulated DVC banked points.
We have not wanted to hassle with renting but just could not find time to go to Disney and could not give away to our married kids(they did not want).
Sunday night I listed my 150 banked points with David's. The form asks the number of total points this use year which also included points we could bank into next year.
I figured hope for the best and if need be I would do a moms trip with a few friends if points hadn't rented within a few months.
WOW---Monday morning I had request for 122 points. I made reservation and when I sat down to lunch the payment had hit my email.
I was amazed and very thankful for Davids.
I had hope that the rest would be rented by when the current ones needed to be banked at end of March.
Today, I got a request for the rest of them and made that reservation.
I now have $2000 spending money for my cruise.
Again, very impressed with the ease of using David's Rentals and thankful for the service they provide.

I had an almost identical experience. Worked out far better than I expected...and they made it so simple!
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:58 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mort1331 View Post
Lilpooh, although I have not rented my points ,,YET, its coming,, I think renting to recoup your inital buy in is not fair. Having your dues covered for sure, couple of dollars for your time, but not to cover your inital buy. That is what you call a professional renter, or just be a broker yourself.
Yes I would like to see the price go up, but only because they have stayed where they are for awhile. This is true on the rent/trade board too.
I feel people rent their points because they cant use them, not to have a business with them.

I've rented and transferred at both $11 to $12 per point. My renters are happy. The $1 per point difference from my price point as compared to David's price point isn't going to help me recoup my initial buy. That would be ridiculous.

My point is that owners are NOT renting with David's for a reason--it's because his price point right now will cause owners to rent at a loss, considering that dues at Aulani are $6.25.

Obviously I'm not the only one that feels this way---there is a reason why his demand for points outweighs his supply. People are voting with their feet by turning away from his business. If David intends on running a successful business brokering point rentals, he needs to see the reality as to why his supply of points is waning. Obviously with his recent $1 bonus he's giving, he's starting to see the light. *Don't shoot the messenger.*

By the way, no one is supposed to have a business renting their points out. If you check my post history, you'll see that I don't run a business renting points.

I'm sure David makes more money than me. After all, he makes $3/pt conducting Paypal transactions. It's not his risk of ownership, his risk of renter damage to the room, etc.
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Old 01-19-2013, 10:13 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by pharmlivin View Post
offering a 1.00 bonus (11 dollars a point) if you sign up today to rent your points because of the increased demand.

Not sure how OP made 2000 renting 150 points ...Maybe I missed something. I'll go back a reread the post.
Sorry I thought I had said I used some points from this use year that I would have booked into next year. I rented a little over 200 points. My first did not use all my banked points and to get another to use the rest I had to also rent current points.
I missed the $11 special by a few days.
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Old 01-19-2013, 10:17 AM   #36
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I do not rent points to make money. I do not want to let banked points expire unused. There are years we cruise or vacation elsewhere to the point DH has no vacation time left to use our points. I could take friends but there is too much on the calendar to even do that this year.
It is easier to rent the points and use that money towards other trips this year.
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Old 01-19-2013, 10:38 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mort1331 View Post
Lilpooh, although I have not rented my points ,,YET, its coming,, I think renting to recoup your inital buy in is not fair. Having your dues covered for sure, couple of dollars for your time, but not to cover your inital buy. That is what you call a professional renter, or just be a broker yourself.
Yes I would like to see the price go up, but only because they have stayed where they are for awhile. This is true on the rent/trade board too.
I feel people rent their points because they cant use them, not to have a business with them.
Just recouping your expenses occasionally (which do include initial buy in), or even just renting occasionally for any reason, would be far from being considered a professional renter or broker by most people IMO. From another viewpoint I don't understand why an owner should or would in essence subsidize a renter by not recouping all costs of the points for that year if they have the opportunity to and aren't doing it from some sort of distressed situation.
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Old 01-19-2013, 11:31 AM   #38
mort1331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilpooh108 View Post

Obviously I'm not the only one that feels this way---there is a reason why his demand for points outweighs his supply. People are voting with their feet by turning away from his business. If David intends on running a successful business brokering point rentals, he needs to see the reality as to why his supply of points is waning. Obviously with his recent $1 bonus he's giving, he's starting to see the light. *Don't shoot the messenger.*

.
Thats one way to look at it, or the other way is that word is getting out about how easy for both parties to rent thru Dave's. I think this is more the senerio, as people are looking at saving money and finding out about Dave's, they see the ease and simplicity of that. There are some owners out there, apparently you, that are trying to squeeze every last dollar.
Dave has a big demand becuase he hasnt raised his retail price, which he would have to do if he started to pay higher. That could slow down business and once you lost business its a lot harder to get back.
He has shown he pays attention to the boards and sent out his newest offer, but as you see he didnt raise his retail, so he is really cutting into his costs to try and please a few.
Keep up the great work Dave, you are obviously respected by alot here and your pricing is fair in this market.
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Old 01-19-2013, 01:27 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAT4DISNEY View Post
Just recouping your expenses occasionally (which do include initial buy in), or even just renting occasionally for any reason, would be far from being considered a professional renter or broker by most people IMO. From another viewpoint I don't understand why an owner should or would in essence subsidize a renter by not recouping all costs of the points for that year if they have the opportunity to and aren't doing it from some sort of distressed situation.
Thanks Kat, well said.

To the renter that keeps arguing with me, consider this: You want to save $1/pt for the exact same reasons that I'd rather make an additional $1/pt.

Pot, kettle, kettle, pot.

The basic reality of increasing dues is why David will eventually have to give owners more than $10/pt to continue with his operation. Whether he chooses to take it from his own cut or to raise his "retail" is up to him. We shall see, won't we.

My comments on this thread are done, since I have other things to do, like Fish Extender gifts. By the way, I don't charge for those.
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Old 01-19-2013, 02:20 PM   #40
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Unless he's willing to share with us his business fundamentals (not likely) we will never know whether his current situation is due to a shrinking supply, or a growing demand, or both. That said, it is the case that travel demand continues to recover. So it stands to reason that at least part of the "problem" is that more potential renters are looking to use his service. It also seems reasonable (at least to me) that someone going through him gets a little bit less than they would trying to rent directly to customers, as that is quite a bit of work. See the "Ethics and Tact" thread as an example.

As to the "market" for rental prices; they have crept up a little bit, but in the long run they do not seem to have gone up nearly as fast as dues on a percentage basis, let alone the higher percentage increase in Disney's room rates. I'm not sure why that is, but it has been a consistent trend for many many years, even before the recession hit.
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Old 01-19-2013, 05:22 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by twoj View Post
Well you have to look at what it would cost to rent the same room through Disney. I booked a stay in Hilton head and noticed if someone used David's it might be more expensive than just booking through Disney.
did you get your 25% off at HH - that may be the difference.
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Old 01-19-2013, 05:58 PM   #42
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4 add-on's and I still don't have any points...I am envious of those who are able to bank!
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Old 01-19-2013, 07:46 PM   #43
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I have to say that I never wanted to use his services until I see the special yesterday for $11/pt because I can rent my points for that much if I need to.
I'm glad he did raise the price tho...
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Old 01-20-2013, 07:38 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Brian Noble View Post
Unless he's willing to share with us his business fundamentals (not likely) we will never know whether his current situation is due to a shrinking supply, or a growing demand, or both.
Exactly Brian. Well said .

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Old 01-20-2013, 09:24 AM   #45
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Hello Everyone,

This may not be the place so my apologies in advance but I have a question for those of you who know David's DVC Rentals fairly well. Is it difficult to get the room you want? If I'm looking to take my trip in Nov 2013 - is this the best time to start putting in a request? I've read his site top to bottom but I'm looking for people who've used him before. I know there's probably no way to answer these questions but I have to try. Any advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks

JT
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