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Old 01-07-2013, 08:34 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennasis View Post
The one I don't understand is "dwarf" v. "little person". I just don't get why being called a dwarf (when the medical term for the condition they have is dwarfism) is negative but being called a LITTLE person (which sounds like less of a person to me) is okay.
That one used to make me wonder, as well. However, when I started teaching special education, all of our training emphasized putting the child before the disability when writing paper work that did not allow for the child's name and required specification of the disability. For example, if a person had albinism, you did not refer to them as an albino. Rather, they were "the child with albinism". Always "the child" first. I think that maybe dwarf is the same thing and why we aren't supposed to refer to a person as a dwarf. Of course, using my logic, you would need to refer to them as "the person with dwarfism". I don't understand how "little person" isn't offensive. I know I wouldn't like it.

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Originally Posted by laurajetter View Post
One I didn't realize was not politically correct is sitting "indian-style". Now they just say "criss-cross applesauce". Is it really derogatory to refer to that seating position as indian-style? I guess I just never had any racist thoughts when I used the term myself, it just referred to that particular sitting position so I didn't see what was that wrong with it. I'm sure someone will enlighten me though... (Please no flaming, it's just one of those things I grew up getting used to and haven't given it much thought since then; my intention would never be to offend anyone.)
I believe it is the use of the word "Indian". There was a time when people could be called Indians, as Christopher Columbus called them. Then, it was decided it was inappropriate to call them as such since they did not come from India. They were then called "Native Americans". Some people started to take offense to this, however, because they argued that they were born in this country which made them native Americans - just not in the strict definition of the term. Then, I believe the term coined was "American Indian". So, in any case, people didn't like it being called "Indian style" because it originally was called that as it was how Indians/Native Americans/American Indians were thought to sit around a fire. If you couldn't call them "Indians", you couldn't call it "Indian style".



For the record, I think criss cross applesauce is a really weird thing to call it. There is no applesauce and it makes me want applesauce.
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:34 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by *pixie*dust* View Post
In my experience, people prefer to be refered to by their country of origin. To use the blanket "Middle Eastern" label discounts their unique countries and heritage and lumps a wide variety of people in one generic group.
While this may be true, when you are trying to describe someone to another person, you can't always possibly know what country someone is from. I honestly think people need to lighten up a little and stop looking to be offended.
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:35 PM   #33
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Because it is used, incessantly, as an insult. While it was once a medical term, it's now become pejorative and slang, so self advocates with intellectual disabilities, and people who advocate on behalf of those with intellectual disabilities have chosen a new, equally if not more descriptive term to use instead.
Which, very sadly, people will just as quickly use as an insult. I've heard young adults and teenagers fling the new acceptable words around with the same ignorance and inconsideration as the words that came before.

I think we need to change minds, not words, if we want to see real change. While I totally agree that language is important, if we don't educate as to why we're changing the words, it won't make a difference.

The one I've always found a little funny was "hearing impaired." I've worked with the deaf community and they self-identify as "deaf." Yet, in PC terms that isn't inclusive of the range of hearing loss that can happen, so they insist on "hearing impaired" over the actual wishes of many of the people they are referring to.
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:38 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Jennasis View Post
I agree...AND the term "criss-cross applesauce" is beyond stupid. They could simply go with cross-legged.
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:39 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laurajetter View Post
One I didn't realize was not politically correct is sitting "indian-style". Now they just say "criss-cross applesauce". Is it really derogatory to refer to that seating position as indian-style? I guess I just never had any racist thoughts when I used the term myself, it just referred to that particular sitting position so I didn't see what was that wrong with it. I'm sure someone will enlighten me though... (Please no flaming, it's just one of those things I grew up getting used to and haven't given it much thought since then; my intention would never be to offend anyone.)
As with most things politically incorrect, it's probably not even offensive to the people it allegedly offends
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:50 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laurajetter View Post
One I didn't realize was not politically correct is sitting "indian-style". Now they just say "criss-cross applesauce". Is it really derogatory to refer to that seating position as indian-style? I guess I just never had any racist thoughts when I used the term myself, it just referred to that particular sitting position so I didn't see what was that wrong with it. I'm sure someone will enlighten me though... (Please no flaming, it's just one of those things I grew up getting used to and haven't given it much thought since then; my intention would never be to offend anyone.)
"criss-cross applesauce" I haven't heard that expression since the 70's. When we were kids, we used to do some kind of rhyme on someone's back....

Criss-Cross applesause
Spiders crawling up your horse
Cool breeze
Tight Squeeze
Now you got the shiver-ese

My kids are 11 and 13, when they were young, it was called "pretzel up"!
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:51 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennasis

I agree...AND the term "criss-cross applesauce" is beyond stupid. They could simply go with cross-legged.
Or pretzel legs
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Old 01-07-2013, 08:58 PM   #38
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I know ALOT of people from India/Pakistan. I work with alot of them, neighbours and friends with them and my kids are friends with alot of kids from these countries. They all refer to themselves as "brown" so that's how they are discribed here (Canada). It's no different then saying "black" to discribe a person.
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:09 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Tinijocaro View Post
Or pretzel legs
Except some pretzels are straight! All we have at our house are pretzel sticks, so my kid would have been mightily confused if someone used this term to mean cross-legged!

We did the "criss-cross applesauce" game in the 70s also. However, it had NOTHING to do with sitting cross-legged- it's a game where you lightly touch people on their back, head, etc., which gives them the "shivers" or "creepy-crawlies." I was pretty surprised to hear a 2nd grade teacher use "criss-cross applesauce" to describe a sitting position!
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:13 PM   #40
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Except some pretzels are straight! All we have at our house are pretzel sticks, so my kid would have been mightily confused if someone used this term to mean cross-legged!

We did the "criss-cross applesauce" game in the 70s also. However, it had NOTHING to do with sitting cross-legged- it's a game where you lightly touch people on their back, head, etc., which gives them the "shivers" or "creepy-crawlies." I was pretty surprised to hear a 2nd grade teacher use "criss-cross applesauce" to describe a sitting position!
Yes that is what I meant! I never heard the term used to describe sitting with your legs crossed...only heard it in a silly rhyme back in the day! that's why I was suprised to see it used that way. It was just tickling, touching, blowing, etc on someone's back!
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:15 PM   #41
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I think criss-cross applesauce came from teachers and kids trying to make a rhyme out of everything. Just like "easy peasy, lemon-squeezy" is popular right now.

I hear "criss-cross, applesauce" more with the little kids. My third graders "sit like a pretzel."
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:18 PM   #42
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On the topic of American Indian vs. Native American. Either one is about the same in terms of cultural sensitivity. Some people use one and some use another, it's more personal preference. A lot of American Indian websites use the terms interchangeably.

However, it's best to refer to someone by their TRIBAL affiliation. So you would say "Ms. Whatsit of the Natchez tribe."
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:28 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mombrontrent
I know ALOT of people from India/Pakistan. I work with alot of them, neighbours and friends with them and my kids are friends with alot of kids from these countries. They all refer to themselves as "brown" so that's how they are discribed here (Canada). It's no different then saying "black" to discribe a person.
But many Americans are uncomfortable even mentioning skin color. It makes for needlessly uncomfortable and complicated situations. My kids are half Indian (Asian, not American) and when my son was little (3 or 4), I liked to talk to him about the differences in our family members' skin colors. He would say Daddy is brown, E (his sister) is medium brown, G ( he) is light brown, and mommy is pink! The first time he said that I laughed so hard. Because it's true. I'm so white I'm actually pink! I have no problem describing my kids as brown. And neither do they. I kinda' wish I were a little less pink and a little more brown .
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:34 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by leebee View Post
We did the "criss-cross applesauce" game in the 70s also. However, it had NOTHING to do with sitting cross-legged- it's a game where you lightly touch people on their back, head, etc., which gives them the "shivers" or "creepy-crawlies."
ok, let's see how this varies by region...here's the Maryland version from the 80's that I knew:

criss-cross (make a + on the person's back)
applesauce (poke both index fingers in a line going up the back in time to the syllables)
spiders crawling up your back (quickly walk two fingers on each hand going up the back)
spiders crawling down your back (walk fingers back down)
(blow on the neck) cool breeze
(squeeze the neck) tight squeeze
now you've got the shiveries (lightly tickle the shoulders and upper arms)
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Old 01-07-2013, 09:46 PM   #45
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I think criss-cross applesauce came from teachers and kids trying to make a rhyme out of everything. Just like "easy peasy, lemon-squeezy" is popular right now.

I hear "criss-cross, applesauce" more with the little kids. My third graders "sit like a pretzel."
at my son's school , the teachers are not allowed to say sit on your bottom, they have to say "sit on your pockets.."
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