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Old 12-27-2012, 10:09 AM   #1
hsmamato2
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"turn off ALL devices..." ???

Ok, I've flown for quite a few years, but this past Dec. trip was new....on SWA, when taking off/landing (like a 15 minute window on each) they make us shut every electronic thing off. Even a simple camera,or black and white e-reader,or kids handheld game. Is this a new thing everywhere? I found it very strange....they monitored us all very closely too to be sure we all complied...not 'cellphones in airplane mode'...OFF. anyone else know about this?
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:21 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hsmamato2 View Post
Ok, I've flown for quite a few years, but this past Dec. trip was new....on SWA, when taking off/landing (like a 15 minute window on each) they make us shut every electronic thing off. Even a simple camera,or black and white e-reader,or kids handheld game. Is this a new thing everywhere? I found it very strange....they monitored us all very closely too to be sure we all complied...not 'cellphones in airplane mode'...OFF. anyone else know about this?
I fly two times a month across various airlines and they all have this announcement. The only time I don't have to power off is when I am on a private jet - but the wifi does not work until 10,000 feet.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:26 AM   #3
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I have been flying for almost 40 years. This has always been the case for takeoff and landing.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:27 AM   #4
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That's not new as far as I know. It's always been that way on all my flights.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:43 AM   #5
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That's not new as far as I know. It's always been that way on all my flights.

Agreed. Basically, if it has an on/off switch, it needs to be off.

The theory is electronic devices could cause problems with the airplanes electronics. Although I heard/read something recently that studies have shown that isn't true and some group (FCC?) is asking the FAA to allow at least certain electronic devices to be on for take off/landing.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:49 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

Agreed. Basically, if it has an on/off switch, it needs to be off.

The theory is electronic devices could cause problems with the airplanes electronics. Although I heard/read something recently that studies have shown that isn't true and some group (FCC?) is asking the FAA to allow at least certain electronic devices to be on for take off/landing.
This is the theory, but I am one who doesn't want to test the theory.

On a recent flight a lady, was playing words with friends and was trying to hide it from the flight attendant. She was caught and was asked to turn off her phone and put it away.

Do we all need to be connected every second of the day? What is the harm in a few minutes of not using an electronic device?
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:54 AM   #7
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I agree, not a new requirement.

However, how many planes a day fly with electronic devices belonging to passengers running (intentionally or not), with no problems? Probably thousands. If these items were really such a danger, they wouldn't be allowed on planes at all.
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Old 12-27-2012, 02:48 PM   #8
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hmmm...ok. I probably never paid attention, but now I have a kindle for reading... It surprised me about the regular camera though<i'd never heard that either. I think what got me thinking about this was another thread with the title" I should have landed 15 minutes ago"....so the person was obviously using a device while circling/waiting....made me wonder if I'd just been missing all this.....
FWIW,I don't think it interferes with plane stuff either...and I don't mind turning stuff off(though I wanted to keep reading lol) it just seemed,really enforced. Last week we had to circle/wait for Airforce 1 to clear,and we had to keep everything shut down for about an hour.....
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

Agreed. Basically, if it has an on/off switch, it needs to be off.

The theory is electronic devices could cause problems with the airplanes electronics. Although I heard/read something recently that studies have shown that isn't true and some group (FCC?) is asking the FAA to allow at least certain electronic devices to be on for take off/landing.
I've heard the same thing. They are looking at allowing certain electronics to remain on, not all but some of them.
Now, do I think that if I keep my cell phone on, and functioning, it is going to bring down the plane? Nope, doubt that. Otherwise, it would be pretty easy for terrorists, wouldn't it???

I'm sure that some electronics may be able to interfere with some onboard electronic stuff....but I doubt it's a huge danger!!
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:30 PM   #10
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I've heard the same thing. They are looking at allowing certain electronics to remain on, not all but some of them.
Now, do I think that if I keep my cell phone on, and functioning, it is going to bring down the plane? Nope, doubt that. Otherwise, it would be pretty easy for terrorists, wouldn't it???

I'm sure that some electronics may be able to interfere with some onboard electronic stuff....but I doubt it's a huge danger!!
I should have mentioned earlier, having cell phones in "airplane" mode makes sense. Think about how a cell phone works... it transmits to nearby cell towers. As you move, you get switched to another tower (cell) seemlessly (most of the time).

Speaking of receivers and transmitters, the higher you are, the further you can receive/transmit. So how many towers do you "hit" while flying (at least climbing & descending). I had heard the reason to keep cell phones off was more from cell phone companies than it was aircraft manufacturers.
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Old 12-27-2012, 03:57 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post
I should have mentioned earlier, having cell phones in "airplane" mode makes sense. Think about how a cell phone works... it transmits to nearby cell towers. As you move, you get switched to another tower (cell) seemlessly (most of the time).

Speaking of receivers and transmitters, the higher you are, the further you can receive/transmit. So how many towers do you "hit" while flying (at least climbing & descending). I had heard the reason to keep cell phones off was more from cell phone companies than it was aircraft manufacturers.
The "airplane" mode shuts down the phone's transmit and receive functions - it's totally related to interference with the aircraft's avionics and not the cellular system.

edited to correct last part -
Quote:
Cellphones are banned during entire flightsnot just during takeoff and landingbecause they can interfere with ground-based antenna capacity.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...080904804.html

eta:
[quote]
Quote:
The reason they don't want you using personal electronics during takeoff and landing is that most personal electronics, even though they're shielded and not supposed to emit much, emit certain amounts of RFI (Radio Frequency Interference). While one or two devices might not interfere, a lot of them could interfere with aircraft pilot-ground communications, which is critical during takeoff and landing, when the aircraft is most vulnerable. If there is an emergency, the pilot needs to have clear communication with the Air Traffic Controller for emergency instructions and other necessary coms.

Cell Phones and Notebooks are the biggest RFI and EMI (electromagnetic interference) offenders - even though they're shielded, they still emit quite a bit of interference, and cell phones by their nature could theoretically directly overlap an emergency com frequency that the pilot is using.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_must_y...rplane_takeoff
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Last edited by CPT Tripss; 12-27-2012 at 04:09 PM.
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Old 12-27-2012, 04:05 PM   #12
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The "airplane" mode shuts down the phone's transmit and receive functions - it's totally related to interference with the aircraft's avionics and not the cellular system.
Has there been any documentation showing a phone interfering with avionics?

ETA: If cellular technology interferes with avionics, why don't cell tower transmissions interfere? What about TV stations Doppler radar? Satellite transmissions (I know people who operate satellite trucks... broadcasting sporting events)? Sometimes an aircraft will fly through the "beam" being sent up to the satellite. Those planes apparently haven't had problems yet.
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Old 12-27-2012, 04:20 PM   #13
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Has there been any documentation showing a phone interfering with avionics?

ETA: If cellular technology interferes with avionics, why don't cell tower transmissions interfere? What about TV stations Doppler radar? Satellite transmissions (I know people who operate satellite trucks... broadcasting sporting events)? Sometimes an aircraft will fly through the "beam" being sent up to the satellite. Those planes apparently haven't had problems yet.
The have been numerous incidents reported by pilots as well as tests, using personal electronics, onboard aircraft that recreated the reported incident.

As far as "why" and "why not" - electronic devices whether capable of transmiting a signal or not use RF in their internal workings. Regardless of the device these frequencies are typically all in the same, narrow range. It's these frequencies that have the potential to interfere with avionics (that use the same internal frequencies) more than the actual emitted transmitting frequency. The cell phone/iPad/pc is close to the aircraft's wiring . . . the weather radar, satellite truck are far away from the aircraft's wiring.
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:39 PM   #14
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14 CFR 121.306 - Portable electronic devices.

§ 121.306
Portable electronic devices.
(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person may operate, nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft allow the operation of, any portable electronic device on any U.S.-registered civil aircraft operating under this part.
(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to—
(1) Portable voice recorders;
(2) Hearing aids;
(3) Heart pacemakers;
(4) Electric shavers; or
(5) Any other portable electronic device that the part 119 certificate holder has determined will not cause interference with the navigation or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used.
(c) The determination required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that part 119 certificate holder operating the particular device to be used.
[Doc. No. FAA-1998-4954, 64 FR 1080, Jan. 7, 1999]


I believe certain airlines allow their pilots to use iPads for electronic flight bags (EFBs) for navigational purposes only. The law is the law, obey it.

Source: http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/121.306
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:42 PM   #15
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Interesting Blog... http://www.edn.com/electronics-blogs...th-or-reality-

And hey... Mythbusters did find out older, unshielded planes could have problems... http://mythbustersresults.com/episode49.

But, if use of an electronic device could be so detrimental to flying, why aren't they banned? Shouldn't the TSA force us to check our electronics?
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