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Old 12-15-2012, 12:07 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Gumbo4x4 View Post
True, I also think a sturdy door with a lock would be just as effective as the safe rooms and easier to secure.
The walls are already cinder block...at least in our schools...so they just need steal doors with no windows and a good deadbolt at each classroom. I also think they should somehow door off the school from the office and the office should be when you come in the main door. I really wish we could have small neighborhood schools, but that's never going to happen. I think we will go the way of home schooling (my DS does an online school at home and I think that may be the way of the future).
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:21 PM   #47
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In the beginning of the year, we had fire drills, tornado drills and lock down drills. Unfortunately, there is no way to truly predict exact scenarios.
Our lock down procedures have three phases. The 1st and 2nd are similar: lock the doors and continue teaching as normal. The 3rd phrase is to make sure the doors are locked and to hide the children.

I think the most horrifying part of this story (for me as a teacher) is that the shooter was a child of a teacher. At my school, children of teachers are frequent visitors at school. If were to see one of them at school, I wouldn't think anything of it.

A group of teachers discussed after school that this might change schools forever. No more parent volunteers, no more visitors without searches or background checks. It's something to think about.

This is just my opinion of course.
I live in a town much like Newtown; sleepy, family oriented, people rarely lock doors.

However, the school district takes multiple safety measures.

All parent volunteers must go through a background and fingerprint check before they are allowed in the classroom.

Schools have all doors locked and visitors can only enter by the front door. They ring the bell, office has both video and direct vision of person at door, they unlock door.

We have regular fire, lockout and lock down drills.

However, all this can be moot as Sandy Hook also had brand new security system with locked doors, etc. The shooter apparently forced his way in.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:26 PM   #48
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I hope they make no changes. There is just no money for that. Wile tragic, this was not the worst school massacre in our history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster

I hope they keep money in educating our students and not in costly measures that only give a false sense of security.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:38 PM   #49
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I loved the way out elementary was designed. It is all one level and every classroom has a dorway to the outside of the building. No one could get in the doors, they are heavy security doors and are locked from the inside, but the kids could get out, if needed, witout going into the hallway.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:51 PM   #50
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I hope they make no changes. There is just no money for that.

I hope they keep money in educating our students and not in costly measures that only give a false sense of security.
Really? You must not have young kids in school. It would take very little money to beef up the doors in each school. Worth it to me.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:58 PM   #51
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Beefed up doors would be good but there are windows. If someone has gone off the deep end and is determined to cause harm, they will. They can wait for recess, lunch breaks, etc. Yesterday, the Sandy Hook Elementary doors were locked. Did Adam Lanza have his mother's key or did he manage some other way to get into the school? There is no way to 100% protect a building or those in it from a determined person with killing on their mind. You can make it harder but you cannot prevent it.
**** Just read, Adam Lanza did not have a key, he forced his way in somehow.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:14 PM   #52
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Beefed up doors would be good but there are windows. If someone has gone off the deep end and is determined to cause harm, they will. They can wait for recess, lunch breaks, etc. Yesterday, the Sandy Hook Elementary doors were locked. Did Adam Lanza have his mother's key or did he manage some other way to get into the school? There is no way to 100% protect a building or those in it from a determined person with killing on their mind. You can make it harder but you cannot prevent it.
**** Just read, Adam Lanza did not have a key, he forced his way in somehow.
Beefed up doors and windows would be good, however, it will stop an attack if someone wants to cause harm.

As a country we truly need to look into the issue and fix the real problem. Right now, we are reacting to the situation and not truly focusing on what is the real cause. People use situations like this as a political tool, while doing nothing for the issue.

We need to start with mental illness and get people real help. I have known people who did seek help and didn't receive it. They were held for 72 hours, but no one truly gave them the tools to deal with life. They medicated them and sent them on their way. So as a country we just put band-aids on top of band-aids and say, "see it's fix, everything is okay." Then we wonder why these things happen.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:20 PM   #53
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From what I understand, the shooter shot out the windows in the door to gain access to the windows. You would need a building with no windows or with bars in order to have stopped him. As somebody said, someone determined to do this, will, unfortunately, find a way. I did like that somebody mentioned that all classrooms has doors that lead outside. That sounds like a good idea.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:25 PM   #54
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What happened yesterday was a terrible tragedy. I cannot imagine what the affected families are going through.


That said I read a statistic yesterday that 33 children died in schools in 2011. Deaths in school have been dropping. Obviously this year's number will be higher but even at 50 or 60 deaths per year, the safest place for our children is in school. School security is not the problem.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:41 PM   #55
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If you have a question about security procedures in your child's school, just ask. Any adult in the building will be happy to answer. I know we had an emergency meeting the second the buses rolled out yesterday about our current procedures, changes we can make immediately to increase our already high security (without costing any money), and answers we can give to parents, as it is expected that we will face questions in the coming week.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:44 PM   #56
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Really? You must not have young kids in school. It would take very little money to beef up the doors in each school. Worth it to me.
I have a child in elementary schools. Throwing money at frankly a non-problem would be a waste. Your Idea of very little money is false when you consider some schools have no money to start. Even in our affluent district, teachers still must use their own money for class supplies.

It would take a huge amount of money to beef up the doors.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:50 PM   #57
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From what I understand, the shooter shot out the windows in the door to gain access to the windows. You would need a building with no windows or with bars in order to have stopped him. As somebody said, someone determined to do this, will, unfortunately, find a way. I did like that somebody mentioned that all classrooms has doors that lead outside. That sounds like a good idea.
Even having door that lead outside may not help. At our one school that had doors to the outside said, the best thing to do is hide and not go out the back. The reason for this is that you do not know if a shooter is outside waiting for people to leave, so they could shoot someone as they ran.

A good solution would be to have armed police or a principals carry a weapon. I strongly believe that if the principal from yesterday had a gun kids would have been saved. All it would have taken is a shot to the head.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:55 PM   #58
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I loved the way out elementary was designed. It is all one level and every classroom has a dorway to the outside of the building. No one could get in the doors, they are heavy security doors and are locked from the inside, but the kids could get out, if needed, witout going into the hallway.
Yes, one of my son's elementary schools was the same way. I really liked that design, because it meant you could escape from multiple points. Most of the school yesterday could have evacuated immediately if they were in a setting like that.
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:04 PM   #59
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I hope they make no changes. There is just no money for that. Wile tragic, this was not the worst school massacre in our history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster

I hope they keep money in educating our students and not in costly measures that only give a false sense of security.
Thank you! I thought I remembered reading about a tragedy with a bombing that had happened in the past when my DMIL was a girl, but thought it happened in the South for some reason. I looked it up, because DMIL told me that news of the incident had scared her a great deal - she was 8 when it happened.

ETA: WOW. There was a StoryCorps interview from 2009 linked on the Wiki site with a man who survived the bombing and his daughter. Thanks again.
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:16 PM   #60
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I like the idea of an exit to the outside in every classroom, but I can see that would be a very costly step to take as well. But, the kids could shelter in place in the classroom, then when given the all clear, they could exit directly from their classroom and not have to walk through the devastation in the halls.

the kindergarten and 1st grade classrooms at our elementary school have 2 classrooms that have an open free-flowing passageway between 2. A kind of hallway where there are bathrooms and a small area for special needs care. You can hear and see the kids from one room to the other and there is no door in between. So I can easly see in this type of setting that if a shooter enters one of those rooms, there would be no way of sheltering in place for the students in the other room.

Also, I'm sure there is a different response to take if it were to happen when the students are in a more public area. Like when they are in the hallway transferring to another area of the school, or if in the cafeteria, gym, playground, library, etc. These are very open places with nowhere to hide. So, if all the classrooms are locked from the inside, what happens to the kids that are outside the classroom? Run for exits I'm sure.
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