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Old 12-07-2012, 09:50 PM   #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaytieeldr
This year's flu vaccine appears to be extremely effective against this year's flu mutation (see DISers own reports in this thread, as well as official reports).

Because the virus mutates as it travels from one victim to the next, one vaccine can't be effective. The vaccine has to be adapted to fight the specific mutation.
Ok. Yes, the flu vaccine needs to change every year, perhaps even more often. I certainly understand that and I wasn't arguing that. However, the new report I read about flu efficacy from the University of Minnesota specifically says, "there is no evidence to support the idea that flu vaccine is more effective in years when the strains included in the shot are a good match for those circulating in nature." The point of the study is that, historically, the flu vaccine is just not as effective as we've been led to believe, even when the strains are well matched.

So, we choose not to use the vaccine. If one day the CDC can prove that the flu vaccine will eradicate or vastly reduce the incidence of the flu, we will reconsider the vaccine. That's all I'm saying. I'm not trying to be a radical anti-vaccine activist. I'm trying to explain my much-deliberated decision to not to use a vaccine that can't be proven to be effective. But perhaps I'm just not being clear, so I apologize.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:01 PM   #257
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I've always felt I'd rather be protected from some of the strains rather than none. I don't understand not getting it because it's not 100%. Even if it protects against 50%, it's better than none. I've gotten it the past 5 or 6 years because I traveled frequently and never got the flu. Who knows if I was exposed or not, you never really know. You only know if it didn't work.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:06 PM   #258
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I spent one year in bed for 10 days with the flu - NEVER AGAIN. Perhaps some will change their minds when the get "the flu". Not some virus that is going around.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:13 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by disney1990 View Post
I spent one year in bed for 10 days with the flu - NEVER AGAIN. Perhaps some will change their minds when the get "the flu". Not some virus that is going around.
I didn't. I definitely had the flu. And when I had H1N1, they made me wear the surgical mask. I got pneumonia from H1N1 so it just kept dragging out and I got even more meds. I didn't think I was ever going to feel right. As the saying goes, I wasn't sure if I was dying or just wanted to. I still don't have my DD get vaccinated.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:50 PM   #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jahber View Post
In fact, my children and I came down with a violent case of the exact strain we were "immunized" against. The nurse was shocked when she saw the results of the strain test. The thing is, we ended up with the flu AGAIN the next year after the shot. And I'm talking bad enough to go to the doctor, although they didn't test that time because it was so obvious we had the flu (and maybe didn't want to report another case of flu after a vaccine?). So, we don't get the vaccine anymore.
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I'm not sure what you're arguing against here. I didn't say I only approve of vaccines that guarantee 100% effectiveness. Nor did I imply that the flu vaccine should provide immunity for more than one flu season. I said I personally approve of vaccines that *work*, in other words, that fulfill their purpose of eliminating or vastly reducing a disease among the vaccinated population. At least, that's what I was taught in my medical sciences classes. Perhaps others have a different understanding of what an effective vaccine does. Incidences of small pox, measles, rubella, etc, have been drastically reduced or officially eradicated (small pox) by vaccines. While the flu vaccine CAN be effective when it is well matched to the strain you actually contract, it has not happened for my family. And in fact, according to independent sources--including those already mentioned previously--the vaccines have not been nearly as effective as we've been led to believe. I hope that helps clear up any confusion about the point I was trying to make.
Actually I am confused by your post. Perhaps I read it wrong, but the bolded sounds as if you had expected to be protected from the flu the following year
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:00 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by mfd25wife View Post
I didn't. I definitely had the flu. And when I had H1N1, they made me wear the surgical mask. I got pneumonia from H1N1 so it just kept dragging out and I got even more meds. I didn't think I was ever going to feel right. As the saying goes, I wasn't sure if I was dying or just wanted to. I still don't have my DD get vaccinated.
I guess it's your choice, but I find it shocking that you would not want to TRY to protect your child from such a traumatic experience.
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:19 AM   #262
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I guess it's your choice, but I find it shocking that you would not want to TRY to protect your child from such a traumatic experience.
She has a strong immune system. Mine is compromised. If something walks by me, I catch it. She doesn't. DH won't bring work clothes home because he doesn't want to carry home what he gets into working with patients. he washes them at the station.
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Old 12-08-2012, 07:11 AM   #263
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I guess it's your choice, but I find it shocking that you would not want to TRY to protect your child from such a traumatic experience.
A car accident is traumatic. Should we keep kids out of cars to protect them from being in one?

Is it just me or when someone says "we don't get the flu shot" others try to convince them they need it. But if someone says "we get the flu shot" no one says "you shouldn't".

I'm 42 years old, never had the shot, never gotten the flu. No one in my family got the flu. I'm simply not convinced the shot lives up to the hype. My choice. You want the shot? Go for it.
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Old 12-08-2012, 07:38 AM   #264
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I know about Herbert Spencer but Darwin inspired the phrase and is more associated with it. The post I answered asked about Darwin so I used it.

I understand your argument but feel that whether or not a child is vaccinated is a decision that should rest with the parents and not with the government.
If you understand Spencer and Darwin's theories, why did you misrepresent how their theories of natural selection and survival of the fittest would cause Darwin to be anti-vaccination, since neither theory (one of which was not even his) would in any way translate to an objection to vaccinations?
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:03 AM   #265
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http://video.msnbc.msn.com/nightly-n...1467/#50131467

The flu season is early this year and is hitting hard. 5 children have already died so far. In 2009/2010, also bad year, more than 279 children died from the flu and countless adults. This is not a risk that I am willing to take.
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Old 12-09-2012, 11:08 AM   #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RitaE View Post
According to this website it is the law in New Jersey

http://www.state.nj.us/health/cd/req_imm.shtml

This is the code for a Religious Exemption which states the school should not question the parent's written statement of religious exemption. Do with that whatever your own value system requires
If you take this route you cannot pick and choose which ones to give your kids. You must stop all vaccination and write a statement explaining that you have done so.

If you have received the other 18 or so vaccinations required by NJ, why do you have a problem with this one?

If you believe in the right for a NJ parent to choose whether or not to vaccinate, call your legislature and ask them to vote yes on A2450 when it comes up for a vote.

http://njvaccinationchoice.org/why-are-we/
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:34 PM   #267
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If you take this route you cannot pick and choose which ones to give your kids. You must stop all vaccination and write a statement explaining that you have done so.

If you have received the other 18 or so vaccinations required by NJ, why do you have a problem with this one?

If you believe in the right for a NJ parent to choose whether or not to vaccinate, call your legislature and ask them to vote yes on A2450 when it comes up for a vote.

http://njvaccinationchoice.org/why-are-we/
Well, in my religion it states (condensed version of course) that dh and I as parents are to make the decisions regarding our children's well being. So yes, we could get 18 other vaccines and decide this one is not happening. That is our religious right.
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:53 PM   #268
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Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post
A car accident is traumatic. Should we keep kids out of cars to protect them from being in one?

Is it just me or when someone says "we don't get the flu shot" others try to convince them they need it. But if someone says "we get the flu shot" no one says "you shouldn't".

I'm 42 years old, never had the shot, never gotten the flu. No one in my family got the flu. I'm simply not convinced the shot lives up to the hype. My choice. You want the shot? Go for it.
Do you put your kids in a car seat?
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Old 12-09-2012, 01:20 PM   #269
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Well, in my religion it states (condensed version of course) that dh and I as parents are to make the decisions regarding our children's well being. So yes, we could get 18 other vaccines and decide this one is not happening. That is our religious right.
That's not comparable to your religion prohibiting medicine or medical intervention.
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Old 12-09-2012, 01:49 PM   #270
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That's not comparable to your religion prohibiting medicine or medical intervention.
Nope but both are valid reasons for getting a waiver.
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