Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Trip Planning Forums > disABILITIES!
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS UpdatesDIS email updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read





Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 01-07-2013, 08:34 AM   #1
jcf
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 763

Abuse of Scooters

One thing that stood out on our trip the week after Christmas was the large number of scooters being used by pre-teens/teens. Even my 11 year old noticed that while some of these kids could be considered overweight, on one bus ride the kids from a family were arguing over whose turn it was to ride it. It was comical that the father of this group was on his own scooter too. It took 15 minutes for them to park their scooters on the bus.

I only bring this up because after several bus pick-ups, the delays by the excessive use of scooters by people with questionable needs started to wear on us...further what happens when Disney runs out of these and people in real need are left out in the cold...

Last edited by jcf; 01-07-2013 at 08:39 AM. Reason: sc
jcf is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 08:40 AM   #2
missy2217
Mouseketeer
 
missy2217's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Orange County, New York
Posts: 444

Annoying, yes. But how can you expect Disney to start questioning disabilities?
missy2217 is offline  
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 01-07-2013, 08:59 AM   #3
jcf
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 763

Medical Note from Dr

I would think Disney could simply require a note from a doctor stating the scooter is medically necessary...I can't imagine a doctor giving an overweight pre-teen/teen a note to ride one of these when walking would serve some of these kids better...
jcf is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 09:27 AM   #4
OrangeCountyCommuter
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 4,738

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcf View Post
One thing that stood out on our trip the week after Christmas was the large number of scooters being used by pre-teens/teens. Even my 11 year old noticed that while some of these kids could be considered overweight, on one bus ride the kids from a family were arguing over whose turn it was to ride it. It was comical that the father of this group was on his own scooter too. It took 15 minutes for them to park their scooters on the bus.

I only bring this up because after several bus pick-ups, the delays by the excessive use of scooters by people with questionable needs started to wear on us...further what happens when Disney runs out of these and people in real need are left out in the cold...
I am continually amazed at the ablity of people to make medical diagnosis by "observation"

You know it's abuse because you can see nothing wrong??? Hmm....
OrangeCountyCommuter is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 09:57 AM   #5
mditkof
Earning My Ears
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 27

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcf
One thing that stood out on our trip the week after Christmas was the large number of scooters being used by pre-teens/teens. Even my 11 year old noticed that while some of these kids could be considered overweight, on one bus ride the kids from a family were arguing over whose turn it was to ride it. It was comical that the father of this group was on his own scooter too. It took 15 minutes for them to park their scooters on the bus.

I only bring this up because after several bus pick-ups, the delays by the excessive use of scooters by people with questionable needs started to wear on us...further what happens when Disney runs out of these and people in real need are left out in the cold...
Disney likely makes a lot of money off the scooter industry. I wouldn't be surprised if they track it as a profit center.

Marty
mditkof is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 10:06 AM   #6
CarolAnnC
Caught Smuggling Jello Shot Syringes From PI
Likes to shoot off her glock in chat
Goin' to the Chapel
 
CarolAnnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 13,532

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcf View Post
One thing that stood out on our trip the week after Christmas was the large number of scooters being used by pre-teens/teens. Even my 11 year old noticed that while some of these kids could be considered overweight, on one bus ride the kids from a family were arguing over whose turn it was to ride it. It was comical that the father of this group was on his own scooter too. It took 15 minutes for them to park their scooters on the bus.

I only bring this up because after several bus pick-ups, the delays by the excessive use of scooters by people with questionable needs started to wear on us...further what happens when Disney runs out of these and people in real need are left out in the cold...
I have to say that with my 40+ trips to WDW I have never seen large numbers of preteens on scooters. Particularly since it is far more often the case to have to wait longer for a bus when using a scooter or wheelchair, I do not see what advantage would be gained.

Most saavy folks are now using off site ECV rental companies since they are cheaper and resolve the issue of not having one available.

You might want to visit the DISabilities board where the topic is covered frequently.
__________________
CarolAnnC is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 10:14 AM   #7
Chuck S
DVC Boards Co-Moderator
 
Chuck S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Seguin, Texas USA
Posts: 25,860
DISboards Moderator

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcf View Post
I would think Disney could simply require a note from a doctor stating the scooter is medically necessary...I can't imagine a doctor giving an overweight pre-teen/teen a note to ride one of these when walking would serve some of these kids better...
This would be illegal under the Americans with Disabilities Act and privacy laws. Businesses are not allowed to require any "proof," nor can they ask the specific nature of the disabilty. While I agree that the majority of people that NEED a scooter or wheelchair would likely have no problem if the law were to be changed to require a doctor's note simply stating they need to use a mobility device, any other info would be an invasion of privacy. I mean, really, is it Disney's (or anyone's) business to know if someone has cancer, heart problems, bad hips, arthritis, HIV, or other conditions that require mobility aids?

All, basically, they can ask is "Are you disabled?" and of course, those that do abuse the system will be honest, no doubt.

As this is not a DVC Specific topic, I'm going to move this over to the disABILITIES! forum.
__________________

DVC Member at OKW since 1992
Chuck S is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 10:14 AM   #8
HippieChickadee
Mouseketeer
 
HippieChickadee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 386

I'm torn on this.

My father (only 61 years old) broke his foot this past summer. Since he's had the cast off (came off in September) he's been having pain after periods of activity.

He went back to the docs who did some testing and diagnosed him with degenerative arthritis in the foot.

He would need a scooter for several long days at a theme park even though he could park and walk onto rides, into restaurants, etc. (so people would see this and sigh)

However, my last trip to Disney, I was swearing to myself about almost being mowed down by numerous oblivious scooter riders and the many many long waits for buses to load the scooters.
HippieChickadee is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 10:26 AM   #9
jcf
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 763

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeCountyCommuter View Post
I am continually amazed at the ablity of people to make medical diagnosis by "observation"

You know it's abuse because you can see nothing wrong??? Hmm....

I don't need a medical license to see pre-teens/teens who get off the scooter to let their sibling ride to know their "need" is debatable...I am not taking about older adults.
jcf is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:00 AM   #10
clanmcculloch
DIS Veteran
 
clanmcculloch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 5,569

The contracts with the rental companies state that they'll only be used by individuals 18 or older. This practice, if discovered by the company, would result in the loss of the prepaid cost of the rental as well as loss of the rental.

There are legitimate reasons for kids to need mobility aids part time. If a family has 2 children that both need part time mobility aids, it actually makes sense to rent a single wheelchair (assuming the kids are both similar sized and would need the same size chair) rather than deal with the hassle (and it is a hassle) of multiple wheelchairs. I'm hoping that my 12yo can continue to tour WDW without a mobility device for years to come and I'm agressively working with her doctors to keep up her strength and keep down her pain but just because she's young and looks healthy (there are no obvious visible signs of her health issues) you would assume that she's faking? I thank G-d that right now my 14yo isn't showing signs of needing aid with her medical issues. But, if she does end up needing aids (hopefully we can avoid any dislocations) then we'll do what's best for her. Hopefully we won't encounter people who would assume that they're faking based on age and outward appearance of health.

Disney isn't making an extra dime off the people you saw. If they were bringing the ECVs on the bus then they were rented from a 3rd party and not Disney.

You seem to believe a lot of your own mis-information. Try not to judge what you don't understand.
__________________
Me DH DD(16) DD(14) DSD(32) DSSil (41) DGD (newborn) DSD(30) DGS(4)




Multi-Allergy & Autism Dining Reviews: February 2014 * DL & LA July 2013 * February 2013 * August 2012 * February 2012 * August 2011 * August 2010


February 2014 AKL: me, DH, DD15, DD13 * July 2013 DL offsite (Tropicana): me, DH, DD15, DD12, DSD30, DSSil * February 2013 WDW Poly: me, DH, DD14, DD12
August 2012 WDW FW Cabin & AoA Nemo: me, DH, DD14, DD12, DD12's BFF11 * February 2012 WDW Poly CL: me, DH, DD14, DD11 * August 2011 WDW YC: me, DH, DD13, DD11
February 2011 WDW Poly CL: me, DH, DD13, DD10, DSD28, DSSil * August 2010 WDW POFQ & Poly CL: me, DH, DD12, DD10 * June 2010 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD12, DD9
December 2009 WDW POFQ: me, DH, DD11, DD9 * February 2009 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD11, DD8 * August 2008 WDW SSR: me, DH, DSD25, DSD24, DD10, DD8
September 2007 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD9, DD7 * April 2002 DLR offsite: me, DH, DSD19, DSD17, DD4, DD1.5 * June 2000 DLR offsite: me(pregnant), DH, DSD17, DSD15, DD2
January 1994 WDW offsite: me, DH, DSD11, DSD9 * January 1992 WDW offsite: me, DH, DSD9, DSD7

Last edited by clanmcculloch; 01-07-2013 at 11:16 AM.
clanmcculloch is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:01 AM   #11
lanejudy
Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 4,760
DISboards Moderator

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcf View Post
One thing that stood out on our trip the week after Christmas was the large number of scooters being used by pre-teens/teens. Even my 11 year old noticed that while some of these kids could be considered overweight, on one bus ride the kids from a family were arguing over whose turn it was to ride it. It was comical that the father of this group was on his own scooter too. It took 15 minutes for them to park their scooters on the bus.

I only bring this up because after several bus pick-ups, the delays by the excessive use of scooters by people with questionable needs started to wear on us...further what happens when Disney runs out of these and people in real need are left out in the cold...
I'm not going to judge your experience, as I wasn't there to see what you saw. However, I will point out some inaccuracies or misconceptions: As for pre-teens and teens - neither WDW nor off-site vendors will rent to a teenage user (with very few exceptions for those who use one at home). Therefore, there must have been an adult in the party - other than the dad on his scooter - who needed the ECV. Could be mom or grandpa or someone is the one who "needs" the scooter but didn't feel comfortable parking it on the bus so the kids took turns doing so. A person using an ECV is not required to sit on it at all times and may be found walking while another member of the party drives - that doesn't excuse underage drivers, though.

If they are taking the ECVs on the bus, then it's on off-site rental. WDW rentals are not allowed to leave the parks. Yes, WDW does run out of ECVs, which is partially why many who need one will rent from off-site.

While you may consider it to be "questionable need" to see a younger, healthy-looking person on an ECV, it is not only elderly people who need mobility devices. Perfectly healthy "appearing" people in their 20s or 30s may need assistance due to an invisible health issue and you have no way of knowing this. The ADA does not allow WDW or anyone else to require medical proof of disability for an equal accommodation.
lanejudy is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:10 AM   #12
jcf
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 763

Quote:
Originally Posted by clanmcculloch View Post
The contracts with the rental companies state that they'll only be used by individuals 18 or older. This practice, if discovered by the company, would result in the loss of the prepaid cost of the rental as well as loss of the rental.

There are legitimate reasons for kids to need mobility aids part time. If a family has 3 children that both need part time mobility aids, it actually makes sense to rent a single wheelchair (assuming the kids are both similar sized and would need the same size chair) rather than deal with the hassle (and it is a hassle) of multiple wheelchairs. I'm hoping that my 12yo can continue to tour WDW without a mobility device for years to come and I'm agressively working with her doctors to keep up her strength and keep down her pain but just because she's young and looks healthy (there are no obvious visible signs of her health issues) you would assume that she's faking? I thank G-d that right now my 14yo isn't showing signs of needing aid with her medical issues. But, if she does end up needing aids (hopefully we can avoid any dislocations) then we'll do what's best for her. Hopefully we won't encounter people who would assume that they're faking based on age and outward appearance of health.

Disney isn't making an extra dime off the people you saw. If they were bringing the ECVs on the bus then they were rented from a 3rd party and not Disney.

You seem to believe a lot of your own mis-information. Try not to judge what you don't understand.

Draw your conclusion of kids arguing over "whose turn it is to ride"...genius
jcf is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:15 AM   #13
clanmcculloch
DIS Veteran
 
clanmcculloch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 5,569

I'd like to add one thing about the need for ECVs. If I was ever able to convince my parents to join us at WDW, my mom would need an ECV. The thing is, she can't stay seated all day due to the nature of her back issues so she's have to alternate between riding the ECV and walking. When walking, my DH and I would alternate who would drive it for her because frankly it's not something either of us would want to do all that often (yay, riding faceing everybody's butts with people cutting us off and us having to focus on everybody walking near us rather than looking around; sure sounds fun to me). So, you could hear us discussing who "gets" to ride it next. I will add though that I would never let my kids drive because as I said before, that's in violation of the contract I would have to sign in order to rent it for her.

I'm not doubting that people rent then when not needed or that people violate their contracts. I'm just saying that you can't tell what's going on and the majority of cases there is nothing being done that's sneaky or wrong.
__________________
Me DH DD(16) DD(14) DSD(32) DSSil (41) DGD (newborn) DSD(30) DGS(4)




Multi-Allergy & Autism Dining Reviews: February 2014 * DL & LA July 2013 * February 2013 * August 2012 * February 2012 * August 2011 * August 2010


February 2014 AKL: me, DH, DD15, DD13 * July 2013 DL offsite (Tropicana): me, DH, DD15, DD12, DSD30, DSSil * February 2013 WDW Poly: me, DH, DD14, DD12
August 2012 WDW FW Cabin & AoA Nemo: me, DH, DD14, DD12, DD12's BFF11 * February 2012 WDW Poly CL: me, DH, DD14, DD11 * August 2011 WDW YC: me, DH, DD13, DD11
February 2011 WDW Poly CL: me, DH, DD13, DD10, DSD28, DSSil * August 2010 WDW POFQ & Poly CL: me, DH, DD12, DD10 * June 2010 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD12, DD9
December 2009 WDW POFQ: me, DH, DD11, DD9 * February 2009 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD11, DD8 * August 2008 WDW SSR: me, DH, DSD25, DSD24, DD10, DD8
September 2007 WDW Pop: me, DH, DD9, DD7 * April 2002 DLR offsite: me, DH, DSD19, DSD17, DD4, DD1.5 * June 2000 DLR offsite: me(pregnant), DH, DSD17, DSD15, DD2
January 1994 WDW offsite: me, DH, DSD11, DSD9 * January 1992 WDW offsite: me, DH, DSD9, DSD7
clanmcculloch is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:23 AM   #14
lost*in*cyberspace
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Washington, DC area
Posts: 8,151

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeCountyCommuter View Post
I am continually amazed at the ablity of people to make medical diagnosis by "observation"

You know it's abuse because you can see nothing wrong??? Hmm....
+1

Many people spend too much time worrying about what other people are doing. Why someone is using a scooter is no one else's business.
lost*in*cyberspace is offline  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:56 AM   #15
HippieChickadee
Mouseketeer
 
HippieChickadee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 386

Can we all at least agree that people should have to pass some sort of mini driving test before being released into the parks?

I kid, I kid...

but seriously, I've almost lost ankles to these things during busy seasons because the person driving is oblivious or the don't stop instantly and they wait until they are on TOP of you to let go!
HippieChickadee is offline  
Closed Thread



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:58 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.