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Old 10-21-2012, 03:03 AM   #1
PaulaSB12
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What is your take on this story?

The daily mail is not exactly the most newsworthy paper. In fact any story I read I usually check with other sources but I have never seen an article written by a "journalist" that has shocked or disgusted me as much as this woman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTIWWupaaZE
I have a very good friend, whom I will call Chris. We have been close since our teens. I trust Chris absolutely, as one of the most truthful people I know. So I know for a certainty that everything Chris has told me is true.
Chris and I have another friend whom I’ll call Peter. We knew Peter independently: we are part of the same circle of friends.
Before I knew either of them, Peter acted in many ways like a father to Chris – whose own father was often absent. I always suspected the relationship was controlling. Peter objected strongly to Chris’s marriage, though it was to someone with whom Chris is still very happy.
Peter was so angry about their relationship continuing after he had forbidden it that for some years he broke off all contact.
In the light of subsequent events, I suspect Peter never intended Chris to marry. There was a sense in which he had ‘groomed’ Chris to stay single.
Long ago, Chris told me that there had also been sexual abuse. It wasn’t described as such – the account was matter-of-fact, almost as if there was nothing wrong – but that is certainly what it was. It was conducted as a discipline: if Chris did or didn’t behave in a certain way, there would be sexual acts required to be performed.
Chris was a minor; Peter many years older. He was then, and to some extent still is, in a position of authority over other teenagers. I don’t suppose for a moment that Chris was his only victim.
Peter’s conduct is ironic, given that he publicly disapproves of both sex outside marriage and homosexual civil partnerships.
Why on earth didn’t I urge my friend to go to the police? The really shocking thing is, it simply never occurred to me. And, to be more honest than I am at all comfortable with, it is still almost unthinkable. I come back to the question again. Why?

Wall of silence: Savile's abuse was apparently an open secret, so why did no one act on warnings or report his abuse, thus preventing more vulnerable children becoming victims? (Posed by model)
The first and only decent reason is because of my love for my friend. It never occurred to Chris to report the incidents. I was not told about them with this purpose in mind. So it would be an extreme violation of friendship and confidence to do so on my own initiative, and I will never do this without Chris’s permission.
But this still begs the question, why has Chris not done so? And what are the other reasons that prevented me from even thinking of it? Because of who Peter is. He is a member of a very highly regarded profession. Many people look up to him, and would acknowledge the benefit they derive from his work. To expose him would be devastating to an entire community.
I know, I know; this is no reason at all. I am not attempting to excuse myself, but merely explain. When Peter dies I have little doubt there will be a thousand mourners at his memorial, giving tribute to his beneficial influence. And what he has done for young people as well as for adults. Just like Jimmy Savile.
So what? These were criminal acts. Surely there is nothing for me to be afraid of? Oh, but there is. Many would perhaps question my motives, if I said anything; still more, my veracity. I can picture it now: friends I’ve known for decades saying to me: ‘It can’t have been you, surely, who spread this wicked story? What were you thinking?’
Of course, social disapproval pales into insignificance compared with what Peter has done. He has perpetrated considerable harm. I know other victims of his – though I cannot be sure of any other criminal activity.
One friend walked away from a man she was very much in love with, who was very much in love with her: I heard various explanations for the split, from mutual friends.
A year or two ago I asked her myself, and heard the true reason: ‘There were three people in our relationship.’ The third was Peter. Her boyfriend was so under his control she decided she couldn’t compete. He has only recently got engaged, in middle age, over two decades later.
Another friend was also under Peter’s influence as a teenager, at the same time as Chris. He was later dismissed from his job for an inappropriate sexual relationship with a school pupil.

Held in high regard: The alleged abuser, whose identity is protected, is in a position of authority and a member of a highly regarded profession. (Posed by model)
Is there a connection? Our eldest daughter, in her 20s – who knows the full story – certainly considers it possible. She believes Peter should be behind bars. A few months ago, she asked me if I thought he was still a risk to young people.
‘I don’t know,’ I said honestly, after much consideration. ‘I don’t think so. But how can you ever be sure?’ How indeed. And is it the point, anyway?
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Old 10-21-2012, 03:30 AM   #2
PrinceCharming28
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I don't agree with people being "behind bars". I think there should be a kind of "rehab" center for people with doctors to help them fix the problems in their mind that might be causing them to do certain things such as touch children. Even if it cant change the things they are sexually attracted to, it can teach them and train them not to act on those feelings.

This may remind you of a mental institute, but it isnt the same thing. A mental institute may treat their patients like prisoners who are stupid. I believe love and kindness is how to get to a person's heart and let them speak their mind openly.

If a student gets things wrong in school, they get extra help by their authorities to help them learn better. The government should do this with criminals too. If they mess up and break the law, get them HELP instead of punishing them. If a car isnt working; beating it and locking it in your garage wont help it work again, only fixing the problem will.

As for telling the police, I think you should do it anonymously because the worst thing that can happen to a child is to get their virginity forced away as a child. Or even being sexually abused. Both are horrible for the victim. Dont let this continue to happen. HELP THESE KIDS!
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Old 10-21-2012, 04:06 AM   #3
cornflake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulaSB12 View Post
The daily mail is not exactly the most newsworthy paper. In fact any story I read I usually check with other sources but I have never seen an article written by a "journalist" that has shocked or disgusted me as much as this woman

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTIWWupaaZE
I have a very good friend, whom I will call Chris. We have been close since our teens. I trust Chris absolutely, as one of the most truthful people I know. So I know for a certainty that everything Chris has told me is true.
Chris and I have another friend whom I’ll call Peter. We knew Peter independently: we are part of the same circle of friends.
Before I knew either of them, Peter acted in many ways like a father to Chris – whose own father was often absent. I always suspected the relationship was controlling. Peter objected strongly to Chris’s marriage, though it was to someone with whom Chris is still very happy.
Peter was so angry about their relationship continuing after he had forbidden it that for some years he broke off all contact.
In the light of subsequent events, I suspect Peter never intended Chris to marry. There was a sense in which he had ‘groomed’ Chris to stay single.
Long ago, Chris told me that there had also been sexual abuse. It wasn’t described as such – the account was matter-of-fact, almost as if there was nothing wrong – but that is certainly what it was. It was conducted as a discipline: if Chris did or didn’t behave in a certain way, there would be sexual acts required to be performed.
Chris was a minor; Peter many years older. He was then, and to some extent still is, in a position of authority over other teenagers. I don’t suppose for a moment that Chris was his only victim.
Peter’s conduct is ironic, given that he publicly disapproves of both sex outside marriage and homosexual civil partnerships.
Why on earth didn’t I urge my friend to go to the police? The really shocking thing is, it simply never occurred to me. And, to be more honest than I am at all comfortable with, it is still almost unthinkable. I come back to the question again. Why?

Wall of silence: Savile's abuse was apparently an open secret, so why did no one act on warnings or report his abuse, thus preventing more vulnerable children becoming victims? (Posed by model)
The first and only decent reason is because of my love for my friend. It never occurred to Chris to report the incidents. I was not told about them with this purpose in mind. So it would be an extreme violation of friendship and confidence to do so on my own initiative, and I will never do this without Chris’s permission.
But this still begs the question, why has Chris not done so? And what are the other reasons that prevented me from even thinking of it? Because of who Peter is. He is a member of a very highly regarded profession. Many people look up to him, and would acknowledge the benefit they derive from his work. To expose him would be devastating to an entire community.
I know, I know; this is no reason at all. I am not attempting to excuse myself, but merely explain. When Peter dies I have little doubt there will be a thousand mourners at his memorial, giving tribute to his beneficial influence. And what he has done for young people as well as for adults. Just like Jimmy Savile.
So what? These were criminal acts. Surely there is nothing for me to be afraid of? Oh, but there is. Many would perhaps question my motives, if I said anything; still more, my veracity. I can picture it now: friends I’ve known for decades saying to me: ‘It can’t have been you, surely, who spread this wicked story? What were you thinking?’
Of course, social disapproval pales into insignificance compared with what Peter has done. He has perpetrated considerable harm. I know other victims of his – though I cannot be sure of any other criminal activity.
One friend walked away from a man she was very much in love with, who was very much in love with her: I heard various explanations for the split, from mutual friends.
A year or two ago I asked her myself, and heard the true reason: ‘There were three people in our relationship.’ The third was Peter. Her boyfriend was so under his control she decided she couldn’t compete. He has only recently got engaged, in middle age, over two decades later.
Another friend was also under Peter’s influence as a teenager, at the same time as Chris. He was later dismissed from his job for an inappropriate sexual relationship with a school pupil.

Held in high regard: The alleged abuser, whose identity is protected, is in a position of authority and a member of a highly regarded profession. (Posed by model)
Is there a connection? Our eldest daughter, in her 20s – who knows the full story – certainly considers it possible. She believes Peter should be behind bars. A few months ago, she asked me if I thought he was still a risk to young people.
‘I don’t know,’ I said honestly, after much consideration. ‘I don’t think so. But how can you ever be sure?’ How indeed. And is it the point, anyway?
As it's the DM, the point is, of course, to shock.

The story itself, I find so vague as to be rather meaningless.

Don't get me wrong - she could be talking about a sexual predator who should be stopped/brought to justice/etc.

However, given she gives no details besides "minor" and "many years older," she could be talking about a consensual, though apparently lopsided and/or controlling relationship between like, a 17-year-old and a 23-year-old, you know?

I also don't discount that teens can certainly be sexually abused. It's just not clear to me - or, I think to her, what exactly went on. She says "Chris" never thought of what went on as abuse, and told her about what went on 'matter of factly.' Again, could certainly be that Chris was abused. Seems though, it could also be that he wasn't.

I further don't get the thing about she ponders going to the police. They'd do pretty much nothing if she did - someone reporting what they think might be abuse that took place years or decades ago that the possible victims have no interest in reporting as a crime?

There's not near enough info to make any sort of conclusion there I don't think.
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:45 AM   #4
Tinijocaro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrinceCharming28
I don't agree with people being "behind bars". I think there should be a kind of "rehab" center for people with doctors to help them fix the problems in their mind that might be causing them to do certain things such as touch children. Even if it cant change the things they are sexually attracted to, it can teach them and train them not to act on those feelings.


If a student gets things wrong in school, they get away as a child. Or even being sexually abused. Both are horrible for the victim. Dont let this continue to happen. HELP THESE KIDS!
It has been proven again and again that sexual abusers (of children) cannot be taught not to act on their urges. They cannot be rehabilitated and belong behind bars. These are the most innocent and vulnerable members of society and any person who dares to take advantage of that does not deserve a second chance. That child's life is changed forever.
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Old 10-21-2012, 09:23 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinijocaro View Post
It has been proven again and again that sexual abusers (of children) cannot be taught not to act on their urges. They cannot be rehabilitated and belong behind bars. These are the most innocent and vulnerable members of society and any person who dares to take advantage of that does not deserve a second chance. That child's life is changed forever.
Exactly. Rehab is the place to put active addicts and alcoholics--the success rate is decent, but not pedophiles. Not saying there shouldn't be any programs in prison to work with these individuals, but prison is where they belong.
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Old 10-21-2012, 10:18 AM   #6
The Mystery Machine
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So, I am guessing that the writer is about my age since she has a dd in her 20's.

I would say that back then it would not have occurred to her to "tell someone". Molesting children and beating up girlfriends and wives were common place and swept under the rug.

Even today, boys & girls that are molested keep that a secret and do not want to "go to someone".

I do not know what it is going to take to stop the abuse of children even today. We try, but unfortunately children are easy prey and will always be easy prey.

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Old 10-21-2012, 12:26 PM   #7
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So, I am guessing that the writer is about my age since she has a dd in her 20's.

I would say that back then it would not have occurred to her to "tell someone". Molesting children and beating up girlfriends and wives were common place and swept under the rug.

Even today, boys & girls that are molested keep that a secret and do not want to "go to someone".

I do not know what it is going to take to stop the abuse of children even today. We try, but unfortunately children are easy prey and will always be easy prey.

Boy, I'd really like to think that you are wrong. Growing up in the 70's, I knew several kids who were molested. My best friend was molested by her step-father. She told both me and another friend. We both told our moms. My mom completely discounted it- just didn't believe her at all, to the point of allowing me to continue to visit the house and spend the night.

The other mom apparently believed it was true and even spoke to the friend, "If there is anything I can do..." Which I think was even worse!

My cousin (my mother's side)was molested by her step-brother. We didn't know anything about that until she was an adult.

My brother was molested by an uncle (father's side) and we didn't know about it until he was an adult, but we found out at that time that some family members had known and hadn't said anything.

So, in two of the three cases, adults did have the choice to intervene and chose not to. I'd hate to think that continues today.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:08 AM   #8
cornflake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinijocaro View Post
It has been proven again and again that sexual abusers (of children) cannot be taught not to act on their urges. They cannot be rehabilitated and belong behind bars. These are the most innocent and vulnerable members of society and any person who dares to take advantage of that does not deserve a second chance. That child's life is changed forever.
That's really not the case.

There are several different types and classes of child molesters - some are very unlikely to reoffend, some are very likely to reoffend.

Most of those not on the very extreme end can, in the right facility, end up with a fairly low recidivism rate.

These facilities, however, are NOT rehabs. People who commit these crimes need to go to prison, for they're criminals in need of punishment. The vast majority will, at some point, be released though, so it benefits society as a whole to find ways to minimize the danger some may cause.

There are prisons that are dedicated facilities, that have very strict rules for admission and continued presence, that also have very good results working with these offenders to stop them from reoffending.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:45 AM   #9
PaulaSB12
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When I was at junior school one of the girls disappeared. I found out years later that her mother had gone into hospital her father decided she could (at six) take over the role of her mother including sex he ended up in prison because someone in authority told and that was years ago. this man she claims is still in a position to abuse kids and probably is.
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Old 10-22-2012, 01:01 AM   #10
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Most molesters can be stopped only by death or physical sterilization. They cannot be cured. There is always a risk of recidivism. Chemical castration cannot be counted upon to work because the offender has the responsibility to go for treatment. They can decide not to go.
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