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Old 09-27-2012, 12:16 PM   #31
snykymom
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Originally Posted by Social Worker Sue View Post
The program was developed to make money. That is not a crime. But, for $4000-$5000 you can give your entire family a learning experience. It’s all about personal choices.
Actually, it wasn't. It was developed to challenge mathematically gifted children in ways that they weren't being challenged back in the 1970's - you know, the era of "New Math." (I worked on the program back then.) And, because it was developed by a psychology professor in a research university, it also gave psychologists and educators a way to study how, if at all, these kids were different than other kids and whether their needs were being met. (As noted, the program was subsequently broadened to deal with verbally gifted kids as well.)

Gifted kids have special needs, but are often overlooked in a time when "special needs" is defined differently. Unfortunately, due to those definitions, gifted kids don't qualify for state or federal funding. And it does cost money to meet those needs, particularly if they are housed, fed and nurtured on a college campus.

Yes, it is all about personal choices. But if you have never been frustrated with public schools that leave bright kids bored being mainstreamed into a class of varying abilities and interests, then it's hard to understand why a family might choose a program like this for their child, with reasons that have nothing to do with "bragging rights."
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Old 09-27-2012, 02:11 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by snykymom View Post
Actually, it wasn't. It was developed to challenge mathematically gifted children in ways that they weren't being challenged back in the 1970's - you know, the era of "New Math." (I worked on the program back then.) And, because it was developed by a psychology professor in a research university, it also gave psychologists and educators a way to study how, if at all, these kids were different than other kids and whether their needs were being met. (As noted, the program was subsequently broadened to deal with verbally gifted kids as well.)

Gifted kids have special needs, but are often overlooked in a time when "special needs" is defined differently. Unfortunately, due to those definitions, gifted kids don't qualify for state or federal funding. And it does cost money to meet those needs, particularly if they are housed, fed and nurtured on a college campus.

Yes, it is all about personal choices. But if you have never been frustrated with public schools that leave bright kids bored being mainstreamed into a class of varying abilities and interests, then it's hard to understand why a family might choose a program like this for their child, with reasons that have nothing to do with "bragging rights."
Well said!! It seems like any thread mentioning gifted kids always ends up going into "bragging rights". I don't see these kinds of tests or experiences as any different than kids getting batting coaches or joining travel teams for athletics. Why is it so bad to help a kid develop academically or provide enrichment experiences if that's their thing?

It was interesting that in my elementary education and special education classes for my recent MEd, less than 1 class period was spent even mentioning high ability learners. While I know kids with special needs on the opposite end of the spectrum have greater obstacles to overcome, I don't think it's necessarily right to assume the gifted kids will just be ok with a little extra work, as some schools seem to think.
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Old 09-27-2012, 02:32 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by StephMK View Post
Why is it so bad to help a kid develop academically or provide enrichment experiences if that's their thing?
The "bad" part is charging $4000-$5000 to do so.
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Old 09-27-2012, 02:36 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Social Worker Sue View Post
The "bad" part is charging $4000-$5000 to do so.
But you must realize that it does cost money to offer these sort of highly academic camp-style courses, right? They usually entail several instructors, room and board, expensive material (especially if it's an engineering or science course), and of course, the school that offers it probably would like to make some money.
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Old 09-27-2012, 03:59 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Social Worker Sue View Post
The "bad" part is charging $4000-$5000 to do so.
Actually, it's not that "bad" when compared to other sleep away summer camps.
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:03 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Oh, Kay!

Actually, it's not that "bad" when compared to other sleep away summer camps.
Yeah, our kids' week at Y camp this summer was $800 each. And that's nothing compared to more exclusive summer camps.
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:10 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by aprilgail2 View Post
Last year about 100 kids in my daughters class got the letters from Johns Hopkins to take the SAT's in 7th grade- about 40 kids decided to do it, the rest didn't want to bother.
100 kids may have gotten letters based upon achievement scores, but that does not mean they actually qualified to take part in the program. They must first take the SAT's or ACT's and meet the requirements which are very vigorous (when my dd took the test in 8th grade I believe the SAT's score for verbal and math had to be around 580 each, a score many high school seniors don't even achieve).
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Old 09-27-2012, 04:10 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Social Worker Sue View Post
The "bad" part is charging $4000-$5000 to do so.
In your opinion. You came into this thread stating that the program originated just to make money and has always focused on trying to appeal to parents so they can have bragging rights, and you are completely wrong. I know this because I have a relative who used to teach in the program, and my son qualified last year for it. You really seem to have a chip on your shoulder. Maybe you do, and maybe you don't, but you come across as if you do.
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:24 AM   #39
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I just want to clarify that there are LOTS of programs under the CTY umbrella. As PPs have said, the summer programs are very expensive. Prohibitavly expensive for my parents, so I never went to any of the summer programs. I did, however, go to a few single day events that were great and not very expensive at all. One, in particular, was about space and aeronautics and is partly responsible for my current career.
So don't write off the whole experience even if the summer programs are out of reach for your family.
And taking the SATs through CTY doesn't cost any more than taking any other SATs, at least it didn't when I took them.
My DS signed up for CTY the year he was in 7th grade. He did take the SAT and we looked at it as a valuable learning experience. The summer programs sound awesome, but they are out of our budget and the ones he was interested in needed a (paying) adult chaperone. I do wish I would have taken advantage of some of the single day events. They always seemed to conflict with something else, like me working on weekends.

I know my son would love to take a space and aeronautics program. I should keep an eye out for the info.
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Old 09-28-2012, 04:34 AM   #40
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In your opinion. You came into this thread stating that the program originated just to make money and has always focused on trying to appeal to parents so they can have bragging rights, and you are completely wrong. I know this because I have a relative who used to teach in the program, and my son qualified last year for it. You really seem to have a chip on your shoulder. Maybe you do, and maybe you don't, but you come across as if you do.
Of course it is my opinion. You are offering yours and I am offering mine. That is what a discussion board is all about

I am so happy that your son qualified. That is awesome! Congratulations

I don't have a chip on my shoulder. I am just offering a differing opinion.

Last edited by Social Worker Sue; 09-28-2012 at 04:40 AM.
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Old 09-28-2012, 05:28 AM   #41
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The "bad" part is charging $4000-$5000 to do so.
What are they supposed to charge that wouldn't be "bad" exactly, for kids to go and stay and take classes designed for them, taught by professors, etc.?

Do you know what it costs to go to Johns Hopkins as a full-time undergraduate?

Tuition is $44,000 a year; room and board is an additional $13,000. Do you think people only go to JHU for "bragging rights" because it costs money? Is it "bad" that it costs $57,000 per year to attend?

Welcome to the world of higher education. The class experiences aren't just a random expensive trip, there are classes, access to the campus facilities, access to professors, etc. for that price.

It's not some scam. It's expensive because it's expensive. Everything that costs money isn't a gimmick - there are plenty of things where you get what you pay for. You can buy Humbolt Fog or you can buy some Kraft cheese-like product. You can make the bed with Porthault or some bed-in-a-bag. You can sip Perrier-Jouet or Korbel.

Sure, some cheaper things are great, some are better than their expensive counterparts and there's a mile of options in the middle. Just seeming to assume that expensive = bad and ripoff or scam and that people would only do something that costs what YOU consider to be a lot in order to brag about it is... bizarre, imo.
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Old 09-28-2012, 11:28 PM   #42
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Just wanted to update and let you know I completed his online application and am waiting to hear back from them about testing info.

Just taking the SAT's at this point will be a great experience for him. Don't know if he'll qualify but I'm glad he has the chance to try! Thanks again for the help!
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Old 09-29-2012, 04:29 AM   #43
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Just wanted to update and let you know I completed his online application and am waiting to hear back from them about testing info.

Just taking the SAT's at this point will be a great experience for him. Don't know if he'll qualify but I'm glad he has the chance to try! Thanks again for the help!
Last year we had our son do the SAT Online Course through collegeboard.com. It was really helpful in helping him prepare, since he knew what to expect.
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