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Old 11-06-2013, 10:54 AM   #1
Lurch
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Considering Purchase, Help Needed With Timing

Hello Everyone!

My wife and I visited Disney for the first time on rented points (BWV) this September and fell in love with the place. We are now seriously considering purchasing DVC. We are looking for BWV or Wilderness Lodge contracts of between 100-150 points; hoping to make at least one trip each year in September.

That said, I am not sure about timing the offer. Our annual bonuses come mid-March each year and this is how we are going to pay for the contract. We plan to vist again September 19-27 2014 split stay WL and BWV or just BWV. If we start the process in March, would we have enough time to secure a reservation in September? I know it is a slower period in the parks, but I don't want to presume. How fast is the best possible turn around on an offer before I would have to pay up? Perhaps I could lead the process by a few weeks.

We are justifying the purchase thinking we will be spending another nearly $2,000 on the points rental which is roughly 20% of the purchase price. Also the DVC AP discount comes into play.

All opinions are welcome; perhaps there is something I am not considering.
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Old 11-06-2013, 11:38 AM   #2
disneynutz


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Here are my thoughts.

Be prepared to spend thousands and thousands and thousands of Dollars at Disney, admission, food, DVC contract, and dues. Don't forget to include the cost of transportation.

Take the time to understand the DVC product, pricing, UY's, rules, restrictions, pluses and minuses.

If we did it over again, we would buy at SSR, used the points to stay at all of the resorts, then buy at our favorite resort(s).

IMO there isn't a slow time at Disney and they are spending big bucks to make sure that the entire year stays busy. You can't tell what's going to happen next year based on what happened last year. At one point there was only the MK, DVC contracts are for 30 - 50 years and a lot can change during that time.

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Old 11-06-2013, 11:41 AM   #3
com_op_2000
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Usually time for the contract back and forth, paperwork, ROFR, closing, title paperwork, and getting your contract set-up 60 - 90 days. Check the ROFR thread for more details on what people are experiencing.
Sept at BWV is going to be iffy depending on the time of the month you want to go. Over Labor Day weekend is usually busy, then there is a null-period until the start of F&W then it is almost impossible to get more than 1-2 nights there until after the New Year. Busy times for DVC do not correspond to busy times in the parks.
One of the major DIS recommendations is "buy where you do not mind staying if that is all you can get". You will need the 11 month window for BWV during F&W time period.
Also, if you find the right contract go for it; just put in a contengency that you can not close until a certain date.
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Old 11-06-2013, 12:26 PM   #4
Nabas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Hello Everyone!

My wife and I visited Disney for the first time on rented points (BWV) this September and fell in love with the place. We are now seriously considering purchasing DVC. We are looking for BWV or Wilderness Lodge contracts of between 100-150 points; hoping to make at least one trip each year in September.

That said, I am not sure about timing the offer. Our annual bonuses come mid-March each year and this is how we are going to pay for the contract. We plan to vist again September 19-27 2014 split stay WL and BWV or just BWV. If we start the process in March, would we have enough time to secure a reservation in September? I know it is a slower period in the parks, but I don't want to presume. How fast is the best possible turn around on an offer before I would have to pay up? Perhaps I could lead the process by a few weeks.

We are justifying the purchase thinking we will be spending another nearly $2,000 on the points rental which is roughly 20% of the purchase price. Also the DVC AP discount comes into play.

All opinions are welcome; perhaps there is something I am not considering.
Some very rough numbers:
- 125 points at BWV or VWL @ $80/point: $10,000
- Closing costs: $400
- Annual Maintenance Fees (MF) per year: $725

Compare this to the $2000 you're paying to rent points and, roughly, you're saving $1250 per year. Ignoring inflation, lost opportunity (i.e. what you could be investindg that money in if it wasn't spent on DVC), etc. It's going to take at least 8-to-9 years to reach your break-even point.

If you had the cash in hand and were pretty sure you were going to be vacationing at WDW 8 years from now, then it probably would sense to go for it.

The thing is, DVC prices are up right now while your annual savings of renting DVC vs. purchasing DVC are relatively small.

The fact that you are talking about spending a bonus you don't have in hand raises a lot of red flags. I'm pretty sure I've seen several sitcoms on this very topic.

Perhaps it's not the advice you are seeking but if you are comfortable renting points, then don't be in a rush to purchase DVC.

Unless DVC prices suddenly plummet, my advice would be to bank your bonus, rent points for one more year, and see if you still feel as strongly after another stay.

If that bonus money is still sitting in the bank 12 months from now and you are still itching to own, then go for it.

Last edited by Nabas; 11-06-2013 at 12:31 PM.
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Old 11-06-2013, 12:46 PM   #5
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Unless you can close and then get into the DVC system by 7 months out before time you plan to go, you should assume you will have problems reserving any time of year. Yes, September is one of the lowest DVC demand times of the year but both VWL and BWV could be gone for Sep if you don't make a bid until mid-March, for which you should assume, even if the process goes smoothly, that you will not be in the system and able to make a reservation until late May or early June. Moreover, if you are thinking, well if I miss Sep, maybe I can try for October through Dec, then be aware that your chances will be slim to get a reservatiion at BWV or VWL if you try to reserve in June because that Oct to Dec period is the highest DVC demand time of the year, by far.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:27 PM   #6
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These are the averages that I noted:
Offer/acceptance can take a few hours to a couple of days

Contracts emailed to buyers and sellers to be signed and returned by 10 days, buyer to deposit $1000 (all this can be done via email)

Once signed documents returned by both parties the contract goes to ROFR, 30 day wait for Disney to act, can be a bit less

After Disney waives ROFR it takes 10-14 days to get closing documents from broker/title co. (in my case it didn't take that long I had the closing docs right after ROFR waiver via email.)

At this stage you must send the cashier's check for the remainder of the money. Once the money is there and both sellers and buyers have signed and returned the documents then it takes 10 - 14 days for the deed to be transferred and another 7-10 days to get the membership number/package.

In my case I made my offer 9/4/13, and just sent my cashier's check 10/30/13, and am now waiting for the sellers to get their act together so we can close. W/ better sellers I suspect it would go faster.
I knew I wanted to have the points 11 months before Jan. 2015, so gave myself lots of lead time.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:32 PM   #7
Lurch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabas View Post
The fact that you are talking about spending a bonus you don't have in hand raises a lot of red flags. I'm pretty sure I've seen several sitcoms on this very topic.

Perhaps it's not the advice you are seeking but if you are comfortable renting points, then don't be in a rush to purchase DVC.

Unless DVC prices suddenly plummet, my advice would be to bank your bonus, rent points for one more year, and see if you still feel as strongly after another stay.
Thanks for the solid advice. I am fairly careful with my money and could easily write a check today for the contract size we are looking for. My wife would say I am crazy, but I have the March bonus (we are both in sales and we get 9 between us each year) is designated for fun. Last year I bought a Harley. For me, my March bonus is already designated for fun, so it is not real money and I don't feel bad spending it on something that may not be fiscally responsible. The other 8 go to serious things like IRA, home improvements, replacement vehicles, and such so I understand the red flag comment, but I just refuse to ever go into debt so I have my crazy money system.

My calculations also show that renting is the safest bet and DVC ownership savings may be marginal, but my thoughts on purchasing are as follows:

1) Buy in inflation, point costs are going up!
2) Rental money could be applied to cost of ownership
3) Season pass discount
4) Most importantly (and again because I am OCD crazy) I can't control my reservation with a rental. Although my BWV rental could not have gone smoother (thanks David's), I hated not being able to set my own DME reservation nor easily change it when my flights changed (I added on a day at POR for the magic bands).

Still kicking the idea around, but we are thinking September in Disney for the forseable future.
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Old 11-06-2013, 01:36 PM   #8
Lurch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drusba View Post
Unless you can close and then get into the DVC system by 7 months out before time you plan to go, you should assume you will have problems reserving any time of year. Yes, September is one of the lowest DVC demand times of the year but both VWL and BWV could be gone for Sep if you don't make a bid until mid-March, for which you should assume, even if the process goes smoothly, that you will not be in the system and able to make a reservation until late May or early June. Moreover, if you are thinking, well if I miss Sep, maybe I can try for October through Dec, then be aware that your chances will be slim to get a reservatiion at BWV or VWL if you try to reserve in June because that Oct to Dec period is the highest DVC demand time of the year, by far.
Thanks. From yours and a couple of other posts it seem and I suspected that the timing would be too close for comfort. I'll book rental points again this year and pick up the right contract when it shows up.

I appreciate all the help, doing Disney calculations and planning is certainly more fun then the contracts I should be reviewing on my desk.
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Old 11-06-2013, 02:09 PM   #9
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Lurch- if you want a BWV standard room to save point costs, you should rent NOW for September 2014. These could be full well before the 7 month mark. And if you do decide to go ahead with the purchase, I'd suggest you start making offers in June 2014 so that you can have an account set up in time to book 2015, if fall trips are a recurring goal. Good luck!
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Old 11-06-2013, 03:01 PM   #10
Nabas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
My calculations also show that renting is the safest bet and DVC ownership savings may be marginal, but my thoughts on purchasing are as follows:

1) Buy in inflation, point costs are going up!
2) Rental money could be applied to cost of ownership
3) Season pass discount
4) Most importantly (and again because I am OCD crazy) I can't control my reservation with a rental. Although my BWV rental could not have gone smoother (thanks David's), I hated not being able to set my own DME reservation nor easily change it when my flights changed (I added on a day at POR for the magic bands).

Still kicking the idea around, but we are thinking September in Disney for the forseable future.
Thanks for the explanation. Nice to know you are not spending the rent money!

Good luck with your decision, I'm sure you'll make the right one!
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:25 PM   #11
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We also fell in love with September travel to Disney. We went there 8th through 15 this year and plan on going 21-28 next September. My wife and I are waiting for ROFR on a small SSR contract for 50 pts. We are paying 3500 for that contract and the MFs are 240 per year. 50 pt contract gets us 100pts every 2 years bank and borrowing and we plan on going every other year for 6 nights staying in studios and for the times we want to go 2 out of 3 years we plan to either use the one time use points (14/pt direct from disney) or get a transfer from another member 11-12 dollars per point esp. at those hard to book inside of 7 month window resorts.

Pt totals needed in sept (adventure season) for 6 nights standard view ranges from 63 BWV to 105 VGF and by being flex on where you stay you can try different resorts and can maximize your contract usage.

My point is if you really want to go in Sept and use rental money towards your purchase you could always purchase a smaller contract now, reserve your vacation on Feb 19th at 7 months and then add on more points as you see fit.
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Old 11-07-2013, 03:37 PM   #12
Lurch
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A Steelers fan in Jersey?!? Shocked, but right on from a Central PA Steelers but most definately not Penguins fan.

I like the way you think! I have been kicking around a small contract just to be consider a DVC "member" and recieve the extra benes. Then add on for a larger contract when the timing works better.
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Old 11-07-2013, 03:49 PM   #13
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I can't help myself. I love BWV and the Steelers. Just sayin'.
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Old 11-07-2013, 03:51 PM   #14
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And we started with a 50 point direct BWV contract and have been cherry picking small resale BWV contracts for more than a year. Starting small and paying it off before adding more is smart, in my opinion.
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Old 11-07-2013, 07:29 PM   #15
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If we did it over again, we would buy at SSR, used the points to stay at all of the resorts, then buy at our favorite resort(s).
Oh, I like that idea! Of course, almost 10 years into SSR, we are still in our "exploring" phase ... I guess it is good thing, too, as Treehouses, California and Hawaii (our favorites so far) were still many years from being announced when we first purchased.
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