Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Trip Planning Forums > Budget Board
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 09-15-2012, 10:59 AM   #61
luvsJack
DIS Veteran
 
luvsJack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: My own little corner of the world
Posts: 12,877

Quote:
Originally Posted by leahjade View Post
Here are more surprising facts about Americans defined as “poor” by the Census Bureau, all taken from various government reports and included in my new paper from The Heritage Foundation called “Understanding Poverty in the United States”:

● Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, in 1970, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.That would be a "need" here in the south

● Fully 92 percent of poor households have a microwave; two-thirds have at least one DVD player and 70 percent have a VCR. All of those cost less than $100 and can be bought at a really cheap end store for even less

● Nearly 75 percent have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks. In many places one vehicle would be a necessity

● Four out of five poor adults assert they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money for food.That would be GOOD thing. Do you think they should be going hungry?

● Nearly two-thirds have cable or satellite television. Ok, you got me there, that is a WANT, not a need

● Half have a personal computer; one in seven have two or more computers.

● More than half of poor families with children have a video game system such as Xbox or PlayStation.

● Just under half — 43 percent — have Internet access.

● A third have a widescreen plasma or LCD TV.

● One in every four has a digital video recorder such as TiVo.

As noted, TV newscasts about poverty in America usually picture the poor as homeless or as a destitute family living in an overcrowded, rundown trailer. The actual facts are far different:

● At a single point in time, only one in 70 poor persons is homeless.I think this is on the rise. We are seeing a lot more homeless people in our area

● The vast majority of the houses or apartments of the poor are in good repair; only 6 percent are over-crowded.

● The average poor American has more living space than the average non-poor individual living in Sweden, France, Germany or the United Kingdom.

● Only 10 percent of the poor live in mobile homes or trailers; half live in detached single-family houses or townhouses, while 40 percent live in apartments.

● Forty-two percent of all poor households own their home; on average, it’s a three-bedroom house with one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.
On the things I didn't comment above, does it say where those things came from?

The computers and video games FOR SOME (I realize many do spend their money where they shouldn't) are things bought for kids from things like the Angel Tree or other Christmas giving organizations. Also, we have students who are most definitely "poor" but buy lap tops with their FA money. Its something that is required for them to have.

Even the homes, there are more organizations out there that will build or help them purchase a house rather than a trailer.

I am not saying that every low income person that has those things has had some kind of help in getting them, just that those things have to be taken into consideration in these reports/studies

The poor in the US aren't "poor" when you look at the "poor" in other countries but still "poor" by US standards. So, do we really want to lower our standards? Would we prefer more homeless? More hungry?

I think there is way too much assistance out there. Too much given to those who do not need it, but I also am realistic enough to realize that there are many that do need it.

Yes, there are many that will take a IRS refund or FA refund and spend on things they WANT and not NEED. Maybe money managing classes should go with these checks? Or maybe not getting them in one large amount? But, for many these things are the way they buy the computers and the game systems and whatever else we see them spending unnecessary money on.

As for cell phones, do you realize how many smart phones that the cell companies are giving away for free? So, when someone isn't thinking ahead, they are getting a free phone and not having to pay anything out of pocket. The mindset is just that they will worry about the bill next month when it comes in.
__________________


10 pounds closer to Skinny Island!
luvsJack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 11:03 AM   #62
luvsJack
DIS Veteran
 
luvsJack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: My own little corner of the world
Posts: 12,877

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4HppyCamprs View Post
How it works is the double dipping into assistance programs. If a person qualifies for food stamps the qualify for all assistance so any cash they do receive is spent as the wish. Food stamps plus free breakfast and lunch at school is a example. Being assisted twice to feed your family. Them the people sell the excess food stamps for cash
Uh, no that is not how it works. DS and dil were on food stamps. That was the only assistance they qualified for. And "food stamps" are on a card, where ID can be asked for so selling excess food stamps isn't really as easy as it used to be.

You do realize that those kids getting free lunch used to be under school age--no free lunch or free breakfast before they enter school. They also are home on the same holidays/summer are your kids, so again no free lunch.

$400 a month for a family of 4 doesn't stretch that far.
__________________


10 pounds closer to Skinny Island!
luvsJack is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 09-15-2012, 12:11 PM   #63
SaraJayne
Stop moving those smilies!
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,075

Quote:
Originally Posted by leahjade View Post
Here are more surprising facts about Americans defined as “poor” by the Census Bureau, all taken from various government reports and included in my new paper from The Heritage Foundation called “Understanding Poverty in the United States”:

● Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, in 1970, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.

● Fully 92 percent of poor households have a microwave; two-thirds have at least one DVD player and 70 percent have a VCR.

● Nearly 75 percent have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks.

● Four out of five poor adults assert they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money for food.

● Nearly two-thirds have cable or satellite television.

● Half have a personal computer; one in seven have two or more computers.

● More than half of poor families with children have a video game system such as Xbox or PlayStation.

● Just under half — 43 percent — have Internet access.

● A third have a widescreen plasma or LCD TV.

● One in every four has a digital video recorder such as TiVo.

As noted, TV newscasts about poverty in America usually picture the poor as homeless or as a destitute family living in an overcrowded, rundown trailer. The actual facts are far different:

● At a single point in time, only one in 70 poor persons is homeless.

● The vast majority of the houses or apartments of the poor are in good repair; only 6 percent are over-crowded.

● The average poor American has more living space than the average non-poor individual living in Sweden, France, Germany or the United Kingdom.

● Only 10 percent of the poor live in mobile homes or trailers; half live in detached single-family houses or townhouses, while 40 percent live in apartments.

● Forty-two percent of all poor households own their home; on average, it’s a three-bedroom house with one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.
Yeah, that's pretty much all I had to read and I didn't bother with the rest.
SaraJayne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 01:36 PM   #64
dtr_angel
You're really cute, but I have no idea what you are saying
 
dtr_angel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: too far from Disney
Posts: 1,828

Does anyone know if you are required to have a data plan with iPhones with AT&T? With wifi DH and I don't use 3G at all and it could easily save us money, I thought it was required.

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards
__________________
June 1998 Offsite // June 2008 Pop Century // March 2009 Pop Century // August 2009 Wilderness Lodge // May 2011 Animal Kingdom Lodge CL // May 2013 Art of Animation Nemo Suite // May 2014 Windsor Hills // October 2014 All Star Sports // December 2014 Grand Floridian & Windsor Hills //
dtr_angel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 01:41 PM   #65
Colleen27
DIS Veteran
 
Colleen27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 16,802

Quote:
Originally Posted by leahjade View Post
Here are more surprising facts about Americans defined as “poor” by the Census Bureau, all taken from various government reports and included in my new paper from The Heritage Foundation called “Understanding Poverty in the United States”:

● Eighty percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, in 1970, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.

● Fully 92 percent of poor households have a microwave; two-thirds have at least one DVD player and 70 percent have a VCR.

● Nearly 75 percent have a car or truck; 31 percent have two or more cars or trucks.

● Four out of five poor adults assert they were never hungry at any time in the prior year due to lack of money for food.

● Nearly two-thirds have cable or satellite television.

● Half have a personal computer; one in seven have two or more computers.

● More than half of poor families with children have a video game system such as Xbox or PlayStation.

● Just under half — 43 percent — have Internet access.

● A third have a widescreen plasma or LCD TV.

● One in every four has a digital video recorder such as TiVo.

As noted, TV newscasts about poverty in America usually picture the poor as homeless or as a destitute family living in an overcrowded, rundown trailer. The actual facts are far different:

● At a single point in time, only one in 70 poor persons is homeless.

● The vast majority of the houses or apartments of the poor are in good repair; only 6 percent are over-crowded.

● The average poor American has more living space than the average non-poor individual living in Sweden, France, Germany or the United Kingdom.

● Only 10 percent of the poor live in mobile homes or trailers; half live in detached single-family houses or townhouses, while 40 percent live in apartments.

● Forty-two percent of all poor households own their home; on average, it’s a three-bedroom house with one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.
That's because contrary to popular belief, most of the poor in America are transitory poor - they were middle or working class, lost a job or experienced a divorce and fell into poverty, and most will once again move out of it within a fairly short time.

And you can't discount the effects of 1) gifts and 2) the falling costs of consumer goods. A DVD player costs $20 and has a resale value of exactly nothing; I ended up giving our extra one away (ironically, to a neighbor who is on assistance and didn't have one) after I couldn't even get $5 for it at our garage sale or on either of the two Facebook swap groups I participate in.

But really, anyone who looks to The Heritage Foundation for statistics obviously isn't interested in facts other than those that support their biases. It is rather tiresome that on a forum where we're not allowed to discuss politics, threads that are little more than a string of right wing talking points are A-OK.
__________________
~~**Colleen & Crew**~~
POR 10/05 ~ BC 08/07 ~ WL 01/08 ~ CBR 12/09 ~ POP 03/11 TR/ DR
POP 1/12 TR ~ ASSp 5/12 ~ CSR 3/13 ~ POP 4/13 ~ ASMu 12/13


Colleen27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 01:48 PM   #66
Colleen27
DIS Veteran
 
Colleen27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 16,802

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtr_angel View Post
Does anyone know if you are required to have a data plan with iPhones with AT&T? With wifi DH and I don't use 3G at all and it could easily save us money, I thought it was required.

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards
It is. That's one of the biggest reasons I haven't gotten one yet; I don't want to pay for data I don't need, nor do I want to be contractually obligated to a bill that would be one of the first I'd look to cut in the event of a job loss, medical emergency, or other major budget-changer. I'm going the unlocked iPhone/Straight Talk sim card route instead, but I'm waiting on the iPhone 5 release in hopes prices for the used 4S come down a bit.
__________________
~~**Colleen & Crew**~~
POR 10/05 ~ BC 08/07 ~ WL 01/08 ~ CBR 12/09 ~ POP 03/11 TR/ DR
POP 1/12 TR ~ ASSp 5/12 ~ CSR 3/13 ~ POP 4/13 ~ ASMu 12/13


Colleen27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 01:59 PM   #67
leahjade
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,091

Quote:
But really, anyone who looks to The Heritage Foundation for statistics obviously isn't interested in facts
Except the facts come from the US Census bureau. But you can just continue to believe that everyone who has gotten themselves into financial trouble is totally innocent of any overspending, foolish choices etc. That way it takes away any individual responsibility whatsoever, and the government can just continue to bail you out and take care of you from cradle to grave.
leahjade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:03 PM   #68
leahjade
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,091

Quote:
That was the only assistance they qualified for. And "food stamps" are on a card, where ID can be asked for so selling excess food stamps isn't really as easy as it used to be.
That's not the case any more in most states - each month, the cash is loaded onto electronic benefit transfer (EBT) cards -people can then use the cards either as debit cards at a point of sale or as direct withdrawal cards at any ATM for whatever they want to buy.
leahjade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:15 PM   #69
Colleen27
DIS Veteran
 
Colleen27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 16,802

Quote:
Originally Posted by leahjade View Post
Except the facts come from the US Census bureau. But you can just continue to believe that everyone who has gotten themselves into financial trouble is totally innocent of any overspending, foolish choices etc. That way it takes away any individual responsibility whatsoever, and the government can just continue to bail you out and take care of you from cradle to grave.
But only cherry picked facts, not the whole picture. And that's the point, right - to continue to ignore structural changes in our economy by continuing to put it down to personal responsibility, rather than facing the fact that decades of bought-and-paid-for government has gotten us an economy where workers are expected to shoulder an ever-increasing share of the load on less and less income (in real dollars).
__________________
~~**Colleen & Crew**~~
POR 10/05 ~ BC 08/07 ~ WL 01/08 ~ CBR 12/09 ~ POP 03/11 TR/ DR
POP 1/12 TR ~ ASSp 5/12 ~ CSR 3/13 ~ POP 4/13 ~ ASMu 12/13


Colleen27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:19 PM   #70
tajz90
Mama D
 
tajz90's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,434

I spend a lot on our phones and it is a want, but I make sure my needs are covered first.

I'm sure what is really wrong with America is that people can't decipher between a want and a need. Focus need and then once that's covered, enjoy your wants if you so choose.
tajz90 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:21 PM   #71
Colleen27
DIS Veteran
 
Colleen27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 16,802

Quote:
Originally Posted by leahjade View Post
That's not the case any more in most states - each month, the cash is loaded onto electronic benefit transfer (EBT) cards -people can then use the cards either as debit cards at a point of sale or as direct withdrawal cards at any ATM for whatever they want to buy.
That only applies to CASH benefits, whether welfare (TANF or whatever it is called these days) or disability or in some states unemployment or child support. Food stamp benefits can only be accessed at the point of sale with a PIN-based transaction and only for items classified as non-prepared food. The transition to EBT cards has decimated the black market for food stamps and dramatically reduced fraud, yet we hear more about it than ever because the stereotype of the poor, black, urban mother selling her food stamps to buy cigarettes is much more politically useful than the image of a laid-off factory worker loading the pantry with cereal and ramen to stretch her food stamps.
__________________
~~**Colleen & Crew**~~
POR 10/05 ~ BC 08/07 ~ WL 01/08 ~ CBR 12/09 ~ POP 03/11 TR/ DR
POP 1/12 TR ~ ASSp 5/12 ~ CSR 3/13 ~ POP 4/13 ~ ASMu 12/13


Colleen27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:31 PM   #72
Colleen27
DIS Veteran
 
Colleen27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan
Posts: 16,802

Quote:
Originally Posted by tajz90 View Post
I spend a lot on our phones and it is a want, but I make sure my needs are covered first.

I'm sure what is really wrong with America is that people can't decipher between a want and a need. Focus need and then once that's covered, enjoy your wants if you so choose.
We're a very media driven, celebrity obsessed culture that does a piss-poor job of teaching our kids the difference between reality and fantasy. We all have televisions, most of us have cable, and we all see each and every day all the products and services we "need" to be happy. We all face immense pressure to keep up with the Joneses. And too few of us actually discuss those things with our children. Too many parents play into the "keeping up" game with every trend that "all the kids" are into, too many treat honest discussions about finances as taboo, and too few schools have anything resembling life skills/budgeting or media awareness anywhere in the curriculum.
__________________
~~**Colleen & Crew**~~
POR 10/05 ~ BC 08/07 ~ WL 01/08 ~ CBR 12/09 ~ POP 03/11 TR/ DR
POP 1/12 TR ~ ASSp 5/12 ~ CSR 3/13 ~ POP 4/13 ~ ASMu 12/13


Colleen27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:34 PM   #73
leahjade
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,091

Quote:
That only applies to CASH benefits,
So that's okay to abuse?
After a recent case in Boston where a drug dealer bailed himself out of jail with his Welfare EBT card lawmakers filed a bill pushing for tougher regulations than those recommended by the EBT commission, which advised banning the cards at nail salons, tattoo parlors, strip clubs and casinos — but not at ATMs, jewelry stores, health clubs, rent-a-centers and cruise liners.
If you think this is rare, then I can tell you've never worked for a government agency or non profit or else you are just very naive.
leahjade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:38 PM   #74
sunshinehighway
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,420

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colleen27 View Post
That's because contrary to popular belief, most of the poor in America are transitory poor - they were middle or working class, lost a job or experienced a divorce and fell into poverty, and most will once again move out of it within a fairly short time.

And you can't discount the effects of 1) gifts and 2) the falling costs of consumer goods. A DVD player costs $20 and has a resale value of exactly nothing; I ended up giving our extra one away (ironically, to a neighbor who is on assistance and didn't have one) after I couldn't even get $5 for it at our garage sale or on either of the two Facebook swap groups I participate in.

But really, anyone who looks to The Heritage Foundation for statistics obviously isn't interested in facts other than those that support their biases. It is rather tiresome that on a forum where we're not allowed to discuss politics, threads that are little more than a string of right wing talking points are A-OK.
It certainly seems that way lately.
sunshinehighway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 02:39 PM   #75
furb & dez
City Bear Jamboreers
 
furb & dez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 1,367

Having just topped off my cellphone this morning, I can report that my cell phone bill for the past 90 days was exactly $21.85.

Perhaps people just talk too much (and judging from nearly every conversation I'm forced to listen to) about nothing at all. Or as my mom says, "I don't want to sit and jabber with you all morning on the phone. Come over and we can have lunch and talk all you want for free." And to the lady up the street who has her cellphone plastered to her head before she gets in her car every morning until she sits down at her desk at work thirty minutes later, perhaps she should think about just shutting up for a few minutes? (yes, please.)

And Colleen is absolutely spot on about The Heritage Foundation. You might as well say the "facts" came to you telepathically via time-traveling aliens from Mars.
__________________
Our first trip to WDW! Had fun, a bit disappointed in the lack of things to keep us busy. Next trip: eh, 5 years perhaps? Don't understand the psychosis of wasting time trying to meet actors in fursuits or princess costumes, but, wev...
furb & dez is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:27 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.