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Old 09-05-2012, 02:51 PM   #91
anc876
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I know that some disagree with my statement that many children seem to be unappreciative of college if paid for by their parents. Of course there are those who are grateful and work hard, but there are also those who fail to grasp how much their parents might be sacrificing for their education. And it might not be fair to expect them to pay for college due to skyrocketing tuition and the current economy, but many kids today have more opportunities, more luxuries and more resources.

I can see it from both sides. I was happy to drive my family's old clunkers and get help with community college. You can bet I was proud when I graduated college without debt, and, at 21, purchased my own car and home. There's a newfound appreciation when earning things by oneself, but that doesn't diminish all that my parents provided me with to help me get there.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:07 PM   #92
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North Dakota is pretty cheap as well. And it has a booming economy. It is, however, North Dakota.
There are pluses and minuses to every scenario.

I actually went to grad school with several people from ND (we had a reciprocal program), and they tended to really love their state, so there are people out there for whom it is a perfect fit.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:16 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by anc876 View Post
I know that some disagree with my statement that many children seem to be unappreciative of college if paid for by their parents. Of course there are those who are grateful and work hard, but there are also those who fail to grasp how much their parents might be sacrificing for their education. And it might not be fair to expect them to pay for college due to skyrocketing tuition and the current economy, but many kids today have more opportunities, more luxuries and more resources.

I can see it from both sides. I was happy to drive my family's old clunkers and get help with community college. You can bet I was proud when I graduated college without debt, and, at 21, purchased my own car and home. There's a newfound appreciation when earning things by oneself, but that doesn't diminish all that my parents provided me with to help me get there.
That seems like a parenting problem to me. I knew exactly how much it cost to send me to school. My kids know what their costs are too. They know our income, they know the costs. It was a shock to them when they realized we would be pretty much be paying out 1/3 of our takehome pay for one student if we paid out of pocket. They know exactly what savings plans are in place and how much are in them. They know we have specific plans to help when they're both in. They know we work overtime and cut costs. They know that while we are more fortunate financially than some, it has been through the choices we've made that we're able to help them as much as we are. They know that their college money often took priority away from a new vehicle, a vacation, a bigger home, etc. We talked about those things as we made those decisions. We consider teaching through modeling our finances to be our job as parents.

We didn't have to knock these things over their heads, we simply didn't keep finances private - we discussed them. Money isn't the main topic of conversation in our family, but it's not taboo either.

Of course it's not FAIR to expect parents to pay - paying is a gift, not a demand or an obligation. Many parents can't afford to pay or even help pay, that doesn't mean they aren't meeting some sort of obligation. They support in other ways.

I think that the kids need to be involved in the finances and have some understanding of what those costs mean for their families. People also need to realize that it's NOT a really sacrifice for some families with higher incomes. In that case, kids need to have the ability to understand what other students might be experiencing and how they can appreciate what they've been given - and THAT is something parents should have taught as well.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:29 PM   #94
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My daughter is looking at 2 years of community college (about $2200 a year in tuition, plus books) and then two years at Wayne State University (about $11,000 per year in tuition/fees + books.)

So - $30k for four years. Certainly not the $30k a year numbers I see bandied about, but she's not looking to go away to school, she's not looking to go to a private out of state school - she's looking at her options based on what will get her into the field she's interested in (video production) and what is most economically viable for her right now. She'll live at home, she'll work full time summers and possibly part time during the school year, she's already got enough in savings to pay a big chunk of her first year of college herself, etc. (Not that we'll need her to, but if she had to, it's there.)

She's looking at college not as some sort of "experience" but as "What do I need to do to get a job in my field." Maybe that's the difference.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:32 PM   #95
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Oh, I never meant to imply that it wasn't worth applying; you never know what you'll be offered. What I meant to point out was that one should not count on public/private costs working out about even or better.

It seems to be a common idea here that private schools have so much more money that they almost always even out with public costs, and that is much too simplistic an idea. I depends entirely on your state. In the Deep South, in particular, you are unlikely to be able to beat the cost of one of your state universities (perhaps not the flagship, however) with private-school student aid unless you get a full ride, or if you can live at home for the private vs. living away for the public.

Now, if your family income is low enough to be eligible to go to Berea or College of the Ozarks, or another school of that sort, then they should definitely be encouraged to consider them. Those are both excellent private schools that cover full cost of attendance for all students via work-study programs.
So true of so many things here on the Dis.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:09 PM   #96
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No, but at the same time...

I live in a fairly nice neighborhood next to a really nice neighborhood. And I talk to other parents. And in one conversation we can move from "college is so expensive, I don't know how they expect us to pay for it" to "Roger is getting a new BMW, I tried to talk him into a Mercedes this time" to "where are you going for Spring Break" (because everyone goes somewhere for Spring Break).

If you need to go into debt for your kids college because you make a small amount of money, don't do it. If you need to go into debt because you've been spending for eighteen years assuming that scholarships and grants are going to make up for your lack of frugality, that is a different story.
Yup! DD19 has friends who had to take out the maximum in loans and have picked schools based on scholarships offered, not interest. I see the cars in their parents' 3 car garage and shake my head. I don't even have a garage, but DD will graduate (close to) loan free and I still contribute to retirement.

One of DD's friends thinks we are "secretly rich" because we can afford college
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:40 PM   #97
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There is a poster on the Dis (not on this thread that I have seen) who cashed in everything to put the kids through college and has told the kids that they need to take care of their parents when they retire. There is also at least one person on this thread who has said, "I will do whatever it takes" to pay for my kids to get through college debt-free.
Wow. It's crazy the span of choices. I've seen the other way, posters saying "I'm not going to give up going to WDW so my kids can go to college."

While I agree that you don't need to sacrifice everything for your child so their future will be easier, I think it's worth some sacrifice! Just like most things, it's all about balance.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:04 PM   #98
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I pretty much paid for college by myself. My parents helped out when they could and my Aunt always gave me cash for books/gas/food each semester. I was lucky though. I went to Community College, lived at home, and had a great part time job.

I think I have appreciated it more by paying for it myself. My one Aunt and Uncle have entirely funded my two cousins college educations and neither appreciate it. By goofing off they took 4 years of going full time to complete a 2 year degree. They are both now in very expensive 4 year colleges and there are no signs that either will graduate anytime soon, even after already being there 3 years. They party and go out with friends rather than study.
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Old 09-05-2012, 05:37 PM   #99
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For the record, my DH and I paid for practically all of our college education. My parents had zero money and his parents felt he should earn it. When we married, we both had substantial student loans and had to apply for deferment for at least 6 months so we could at least get jobs after graduation to pay. Looking back, I really wish I hadn't taken out student loans and chosen to work more. Why is hindsight so freaking clear??

Now we have our own kids. We're planning to help them out somewhat, most likely pay for around 1/2. That's contingent on them choosing to first start at community college and then if they want, transfer to one of our state schools. Obviously the rates are cheaper when you're in state.

This is just my opinion but I can't imagine my child demanding to go elsewhere and expect us to still help out. It's almost like someone saying hey, I'm going to give you a gift and then the receiver saying ok but here's where I want you to get it from. In my honest opinion, college is a gift and it isn't for everyone. Not all kids are cut out for it and we won't push our kids toward it if they truly have interests somewhere else. I am also not of the mindset that at 18, you effectively kick your kids out of the house to fend for themselves either. Should they choose not to go to college, they are more than welcome to live at home provided they are working and can help out with expenses.
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Old 09-05-2012, 06:33 PM   #100
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We have five children...all grown now. Our second oldest daughter got a basketball scholarship ( full ride) which helped a lot. We paid for undergraduate degrees for the other four kids...one got a little money for track and one graduated in three and a half years. Our oldest daughter worked full time while going to graduate school for her Masters degree. Each kid was responsible for books and spending money.
I don't know how people do it now. It is so expensive.
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Old 09-05-2012, 06:35 PM   #101
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You might consider sending your kids south for school. Here is the best deal that I know of: non-resident tuition at the University of Arkansas is just over $9200, but you only have to pay it for the first year. After that, a full-time continually-enrolled student who is not listed as a dependent on a parent's tax return is eligible for resident status. (Resident status is harder to obtain in other states, but Arkansas is very generous about it.)
That is definitely something I'll keep in mind as college gets closer. I'd kind of like the kids to go away - meaning a real distance - for school anyway. DH & I both stayed close to home and it has certainly left us feeling trapped at times when there were better job options elsewhere but family expectations that we'd stay.

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Oh, I never meant to imply that it wasn't worth applying; you never know what you'll be offered. What I meant to point out was that one should not count on public/private costs working out about even or better.

It seems to be a common idea here that private schools have so much more money that they almost always even out with public costs, and that is much too simplistic an idea. I depends entirely on your state. In the Deep South, in particular, you are unlikely to be able to beat the cost of one of your state universities (perhaps not the flagship, however) with private-school student aid unless you get a full ride, or if you can live at home for the private vs. living away for the public.
Not always, of course, but there can be and you don't know until/unless you apply, especially for high-achieving students.
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Old 09-05-2012, 06:40 PM   #102
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I know that some disagree with my statement that many children seem to be unappreciative of college if paid for by their parents. Of course there are those who are grateful and work hard, but there are also those who fail to grasp how much their parents might be sacrificing for their education. And it might not be fair to expect them to pay for college due to skyrocketing tuition and the current economy, but many kids today have more opportunities, more luxuries and more resources.

I can see it from both sides. I was happy to drive my family's old clunkers and get help with community college. You can bet I was proud when I graduated college without debt, and, at 21, purchased my own car and home. There's a newfound appreciation when earning things by oneself, but that doesn't diminish all that my parents provided me with to help me get there.
I agree that not all parents can afford to finance their child's education. My DD was accepted to all 6 universities she applied to (they were all here in the state of CO, and four of them were state schools). She received scholarship offers from all six. We actually thought she would choose one of the private schools. Despite a generous scholarship offer ($80,000 over four years), our out of pocket would have still been in the neighborhood of $35,000 a year (University of Denver...super expensive, although an excellent school). We told her if she chose to go there, we would still cover what the scholarship didn't. Yes, it would have been a bit of a hit every month, but nothing that would have had us dipping into savings or cutting in our retirement. But she took into account the fact that by living at home, and going to a state school where over half her tuition would be covered by her scholarships, she'd save us a ton of money, and still get a great education. And that is exactly what she did. We don't spoil her (she doesn't even have her own car...she shares mine, which is 6 years old). But we do give her every advantage she needs to get a good education, and fulfill her dream of becoming a large animal vet. She deserves that.
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Old 09-05-2012, 07:40 PM   #103
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DH's parents paid for all his college.

My parents helped as much as possible, then I borrowed. Yes, the first couple of years after college money was tight, but I managed.


For our DD : we save some every month in a 529. DH's mom left a small 529 when she died. She will be expected to work and borrow.

Since the plan is for DH to retire while DD is in HS, we need to save this now. We heard this and follow: You can borrow for college but not for retirement.
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Old 09-05-2012, 07:59 PM   #104
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I pretty much paid for college by myself. My parents helped out when they could and my Aunt always gave me cash for books/gas/food each semester. I was lucky though. I went to Community College, lived at home, and had a great part time job.

I think I have appreciated it more by paying for it myself. My one Aunt and Uncle have entirely funded my two cousins college educations and neither appreciate it. By goofing off they took 4 years of going full time to complete a 2 year degree. They are both now in very expensive 4 year colleges and there are no signs that either will graduate anytime soon, even after already being there 3 years. They party and go out with friends rather than study.
That's not just a lack of appreciation it's a lot of things that have nothing to do with regular students who go four years with the help of their parents. My kids would have been cut off the first time they weren't passing a full load of classes. I would hope that MOST parents are smart enough to have some expectations of kids they are funding.

Are you sure the parents are still funding? One of my brothers lost parental funding after freshman year, but kept attending/partying for several years. He knew the expectations so there weren't any family rifts or anything - there might have been people assuming my parents were still paying.
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Old 09-05-2012, 08:48 PM   #105
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That's not just a lack of appreciation it's a lot of things that have nothing to do with regular students who go four years with the help of their parents. My kids would have been cut off the first time they weren't passing a full load of classes. I would hope that MOST parents are smart enough to have some expectations of kids they are funding.

Are you sure the parents are still funding? One of my brothers lost parental funding after freshman year, but kept attending/partying for several years. He knew the expectations so there weren't any family rifts or anything - there might have been people assuming my parents were still paying.
I am sure they are still paying because my Aunt likes to rub it in my face that her kids do not have to work through college like I do. She says that it is her responsiblility as a parent to pay for the kids college education and that my parents failed me by not fully paying for mine. She is a real peach.
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