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Old 07-20-2012, 09:11 PM   #31
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Old 07-20-2012, 09:42 PM   #32
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I think what bugs me most about the added perk argument is the fact that avoiding lines and less wait times, or getting additional Fastpasses is considered a perk in the first place. It was Disney who marketed their theme parks to potential visitors thus creating added lines and wait times. It was Disney who filled their theme parks and created longer lines by not building enough new attractions or adding a new theme park. Now they are going to capitalize on the environment they created by giving deluxe resort guests the added benefit of more Fastpasses or less wait times. They are baiscally going to have us spend more of our money because of an environment they created.

The same could be true about the Dining Plan. They artificially inflate menu prices to make the cost of the Dining Plan look like a value when in essence it's overpriced.

I give Disney a lot of credit. They artificially create certain environments and sell us bargains, values, and perks in return. I'm not exactly sure of the specific term used for this type of marketing, but it seems to work well for Disney. It's easy for the less than regular theme park visitor not to see the cost structure.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 07-20-2012, 10:10 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADP View Post
I think what bugs me most about the added perk argument is the fact that avoiding lines and less wait times, or getting additional Fastpasses is considered a perk in the first place. It was Disney who marketed their theme parks to potential visitors thus creating added lines and wait times. It was Disney who filled their theme parks and created longer lines by not building enough new attractions or adding a new theme park. Now they are going to capitalize on the environment they created by giving deluxe resort guests the added benefit of more Fastpasses or less wait times. They are baiscally going to have us spend more of our money because of an environment they created.

The same could be true about the Dining Plan. They artificially inflate menu prices to make the cost of the Dining Plan look like a value when in essence it's overpriced.

I give Disney a lot of credit. They artificially create certain environments and sell us bargains, values, and perks in return. I'm not exactly sure of the specific term used for this type of marketing, but it seems to work well for Disney. It's easy for the less than regular theme park visitor not to see the cost structure.

Just my 2 cents.
It is called "high-low pricing." It is part of Rasulo's and Iger's strategy to "reduce broad-based discounting." Iger has even referred to it as “weaning” theme park visitors from expecting discounts. Page 8 of http://cdn.media.ir.thewaltdisneycom...transcript.pdf
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Old 07-21-2012, 02:14 AM   #34
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Of course, Disney's idea of "deluxe" is not really as deluxe as their prices suggest. I would say Portofino at Universal felt more "deluxe" to me. The bedding was nicer, the bathrooms were bigger, and the grounds and amenities just seemed to be more "deluxe" at the Loew's hotel.

Disney is charging those prices just the way Aaron had described. It's part of the reason I joined DVC 10 years ago. I knew that for as often as I like to visit WDW, their rate of inflation was going to price itself out of what I'm comfortable paying, even if I stayed at the value resorts each time.

The only way I think the RFID system with extra perks could potentially NOT alienate people would be if there was no transparency. That means, nobody would be able to tell which guests have the tiered extra perks. Here's an example. Let's say Value gets 2 Fast Pass perks. Moderates get 3, and Deluxes get 4. When you go to the attraction and watch someone use a wristband to enter the Fast Pass line, you wouldn't know if that party was staying at which level. You wouldn't be able to tell if this was the 2nd, 3rd or 4th use, especially if you get the ability to schedule times. But you will know they were getting the perks as a Disney resort guest, similar to Extra Magic Hours.
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Old 07-21-2012, 02:34 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BriarRosie View Post
Of course, Disney's idea of "deluxe" is not really as deluxe as their prices suggest. I would say Portofino at Universal felt more "deluxe" to me. The bedding was nicer, the bathrooms were bigger, and the grounds and amenities just seemed to be more "deluxe" at the Loew's hotel.

Disney is charging those prices just the way Aaron had described. It's part of the reason I joined DVC 10 years ago. I knew that for as often as I like to visit WDW, their rate of inflation was going to price itself out of what I'm comfortable paying, even if I stayed at the value resorts each time.

The only way I think the RFID system with extra perks could potentially NOT alienate people would be if there was no transparency. That means, nobody would be able to tell which guests have the tiered extra perks. Here's an example. Let's say Value gets 2 Fast Pass perks. Moderates get 3, and Deluxes get 4. When you go to the attraction and watch someone use a wristband to enter the Fast Pass line, you wouldn't know if that party was staying at which level. You wouldn't be able to tell if this was the 2nd, 3rd or 4th use, especially if you get the ability to schedule times. But you will know they were getting the perks as a Disney resort guest, similar to Extra Magic Hours.
while I understand what you are saying. it doesn't matter to me.. I don't have to know specifically WHICH guests are getting a better deal than I am.. just knowing someone else is bugs me.
I am disney savvy enough and active on these boards that I will know, if we decide to do a longer trip at a value or moderate resort, rather than a shorter at a deluxe, that I am getting less "theme park" perks.
and i don't like the idea one bit. I like to pick and choose where I spend my money.
maybe one trip will be more resort intensive, less theme park intensive... we will , say, do a split stay between a moderate, with a room discount, and a deluxe, renting points from friends.
maybe the next will be a "park commando" trip, with very littel time at a resort. so we'll stay value. OR maybe we'll purchase a dining plan, stay at a value,cahnge to a moderate. and spend a lot of time in restaurants.
we love to "change it up"!!! ...."switch gears!".. "keep it fresh!".....
we could be having a chili cheese dog at the pop century food court one night, and having a porterhouse steak at yachtsman steakhouse, staying at the beach club villas, the next.
if disney starts pulling this snobbish "tiered perks", we would be very unhappy.
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Old 07-21-2012, 06:41 AM   #36
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I still don't believe that they should give extra perks at the park for deluxe guests. The hotel is the perk. Try the restaurants. Try to find a sit down restaurant at a value. Deluxes have some nice ones. Even the moderates are scarce on good sit downs. And good luck finding concierge at a value.

Nicer shops and spas for goodness sake and location location location. But I'm repeating myself.

It's a little too late to give extra perks to Deluxe at the parks and seems like another thing an AP holder can't have. I don't have much hope for the Next gen fastpass either. I see TSM booked up months in advance the new "Le Cellier"

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Old 07-22-2012, 03:07 PM   #37
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The answer is; of course not. Disney would never do anything like that. Now I do believe that Disney needs to do something in addition to EMH as a perk, maybe they could have some sort of ultimate FP system that on property guest could pay extra for. Maybe a cross between what Six Flags and Universal have.
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Old 07-23-2012, 01:13 PM   #38
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Yes, there should be some added value for staying at the deluxe resorts. But it should have nothing to do with Fast Passes. it should have everything to do with a "frequent flyer" program.

Disney needs to put something into place to award those repeat customers. And like Pete has said, they are the only hotels who don't offer that. Some could argue that DVC is the award for repeat customers but there should be something more.

On the cruise line the Castaway Club has developed into tiers of silver, gold and platinum based on the number of cruises you have taken. The problem with doing things this way is that there is no added value for taking longer cruises or staying in nicer staterooms. A 1-night cruise in an inside stateroom out of New York counts the same as a 14-night transatlantic cruise in the Roy Disney Suite. That is just not right.

When a "frequent flyer" program rolls out for those staying on property at WDW, they can include value for those who stay at the Deluxe resort.
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Old 07-23-2012, 02:13 PM   #39
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I think that Deluxe guests will be getting additional perks when the X-pass (or whatever its called) starts - I think it will either be restricted to Deluxe guests or else Deluxe guests will get more passes per day.

I don't agree with this, I think Fast Pass should stay as it is, but this is what I think will happen as Disney tries to keep their Deluxe resorts full without deep discounts.
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Old 07-23-2012, 03:18 PM   #40
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I'll take the unpopular approach here and say that I am all for additional perks for Deluxe resort guests. I'll preface this by saying that I typically only stay at Deluxe resorts if I'm on points and most of our trips tend to be at the Swolphin or moderates and even values if points are not being used. In my opinion the current "perks" for deluxe resort guests do not warrant the extra cost for me. Now, you start throwing in some EMH or unlimited fastpasses and such then I may be more willing to shell out my hard earned money to stay at one of these resorts.

Now, in Disney's mind if they can convince people such as myself to shell out some extra $$$ for a perk that really doesn't have a cost as far as they are concerned. Well, that's just smart business. Call me a sucker if you will but some perks are worth the extra cost for me.

We have also stayed at Universal (Hard Rock and Portofino Bay) and honestly the only reason we stayed there and didn't drive back and forth from Disney was ONLY because of the FOTL access. Worth every penny.

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Old 07-23-2012, 03:53 PM   #41
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I don't think I can expand too much more than what has already been stated, but my humble opinion is that Disney should not use the class system with Fastpasses. I usually stay Deluxe and that is my choice....would I like to see some more perks, sure, but I really don't think extra fastpasses is the way to go.
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Old 07-23-2012, 04:09 PM   #42
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In my humble opinion, the perk should be related to the accommodations and not the parks.
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:00 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCTooTall View Post
The resorts are already classed and vary based off what they offer. It would seem greedy to start offering more non-resort perks to those staying at Deluxe resorts.

If anything, I'd almost say that the only additional perk I'd like to see at the Deluxe resorts, Is for them to start actually offering closer to the non-Disney version of "Deluxe Resort" service. While there is a noticable difference in the resort feel from a moderate or Value, The Deluxe's, to me, don't really seem to really be up to a true deluxe standard that would justify the cost difference.

Since people seem to bring up comparisons to onsite at Universal quite often, I'll throw in my own analysis. The Way Universal handles their express or FotL Priviledges work for them because of the park layouts and design....and their total resort capacity allows them to over the unlimited express without overloading the system. Disney's park layouts and designs, along with their resort capacity, don't really offer them the same ability to offer the same type of perk to their guests without major tweaks that will throw the entire system off-balance.

More importantly... If you look at the costs, Yes....Universal's Current resorts can be priced comparably to the Disney Deluxes. What you get however within your resort and room however at Universal's Resorts are much closer to what would pass for a Deluxe Resort outside of Disney. The universal resorts, run by Lowes, offer the same level of service that you might expect at a Lowes anyplace else in the country.

So IMHO, Rather than concentrate on how to "Improve the Disney Deluxe Experience" thru additional perks or privileges at the parks, I Think Disney would be better served and have more success by improving the level of service at the resorts themselves. [Which might be something as simple as improving the staff training, expectations, and experience to a level that Disney's current pay-scale and interchangeable resort staffing policies currently don't allow]
i completely agree with you! .... the level of service at the deluxes is not at all in line with the incredibly high price...but of course, pricing is whatever the market will bear....if they can sell mediocre quality and service at such exorbitant prices then apparently they aren't overpriced!!
i for one, no longer stay at the deluxes....we used to only stay in concierge - now it's the pop century for us...i can't justify paying those ridiculous prices ..

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADP View Post
I think what bugs me most about the added perk argument is the fact that avoiding lines and less wait times, or getting additional Fastpasses is considered a perk in the first place. It was Disney who marketed their theme parks to potential visitors thus creating added lines and wait times. It was Disney who filled their theme parks and created longer lines by not building enough new attractions or adding a new theme park. Now they are going to capitalize on the environment they created by giving deluxe resort guests the added benefit of more Fastpasses or less wait times. They are baiscally going to have us spend more of our money because of an environment they created.

The same could be true about the Dining Plan. They artificially inflate menu prices to make the cost of the Dining Plan look like a value when in essence it's overpriced.

I give Disney a lot of credit. They artificially create certain environments and sell us bargains, values, and perks in return. I'm not exactly sure of the specific term used for this type of marketing, but it seems to work well for Disney. It's easy for the less than regular theme park visitor not to see the cost structure.

Just my 2 cents.
very well said!!
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:07 PM   #44
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You should absolutely get more perks in the the parks and on property. Disney isn't cheap, but they do offer places for people to stay at lower costs, and offer packages for people so they can receive for their dollar. If you stay at a value or moderate you should still get some perks, but if i choose to spend more at a deluxe, Disney should bend over backwards and give me every extra perk possible. A nicer pool or room doesn't cut it. Deluxe rooms are 3 to 4 times more than a value per night. The people that stay in the deluxe usually spend more money for dining and merchandise too. Where is the value for my dollars? If you stay at a value no one will take away your perks, but if i spend more I should get more. It's capitalism not communism.
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:18 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briconlo View Post
You should absolutely get more perks in the the parks and on property. Disney isn't cheap, but they do offer places for people to stay at lower costs, and offer packages for people so they can receive for their dollar. If you stay at a value or moderate you should still get some perks, but if i choose to spend more at a deluxe, Disney should bend over backwards and give me every extra perk possible. A nicer pool or room doesn't cut it. Deluxe rooms are 3 to 4 times more than a value per night. The people that stay in the deluxe usually spend more money for dining and merchandise too. Where is the value for my dollars? If you stay at a value no one will take away your perks, but if i spend more I should get more. It's capitalism not communism.
When you pay to stay at a Deluxe or a Value, You are paying more, or less, For your room. The package stuff is extra. While I'm not a HUGE fan of the packages (AP Passholders and DVC Owners tend to get screwed), I don't have as much of an issue with the idea that different packages can get different perks. For the most part, The Packages are what give you the perks outside of the hotel you are staying at, and are a base upcharge above what you spend for your room (and are available to everyone onsite regardless of what level accommodation you stay at.).

The only exception to that rule is the Platinum Package, which was only available to those staying in Deluxe level accommodations.... But I don't really have a big issue with that either considering it was one package that was a small upgrade from the next highest level package that is available to everyone.

Call me old fashioned... but I tend to believe you pay more, or less, based off the quality and merit of the individual hotel/resort you are choosing to stay at. I'm not paying for 'perks' outside of the hotel/resort itself. If I was, then what's to stop Disney from opening up a virtual no-tell motel level place onsite, charging you $200/night, and saying you are paying for the "onsite perks"?
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