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Old 05-09-2012, 05:12 AM   #181
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I haven't seen the movie yet (I have seen Thor though), but from how my husband and kids explained it, I think people are laughing at Thor, and the quick turnaround he made of throwing his brother under the bus - it was out of character and therefore funny. They are not laughing at Loki, whose adoption is not played as funny at all. And Thor's true feelings about Loki are shown through 2 movies.

If they were blood related I guess the line could easily have been something like "Well he takes after the other side of the family" or something and the point would still be the joke is about THOR not Loki.
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Old 05-09-2012, 07:59 AM   #182
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In other words, you failed to comprehend the content of his post. There was NOTHING in it approaching censorship. But then, that is not surprising in a person who tosses around the term "pathetic" in the way you do.
But it is censorship. It is something that you (a general you) don't like and feel that it should be removed. The pp gave suggestions on how HE thought it should be written. Or apologized for.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:43 AM   #183
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Originally Posted by Skywalker View Post
I haven't seen the movie yet (I have seen Thor though), but from how my husband and kids explained it, I think people are laughing at Thor, and the quick turnaround he made of throwing his brother under the bus - it was out of character and therefore funny. They are not laughing at Loki, whose adoption is not played as funny at all. And Thor's true feelings about Loki are shown through 2 movies.

If they were blood related I guess the line could easily have been something like "Well he takes after the other side of the family" or something and the point would still be the joke is about THOR not Loki.
That was exactly what the line was about. He was defending Loki vehemently because he was his brother and one of his planet's people...but then he was reminded that Loki was also a mass murderer who had killed 80 people in the last two days and suddenly Thor was backtracking his entire relationship to Loki.

And it was completely out of character for Thor, so that made it funny too.

It was clear for both this movie and Thor that he always considered Loki his brother (even after the now-infamous line) and wanted him to stop and redeem himself. He clearly loved him as a brother.

I could understand a little one being confused by the line. But it's clearly not meant a slight against all adoptees, just a way of Thor momentarily disassociating himself with his brother because of the crimes he committed.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:51 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by JenM View Post
I could understand a little one being confused by the line. But it's clearly not meant a slight against all adoptees, just a way of Thor momentarily disassociating himself with his brother because of the crimes he committed.

I don't think most of us are confused by that line. And just because it might not be meant as a slight against adopted children, doesn't mean its not offensive to some. In my case, it was an issue that needed to be discussed. For us, the intent doesn't matter - its still there and had to be dealt with.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:09 AM   #185
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So bottom line is: If you are offended then you are thin-skinned, weak and looking to be offended. If you are not offended you "just don't get it."
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:14 AM   #186
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So bottom line is: If you are offended then you are thin-skinned, weak and looking to be offended. If you are not offended you "just don't get it."

This is funny and maybe some people do feel one of these ways. And maybe I've even sounded like I felt that way .

I don't believe that anyone has to be offended. But we could understand that someone else might be.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:15 AM   #187
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My daughter is adopted. I haven't seen the movie yet, but based on OP's description of the issue, I don't think it's a problem.
My daughter is adopted...from China...that IS THE REASON she looks different from us. That doesn't mean that she is less family - it just is what it is.
I think Marilyn Munster is adopted...isn't she? From the Munsters? In that situation, she is more normal than the rest of the family.
In this case it seems Loki was adopted from an evil group. I really don't think Thor is implying that he is evil simply because he is adopted and therefore anyone who is adopted is evil.
The bottom line is that there will be genetic differences between an adopted person and the rest of the family. Sometimes it will be in favor of the adoptee (my DD will never have to worry about sunburn...) and sometimes not (Loki evident had evil passed down to him genetically).
My DD is totally psyched about seeing the Avengers. She is a huge fan of superheroes. I really don't think the adoption comment is going to phase her.
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:23 AM   #188
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I don't think most of us are confused by that line. And just because it might not be meant as a slight against adopted children, doesn't mean its not offensive to some. In my case, it was an issue that needed to be discussed. For us, the intent doesn't matter - its still there and had to be dealt with.
And a lot of things in movies need to be dealt with subjects that might be sensitive to some viewers. When the first Spiderman movie was released less than a year after 9/11, news outlets in the NYC area did warn parents that scenes of Manhattan being attacked by Green Goblin might be disturbing to children who had seen a real attack on the city just a few months earlier. Doesn't mean that they were trying to offend people.

Intent does matter. Someone saying The Avengers meant to offend adopted children simply isn't true. Anyone saying that people who laughed at the line (which I did) are some kind of heartless creatures who don't 'get it' isn't true either.

It was clear the intent of the line in Avengers was not to say that adoptees were bad, it was just an awkward, out-of-character backtrack from Thor. Saying that this movie intended to do something like that to someone other than Loki with that line is just not accurate.

Saying that the line was bothersome because of a personal situation? That I understand. You can talk to anyone and they'll tell you a movie that made them cringe because something in it came too close to home, even if the movie wasn't going out of it's way to personally attack them.

I see that this subject has been somewhat controversial in other movies such as Tangled, Lilo & Stitch, ELF, Annie, Meet the Robinsons, and Despicable Me, where adoption, or orphans, using the phrase "real parents" has been a problem. But I've seen those movies - like the line in Avengers, using these characters' situation as a plot point was not intended to offend, or send some kind of message that an adopted child is less than any other child.

The "it's harder to love an adopted child" tagline on the movie poster for Orphan a few years back was offensive - it's an R-rated horror film, but that was on a poster that any kid at a movie theater could see. And the studio was smart to change the line on the poster.

I can totally understand why the Avengers line might have hit a nerve. But I won't say that the movie intended to do so, because it didn't. I'm not going to petition for the line to be removed, because it clearly wasn't the intent of the line.
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:44 PM   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JenM View Post
And a lot of things in movies need to be dealt with subjects that might be sensitive to some viewers. When the first Spiderman movie was released less than a year after 9/11, news outlets in the NYC area did warn parents that scenes of Manhattan being attacked by Green Goblin might be disturbing to children who had seen a real attack on the city just a few months earlier. Doesn't mean that they were trying to offend people.

Intent does matter. Someone saying The Avengers meant to offend adopted children simply isn't true. Anyone saying that people who laughed at the line (which I did) are some kind of heartless creatures who don't 'get it' isn't true either.

It was clear the intent of the line in Avengers was not to say that adoptees were bad, it was just an awkward, out-of-character backtrack from Thor. Saying that this movie intended to do something like that to someone other than Loki with that line is just not accurate.

Saying that the line was bothersome because of a personal situation? That I understand. You can talk to anyone and they'll tell you a movie that made them cringe because something in it came too close to home, even if the movie wasn't going out of it's way to personally attack them.

I see that this subject has been somewhat controversial in other movies such as Tangled, Lilo & Stitch, ELF, Annie, Meet the Robinsons, and Despicable Me, where adoption, or orphans, using the phrase "real parents" has been a problem. But I've seen those movies - like the line in Avengers, using these characters' situation as a plot point was not intended to offend, or send some kind of message that an adopted child is less than any other child.
The "it's harder to love an adopted child" tagline on the movie poster for Orphan a few years back was offensive - it's an R-rated horror film, but that was on a poster that any kid at a movie theater could see. And the studio was smart to change the line on the poster.

I can totally understand why the Avengers line might have hit a nerve. But I won't say that the movie intended to do so, because it didn't. I'm not going to petition for the line to be removed, because it clearly wasn't the intent of the line.


Exactly anyone who knows the Marvel Comics story line knows that Thor and Odin love Loki as blood and are always there with open arms to embrace him despite his mischevous behaviour....Loki isn't mischevous because he is adopted, he is mischevous because he is the son of Frost Giants and not Odinson. Context and intent are everything
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:54 PM   #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JenM View Post
And a lot of things in movies need to be dealt with subjects that might be sensitive to some viewers. When the first Spiderman movie was released less than a year after 9/11, news outlets in the NYC area did warn parents that scenes of Manhattan being attacked by Green Goblin might be disturbing to children who had seen a real attack on the city just a few months earlier. Doesn't mean that they were trying to offend people.

Intent does matter. Someone saying The Avengers meant to offend adopted children simply isn't true. Anyone saying that people who laughed at the line (which I did) are some kind of heartless creatures who don't 'get it' isn't true either.

It was clear the intent of the line in Avengers was not to say that adoptees were bad, it was just an awkward, out-of-character backtrack from Thor. Saying that this movie intended to do something like that to someone other than Loki with that line is just not accurate.

Saying that the line was bothersome because of a personal situation? That I understand. You can talk to anyone and they'll tell you a movie that made them cringe because something in it came too close to home, even if the movie wasn't going out of it's way to personally attack them.

I see that this subject has been somewhat controversial in other movies such as Tangled, Lilo & Stitch, ELF, Annie, Meet the Robinsons, and Despicable Me, where adoption, or orphans, using the phrase "real parents" has been a problem. But I've seen those movies - like the line in Avengers, using these characters' situation as a plot point was not intended to offend, or send some kind of message that an adopted child is less than any other child.

The "it's harder to love an adopted child" tagline on the movie poster for Orphan a few years back was offensive - it's an R-rated horror film, but that was on a poster that any kid at a movie theater could see. And the studio was smart to change the line on the poster.

I can totally understand why the Avengers line might have hit a nerve. But I won't say that the movie intended to do so, because it didn't. I'm not going to petition for the line to be removed, because it clearly wasn't the intent of the line.

I responded to this once, but its not here for some reason! If this is a duplicate, I apologize in advance. Basically, I think we have to be careful about censorship. I don't like the line, but I wouldn't want to tell writers what they can or can't put in a movie. The line is there - I don't think they intended to hurt anyone, but it does. That's what I meant when I said that intent doesn't matter to me in this case. Its good to know ahead of time (for once, our family's slowness in seeing a new movie has paid off ), and if people are upset, its good for them to write the studio.
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:59 PM   #191
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Exactly anyone who knows the Marvel Comics story line knows that Thor and Odin love Loki as blood and are always there with open arms to embrace him despite his mischevous behaviour....Loki isn't mischevous because he is adopted, he is mischevous because he is the son of Frost Giants and not Odinson. Context and intent are everything

So Loki is bad blood? That's part of what bugs me about the line. I know its part of the story, and maybe it makes sense for that line to be there. I'm not lobbying to take it out. Movies will always offend people, right?

Adopted kids can be (not always) sensitive. I have one of each. But sometimes there is a fear about whether or not they inherited "bad" traits from birth parents.

Now as I've said, I understand that intent may not have been there, but its something to deal with. I can understand why someone would be offended.

I can't wait to see Loki in action though . I kind of like his badness. I read some Norse myths with my youngest after watching Thor. Loki is a fun character - though much cooler in the movie than in the myths we read. The adoption part of the story didn't seem like a big deal in the book we read.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:00 PM   #192
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Yeah, you go right ahead and write to Disney about that line and how they should be more careful and remove it from the movie.

Then you could tell them all about how hurt stepchildren and stepmothers are by Cinderella and Snow White.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:11 PM   #193
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So Loki is bad blood? That's part of what bugs me about the line. I know its part of the story, and maybe it makes sense for that line to be there. I'm not lobbying to take it out. Movies will always offend people, right?

Adopted kids can be (not always) sensitive. I have one of each. But sometimes there is a fear about whether or not they inherited "bad" traits from birth parents.

Now as I've said, I understand that intent may not have been there, but its something to deal with. I can understand why someone would be offended.

I can't wait to see Loki in action though . I kind of like his badness. I read some Norse myths with my youngest after watching Thor. Loki is a fun character - though much cooler in the movie than in the myths we read. The adoption part of the story didn't seem like a big deal in the book we read.
Truth is, unless the biological parents were perfect, then your adopted child probably did inherit some bad traits. But so did your biological child (unless you're perfect?).
I think it's fine for my child to think she may have inherited some bad traits. As long as she realizes it's up to her to take what she is given and make the most of it. She should also realize that she may have inherited some good traits - traits she would never have if she came out of me!
So, I think it's fine if Loki comes from "bad blood". If he came from bad blood but wasn't adopted - no one would have a problem with it. So, should we all make believe that all adopted children come from genetically perfect biological parents? Just seems like a silly argument to me. And I don't think my daughter will ever be sensitive to it - because I don't present it to her as a problem.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:14 PM   #194
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Truth is, unless the biological parents were perfect, then your adopted child probably did inherit some bad traits. But so did your biological child (unless you're perfect?).
I think it's fine for my child to think she may have inherited some bad traits. As long as she realizes it's up to her to take what she is given and make the most of it. She should also realize that she may have inherited some good traits - traits she would never have if she came out of me!
So, I think it's fine if Loki comes from "bad blood". If he came from bad blood but wasn't adopted - no one would have a problem with it. So, should we all make believe that all adopted children come from genetically perfect biological parents? Just seems like a silly argument to me. And I don't think my daughter will ever be sensitive to it - because I don't present it to her as a problem.

Of course - we all inherited bad traits - I was just saying it was an issue in the minds of some kids. I don't think you understand my "silly" argument - maybe its my explanation, who knows. And good for your daughter for not being sensitive to it. All kids are different. And I don't present it to my kids as a problem either.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:16 PM   #195
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Yeah, you go right ahead and write to Disney about that line and how they should be more careful and remove it from the movie.

Then you could tell them all about how hurt stepchildren and stepmothers are by Cinderella and Snow White.

Not sure if this is directed at me, but I never said that I would write to Disney and tell them to remove it from the movie. But I support others' doing that if they want to. I certainly wouldn't laugh at them. It never hurts to express your views.
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