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Old 08-21-2010, 04:33 AM   #736
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oops.. didn't realize he had "checked out". guess I can put my dictionary and thesaraus away now.
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Old 08-21-2010, 05:43 AM   #737
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Oh, how I remember those heated threads.

I think it's a cop-out when companies totally blame the economy too - it relieves them of taking any responsibility for the problems. I don't see Disney doing this totally though, as I did read something about them considering all areas of the company. But again, how much of this they believe is the other issue. If they believe it's all the economy, then it will continue to function as is, or, possibly get worse? Not sure...?

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The cost of employment is a real factor. This is one reason uneployment is so high across the country. I see the mention of Disney layoffs.. They've also outsourced a few departments.

Methinks, Disney expects us to bail them out, i.e. cuts in services, quality, choices and price increases.

Insurance costs are on the rise, taxes are increasing, everybody still wants a raise and the company needs to keep the shareholders happy. This is a vicious cycle and not just a Disney problem.
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Old 08-21-2010, 06:49 AM   #738
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In response to the topic,

Not at all! It's gotten better. Me and colleague were talking about this yesterday, we both went about 5-8 years ago and didn't really enjoy it. It's only been our recent trips we've absolutely loved. I think Disney has gotten out of that whole "Eisner" way of thinking and is really getting back to creativity.

If anything I would say Disney is approaching a new peak.
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Old 08-21-2010, 07:37 AM   #739
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The cost of employment is a real factor. This is one reason uneployment is so high across the country. I see the mention of Disney layoffs.. They've also outsourced a few departments.

Methinks, Disney expects us to bail them out, i.e. cuts in services, quality, choices and price increases.

Insurance costs are on the rise, taxes are increasing, everybody still wants a raise and the company needs to keep the shareholders happy. This is a vicious cycle and not just a Disney problem.
ITA! Disney expects us to bail them out...excellent way of wording it. I think there are 2 points to that: keep coming to the parks, and accept the cuts. Wages are interesting as I come from Canada - highest minimum wage over $10.00/hour, plus probably the highest taxes. Those two alone make running a business darn near impossible, yet many companies do so. You have to get creative, and have realistic profit expectations. From all of my reading, it seems that Disney has very high profit expectations, which may or may not be good, as there are external factors that will affect those numbers.

It definitely isn't just a Disney problem...yet, they are building two new resorts (Value and Aulani DVC) and expanding MK, yet they might lay off CMs. Huh? There is a disconnect...if more people come, who will take care of those new customers, if there isn't enough staff around to do it? Surely, we will see dirty parks, dirty rooms, and cheaper food, as there is no other way around it, IMHO. Not to mention grossly overworked CMs, who are serving customers who are making every penny count, as they also live in the same economy that Disney does...This is the downslide that some of us fear...

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In response to the topic,

Not at all! It's gotten better. Me and colleague were talking about this yesterday, we both went about 5-8 years ago and didn't really enjoy it. It's only been our recent trips we've absolutely loved. I think Disney has gotten out of that whole "Eisner" way of thinking and is really getting back to creativity.

If anything I would say Disney is approaching a new peak.
Just wondering how many times you've been to WDW? Being there 8 years ago is a very long time ago, in terms of this discussion. AK was still new, and there were several less resorts, just off the top of my head.

I, as well as my other peers here in this discussion, would love to hear more about your assessment. I will agree it's more creative, in certain respects, but when talking about going downhill, as we've been discussing, we are referring to the minute details that make up WDW: housekeeping, food, resorts and CM attitudes.

Would love to hear your thoughts about this new 'peak'! Tiger
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Old 08-21-2010, 08:42 AM   #740
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I will say this about Eisner at least under his reign alot of new parks and attractions were built.I still don't get spending more to build another value resort,isn't there one that needs finished?
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Old 08-21-2010, 08:47 AM   #741
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The new value resort will be located at the unfinished side of Pop Century (although the plan is now for it to be an entirely different resort, not Pop Century II)

Under Eisner there was better food.

Granted, the only way to not accept the cutbacks is to stop going, but if people stop going there will just be more cutbacks.
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Old 08-21-2010, 09:19 AM   #742
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The money is not the problem for me because I know I have to pay for what I get. But as the original poster pointed out last Christmas the decorations at EPCOT were non-existant compared to other years. I go there looking to escape the real world and enjoy the magic but they seem to be putting out less every time. This does not mean I will not return. We go atleast twice a year and i am still like a kid when planning and watching our countdown clock. As for the food we do not use the dining plan...it never really seemed to work for us so I cannot really comment on that.
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Old 08-21-2010, 09:34 AM   #743
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We go once a year on average...I always ride the Tomorrowland Transit people mover (don't laugh...I love a ride that never has a line!) and from that high up you see the roof lines, eaves, etc and I seem each year to see more & more areas of peeling paint, rust, etc.-areas that are in need of maintenance. I also do not like to see closed/abandoned areas within the parks-to me that just does not look good. The area that comes to mind (unless it has re-opened) is the big restaurant that used to be in Epcot on the left of the main bridge as you crossed into World Showcase.
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Old 08-21-2010, 10:29 AM   #744
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oops.. didn't realize he had "checked out". guess I can put my dictionary and thesaraus away now.

But if you call name 3 times and turn around he may come back.
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Old 08-21-2010, 10:37 AM   #745
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The new value resort will be located at the unfinished side of Pop Century (although the plan is now for it to be an entirely different resort, not Pop Century II)

Under Eisner there was better food.

Granted, the only way to not accept the cutbacks is to stop going, but if people stop going there will just be more cutbacks.
So they will actually finish those buildings as a part of new resort, or just leave them?
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Old 08-21-2010, 10:58 AM   #746
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So they will actually finish those buildings as a part of new resort, or just leave them?
I believe they will be part of a new resort (animation themed).
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Old 08-21-2010, 01:14 PM   #747
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Originally Posted by TDC Nala View Post
The new value resort will be located at the unfinished side of Pop Century (although the plan is now for it to be an entirely different resort, not Pop Century II)

Under Eisner there was better food.

Granted, the only way to not accept the cutbacks is to stop going, but if people stop going there will just be more cutbacks.


Eisner and food. I will give the nod for his vision.

Eisner actually created a division dedicated to improving the quality of the food offered at WDW. He wanted the bar raised so WDW would be considered a "foodie" destination. How do I know? I worked with a woman who was in that department.

They searched and hired some of the best chef's they could, gave them the budgets to create the reputations that many of the restaurants are riding on now.

Three years ago, when the first round of layoffs began, they slashed the budgets for the restaurants. Next they changed the rules for the chefs....cutting out more expensive cuts of meat for example. Now they "shop from the company store" and are told what to do vs. the creative element we enjoyed. Even worse, some of the food is cooked in a centeralized kitchen and delivered to the restaurants. Next time you are at Riverside's Boatrights.....know you are, for the most part, eating the same food, cooked in the same kitchen as CRT for 40% more over there. I use this as an example because on our last trip we ate at Boatrights (before seeing BOB---love Yehaa Bob) and the next night asked for a refund at CRT because we had the same menu as the night before for far less $$$).

It doesn't end there. Food and Wine festival.

One or our dearest Disney friends is a F&W addict. He has attended each one and knows many of the guest chef's very well. The stories he was told about their $$ cutbacks and new restrictions has him wondering if he wants to go to F&W at all this year.

We might not like Eisner....but he DID have a vision for dining at WDW and DL.

Now we get to eat Denny's food at WDW with different themes. (Ok, I admit it...when my 90 year old mother goes out to dinner....she often chooses Denny's. But it doesn't cost $36 p/psn for the buffet.)

....and don't forget the staff cutbacks the last two years.....which means fewer staff at the restaurants...and more stress for those still there.

What does it mean.....less quality in food options overall.
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Old 08-21-2010, 01:19 PM   #748
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So they will actually finish those buildings as a part of new resort, or just leave them?

I'm not a contractor so I don't know....but can they salvage the structures which have been in the open elements so long?

Perhaps they just take the shells down to the foundatons and start from there. Anyone who watches "Income Properties" on HGTV knows what horrors await the construction people if they are responsible for salvaging those buildings. euwwwwwwwwwww, stinky!
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Old 08-21-2010, 01:35 PM   #749
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Ok, one more idea and I'll be quiet for a while.

I want to talk about decline in an area that is precious to me....Christmas.

Over the years I have watched the resort decorations reduced. I remember when the Beach Club introduced it's current theme of smaller trees in blues and greens vs. the giant tree of read poinsettias in the lobby. I noticed the smart resort manager KEPT some of the retired decorations....one specific.....they had beautiful Christmas "sprays" on the walls on the far side of the gift shop heading to the rooms. The red sprays were there after the blue/green theme was introduced.

The old decorations were kept and put up in places where budget cuts prevented new decorations to be made. (DH is a castmember and we were chatting with the assistant manager and he talked about the cutbacks in resort decorations).

Remember the EPCOT Christmas tree was on a platform and each night the tree lighting included characters?

Ok....I have to carry the crisis hotline number this December for my husband.....Lights of Winter.

They used to have those beautiful Liberty Red Poinsettias in the planter boxes on top of ALL the trash boxes surrounding the EPCOT resorts.....and garlands ringing all the lamp posts.

We have a photo of the Christmas tree behind Boardwalk - between the building and the lake. It was so tall it made my DH look like a munchkin. The next year and since, it's about 8 feet.

I remember describing all the EPCOT decorations to my (at the time) fiance. It was his first Christmas at WDW. I told him how the Beach Club decorations began as you drove up to the entrance wth giant wreath out front...gone....decoratons on the breezeway walk to the busses......gone. At least the poinsettia trees and the poinsettias in the plantings are still there.

In our house I begin my Christmas planning in the summer....I make tree decorations each year for our family and this year I have (Ok, I know...not well) pretty much finished my shopping. I NOTICE Christmas decor everywhere.

I just notice each year when something I loved in the past....is gone. $$$ cuts make it difficult for Holiday Services to replace exhisting decorations at the same scale.

Sure it's still beautiful....but no question a decline from years past. Let's not forget that everything guests touch at WDW over the holidays is priced at a premium.....heck a standard room at BC goes from $325ish to over $500 p/night!

Disney's Holiday mantra ---- give 'em less, charge 'em more!


Ok, I'll give everyone a rest from my ramblings.
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Old 08-21-2010, 01:48 PM   #750
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I'm not a contractor so I don't know....but can they salvage the structures which have been in the open elements so long?

Perhaps they just take the shells down to the foundatons and start from there. Anyone who watches "Income Properties" on HGTV knows what horrors await the construction people if they are responsible for salvaging those buildings. euwwwwwwwwwww, stinky!
Depends on just what exactly was already up. If they are keeping a similar footprint, then they may be able to salvage the foundation. Also if they used steel beam construction they may be able to salvage that My guess is that all the drywall would have to be tossed since it was exposed for so long.

But I don't know how far along they had been before the project was stopped.
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