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Old 08-20-2010, 01:00 PM   #631
brunette8706
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Originally Posted by bicker View Post
No not quite, and that was just one portion of what Disney promises. I don't have the time or space to essentially repost their entire website, and all the advertising materials and promotional materials that they publish. What I posted as a very small sampling so you could gain some understanding of what type of information constitutes a promise.

Not hardly. Rather what is "ludicrous" is refusing to grant service providers a place in telling customers what they're offering - putting one's own guesses over what the service provider actually says.
*
But what you are saying is that Disney promises a bear minimum of what, say motel 8 promises. I think that Disney promises so much more than that. People are in awe of Disney commericials when everything looks so magical and clean. And for the most part they are. But I think the poster in question and a few other folks are saying that they are paying a PREMIUM to go to Disney, because DISNEY is top notch that they should receive premium service. Such as shakes that were 16 oz or now 10 oz, turkey legs that were $4.99 in 2007 or now close to $8.00, buffet surcharges (in other words gouging people) CMs that should be more polite etc etc. All this is presented by their slogan "The Most Happiest Place On Earth". This is what's getting people frustrated about Disney. Yes, it's a GREAT PLACE but some of their offerings (food, value, strollers, attitudes) are going downhill/slipping.

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Old 08-20-2010, 01:01 PM   #632
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That's not true. Free Dining was both more plentiful and lasted longer in 2005 and 2006.
Economy was not that bad in 2005 or 2006. And before that, did you see free DP.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:01 PM   #633
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Now I'm confused. Are you not contending your assertion as firmly as I'm contending mine? We actually do disagree so it shouldn't be surprising that if you try to assert something as defense for what you're saying, that as part of my disagreement I'll point out why your defense either is invalid or doesn't address the assertion I made. Let's stop talking about the discussion, please. I made some points, and asked some questions, in that message. If you want to discuss my message, let's discuss the on-topic aspects of it, okay?
The difference is that I'm just chatting and discussing things that are of interest to me. I'm not dissecting posts and expecting others to prove each and every point that they made. I'm not grading my students' papers, nor defending my thesis either...but this thread sure makes me feel like I am...

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Old 08-20-2010, 01:03 PM   #634
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But what you are saying is that Disney promises a bear minimum of what, say motel 8 promises.
No I'm not. That's what you said. I disagreed with you. See above.

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People are in awe of Disney commericials when everything looks so magical and clean.
Universal's commercials show two children actually flying through the air -- not in a roller coast, actually flying on brooms. Are you going to expect your children will actually fly on brooms, if you bring them to Universal?

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Economy was not that bad in 2005 or 2006.
Precisely my point.

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And before that, did you see free DP.
It wasn't thought-up yet.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:06 PM   #635
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However, you're not digging deep enough: Businesses pursue profit, not for its own merit, but rather to further the financial interests of their owners, which again comes back to society, such as the folks in society who invest their savings, for vacations, for college, for retirement, etc., in stocks, mutual funds, etc. It still comes back to people - on you and me - no matter how you slice it. Those unreasonable expectations we collectively hold as consumers, well we hold comparable expectations when we're investors as well. And that's what drives the way things are.

I think you meant "stakeholder" The term "shareholder" and "stockholder" are synonyms "stockholder, bondholder, part-owner, sharer".

you are correct, typo error early in the morning. Don't need the yourdictionary.com to learn the synonym for shareholder or stockholder.

Again, I think your wording is problematic, and drive a misunderstanding of the reality. Consumers do not have a "vested" interest. They have a non-vested interest... precisely the opposite. That's one of the reasons why when the objectives of consumers and of owners clash, the objectives of the owners win - because the owners have a vested interest while consumers have a non-vested interest.

As mentioned before, you need to operate legally, which includes being honest about what you're offering and what you're going to provide. You also need to provide what you offer safely, and assuring security. Those are the only responsibilities to your customers that could trump the responsibilities to the owners, for the reason mentioned above. You do have other responsibilities to your customers, but those responsibilities are subservient to the responsibilities to the owners. If it doesn't make a difference to the owners, then surely you should be fulfilling those responsibilities to your customers. Indeed, many responsibilities to customers actually serve the interests of the owners, and as such are responsibilities that should be fulfilled because they satisfy the responsibilities to the owners.

I don't disagree, but if push comes to shove, there is a priority, and it is the long-term best interests of the owners, over the interests of customers.

Well, to be fair, I disagree with the premise, and am asserting that the premise actually stems from something other than what is claimed. There is no way for me to see this specific thing from the other side of the fence without refuting what I actually believe. I did say, many times in this thread, that I respect the right of the poster to feel differently. That is effectively "viewing the opinions from the other side of the fence".

Yes, there are. Some things I mentioned earlier in this message (such as the relative priority of vested interests over non-vested interests) are absolutes.

Absolutely. Understand that businesses almost universally do understand the consumer half of the equation, while by contrast consumers understand very little of the marketing, sales and operations management half of the equation.

I guess the best thing to do at this point is what others have done, just hit the ignore button. The only correct opinion or the only correct ideology or the only correct perception comes from the keyboard of Bicker who certainly appears to look at the world around him/her through rose colored glasses. It must be nice to not only have so much disposible income to view WDW as inexpensive, but also to have all the answers and solutions to this worlds problems. I commend you.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:06 PM   #636
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A discretionary income gap - which has nothing to do with what was asserted earlier, that it is because there was a value gap.

That's not true. Free Dining was both more plentiful and lasted longer in 2005 and 2006.

When weren't there deals? Regardless, I did explain why. Market segmentation. And Brunette graciously provided a secondary reason for some of this past year's deals: A discretionary income gap caused by the recession. (Now that we're in recovery, that reason won't apply next year, unless we have a double-dip.)
*
They never, EVER had FREE DINING for one solid, year (365 days). You're assertion is incorrect. They might have had FREE DINING for a few months throughout the year but not for a straight 365 days.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:09 PM   #637
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Originally Posted by brunette8706 View Post
*
But what you are saying is that Disney promises a bear minimum of what, say motel 8 promises. I think that Disney promises so much more than that. People are in awe of Disney commericials when everything looks so magical and clean. And for the most part they are. But I think the poster in question and a few other folks are saying that they are paying a PREMIUM to go to Disney, because DISNEY is top notch that they should receive premium service. Such as shakes that were 16 oz or now 10 oz, turkey legs that were $4.99 in 2007 or now close to $8.00, buffet surcharges (in other words gouging people) CMs that should be more polite etc etc. All this is presented by their slogan "The Most Happiest Place On Earth". This is what's getting people frustrated about Disney. Yes, it's a GREAT PLACE but some of their offerings (food, value, strollers, attitudes) are going downhill/slipping.

Brunette

Right - plus, housekeeping and security are missing from that list that he provided? What about that? I expect my room to be cleaned, and muggers not to come in my room and attack me.

Sure housekeeping is listed elsewhere, but it's not on that list. PLus, the housekeeping blurb I found on my DVC stuff doesn't say that they are going to remove other guests' hair and food. So, there is an implication that rooms will be cleaned, but Disney doesn't in fact get super extensive in what or how they are going to do this (except for DVC as we have Trash and Towel and full, which extensively lists the services provided insofar as emptying of trash, making beds, replacement of towels).

So, based on this, I will in fact say that those of us who are concerned about Disney's direction, have valid reason to feel so. They don't explicitly list all of their services, and frankly, some things can't be listed. There are some areas in which Disney doesn't give specifics, so we as the guest, can't bring that back against them. Saying that they will clean your room, is very generic...my idea of clean, and their idea might not match, so whose cleanliness is going to win out? Again, if there is hair in my room from another guest, and leftover food, that is not reasonable, nor acceptable to me, yet nowhere in their guest literature does it say that they will remove these things for me. Now what?

Tiger

Last edited by Tiger926; 08-20-2010 at 01:15 PM.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:11 PM   #638
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Originally Posted by brunette8706 View Post
**
heheheehe! Yeah, we have to put together another DIS meet! How bout inviting everyone on this thread!? LOL! Remember the golden rule what happens at Disney stays in Disney! LOL!

After this thread runs it's course, which I think will be very soon, (LOL) we'll have something else to discuss and then have to remember that golden rule.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:12 PM   #639
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I guess the best thing to do at this point is what others have done, just hit the ignore button. The only correct opinion or the only correct ideology or the only correct perception comes from the keyboard of Bicker who certainly appears to look at the world around him/her through rose colored glasses. It must be nice to not only have so much disposible income to view WDW as inexpensive, but also to have all the answers and solutions to this worlds problems. I commend you.
**
LOL! You and most everyone on this thread. He gives people:

headaches
click on IGNORE button (2 so far)
frustration
etc.

It's fine to disagree, but he will not let the person offer their opinion. It always has to be refuted, as if the person is a dope or doesn't know what they are talking about. We all can't be wrong. And for the people that do disagree, that's great! At least most give their opinion why. I don't think many here refuted other's opinons. Heck this thread would be boring if we all agreed! We all love Disney or we wouldn't be on these boards. But there are things that have gone downhill and need to be addressed. I hope he doesn't work in Customer Service, or better yet Guest Relations! LOL! Sheesh.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:14 PM   #640
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Ah, my old friend Bicker still arguing away from your mom’s basement. I’ve read through your posts and still cannot figure out what you are arguing.
My opinion, like many others, is that Disney’s overall product has declined over the last few years. Is your opinion that it has not? If it is that is fine as it is your opinion.

I have another example, I also used to live in Burlington, MA. In my opinion it was pretty trashy so we moved to Lexington. The move was based solely on my experiences and opinion of the community. You may disagree but there is no right answer. I thought Burlington was heading in the wrong direction so I moved to what I believe is a better community. I think Disney is decling so I react by going there less.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:16 PM   #641
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Hands down!!!!!!
I love it.

I guess one would have had to been at the Dole Whip meeting to understand the humor in this statement.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:16 PM   #642
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Goofy4prez says: you are correct, typo error early in the morning. Don't need the yourdictionary.com to learn the synonym for shareholder or stockholder.


*
I knew EXACTLY what you were talking about. LOL! We all make spelling mistakes. No worries at all. Frankly I don't have alot of time to proof my spelling and I can't download the spell check on my work computer. LOL!
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:17 PM   #643
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Quote:
Free Dining was both more plentiful and lasted longer in 2005 and 2006.
They never, EVER had FREE DINING for one solid, year (365 days).
Of course not. I never said that it did.

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You're assertion is incorrect.
It wasn't my assertion; you made it up.
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:17 PM   #644
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It wasn't thought-up yet.
That is your respond? So what made them think of countless deals after all? Market segmentation or whatever you call your opinion or decrease in people comming for due to economics and price increase?
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Old 08-20-2010, 01:19 PM   #645
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*
They never, EVER had FREE DINING for one solid, year (365 days). You're assertion is incorrect. They might have had FREE DINING for a few months throughout the year but not for a straight 365 days.
Exactly, so since it's been pointed out time and again that we are wrong about the reason for Disney offering the Free Dining promo, let's figure out why Disney is offering the promo:

1. They are being nice, so they are rewarding customers
2. They have extra food to throw around
3. The chefs and servers need more training on serving guests
4. Resorts are not at full capacity
5. Profits are down
6. They are using it as a marketing ploy to lure in new guests
7. They know that their prices are too high, so they are discounting everything: food, recreation, Photopass, merchandise and resorts in order to draw guests back

What do you all think is the reason? I come from a business family, so I know there are various reasons why businesses discount their products and services. Disney has NEVER offered Free Dining for an entire year, ever! Why now?

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