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Old 11-02-2013, 11:44 AM   #46
doconeill


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Originally Posted by Tonka's Skipper View Post
Of course in the last few months Natural gas is going up and its expected to continue.!

It could at some point end up just a expensive as diesel.

Am I correct natural gas mileage is less as well?

AKK
From what I remember, CNG mileage per "gallon equivalent" was better than a standard gasoline/diesel engine, but worse than a typical hybrid, at least with cars. Not too many hybrid buses out there.

However, there is a less tank capacity (it's a compressed gas, not a liquid, in most cases), so you need to fill more often than with gasoline.

I know at one point at least a CNG "gallon equivalent" was priced at about half that of gasoline. Not sure currently. But as mentioned, natural gas prices go up, just as they do every winter, as people heat their homes.
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Old 11-02-2013, 03:25 PM   #47
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A few months ago, there was talk about hybrid buses. I saw several brought around for testing but I'm not sure if anything ever became of that.
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Old 11-02-2013, 04:06 PM   #48
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A few months ago, there was talk about hybrid buses. I saw several brought around for testing but I'm not sure if anything ever became of that.
Those weren't hybrid buses...they are double "articulated" buses that consume twice the gas...but haul more flesh.

And the fact that they are rebuilding the MK bus station to suit them is a bad sign for any mode of transportation not named "buses"
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:59 PM   #49
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I'm not sure if Disney has any or has tried any but Hybrid Buses do exist! The local transit authority here Louisville actually has quite a few of them. They are much more expensive to buy initially, but heck, they use taxpayer dollars to do that. Their operation is keeper however because they get considerably better fuel economy.
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:04 PM   #50
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No, no, no. I know for a fact that they were hybrid buses. You're going to have to trust me on this one. This wasn't in a guest area. It was out by the distribution warehouses.
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:11 PM   #51
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I do recall something about them testing an all-electric around Ft. Wilderness during the summer.

They did test a hybrid Gillig bus back around 2007/2008, but I don't believe they kept it. It cost around 3x as much as a standard Gillig when they were buying more buses then. I haven't heard about any hybrids, unless the new artic buses for POP/AoA are hybrid - but I haven't heard anything to confirm they are.
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:16 PM   #52
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Hybrid buses would be cool, I liked the idea, but I'm still a huge fan of the monorail system. I'd love to see a light rail or extended monorail system. I know that's a long shot though.
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Old 11-02-2013, 09:36 PM   #53
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Of course in the last few months Natural gas is going up and its expected to continue.! It could at some point end up just a expensive as diesel. Am I correct natural gas mileage is less as well? AKK
Up here in western North Dakota we are burning off enough natural gas at the oil wells to heat multiple states or run 1000's of busses every year. It is just burned off to get to the oil. Look at a google earth view of western ND it is crazy. It has been getting better but we need more pipelines both oil and gas lines to get the product refined and to the rest of you.

The payback on switching a over the road truck to natural gas is 3 years just need the infrastructure to make it work. With disney logging lots of miles but actually not getting anywhere the savings has to be quite substantial over dealing with another monorail.
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:40 PM   #54
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I don't believe any of the high speed rail projects included stops at WDW.

AKK
Yes, the last incarnation of the scuttled HSR did include a stop for Disney, but it didn't get far enough to say exactly where it would be located.
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:50 PM   #55
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And to add...

The majority of Disney buses do and have run for a decade on compressed natural gas... Not diesel.

They typically aren't waiting in line next to the Hess station for a fillup
This is absolutely incorrect. ALL Disney buses burn diesel. The fueling station is behind the MK Hess station.

Disney has run trials of diesel hybrid and all-electric buses over the past few years, but none have passed muster. There is another all-electric bus in house for testing now.
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:58 PM   #56
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I can only imagine what a logistical nightmare that would be for a private group... Unless they could invoke eminent domain. Even thought Florida is still "sparten" in development, seems like it would be tough to do.

And then once the train gets to MCO? Are they gonna hook up to wdw (which they would have to For viability) and get Disney to go along without near total control? That ain't happening.
The project is to run conventional trains between Miami & MCO. There is no Disney connection or involvement.

The lead partner is CSX, which owns the trackage from Miami to somewhere around Port Canaveral. The only additional right of way is from the coast to Orlando, and then onto the airport. They have been in negotiations with Florida DOT & the Orlando aviation authority for that; no private land is needed.
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:17 PM   #57
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The automated systems (some have called them "pods") are actually known as PRT, for Personal Rapid Transit.

They would have capacity issues, but that can be alleviated somewhat by building stations with multiple docks, so several cars can load at once. Also, AI scheduling algorithms would route empty cars to areas that are expected to have upcoming heavy demand, and possibly keep some empty cars circulating through the system.

But the real problem with PRT is, though it sounds great and entrepreneurs have been pushing it literally for decades, no one has yet succeeded in building a system with multiple interlocking lines. A few prototype systems have been built, including a shuttle in Dubai and a new system at Heathrow Airport, but a full-blown automated-switching PRT system is still unproven technology.

If Walt were alive, he might very well be pushing for such a system. But today's Disney Corp is a lot more about money and a lot less about Vision. I think they're highly unlikely to invest in something so cutting-edge. And with their current penny-pinching ways, if they did, they'd probably botch it up.
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Old 11-04-2013, 12:28 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by joelkfla View Post
This is absolutely incorrect. ALL Disney buses burn diesel. The fueling station is behind the MK Hess station.

Disney has run trials of diesel hybrid and all-electric buses over the past few years, but none have passed muster. There is another all-electric bus in house for testing now.
Unless they have massively switched gears...the "belchers" Were to be all but eliminated years ago. And if I remember correctly...buses were
Dispatched from a Couple of Spots...not just magic kingdom.

But I'm all for new - or in this case old - info
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Old 11-04-2013, 12:31 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joelkfla View Post
The project is to run conventional trains between Miami & MCO. There is no Disney connection or involvement.

The lead partner is CSX, which owns the trackage from Miami to somewhere around Port Canaveral. The only additional right of way is from the coast to Orlando, and then onto the airport. They have been in negotiations with Florida DOT & the Orlando aviation authority for that; no private land is needed.
A line without a connection to wdw is beyond pointless/useless

It would be like running a train from Phoenix to Reno and not stopping in Vegas... There's no damn point.
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Old 11-04-2013, 09:09 AM   #60
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A line without a connection to wdw is beyond pointless/useless

It would be like running a train from Phoenix to Reno and not stopping in Vegas... There's no damn point.
Absolutely Correct!

The station tying in WDW would be the pod or light rail connection!(whispering.........maybe even a Monorail).


I never understood the end of the line being MCO, it just didn't make sense.


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