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Old 10-29-2013, 09:52 PM   #16
disneynutz


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IMO Disney will use FP+ to control crowds and reward guests based on where they are staying. They might offer FP+ as part of a package like DDP with a reservation and tickets. They could also offer them as a cost add on.

This won't happen until we all get trained and addicted to using them.

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Old 10-29-2013, 10:20 PM   #17
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This probably won't be popular but I like the idea of passes being offered with a FP+ add-on. They do it for hoppers and no expiration so why not this too?
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Old 10-29-2013, 10:55 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin Dad View Post
I heard from a CM (I know, take with a grain of salt) that off property guest will have a heck of a time getting FPs come Christmas time. The other thing I noticed when we were messing with FP+ last week was how hard the system tried to spread you out with selections and return times. We really had to fiddle with it to get rides times that are close together. And don't even get me started on trying to get two different accounts to match up.
If I were going at Christmas and staying off site I might be tempted to do what another poster did. She booked an extra day at the beginning of her trip at a Disney value resort. She already had UCT 5 day tickets. She got magic bands and could schedule FP+ for 5 days over a 14 day period. It didn't matter that she only stayed one day at a Disney hotel. She had already returned home and had no problems at all on her trip. Might be worth paying for one night in a Value to have access to FP+ for your whole offsite Christmas trip.

Just to clarify, I am not going to WDW over Christmas. I plan on waiting until the MB/FP+ situation has been thoroughly worked out. At that point I count on there being several threads here and at Touringplans.com telling me how to best use the new system.
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:15 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPCummerbund View Post
After reading through a lot of posts about Magic Bands and current guests' experiences, it has me wondering where Magic Bands / MDE will be in another year or two (or several years down the road).

Will paper FP- really disappear in a few months? If so, will guests still get only 3 FP+ per day, at one park?

Does Disney have anything else in mind for MDE other than Fastpasses?


What do you think?


Here are some of my guesses:

1) FP+ was rolled out as a way to get guests to spend less time in line and more time in gift shops and restaurants. The current limit of 3 per day doesn't do that - instead, it's probably leading to MORE time in line for most people who are used to getting twice as many FP- (or more) per day. AFAIK, guests can book one ride per window, and each window is one hour. I would not be surprised if eventually every hour of the day is filled with Fastpass reservations. You'll literally be able to plan your way around every park.

2) If Disney allows one ride per hour, and the average wait is 20 minutes or so plus maybe 10 minutes per ride, that leaves guests 30 minutes out of every hour to stand around waiting for their next ride (assuming they picked a ride nearby, instead of crisscrossing the park). Plenty of time to do some shopping or pick up a snack.

3) Of course, if everybody can schedule every single hour, then they'd fill up the fastpass lines entirely, and there'd be no standby line, thus eliminating the entire system. So, Disney has to limit the number of FP+ somehow. Perhaps off property guests get fewer FP+, or maybe Deluxe resort guests get more than Value resort guests.
Here's my guess:
Off site: 3 FP+
Value Resort: 6 FP+
Moderate Resort: 9 FP+
Deluxe / DVC Resorts: 12 FP+ (the whole day)

4) Disney eliminates Extra Magic Hours. The whole point of EMH is to experience the parks when they're least crowded, so you can go on more rides. Keeping the parks open that extra hour is expensive for Disney - if they can accomplish the same goal by giving resorts guests more FP+, they can save money.


I'd be interested to hear whether anyone else has any ideas about where Disney can/might go with the whole MDE system.
Ooooo, one more thing I just thought of and wonder what you predict. Will Disneyland Resort and WDW eventually have the same Fastpass policy? There does not seem to be a timeline for moving DLR to MB/FP+ that I can find. Will DLR keep the legacy fastpass system (FP-)? The two resorts do not currently have the same ticket systems so there is a history of each resort doing it's own thing. In addition the two places are totally different animals.

WDW is very resort driven, tons of over night guests, with many staying in resort hotels and offsite for various lengths of time.

DLR only has 3 smallish hotels and it's attendance is largely made up of the local SoCal population. Tons of day guests. Are those folks who pop over after work going to make FP+ reservations 60 days before they pop over?

Interested to see what you guys think.
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Old 10-30-2013, 01:07 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Ciz View Post
WDW is very resort driven, tons of over night guests, with many staying in resort hotels and offsite for various lengths of time.

DLR only has 3 smallish hotels and it's attendance is largely made up of the local SoCal population. Tons of day guests. Are those folks who pop over after work going to make FP+ reservations 60 days before they pop over?

Interested to see what you guys think.
You're right about this. Whatever FP+ ends up being at DL, it won't be the same as at WDW. I'm guessing more of an "FP+ Lite". The virtual queuing aspect is still just as important there - Disney needs to encourage those after work visitors to stay for dinner and buy souvenirs too.
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:33 AM   #21
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For those of you guessing that EMH will go away, how can you state that Disney is not making any money off the EMH? Do you honestly think that if the concept was not plausible they would have cut it long before now?

Disney is a corporate entity, with shareholders and they are attempting to gain as much information from their guests as see patterns and find out what makes a typical guest tick. Disney got sideswiped from HP and now is trying to play catchup. They are and will always be the kings in central Florida; however what they are attempting to do, from my perspective, is to make every park a full day park to get the most out of every guest they can. And also to make the guest experience the best i the industry, which they have slipped some in my opinion.

Fastpass+ is here to stay, and Legacy Fastpass are going the way of the dinosaurs but the next new experience MDE or something else, but its only a wait and see as we can only speculate as to what it may be. Changes happen for the simple reason to make things better, sometimes they don't always work as planned, but I can guarantee you that with the supposed $1B behind MB and MDE, this plan was thought out extensively. IMO
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:59 AM   #22
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The bigger goal will be to get more money from us.
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:16 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowellfam6 View Post
For those of you guessing that EMH will go away, how can you state that Disney is not making any money off the EMH? Do you honestly think that if the concept was not plausible they would have cut it long before now?
Good question...it depends on the statistical model they're using. They probably have something that says there is an inherent benefit to it...whether in addition room bookings or ancillaries. I do know for a fact that the program has not been a profit driver. Profit is not in getting people into the parks an hour early so they can grab fastpasses and ride hop. That costs disney money (no...no profit in tickets either). If you notice...people run past the giftshops on their way to the rides on early mornings...that's practically a death sentence.

There also has been a very distinct corporate shift the last few years at TWDC...."making" money hasn't been enough...its now shifting to "making a minimum of X % of money"...which is dangerous to consumers/fans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowellfam6 View Post
Disney got sideswiped from HP and now is trying to play catchup. They are and will always be the kings in central Florida; however what they are attempting to do, from my perspective, is to make every park a full day park to get the most out of every guest they can. And also to make the guest experience the best i the industry, which they have slipped some in my opinion.
Disney in no way got "sideswiped" by Universal. Universal has made alot of new revenues and packed them in...but disney's profits have increased right along. And that is why disney can do whatever the hell they want - including nothing. They always make more...period.
They may be trying to increase the appeal of their parks longterm - but that is far from certain. The theory of the "feeder parks"..i.e. smaller day parks feed their attendees into the larger/more shopping laden areas...is a valid theory (i'm convinced). And while their offerings and service have most definitely slipped...that is a longterm concern - if at all. In the short term, they have been and are raking it in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowellfam6 View Post
Changes happen for the simple reason to make things better, sometimes they don't always work as planned, but I can guarantee you that with the supposed $1B behind MB and MDE, this plan was thought out extensively. IMO
Changes in Walt Disney World happen to make more money...period. If you want to look for the reasons as to "how" and "Why"...you need to start there and work your way back.
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:18 AM   #24
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I find it hard to believe that Disney would eliminate EMH.

It's a huge draw for people like me and DW in our early 20s. We don't have kids and we get to experience a less crowded park. Plus, I just like the park better at night. We prefer to go to the park from 11am-midnight as opposed to 9am-10pm. It's just the inverse of rope drop.

At the end of the day, I'm also more likely to spend more money. Whatever is in my pocket is what is left for the days budget, with no more meals or expenses. If I've still got $20 in my pocket and am walking out of the park, I'm more likely to buy a shirt or something with it.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:41 AM   #25
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We were there for the initial testing a couple of weeks ago (Oct 16-23) at Wilderness Lodge. Based on a conversation with a manager there about MM+, they are eventually going to implement more "pay more get more" options for it. The example used was something like the lights in the walkway at Epcot in Future World lighting up as you walk through it (so long as you have your band on and have paid for it!). So I'm guessing it will be multi-tiered, like the Magic Your Way tickets. You want Cinderella to know your child's name and birthday when you see her? You want a fountain to come to life when you walk by? Pay up, ya'll.

Base level gets you some magic.

Next level....EVER MORE MAGIC.

Top level.....SO MUCH MAGIC YOU WILL DOO-DOO IN YOUR PANTS.

Etc.

(I'm also guessing this means each tier will have more FP+ options.)
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Old 10-30-2013, 01:37 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
Good question...it depends on the statistical model they're using.
Statistics can say what ever the data inputter is trying to make them say. I'm just pointing out that Disney does not do anything without completely evaluating all aspects and costs associated with any project.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
Disney in no way got "sideswiped" by Universal. Universal has made alot of new revenues and packed them in...but disney's profits have increased right along. And that is why disney can do whatever the hell they want - including nothing. They always make more...period.
I disagree a bit, I personally don't think that Disney felt that the increase that HP gave Uni would be as great. I admit that Disney's profits have increased over the same period of time, and I fully understand why. However, I do suspect that the powers that be did not see the power of HP, why else would Avatar even be considered? I admit that HP and Avatar are polar opposites; however why would Dis venture away from what its core has always been.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
They may be trying to increase the appeal of their parks longterm - but that is far from certain. The theory of the "feeder parks"..i.e. smaller day parks feed their attendees into the larger/more shopping laden areas...is a valid theory (i'm convinced). And while their offerings and service have most definitely slipped...that is a longterm concern - if at all. In the short term, they have been and are raking it in.
I don't think the feeder park concept is accurate, I think they are trying to get 4 solid full day parks, and having the feeders as being the new Disney Springs and other outside park adventures.(i.e. resorts, water parks, things like that). I do agree with your theory of getting feeders to plow park attendance, but I admit that parks are too expensive to just be half day or smaller entities, they are trying to get the most out of all of the parks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
Changes in Walt Disney World happen to make more money...period. If you want to look for the reasons as to "how" and "Why"...you need to start there and work your way back.
I TOTALLY agree it is all about the money, that's why they are very calculated in what they are doing rather than just the Eisner era. I see vast changes behind the scenes rather than in front for the guests to see. I feel that Disney is doing a lot behind the scenes to get the most out of what they have, and not trying to add. All be it they will add, to keep them coming, but it will be more pronounced behind the scenes. IMO. I agree with everything you are saying, we both know that for Disney it's all about the money.....it will always be about the money now!!!
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Old 10-30-2013, 03:14 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelaF View Post
We were there for the initial testing a couple of weeks ago (Oct 16-23) at Wilderness Lodge. Based on a conversation with a manager there about MM+, they are eventually going to implement more "pay more get more" options for it. The example used was something like the lights in the walkway at Epcot in Future World lighting up as you walk through it (so long as you have your band on and have paid for it!). So I'm guessing it will be multi-tiered, like the Magic Your Way tickets. You want Cinderella to know your child's name and birthday when you see her? You want a fountain to come to life when you walk by? Pay up, ya'll.

Base level gets you some magic.

Next level....EVER MORE MAGIC.

Top level.....SO MUCH MAGIC YOU WILL DOO-DOO IN YOUR PANTS.

Etc.

(I'm also guessing this means each tier will have more FP+ options.)
OMG your post made me laugh so hard - especially the top level line! I don't think I would pay for lights lighting up, a fountain or such "extra magic", but I'm sure some people would.
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:07 PM   #28
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I'll also add....

To be honest, I don't understand all the hate on the Magic Bands. Are we supposed to be mad that they are collecting data? Or are we supposed to be mad that a corporation - that most of us enjoy, to whatever degree, or we wouldn't be on these boards - is implementing a business strategy that is designed to make more money? Because if that's the case, I'm not sure when we were all taught that Disney is the ultimate altruistic company. They are in the entertainment business. They are not MAKING YOU spend any money you are not WILLINGLY spending.

We had a number of hiccups with our bands when we were there the other week, and a number of issues with the MyDisneyExperience app and website for a couple of those days. But it's also JUST getting rolled out. I fully expect them to make changes and fix those problems. In every instance, the cast members were very gracious and helpful and apologetic about the situation. Overall, I found the bands to be very useful and handy. I genuinely don't understand the backlash. If you want to make money off Disney, buy stock. If you don't want to give Disney any money, stay home. But don't blame them for doing what they - as a business - are meant to be doing. All the complaints about Disney being "all about the money"...well then why are you still giving them yours, if that is upsetting to you?
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Old 10-30-2013, 09:42 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
I'd like to know who is truly excited about this thing? I don't mean "tolerate"...or "benefit of the doubt" - I fall Into those categories...
I mean "truly excited"

Can you honestly say that...perhaps other than some of the clinical OCD types...that only the developers of the hardware and the accountants could be geeked up about this?
I'm just curious...
I was thinking this exact same thing the other night. I feel like Disney is not even really making an attempt to "sell" this as a positive thing (whether it really is positive for the customer or not). It seems like a half hearted effort for something that costs $1.5bil to implement. There are WAY too many questions (go see the TPAaS board) that are still unanswered. I get that this is still in the testing phase but I would go ahead and call this 80% implemented with what we are hearing about Legacy FP. Still though there are too many questions for offsite guests and number of FP+ people should/could/will get once fully implemented. The panic this has caused is probably overstated a little on the boards because people are more willing to talk when something negative happens over something positive but it's tough to ignore.

I'm with you on "benefit of the doubt".
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:03 PM   #30
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I'll also add....

To be honest, I don't understand all the hate on the Magic Bands. Are we supposed to be mad that they are collecting data? Or are we supposed to be mad that a corporation - that most of us enjoy, to whatever degree, or we wouldn't be on these boards - is implementing a business strategy that is designed to make more money? Because if that's the case, I'm not sure when we were all taught that Disney is the ultimate altruistic company. They are in the entertainment business. They are not MAKING YOU spend any money you are not WILLINGLY spending.

We had a number of hiccups with our bands when we were there the other week, and a number of issues with the MyDisneyExperience app and website for a couple of those days. But it's also JUST getting rolled out. I fully expect them to make changes and fix those problems. In every instance, the cast members were very gracious and helpful and apologetic about the situation. Overall, I found the bands to be very useful and handy. I genuinely don't understand the backlash. If you want to make money off Disney, buy stock. If you don't want to give Disney any money, stay home. But don't blame them for doing what they - as a business - are meant to be doing. All the complaints about Disney being "all about the money"...well then why are you still giving them yours, if that is upsetting to you?
Honestly, I don't think the magic bands are a bad thing. Sure, they could have had more of the kinks worked out before they started testing them on people, but all in all not a bad thing. However, I am not a fan of the FP+ component. Making reservations 60 days ahead bothers me the most. I wish they had left that part alone because it worked well for me. At some point I will be visiting WDW again and I hope the whole FP+ issue will not be as bad as I imagine it will be. Only time will tell. I'll plan my next visit after all this is thoroughly sorted out.
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