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Old 10-21-2013, 08:59 AM   #211
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Originally Posted by OklahomaTourist View Post

For every one person thinking AvatarLand is a good idea, I've got to believe there are at least five, maybe ten, who are ready to plunk down serious cash right now if a Star Wars land were to about to open up. SW is a huge social icon the world around...Avatar...big individual movie, but social icon?? Not so much.
I agree. IMO, DHS needs far more attention than AK. An expanded Star Wars area would be huge.
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Old 10-21-2013, 09:52 AM   #212
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It is my opinion that Disney hasn't produced anything to match or exceed Spider Man at Universal from a technology standpoint. It debuted 13 years ago. Since then, Universal has created yet another ride, Harry Potter, that hasn't been matched or exceeded by Disney.

I gather that the new Fantasy Land refurb is supposed to be Disney's answer to Harry Potter Land. Although it will be a great addition to the park, I don't see it as meeting nor exceeding that which Universal created.

What Avatar Land has going against it is that few people have the connection to Avatar that they do to Harry Potter. It was wildly popular in the theaters, but never had that same lasting connection to the audience. That is why I feel an investment in Star Wars would be money better spent. Not only could Disney meet the standard set by Universal, but it could also exceed it in a big way.

Yet, barring a switch over to a Star Wars land, I am in agreement that whatever they cook up has to be mind blowing.
Agreed!! Universal when it comes to rides beats Disney hands down. Disney for a lot of things are amazing BUT they do need to up their game when it comes to new rides.
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Old 10-21-2013, 02:19 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by boreas154 View Post
I really think that most of the issue folks have is related to using the 'Avatar' name.

If on the other hand they had said:

"Our Imagineers are at work in conjunction with a major Hollywood director on an Animal Kingdom expansion. This area will be based off a mythical vibrant and colorful world. Featuring floating mountains, bioluminescent plants, and fantastical creatures. This land will appeal to all of our senses. Also in the works are new rides and experiences for our guests that tie in wonderfully with our overall vision of the Animal Kingdom park."

etc, etc...

Even if you had never heard of (or seen) Avatar, I think this would have gone over better.

Absolutely!
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Old 12-30-2013, 12:28 AM   #214
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I agree. IMO, DHS needs far more attention than AK. An expanded Star Wars area would be huge.
~Plans for Avatarland were put in place long before Disney acquired full ownership the Star Wars empire. Avatarland is the reason Disney was finally able to negotiate a feasible deal with Lucas. Hopefully, we'll have a Star Wars land and Pixar expansion sometime in 2020!
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Old 12-30-2013, 07:42 AM   #215
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~Plans for Avatarland were put in place long before Disney acquired full ownership the Star Wars empire. Avatarland is the reason Disney was finally able to negotiate a feasible deal with Lucas. Hopefully, we'll have a Star Wars land and Pixar expansion sometime in 2020!
Ok...I'll bite...
Explanation on the Lucas tie in here?

And also, 2020? There amusement park rides for gods sakes...I'd like to see some of this stuff before I'm dead...and I'm not 40 yet.
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Old 12-31-2013, 07:13 AM   #216
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Ok...I'll bite...
Explanation on the Lucas tie in here?

And also, 2020? There amusement park rides for gods sakes...I'd like to see some of this stuff before I'm dead...and I'm not 40 yet.
~Hey lockedout, it's been awhile! Okay, I'm ready to spill the tea, lol. Apparently, the relationship between Disney and Lucas was a troubled one. Lucas was extremely guarded and protective of his precious Star Wars IP much like JK Rowling, severely limiting Disney in how they could utilize the IP in the parks and to their benefit and otherwise.

~Lucas founded Pixar and while he was impressed with how Disney handled that acquisition from Jobs. Lucas did not want Disney to mess up his vision of Star Wars. Iger kept on asking and Lucas told Iger during a private breakfast at Hollywood Brown Derby that he will let him know if and when he's ready.

~Anyway, it is no secret that James Cameron wanted Avatar to be the next Star Wars! While, Avatar may not be Star Wars -- it holds the box office record for highest grossing film. James Cameron is still committed to Avatar with the upcoming Avatar sequels.

~When Disney announced the deal with Cameron for Avatarland, it immediatedly caught Lucas's attention. He must have been concerned about Avatar upstaging Star Wars presence at Disney. And that his IP could fall between the cracks, meaning that Disney would no longer be interested in hosting Star Wars.

~Iger knew from the beginning that Avatar would not be the answer for Harry Potter, but Star Wars could. George Lucas wanted his IP to continue to thrive and he definitely did not want Star Wars to be lost in Avatar's shadow.

~For decades Lucas had no incentive to sell, but now with Avatar as an option, Iger was in a much better position to negotiate and leverage Lucas into an acceptable price.

~With all of the news surrounding Avatarland, Iger finally got a phone call from Lucas. Lucas was not comfortable about this deal but the James Cameron and Avatar relationship with Disney made him nervous.



~While Lucas has given up all control to Disney, he still has tremendous influence over his IP. He just doesn't trust Disney entirely, so Lucas made Kathleen Kennedy president of Lucasfilm which must remain intact and the next Star Wars film will be released under her authority -- so technically he's still calling the shots with the films.

~I'm not 40 yet either, but I might be by the time Disney finishes Star Wars land, if they ever start. It's so funny, I hope we're not to old to see a Star Wars ever.

~Now, that Disney has made the deal of a lifetime, I'm still not convinced that they are eager to build a Star Wars land. Disney just did not want Universal or anyone else to get their hands on it. If Harry Potter 2 is not a huge success than Disney won't do anything else in the parks, we'll see.
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Old 12-31-2013, 07:24 AM   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRDISNEYMD View Post
~Hey lockedout, it's been awhile! Okay, I'm ready to spill the tea, lol. Apparently, the relationship between Disney and Lucas was a troubled one. Lucas was extremely guarded and protective of his precious Star Wars IP much like JK Rowling, severely limiting Disney in how they could utilize the IP in the parks and to their benefit and otherwise.

~Lucas founded Pixar and while he was impressed with how Disney handled that acquisition from Jobs. Lucas did not want Disney to mess up his vision of Star Wars. Iger kept on asking and Lucas told Iger during a private breakfast at Hollywood Brown Derby that he will let him know if and when he's ready.

~Anyway, it is no secret that James Cameron wanted Avatar to be the next Star Wars! While, Avatar may not be Star Wars -- it holds the box office record for highest grossing film. James Cameron is still committed to Avatar with the upcoming Avatar sequels.

~When Disney announced the deal with Cameron for Avatarland, it immediatedly caught Lucas's attention. He must have been concerned about Avatar upstaging Star Wars presence at Disney. And that his IP could fall between the cracks, meaning that Disney would no longer be interested in hosting Star Wars.

~Iger knew from the beginning that Avatar would not be the answer for Harry Potter, but Star Wars could. George Lucas wanted his IP to continue to thrive and he definitely did not want Star Wars to be lost in Avatar's shadow.

~For decades Lucas had no incentive to sell, but now with Avatar as an option, Iger was in a much better position to negotiate and leverage Lucas into an acceptable price.

~With all of the news surrounding Avatarland, Iger finally got a phone call from Lucas. Lucas was not comfortable about this deal but the James Cameron and Avatar relationship with Disney made him nervous.



~While Lucas has given up all control to Disney, he still has tremendous influence over his IP. He just doesn't trust Disney entirely, so Lucas made Kathleen Kennedy president of Lucasfilm which must remain intact and the next Star Wars film will be released under her authority -- so technically he's still calling the shots with the films.

~I'm not 40 yet either, but I might be by the time Disney finishes Star Wars land, if they ever start. It's so funny, I hope we're not to old to see a Star Wars ever.

~Now, that Disney has made the deal of a lifetime, I'm still not convinced that they are eager to build a Star Wars land. Disney just did not want Universal or anyone else to get their hands on it. If Harry Potter 2 is not a huge success than Disney won't do anything else in the parks, we'll see.
Wow-- it sounds like you were there for the negotiations--

I like this theory(?) and hope it can spark some new development.

It's best to rely on your mental age-- sometimes I am 10.
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Old 01-01-2014, 07:30 AM   #218
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Wow-- it sounds like you were there for the negotiations--

I like this theory(?) and hope it can spark some new development.

It's best to rely on your mental age-- sometimes I am 10.
~Hey beer dave! I don't think this is a compliment! I guess instead of simply spilling the tea, I must have drowned poor LOL in it! He asked...

~But yeah, I'm fighting so hard to keep my inner child alive! And, I think 10 is a wonderful age!
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Old 01-01-2014, 10:37 AM   #219
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Originally Posted by DRDISNEYMD View Post
~Hey beer dave! I don't think this is a compliment! I guess instead of simply spilling the tea, I must have drowned poor LOL in it! He asked...

~But yeah, I'm fighting so hard to keep my inner child alive! And, I think 10 is a wonderful age!

Not an insult either-- just amazement at the level of development given to your concept, leading to the question " was she there for this" I can't write things like a lot of you do on here-- Just the occasional observation linked with a quip.

I rely on the writers here to provide the plot for the show. Then I sit in the cheap seats and heckle.
Thanks.
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:53 PM   #220
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That was a very detailed take on Lucas and Cameron, Dr.

But I'm gonna have to go ahead and reject it flat out...

The main problem is the concept that somehow Lucas was threatened by Cameron...maybe on some USC geek, director, special effects level...
But not on money which is what matters

Star Wars has made a
Fortune in everything they've done for 35 years...it's just on another plane

Like Wdw and universal... Fans "hope" they're close so they'll duel it out in steel and French fries...
But that's simply not the case.

I think officially Lucas just realized he couldn't produce anything that sets the standard anymore:.. Caught by the Cameron's, Jackson, Abrams of the world...and just dumped what cost him originally nothing for a cool 4 billion smackers plus I'm sure future considerations
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Old 01-03-2014, 01:29 AM   #221
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Originally Posted by beer dave View Post
Not an insult either-- just amazement at the level of development given to your concept, leading to the question " was she there for this" I can't write things like a lot of you do on here-- Just the occasional observation linked with a quip.

I rely on the writers here to provide the plot for the show. Then I sit in the cheap seats and heckle.
Thanks.
~No, I wasn't there. But I read a few articles that broke down the deal. I think you're an excellent writer and that you should write more! And, you are VIP, so no cheap seats for you but you can still heckle.

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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
That was a very detailed take on Lucas and Cameron, Dr.

But I'm gonna have to go ahead and reject it flat out...

The main problem is the concept that somehow Lucas was threatened by Cameron...maybe on some USC geek, director, special effects level...
But not on money which is what matters

Star Wars has made a
Fortune in everything they've done for 35 years...it's just on another plane

Like Wdw and universal... Fans "hope" they're close so they'll duel it out in steel and French fries...
But that's simply not the case.

I think officially Lucas just realized he couldn't produce anything that sets the standard anymore:.. Caught by the Cameron's, Jackson, Abrams of the world...and just dumped what cost him originally nothing for a cool 4 billion smackers plus I'm sure future considerations
~This doesn't surprise me at all. I don't think Lucas is threatened by Cameron. Cameron actually looks up to Lucas. Why sell now? You say, the money matters, but apparently not to Lucas. He sold his entire empire for a *fraction* of what it was worth, after decades of not budging -- and shortly after the Avatarland deal but well before Avatarland starts construction. It could be a coincidence, I don't know. But it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. I just hope Lucas required Disney to build Star Wars land at DHS as part of the deal!

~I'm glad you're finally excited about Avatarland! It's about time. The World of Pandora is going to be fabulous!
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:31 PM   #222
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I think Lucas sold Because he is - frankly - an aging man who lost his game and ran out of creative juice.

And I still think Disney is hitching his cart to a broken down horse here.

Even if avatarland is done the best possible... Still think the predominant reaction is gonna be
"That's really cool... But avatar is
Kinda dumb"

Because it is...and that's still an issue. The characters do matter...
There's reason why Mickey Mouse rules the parks but Tom and Jerry and woody woodpecker don't...
There's a reason why marvel and Harry potter
Have been leased at IOA for a small
Fortune and six flags had paid DC for 25
Years.

It does matter...which is now the main counterargument to the doubters of this hairbrained scheme
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:39 PM   #223
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There's reason why Mickey Mouse rules the parks but Tom and Jerry and woody woodpecker don't...


It does matter...which is now the main counterargument to the doubters of this hairbrained scheme
Isn't mickey mouse popular because of the attachment to Disney? I always thought the MM cartoons were lame. They don't have the adult tie in references like the old Bugs Bunny stuff. As a stand alone character, I would take bugs any day over MM.
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:11 PM   #224
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
And I still think Disney is hitching his cart to a broken down horse here.

Even if avatarland is done the best possible... Still think the predominant reaction is gonna be
"That's really cool... But avatar is
Kinda dumb"

Because it is...and that's still an issue. The characters do matter...
There's reason why Mickey Mouse rules the parks but Tom and Jerry and woody woodpecker don't...
There's a reason why marvel and Harry potter
Have been leased at IOA for a small
Fortune and six flags had paid DC for 25
Years.

It does matter...which is now the main counterargument to the doubters of this hairbrained scheme
This logic makes absolutely no sense to me. When you look at facts: The popularity of various rides, it isn't the defining characteristic. It is an extra plus, but not a necessity for success. Mickey mouse is only iconic because Walt made him the icon, NOT because of his cartoons. According to your logic people shouldn't like Splash Mountain, Tower of Terror, Space Mountain, Test Track, Rockin' Rollercoaster and all the other rides that aren't based on a current major franchise. Some are from cultural things that are old and some aren't based on a cultural icon of any kind, movie or otherwise. Obviously these rides are popular for the RIDE and any association is just gravy.

Therefore, it is the IDEA of Pandora, the creative environment that EVERYBODY loved in 2010 that is the good idea, not the movie. If Pandora is done right people will love it without even thinking about the movie. And then if Avatar 2,3, and 4 are successful and turn into a franchise that will be GRAVY for Disney, but will not be necessary for success.
There is an extra plus for a real franchise like Star Wars and HP that will increase attendance for the fans, but that is not necessary for a successful ride or for Pandora to be a success. Other rides and areas prove this.

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Isn't mickey mouse popular because of the attachment to Disney? I always thought the MM cartoons were lame. They don't have the adult tie in references like the old Bugs Bunny stuff. As a stand alone character, I would take bugs any day over MM.
Absolutely correct! Mickey is known and the other characters are not known because Walt chose to put Mickey in the forefront. It has nothing to do with a successful "franchise" of cartoons.
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:08 PM   #225
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Isn't mickey mouse popular because of the attachment to Disney? I always thought the MM cartoons were lame. They don't have the adult tie in references like the old Bugs Bunny stuff. As a stand alone character, I would take bugs any day over MM.
Mickey Mouse and the Disney company are cultural phenomena that are in the same boat...like coke and yes...star wars...

Bugs doesn't quite stand up...no empire was built around him.

Besides... Foghorn leghorn was the brains of the operation anyway
And Taz was the muscle
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