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Old 07-30-2013, 04:32 PM   #61
dairylives
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
To be fair...

You're reaching big time and you know it.

Conventions can't be held as an indicator of widespread popularity...nor can anything where there are fewer people in street clothes than in costume.

That live action show has been MIA since 2005...in fact...I can't even remember if Disney hasn't said that they'd pull the plug...did they?

And the clone wars is a nice cartoon show...but it is a cartoon show on Cartoon Network. And it was canned. And it had crappy characters from the crappy movies.

You're a fan...I get that. But from its height of domination of 25 years...it can't realistically be much lower. Even their consumer products are steadily declining...I have t seen an interesting new toy in 10 years...with the except of Legos based off the original movies.

It's just bad... It really is.

Two words: Angry Birds
I believe Disney canned the show. I don't recall if there was an official announcement, or if it was an understood thing, but its largely believed that the 50+ episodes written and in development are being repurposed for the show Star Wars Rebels.

I agree though, things like Angry Birds were definitely warning signs of things to come, but i don't think The Clone Wars should be so readily dismissed. It was a massive show, and was canned only to make way for sequel-era saturation.

The Disney buy-out was probably the best thing to happen to Star Wars in years, but in terms of pop-cultural significance, as of last year Star Wars was in a pretty good position to "make or break" it with the Live action show. It would've been risky, but i wouldn't say it was in a downward spiral just yet.

also, your costume-to-plainclothes ratio is very very off.
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Old 07-30-2013, 04:39 PM   #62
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also, your costume-to-plainclothes ratio is very very off.
Exactly... Which means you were there...which means the commentary is slathered with a thick layer of French's Spicy Biased Mustard
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Old 07-30-2013, 04:44 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
That live action show has been MIA since 2005...in fact...I can't even remember if Disney hasn't said that they'd pull the plug...did they?
Actually, back in January, ABC was said to be evaluating the series for production. I haven't heard much since, but the process can take quite a while.

The problem was is that the series was too far ahead of the technology to produce it on a TV budget. But that could have been Lucas' vision of it - which as already discussed isn't necessarily what people want.

Quote:
And the clone wars is a nice cartoon show...but it is a cartoon show on Cartoon Network. And it was canned. And it had crappy characters from the crappy movies.
Disagree. Clone Wars did far more with the characters than all three movies. Anakin was more believable (which isn't saying much for Hayden Christensen), and it brought the story to another generation. My two daughters were huge fans.

Clone Wars was not "canned" because of ratings in general (they were good, not great.) After the acquisition, Disney decided to put all focus on movies. Clone Wars was also facing a dead end - it was getting close to Episode III in story line. They decided to shut it down where it was - even with new scenes already filmed - to concentrate on new productions - that they didn't have to share with Cartoon Network.

It still remains to be seen if they will actually completed the in-process stuff and release it in some fashion - they said "new episodes" as recently as Star Wars Weekends.

Since then, Dave Filoni, who was in charge of Clone Wars, is working on another animated series in early development, which will apparently bridge the gap between trilogies.


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You're a fan...I get that. But from its height of domination of 25 years...it can't realistically be much lower. Even their consumer products are steadily declining...I have t seen an interesting new toy in 10 years...with the except of Legos based off the original movies.
I agree, but it depends on "interesting to who?" But certainly, there has been nothing on the scale of what was available when I was a kid...which is fortunate...couldn't afford it at today's prices.
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Old 07-30-2013, 06:27 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
To be fair...

You're reaching big time and you know it.

Conventions can't be held as an indicator of widespread popularity...nor can anything where there are fewer people in street clothes than in costume.

That live action show has been MIA since 2005...in fact...I can't even remember if Disney hasn't said that they'd pull the plug...did they?

And the clone wars is a nice cartoon show...but it is a cartoon show on Cartoon Network. And it was canned. And it had crappy characters from the crappy movies.

You're a fan...I get that. But from its height of domination of 25 years...it can't realistically be much lower. Even their consumer products are steadily declining...I have t seen an interesting new toy in 10 years...with the except of Legos based off the original movies.

It's just bad... It really is.

Two words: Angry Birds
The Clone Wars movie was weak, and so were some of the early episodes, but as the series went on it got better and better. There were some really excellent episodes especially in the last season. I think Clone Wars handled the Anakin character even better then the movies did.

Disney did cancel it, but only because they wanted to do something in a different time period. The same production staff is now working on the animated Star Wars Rebels series, so Disney obviously didn't have a problem with the quality of their work or they wouldn't have brought them back.
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Old 07-30-2013, 06:39 PM   #65
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The Clone Wars movie was weak, and so were some of the early episodes, but as the series went on it got better and better. There were some really excellent episodes especially in the last season. I think Clone Wars handled the Anakin character even better then the movies did.

Disney did cancel it, but only because they wanted to do something in a different time period. The same production staff is now working on the animated Star Wars Rebels series, so Disney obviously didn't have a problem with the quality of their work or they wouldn't have brought them back.
And that show will be better...just better material

Away from those trainwreck "prequels"
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Old 07-30-2013, 06:49 PM   #66
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And that show will be better...just better material

Away from those trainwreck "prequels"
Just discovered this thread and agree with the above.

Personally, I would love to see the next movies based on Zahn's novels, even though I know character-wise it's really not feasible. I think he writes the best and most fleshed out characters in the EU.
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Old 07-30-2013, 07:07 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by JediBonas View Post

Just discovered this thread and agree with the above.

Personally, I would love to see the next movies based on Zahn's novels, even though I know character-wise it's really not feasible. I think he writes the best and most fleshed out characters in the EU.
I read the Zahn books when they came out... It was
Cool at the time because it was 10 years since anybody had heard anything from Star Wars (it seemed like 50 years then... the infancy of THE WEB) It was the reintroduction to the world that started the movement to the new movies we all craved...little did we know what we were signing up for...

But those books would have been more heavily criticized if they were movies than Jedi was for rehashing old storylines. They had kinda an Interesting arc... But had reference upon reference to the three movies as well.

My opinion wouldn't have made very good screenplay.

I remember though... In the weeks leading up to the The phantom movie thinking how amateur all those novels would seem compared to Star Wars armed with cgi... The possibilities were endless.

Boy was I WRONG!

thanks, George...no really
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Old 07-30-2013, 07:11 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post
I read the Zahn books when they came out... It was
Cool at the time because it was 10 years since anybody had heard anything from Star Wars (it seemed like 50 years then... the infancy of THE WEB) It was the reintroduction to the world that started the movement to the new movies we all craved...little did we know what we were signing up for...

But those books would have been more heavily criticized if they were movies than Jedi was for rehashing old storylines. They had kinda an Interesting arc... But had reference upon reference to the three movies as well.

My opinion wouldn't have made very good screenplay.

I remember though... In the weeks leading up to the The phantom movie thinking how amateur all those novels would seem compared to Star Wars armed with cgi... The possibilities were endless.

Boy was I WRONG!

thanks, George...no really
Exactly. no clone Emperor, thanks.
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Old 07-30-2013, 07:15 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by lockedoutlogic View Post

I read the Zahn books when they came out... It was
Cool at the time because it was 10 years since anybody had heard anything from Star Wars (it seemed like 50 years then... the infancy of THE WEB) It was the reintroduction to the world that started the movement to the new movies we all craved...little did we know what we were signing up for...

But those books would have been more heavily criticized if they were movies than Jedi was for rehashing old storylines. They had kinda an Interesting arc... But had reference upon reference to the three movies as well.

My opinion wouldn't have made very good screenplay.

I remember though... In the weeks leading up to the The phantom movie thinking how amateur all those novels would seem compared to Star Wars armed with cgi... The possibilities were endless.

Boy was I WRONG!

thanks, George...no really
I see your point, I'm probable biased considering I named my daughter Mara

It's been awhile since I've read any SW books and I haven't read any since the last of whatever series it was with Jacen turning ended. I felt like that series was such a rehash of all the other ones it really started turning me off to the books.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:01 PM   #70
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I give credit where credit is due...


Buying Star Wars is a bold and good move for Disney... It's "in the crapper" by it's standards... Profitable but completely at its creative low point and adrift.
It seems to me that you have forgotten "The Dark Times" after Jedi came out and there was practically NOTHING until the Zahn novels almost 10 years later. Which you even admit seemed like 50 years. I have read many of your posts and it seems that, to you, everything after about 1990 sucks and no one has done anything right. Do I like the prequels? No. The story arc was good but was drown out with poor scripts, stiff acting, and an over reliance on CGI. Sith was much better than the previous two but the damage had already been done. Star Wars has learned their lesson from the 80s and is not letting the brand fade into obscurity. The list of books numbers over 100 with new titles coming out on a monthly basis. I have no clue how many kids books there are. The Clone Wars has kept the brand moving forward with merchandising and a story younger kids know and can follow. I admittedly did not get into Clone Wars until just before Disney announced they were pulling the plug but what I saw was well done and aimed at an older audience. The new series is being done by the same people. Must mean Disney liked their work. The books have been of varying degrees of quality but again, it is keeping the brand relevant. What you have now is a brand that appeals to both original and prequel fans. With Disney at the helm and a new set of movies coming out the future is looking brighter than it has since 1980.
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I see your point, I'm probable biased considering I named my daughter Mara

It's been awhile since I've read any SW books and I haven't read any since the last of whatever series it was with Jacen turning ended. I felt like that series was such a rehash of all the other ones it really started turning me off to the books.
Welcome aboard. I'm a life long fan and have read many of the books. You are not missing much from the last series. Since New Jedi Order the quality of the stories has been repetative.
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Old 08-01-2013, 10:20 PM   #71
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No...I remember everything.


And your analysis is from a fan perspective... Not exactly neutral.

The "dark period" was what USED to happen to pop culture. It died, it was replaced
By a couple of decent sized movies per year... New Saturday morning cartoons...new toys for 8 year old boys...the Star Trek franchise took the place in the genre.

The Internet changed everything, global
Mass production of... Well... Everything... Did too, cgi, streaming, massive cable options, continuing evolution of technology.

I understand you statement... But I'm not sure you're putting it through the wash properly.

Those movies were absolutely disgraceful and all of us diehard fans know it. There's no sense sugarcoating it... The franchise is on creative lifesupport and is on the list for an infusion.

It's not that he didnt sell crap... Nothing seems to put a dent in that...but there was nothing made out of a wealth of possibilities.

They took the emperor down ten notches, made yoda into a laughable cartoon , made the "tortured soul of evil" - Darth vader - pathetic...

Fifteen years ago would you have thought that with a huge war, hundreds of Jedi characters, and bounty hunter galore to deal with... That it could bomb so badly? And it did... Money isn't the only indicator.

Lets be honest.

I hope Disney can bring it back... Really do.

But let's face it...Lucas is a horrid writer and director... Rick mccallum is the biggest clown to ever be let near a movie set.

Stock up: Leigh bracket, Lawrence kasdan, irv kershner, Richard Marquand...
Look what they had to deal with...but it was simpler times then and we never would have known.

Good luck in retirement, George... It's a good deed for the rest of the world.
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Old 08-02-2013, 01:13 PM   #72
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Twin Dad I agree with you and find your response to be completely reasonable.

Lockedoutlogic you seem to be quite bitter again. You argue that Twin dad is writing from a fan perspective and therefore is completely biased. Yet you even describer yourself as a "diehard fan" (which I'm sure you are) but your opinion isn't biased??

I think you are in the group of bitter diehard fans who are disappointed with the second trilogy and feel all is lost.

The thing is The first trilogy was "lightening in a bottle", it is not going to be easy to duplicate that. Was the second trilogy disappointing? Yes it was not on the same level as the first. Was the second trilogy the worst piece of crap I have ever seen and therefore a harbinger of future crap? Nope I don't think so.

Too many "diehard fans" are overreacting to the second trilogy. They are disappointed that the "lighting in a bottle" wasn't duplicated.

Lucas made mistakes with the second trilogy relying on CGI too much and got wooden performances from the actors as a result, but can you blame the guy. After decades he finally gets the technology to support his original ideas and goes a little nuts with it.

However he did follow the same formula IMO but he didn't get the same results as the first trilogy. I honestly think it was out of his control as the expectations were uber high from all the "diehard fans"

And that is even moot as he will only be a consultant on the next trilogy. my view is I'm going to hope for the best. I think there is plenty of story for them to go with, and hopefully they can learn from previous mistakes.

But what do I know, I liked John Carter
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Old 08-02-2013, 10:30 PM   #73
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Am I the only one that didnt hate the second trilogy? Yeah, episode 1 was pretty bad with Jar-Jar and all, but the second two were pretty good IMO.
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Old 08-04-2013, 10:11 PM   #74
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Am I the only one that didnt hate the second trilogy? Yeah, episode 1 was pretty bad with Jar-Jar and all, but the second two were pretty good IMO.
You're not the only one but the haters are very vocal and will shout down anyone who says something nice about the prequels. I personally rank Episode III third behind Empire and A New Hope. The story behind the prequels is a good one. You have a stagnant government that had rotted from the inside, a Jedi Order who has become complacent and a hero who is lured down the wrong path. The problem is in the stiff acting caused by a weak script. Plus the over reliance on CGI just led to a disappointment for lots of fans.

Now, having said all that, if you enjoy them then that is what is important. Don't worry about what others think. Opinions are like farts, everyone else's stinks.
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Old 08-04-2013, 10:31 PM   #75
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Does anyone know if industrial light and magic will still be involved?
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