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Old 06-11-2013, 11:55 AM   #136
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Originally Posted by maxiesmom View Post
I'm sure they do have "reserve" people. But I'm also sure they are not standing around, fully dressed, ready to go at all times. They most likely have to be called, get ready, and drive in. Takes a little time.
Exactly correct!

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As already stated it would take time so I can understand why that isn't an ideal situation. However even if it took time it might help alleviate some of the stress later on if the problems weren't immediately fixed.
What I wonder is why Disney didn't reroute some buses from other parks/resorts which were already in service. IIRC (and I could be mistaken) they have a system in place which allows them to move buses based on need. I don't think it would have been unreasonable to reroute some buses to address those long lines, especially the GF one. I do realize that could cause delays for guests at other resorts/parks but I think if you take 1 bus from here or there it could have made a huge difference, and not have affected other guests too much. But then again I am not a transportation engineer so what do I know. It just seems to me like they didn't do much to address the problem, and that is what would bum me out.

In fact when looking up some info on Disney buses I found an article from September talking about upgrades and the WDW transportation VP said this:

“Here (Disney World) it’s about guest experience, people going on vacation,” said Sam, “It’s a very different atmosphere and mindset … expectation is high.”

http://attractionsmagazine.com/blog/...easing-growth/
Yes, they can shuffle buses around but there are a number of things that they have to consider before doing that. 1. How long is the expected delay. If the information they receive is that it will be a short time, there isn't any sense to rerouting buses. Why? 2. Because if you take buses off a regular route what happens to the people that need that bus? So now instead of having one group of people mad at you, you have multiple groups. And if it indeed is a short time, by the time that the buses discharge whatever passengers they have for wherever they are going and get to the source of the problem, it may have already resolved itself. It's just a snowball rolling down the hill and picking up size and speed as it goes. There is no clean way to do this. You don't over staff to have people literally standing there waiting for a need to arise and you don't call someone in from home and expect them to show up in a period of time that is beneficial to the situation. If they get there and there is no need, the union, I'm sure has a minimum pay requirement for anyone called in. So you do your best to make it work. As someone has said, you don't just go from selling popcorn to driving a 42 foot bus, it takes someone with a CDL and considerable training and/or experience. The solutions may seem simple, but they are anything but simple.

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wow has DW really changed that much from 2007? (that was the last time I was there) This thread makes me doubt planning another trip there for next year. I had no problems with transportation and never waited more than 15 minutes for a bus (stayed at a value resort) I am trying to plan a trip for next June at POFQ which I know is a crazy month, so this is worrying me...
Don't let what you read here influence your travel plans. Most of the comments come from people that are totally unaware of how a transportation system works and what reasonable expectations are. A large number of people that use the Disney bus system, for example, are not regular municipal bus users. They expect them to work like their car, ready when they are. I have worked for more than one municipal bus company and have observed the Disney bus system and I'm here to tell you that considering the destinations, roads and traffic that they work under, they do a terrific job. Once in a while a bus will breakdown or have an accident and I'm here to tell you that NOTHING will throw off a schedule like either of those will. The people that ride the system at Disney expect the drivers to be professional all the while keeping them entertained. Not a good combination.

Back a few years ago a study was done that showed that if you rode a municipal bus and paid $1.00 per ride an additional $14.00 per person was needed to pay for buses, maintenance, drivers, benefits and general overhead, fuel and support staff. Systems that are non-profit public entities are supplemented by the Government. Disney is not and they don't charge you any extra for the service. Yes, it's built in to the cost of tickets and lodging, but it's not likely that the ticket prices would decrease even if the did away with the bus system.
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Old 06-11-2013, 12:20 PM   #137
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Exactly correct!



Yes, they can shuffle buses around but there are a number of things that they have to consider before doing that. 1. How long is the expected delay. If the information they receive is that it will be a short time, there isn't any sense to rerouting buses. Why? 2. Because if you take buses off a regular route what happens to the people that need that bus? So now instead of having one group of people mad at you, you have multiple groups. And if it indeed is a short time, by the time that the buses discharge whatever passengers they have for wherever they are going and get to the source of the problem, it may have already resolved itself. It's just a snowball rolling down the hill and picking up size and speed as it goes. There is no clean way to do this. You don't over staff to have people literally standing there waiting for a need to arise and you don't call someone in from home and expect them to show up in a period of time that is beneficial to the situation. If they get there and there is no need, the union, I'm sure has a minimum pay requirement for anyone called in. So you do your best to make it work. As someone has said, you don't just go from selling popcorn to driving a 42 foot bus, it takes someone with a CDL and considerable training and/or experience. The solutions may seem simple, but they are anything but simple.
All things that I recognized as being issues. As for the bolded part, I don't think it would have been that difficult to have a bus that just dropped off guests from CSR at MK for example, swing out to the GF or TTC pick some people up and drop them off at MK main gate before going back on a regular route. Obviously if you have people waiting at the CSR stop at MK they would have to wait longer so it isn't ideal, as would people back at the resort so I wouldn't suggest a complete reroute (although at RD I wonder how many people would be waiting), but 1-2 buses here or there could have made a difference.
Of course there are a ton of variables to take into consideration, some of which we may not even know. Also I am in no way saying I have perfect answers or solutions, in fact I think in a situation like this there is no perfect solution, someone somewhere will complain. I think the biggest thing something like this shows is the design flaw in the MK transportation and the lack of a good contingency plan in case of mechanical problems. Which coincidentally worries me because now that I own at BLT I have been able to walk there the last couple of trips. But for our October trip we will be at AKL and will have to deal with it since I will have my car and prefer to drive.
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Old 06-11-2013, 01:02 PM   #138
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Disney changed their policy to allow non-monorail resort guest to use the resort monorail. We are only pointing out that when this change was made Disney did not make plans for the boats to carry non-resort guests. This current policy stinks. Transportation that was planned and sized for resort guests is not equipped to handle the volume of guests packed on at TTC. The OP took the risk. It messed up his day but it really messed up the resort guests' day. And the OP added to the problem.


Consider for a moment why Disney changed their policy...MONEY. They wanted to attract EVERYONE to the monorail resorts to spend their dollars via the wildly popular character meals, and high end restaurants, not to mention resort hopping so people can spend more $$ in the gift shops, and perhaps have a few drinks at the resort bars. When guests are dependent upon Disney transportation how will they get to these resorts to spend money at the restaurants, and shops, and bars? With that said, Disney made a logical choice to change their policy to increase revenue. Guests are now suffering from the consequences of that choice, because Disney did not want to spend money to update their aging and inadequate transportation infrastructure.
Like it or not Disney is ultimately responsible for the mayhem that transpired on that day, and we should exercise some compassion for everyone who was caught up in the mess. Be mindful of the OP's story, because this could happen to you.
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:58 PM   #139
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All things that I recognized as being issues. As for the bolded part, I don't think it would have been that difficult to have a bus that just dropped off guests from CSR at MK for example, swing out to the GF or TTC pick some people up and drop them off at MK main gate before going back on a regular route. Obviously if you have people waiting at the CSR stop at MK they would have to wait longer so it isn't ideal, as would people back at the resort so I wouldn't suggest a complete reroute (although at RD I wonder how many people would be waiting), but 1-2 buses here or there could have made a difference.
Of course there are a ton of variables to take into consideration, some of which we may not even know. Also I am in no way saying I have perfect answers or solutions, in fact I think in a situation like this there is no perfect solution, someone somewhere will complain. I think the biggest thing something like this shows is the design flaw in the MK transportation and the lack of a good contingency plan in case of mechanical problems. Which coincidentally worries me because now that I own at BLT I have been able to walk there the last couple of trips. But for our October trip we will be at AKL and will have to deal with it since I will have my car and prefer to drive.
It's not quite that easy and they probably do have contingency plans in place, but part of that plan could include waiting an appropriate amount of time in the thought that things could possibly move again quickly.

Also, if you are at a resort and going to MK, you can take a bus and you will not be going through TTC, but, straight to the park via the roadway. Even if you had to go through TTC, it isn't like that all the time. Only when the occasional mishap occurs. Again, it could happen anytime but after 30 years (42 visits) I have never been held up even once. It is an unusual thing, not to be expected every time. I never take the monorail over to MK at opening, there are way to many people attempting to ride it all at once. I always take the ferry and if I leave at a slower time of the day, I might hop on the train for the return trip to the TTC.
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:53 PM   #140
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[/B]

Consider for a moment why Disney changed their policy...MONEY. They wanted to attract EVERYONE to the monorail resorts to spend their dollars via the wildly popular character meals, and high end restaurants, not to mention resort hopping so people can spend more $$ in the gift shops, and perhaps have a few drinks at the resort bars. When guests are dependent upon Disney transportation how will they get to these resorts to spend money at the restaurants, and shops, and bars? With that said, Disney made a logical choice to change their policy to increase revenue. Guests are now suffering from the consequences of that choice, because Disney did not want to spend money to update their aging and inadequate transportation infrastructure.
Like it or not Disney is ultimately responsible for the mayhem that transpired on that day, and we should exercise some compassion for everyone who was caught up in the mess. Be mindful of the OP's story, because this could happen to you.
Disney is as you state, however what we are saying is it was his choice to jump on that resort monorail. Yes, be mindful of what we are saying as well. Someday you may find yourself possibly staying in a resort monorail hotel when the monorail goes down and you are in the line with hoards and hoards of people and you know they all aren't from the monorail resorts. You may start thinking to yourself, why on earth did you pay that extra money
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:57 PM   #141
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It's not quite that easy and they probably do have contingency plans in place, but part of that plan could include waiting an appropriate amount of time in the thought that things could possibly move again quickly.

Also, if you are at a resort and going to MK, you can take a bus and you will not be going through TTC, but, straight to the park via the roadway. Even if you had to go through TTC, it isn't like that all the time. Only when the occasional mishap occurs. Again, it could happen anytime but after 30 years (42 visits) I have never been held up even once. It is an unusual thing, not to be expected every time. I never take the monorail over to MK at opening, there are way to many people attempting to ride it all at once. I always take the ferry and if I leave at a slower time of the day, I might hop on the train for the return trip to the TTC.
There are no buses if you are staying off property, if you live in driving distance, if you are staying on the Monorail resort line...as you said, only if you are at a "resort" so what do the other 1,000's of guests do? You have gone 42 times in 30 years. I have gone over 42 times in one year, I live 3 hours away & I also have a house an hour away from there that was my mothers... and I encounter the down monorails all the time.. once the monorail and a ferry went down.They had one working ferry. They had to get buses in to take guests to/from the TTC! So the more you go, the more you know (that they do go down frequently)
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Old 06-11-2013, 06:04 PM   #142
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There are no buses if you are staying off property, if you live in driving distance, if you are staying on the Monorail resort line...as you said, only if you are at a "resort" so what do the other 1,000's of guests do? You have gone 42 times in 30 years. I have gone over 42 times in one year, I live 3 hours away & I also have a house an hour away from there that was my mothers... and I encounter the down monorails all the time.. once the monorail and a ferry went down.They had one working ferry. They had to get buses in to take guests to/from the TTC! So the more you go, the more you know (that they do go down frequently)
Well that would be true with anything. The more you do something the more likely it is that you will encounter problems. For all we know it has always been this way though, now we have these internet connections to tell us about it. Before, we never knew. Life was much simpler, don't you think?
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:34 PM   #143
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Well that would be true with anything. The more you do something the more likely it is that you will encounter problems. For all we know it has always been this way though, now we have these internet connections to tell us about it. Before, we never knew. Life was much simpler, don't you think?
Yes, life was simpler. Even simpler back in horse n buggy days too My point is, those that feel the transportation system is in need of repair really do know it is as they go frequently and see just how often it really goes down and and how often the buses back up. If I went maybe once or twice a year, I may not see how often it does and feel it is fine. Like I said, you don't know, unless you go.
You cannot compare it to public transportation. If you own a car, you don't have to take public transportation, however when going to the MK, if you are not staying at the CR (where you can walk), you do have to take the Disney transportation. You have no choice. You have a choice of which route, be it the Ferry, the Resort Monorail (yes, I do know non Monorail resort guests can use it) or the Express Monorail, Resort Boats, or if staying on property with direct bus to front MK gates, but not the system itself. You must use some form of their transportation system... when out in public, if you own a car, you do not have to take it.. so there is no comparison. Disney knows this and doesn't care. Yes, it boils down to money as I said before. No it wasn't always this way. The more resorts they build, the worse it gets. Back in the late 70's this problem did not exist..
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:37 PM   #144
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It's good to see that that the usual WDW apologists are out in full force. Just another reason I rarely visit this board anymore and another reason that I'm thankful I've never had the misfortune to meet any of you in person. As my dad used to say, "If you put their brains in a bird's butt it would fly backwards!"

OP, you have nothing to apologize for - you had a great attitude about it all but I am sorry you have to deal with these mental giants. Peace.
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:50 PM   #145
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What a shame that you couldn't just walk over that imaginary bridge from the GF to MK. That would have took, maybe 15 minutes!

Really, the OP is just a big whiner. Won't walk over the imaginary bridge, didn't use her psychic powers to know the ferry would be faster than the monorail...

Some people's children!
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:57 PM   #146
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It's good to see that that the usual WDW apologists are out in full force. Just another reason I rarely visit this board anymore and another reason that I'm thankful I've never had the misfortune to meet any of you in person. As my dad used to say, "If you put their brains in a bird's butt it would fly backwards!"

OP, you have nothing to apologize for - you had a great attitude about it all but I am sorry you have to deal with these mental giants. Peace.
Why is it that whenever someone tries to explain real reasons for things happening and why they can't just run out and throw money at it, they become an apologist. Isn't it possible that some may have some experience and insight that others that haven't worked or specialized in that area cannot have? No one is saying that Disney is perfect or that they aren't responsible for some of the problems that crop up, but it isn't any better to always assume the worst then to try and understand why certain things happen and how they are impossible to prevent completely. That isn't apologizing, it is an attempt to educate and let people know that there may be many things that influence an action, most of which we are not aware of nor ever think about.

If you want to blame Disney for all mechanical problems, go for it, but that will not prevent problems just because one is unhappy about it and have pointed blame at the big bad company. I see that as being completely negative and not someone that I would want to "have the misfortune of meeting in person" either.

I understand that people are on vacation and they don't want to be exposed to the problems of real life, but, Disney can conjure up fantasy only in certain areas. If we were talking about Universal, Sea World, Busch Gardens or any other place the reasons and explanations would be the same. I understand frustration and disappointment and I guess if people have someone to blame for it, it makes it easier to tolerate. Me personally, I'd rather know the real life reasons for things being the way they are and not based on some conjured up idea of how we would like it to be.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:37 PM   #147
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On our last 3 trips the monorail has been down at least 3 times each trip when we went to use it. Since it seems like this is a regular occurance, they might as well have a handful of buses ready to go and loop around the TTC, resorts and MK.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:32 PM   #148
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Why is it that whenever someone tries to explain real reasons for things happening and why they can't just run out and throw money at it, they become an apologist. Isn't it possible that some may have some experience and insight that others that haven't worked or specialized in that area cannot have? No one is saying that Disney is perfect or that they aren't responsible for some of the problems that crop up, but it isn't any better to always assume the worst then to try and understand why certain things happen and how they are impossible to prevent completely. That isn't apologizing, it is an attempt to educate and let people know that there may be many things that influence an action, most of which we are not aware of nor ever think about.

If you want to blame Disney for all mechanical problems, go for it, but that will not prevent problems just because one is unhappy about it and have pointed blame at the big bad company. I see that as being completely negative and not someone that I would want to "have the misfortune of meeting in person" either.

I understand that people are on vacation and they don't want to be exposed to the problems of real life, but, Disney can conjure up fantasy only in certain areas. If we were talking about Universal, Sea World, Busch Gardens or any other place the reasons and explanations would be the same. I understand frustration and disappointment and I guess if people have someone to blame for it, it makes it easier to tolerate. Me personally, I'd rather know the real life reasons for things being the way they are and not based on some conjured up idea of how we would like it to be.
Glad you got that apparent guilt off your chest. I had no idea you were so well connected to WDW. I guess next you'll be telling us that you were sitting in the meetings when they were doing the root cause analysis of all the various park problems (I can only assume that's where you gleaned your "real life reasons" from).

Given your vast knowledge can you tell us when the next monorail failure will be so we won't make the same ghastly mistake as the OP (using the CM suggested alternate transportation)? Maybe they could have two lines for the resort monorail. One for the guests who are staying at a monorail resort and one for the lowlife dregs who aren't but are directed to use it when the express has one of it's daily failures. Each lowlife park visitor could then be given a good whack on the head or something to make the monorail resort guests feel better about the inconvenience. Heck, might as well let the monorail resort guests take their own swings since they've paid for the privilege.

Now don't we all feel silly.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:49 PM   #149
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PP (Ohiodisneydad), you should write comedy, you are funny and I agree with everything you are saying. Poor OP, comes on and shares their story and is not even that upset about what they went thru and then get attacked for following the directions of the park employees. When I read some of the comments on here, I just laugh.
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Old 06-11-2013, 11:23 PM   #150
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Disney is as you state, however what we are saying is it was his choice to jump on that resort monorail. Yes, be mindful of what we are saying as well. Someday you may find yourself possibly staying in a resort monorail hotel when the monorail goes down and you are in the line with hoards and hoards of people and you know they all aren't from the monorail resorts. You may start thinking to yourself, why on earth did you pay that extra money
The fact that an individual 'dared' to jump on the resort monorail has been blown way out of proportion; in the grand scheme of things it does not matter, and Disney's policy proves it. For the record, I have stayed at each of the monorail resorts, and there have been several occasions when my vacation was interrupted due to breakdowns resulting in significant delays. With that said, it never occurred to me that because I was paying extra for a room, location, and amenities, I was somehow blessed with exclusive rights to use the resort monorail, and boats, and I would therefore never have to mingle with the 'hoards' of people who were not staying at my resort. Perhaps Disney should consider 'wrapping' the resort monorail with a catchy new motto; 'SHARE THE RIDE' .
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Originally Posted by OhioDisneyDad;48658621

[B
Maybe they could have two lines for the resort monorail. One for the guests who are staying at a monorail resort and one for the lowlife dregs who aren't but are directed to use it when the express has one of it's daily failures. Each lowlife park visitor could then be given a good whack on the head or something to make the monorail resort guests feel better about the inconvenience. Heck, might as well let the monorail resort guests take their own swings since they've paid for the privilege.
[/B]


....and maybe all the lowlife dregs will be forced to wear special wristbands that will trigger an alarm when they jump on a resort monorail. Hmm...I'd better be careful; I'm staying at CSR this summer...I could be whacked on the head when I go to 'Ohana's for dinner.
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