Ths DIS is a great place to ask Disney Cruise Line questions and share tips.
Dreams Unlimited Travel - The official sponsor of the Disney Cruise Forums Dreams Unlimited Travel - the official sponsor of the Disney Cruise Forums  

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Disney Cruise Line > Disney Cruise Line Forum
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS UpdatesDIS email updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read



Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 05-25-2013, 05:37 AM   #481
Tonka's Skipper
DIS Veteran
 
Tonka's Skipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Connecticut in the Good Ole USA
Posts: 4,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaid Princess View Post
Ok... I told myself I wasn't going to comment on this thread... but this statement just infuriates me. It's untrue and unfair to the thousands of cast members who put the guests safety ahead of their own. I've been thrown up on, held collapsed, heat exhausted guests in my arms, done CPR, used AED's, been a mediator between the paramedics and a party that spoke another language. I've broken up fights, intervened in domestic disputes, and on one occasion put myself between a wife and her abusive husband.

One bad apple should not discredit the thousands of CM's who believe that the guests safety is their number one priority. Disney puts safety ahead of EVERYTHING. Even the courtesy of the CM's is secondary to the guest's safety. CM's are the reason you do feel safe and comfortable in a Disney environment.

The reason that guests are not pronounced dead in Disney Parks is because there are no doctors on scene to make such a pronouncement, the paramedics treat the patient as if they are alive and do everything in their power to keep it that way.

Totally agree!


In fact the statement is wrong, because the lady at DL who was hit by the cleat that pulled out of the dock, when the Mark Twain was docking was declared dead on the dock.


AKK
Tonka's Skipper is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 05:40 AM   #482
Tonka's Skipper
DIS Veteran
 
Tonka's Skipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Connecticut in the Good Ole USA
Posts: 4,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by billwald View Post
Reporter Tony Pipitone’s favorite quote:

"Believe none of what you hear, half of what you see, and everything you report."



The shame is few if any of the media reporters today believe or follow that quote!


AKK
Tonka's Skipper is offline  
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 05-25-2013, 05:44 AM   #483
Tonka's Skipper
DIS Veteran
 
Tonka's Skipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Connecticut in the Good Ole USA
Posts: 4,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by Otter49 View Post
From the DCL website:

"As required by the Cruise Vessel Security and Safety Act of 2010, the following information is provided as part our commitment to your safety and security."

"Disney Cruise Line has zero tolerance for crime on board its vessels. On international voyages that embark or disembark in the United States, Disney Cruise Line is required by federal law to report on board felonies and missing U.S. nationals to federal agencies. For a missing U.S. national and all serious felonies (homicide, suspicious death, kidnapping, assault with serious bodily injury, sexual assaults as defined by federal laws, firing or tampering with the vessel, or theft of money or property in excess of $10,000) the incident must be reported to the F.B.I. by telephone as soon as possible, to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security electronically, and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing. These requirements apply to incidents that occur on board in U.S. territorial waters, or on the high seas or in foreign waters if the assailant or victim is a U.S. national."

This info is then followed with phone numbers for the FBI, Coast Guard, and numerous local law enforcement departments, including Port Canaveral.

I wonder if these reports were filed. I'm guessing not since DCL doesn't show up in Q3 2012 reporting on the Coast Guard website.



According to the news the vessel reported the attack the next day, so I am sure at that point, everyone was advised as by law.

The USCG is known not post all their notices, events and investigations, etc on the web sites. I cannot speak to the FBI, but as another federal agency, its most likely the same.


AKK
Tonka's Skipper is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 06:56 AM   #484
Rogillio
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,030

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaid Princess View Post
Ok... I told myself I wasn't going to comment on this thread... but this statement just infuriates me. It's untrue and unfair to the thousands of cast members who put the guests safety ahead of their own. I've been thrown up on, held collapsed, heat exhausted guests in my arms, done CPR, used AED's, been a mediator between the paramedics and a party that spoke another language. I've broken up fights, intervened in domestic disputes, and on one occasion put myself between a wife and her abusive husband.

One bad apple should not discredit the thousands of CM's who believe that the guests safety is their number one priority. Disney puts safety ahead of EVERYTHING. Even the courtesy of the CM's is secondary to the guest's safety. CM's are the reason you do feel safe and comfortable in a Disney environment.

The reason that guests are not pronounced dead in Disney Parks is because there are no doctors on scene to make such a pronouncement, the paramedics treat the patient as if they are alive and do everything in their power to keep it that way.

Great post!
__________________
WDW 4/98, Yellowstone 6/99, 4-day Bahamas DCL 6/00, Washington DC 6/01, WDW 1/02, Scotland 6/02, Alaska 6/03, 7-day Caribbean DCL 6/04, 4-day Bahamas DCL 1/05, WDW 1/05, Universal 3/05, Norway 6/05, NYC Waldorf-Astoria 10/05, Snowshoe, WV 12/05, China Adventure 3/06, WDW 6/06, Copper Mountain, CO 12/06, 11-day DCL Med Cruise 5/07, 4-day Bahamas DCL 10/07, 7 Day NCL cruise - Hawaii 7/08, Door County, WI 7/09, Snowshoe WV, 12/09, 12-day DCL Baltic cruise 6/10, 7-day Caribbean HAL 12/10, WDW 6/11, 5-day Dream NYE 12/11, 7-day Canadian HAL 6/12, 3-day Dream Jan 2013, 4-day Dream Feb 2013, 5-day CCL NOLA, 9-day DCL Venice/Greece 6/14
Rogillio is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 07:57 AM   #485
abayaflowers
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Northern Bay Area
Posts: 546

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaid Princess

Ok... I told myself I wasn't going to comment on this thread... but this statement just infuriates me. It's untrue and unfair to the thousands of cast members who put the guests safety ahead of their own. I've been thrown up on, held collapsed, heat exhausted guests in my arms, done CPR, used AED's, been a mediator between the paramedics and a party that spoke another language. I've broken up fights, intervened in domestic disputes, and on one occasion put myself between a wife and her abusive husband.

One bad apple should not discredit the thousands of CM's who believe that the guests safety is their number one priority. Disney puts safety ahead of EVERYTHING. Even the courtesy of the CM's is secondary to the guest's safety. CM's are the reason you do feel safe and comfortable in a Disney environment.

The reason that guests are not pronounced dead in Disney Parks is because there are no doctors on scene to make such a pronouncement, the paramedics treat the patient as if they are alive and do everything in their power to keep it that way.
Agreed. If I did not feel safe on DCL, I wouldn't go. I would make precautionary measures for my child to ensure her safety.

I have always experienced top notched service and attention from CMs especially in minor accidents.

For instance, my DH accidentally dropped a glass in our Stateroom and it broke.

He cut his foot, and we needed.some help. 2 CMs maybe one security person came to our cabin. They were over the top to make sure my husband was ok.

One more thing and I know many disagree, but if something is not reported right away, someone cannot help.

As an protective mom, I tell my children to always tell someone if anything happens that makes them feel uncomfortable, terrible, sad, or bullied. So that I can help fix the problem.

With laws regarding any cruise line, I believe laws can be changed and it can more effective to ensure safety for all in the future.

If I was on the same cruise as the little girl/victim, I would be starting a petition on *********** and addressing to the head of International Cruise organization and also the maritime legal teams.

Just an idea!
__________________
Pics from our cruise http://medcruise2013.tumblr.com

MedCruise June 15-27, 2013 VilleFranche-Sur-Mer, La Spezia, Civitavecchia, Piraeus, Kusadasi, Mykonos, Valetta

MedCruise Aug. 7, 2010 Valetta, Tunis, Naples, Civitavecchia, La Spezia, VilleFranche-Sur-Mer

Mexican Riviera 2008
abayaflowers is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 10:38 AM   #486
Wadekind
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 781

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka's Skipper View Post
Quote:


This guys name is on a list by now. A list all the cruise lines and the hiring companies have. Unless he can totally change his name, looks and background, it is highly unlikely he will ever get a job on a cruise ship again.

AKK
Serious question. Do you know if the cruise lines all have/share photo or fingerprints of bad employees?
I ask because some friends of mine are from India and they think it would not be that hard to change your identity there.
Wadekind is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 10:52 AM   #487
Tonka's Skipper
DIS Veteran
 
Tonka's Skipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Connecticut in the Good Ole USA
Posts: 4,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadekind View Post
Serious question. Do you know if the cruise lines all have/share photo or fingerprints of bad employees?
I ask because some friends of mine are from India and they think it would not be that hard to change your identity there.


Most of the CMs for like hotel service and maintenance, seamen and engine gang, etc., are hiring directly by *hiring Agencies*. The hiring agencies provide the list, experience, ratings, and back ground of the people. With Disney and some of the other major lines, I also know they go direct to various countries and interview people, but the hiring is still done though the hiring companies. Each person is hired with a contract for so many months, the pay and benefits listed as well.

Now all that said, should I would be very surprised if the cruise lines did not photograph and finger print all people hired as part of background checks.

I would think in a small industry like cruise ships, it would be hard for this guy to sneak back in, not impossible, but hard. No line would want to hire this guy and then have something happen on their ships and it come out that he had a previous child abuse charge/accusation.

However as I mentioned before, with the rapes and attacks on women in India in the news lately, it seems the Indian government doesn't take these kind of attacks seriously.

So I would say it would be hard, but not impossible, so your friends may indeed have a point!

AKK
Tonka's Skipper is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 02:40 PM   #488
Otter49
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: A few miles away
Posts: 590

Quote:
Originally Posted by abayaflowers View Post
With laws regarding any cruise line, I believe laws can be changed and it can more effective to ensure safety for all in the future.

If I was on the same cruise as the little girl/victim, I would be starting a petition on *********** and addressing to the head of International Cruise organization and also the maritime legal teams.

Just an idea!
You may very well be right, maybe the laws can be strengthened.

But here is the paraphrase of the Cruise Vessel Security and Safety Act of 2010. This verbage comes straight from the DCL website (as required by the law itself).

"...all serious felonies (homicide, suspicious death, kidnapping, assault with serious bodily injury, sexual assaults as defined by federal laws, firing or tampering with the vessel, or theft of money or property in excess of $10,000) the incident must be reported to the F.B.I. by telephone as soon as possible, to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security electronically, and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing."

There isn't anything ambiguous about what I've bolded here. And no one is going to be able to argue me into believing that a day later is "as soon as possible". We can strengthen laws, but a law is only as good as the people charged with enforcing it.

Like an earlier poster, I believe some people pretty high up the food chain, maybe even the Captain knew about this early on.

I've never been in the cruise industry, but I was in the hotel business for many years - twice working at hotels with well over a 1000 rooms. I can tell you with absolute certainty, that if a sexual assault on a child took place at one of those facilities, that within minutes the following people would know about it - Security Manager, Resident Manager, General Manager, and the Asst. General Manager. And many of them would be on scene.

And without a doubt, a call to law enforcement would have been made within 15 or 20 minutes.
__________________
Don't Look Back - You're Not Going In That Direction
Otter49 is offline  
Old 05-25-2013, 03:03 PM   #489
Tonka's Skipper
DIS Veteran
 
Tonka's Skipper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Connecticut in the Good Ole USA
Posts: 4,386

Quote:
Originally Posted by Otter49 View Post
You may very well be right, maybe the laws can be strengthened.

But here is the paraphrase of the Cruise Vessel Security and Safety Act of 2010. This verbage comes straight from the DCL website (as required by the law itself).

"...all serious felonies (homicide, suspicious death, kidnapping, assault with serious bodily injury, sexual assaults as defined by federal laws, firing or tampering with the vessel, or theft of money or property in excess of $10,000) the incident must be reported to the F.B.I. by telephone as soon as possible, to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security electronically, and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing."

There isn't anything ambiguous about what I've bolded here. And no one is going to be able to argue me into believing that a day later is "as soon as possible". We can strengthen laws, but a law is only as good as the people charged with enforcing it.

Like an earlier poster, I believe some people pretty high up the food chain, maybe even the Captain knew about this early on.

I've never been in the cruise industry, but I was in the hotel business for many years - twice working at hotels with well over a 1000 rooms. I can tell you with absolute certainty, that if a sexual assault on a child took place at one of those facilities, that within minutes the following people would know about it - Security Manager, Resident Manager, General Manager, and the Asst. General Manager. And many of them would be on scene.

And without a doubt, a call to law enforcement would have been made within 15 or 20 minutes.


Ok.......now I have been very vocal about my feelings that the vessel should not have sailed before giving whatever authorities had a chance to investigate!

I feel that way because the vessel own time line shows there was time to find out the basic details and still call.

Now that said, the law quoted is correct, but as soon as possible doesn't mean someone walks up to the guest services and says I have been assaulted and the CMs drops everything and immediately picks up the phone.

The vessel security has to do a preliminary investigation as in find out what is being alleged, look at video, check the scene and talk to all involved parties. This does take some time and more then 15 or 20 minutes.


AKK
Tonka's Skipper is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 11:49 AM   #490
theparsons
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 808

Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowWhite2 View Post
I find it odd that it is from August and just coming out to be reported. Plus if I had video of my 11 yo being molested by a DCL cast member, I would have hired a lawyer before I got back to the states and had him arrested as soon as we got back to PC. (If my DH didn't take him out first )

From my dealings with DCL and my teen, DCL doesn't easily take responsibility for their staff's inappropriate behavior. I'm sure there is more to this story and it will come out shortly.
If it was MY daughter I'd have to hire a lawyer to defend ME for the murder of the CM.
theparsons is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 08:07 PM   #491
TLSnell1981

Sense isn't very common anymore
I can't wait for T shirts and cover ups
 
TLSnell1981's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,961

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonka's Skipper View Post
The shame is few if any of the media reporters today believe or follow that quote!


AKK
"Suppose you picked up this morning's newspaper and your life was a front page headline... And everything they said was accurate... But none of it was true?"

"Absence of Malice"
__________________

I can't think about that right now. If I do, I'll go crazy.
I'll think about that tomorrow.....After all, tomorrow is another day"
Scarlett O'Hara
TLSnell1981 is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 08:15 PM   #492
carpenta
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: grand isle, Vermont USA
Posts: 1,113

Quote:
Originally Posted by TLSnell1981 View Post
"Suppose you picked up this morning's newspaper and your life was a front page headline... And everything they said was accurate... But none of it was true?"

"Absence of Malice"
Wow!!! That would be GREAT. My life is SOOOO boring I would love to have a life reported like a rock star.....hopefully Keith Richards.......Liberace not so much.....
carpenta is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 08:59 PM   #493
Tozzie
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,846

The one line that everyone seems to be skipping over is the line I bolded, neither the victim nor the assailant were US Nationals, hence DCL wasn't required to report the crime. Don't blame them for following the letter of the law blame the people who wrote it.



Disney Cruise Line has zero tolerance for crime on board its vessels. On international voyages that embark or disembark in the United States, Disney Cruise Line is required by federal law to report on board felonies and missing U.S. nationals to federal agencies. For a missing U.S. national and all serious felonies (homicide, suspicious death, kidnapping, assault with serious bodily injury, sexual assaults as defined by federal laws, firing or tampering with the vessel, or theft of money or property in excess of $10,000) the incident must be reported to the F.B.I. by telephone as soon as possible, to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security electronically, and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing. These requirements apply to incidents that occur on board in U.S. territorial waters, or on the high seas or in foreign waters if the assailant or victim is a U.S. national."
Tozzie is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 09:17 PM   #494
rhorsley
Mouseketeer
 
rhorsley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 169

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tozzie View Post
The one line that everyone seems to be skipping over is the line I bolded, neither the victim nor the assailant were US Nationals, hence DCL wasn't required to report the crime. Don't blame them for following the letter of the law blame the people who wrote it.



Disney Cruise Line has zero tolerance for crime on board its vessels. On international voyages that embark or disembark in the United States, Disney Cruise Line is required by federal law to report on board felonies and missing U.S. nationals to federal agencies. For a missing U.S. national and all serious felonies (homicide, suspicious death, kidnapping, assault with serious bodily injury, sexual assaults as defined by federal laws, firing or tampering with the vessel, or theft of money or property in excess of $10,000) the incident must be reported to the F.B.I. by telephone as soon as possible, to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security electronically, and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing. These requirements apply to incidents that occur on board in U.S. territorial waters, or on the high seas or in foreign waters if the assailant or victim is a U.S. national."
I think punctuation & sentence structure is tripping you up here: and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing. These requirements apply to incidents that occur on board in U.S. territorial waters, or on the high seas or in foreign waters if the assailant or victim is a U.S. national."

The 1st independent clause in purple indicates law applied to all passengers/crew in US waters. The second clause indicates the circumstances if the ship is on the "high seas or in foreign waters."

If it were 1 thought to include all, it would be written as "and to the U.S. Coast Guard in writing. These requirements apply to incidents that occur on board in U.S. territorial waters, on the high seas, or in foreign waters if the assailant or victim is a U.S. national." Also it would be unnecessary to list them out, as US territorial waters, high seas & foreign waters are all the possible places the ship could be.

Since the ship was in US waters, it makes sense. Whether you are a citizen or not, the FBI, etc... Wants to know about crimes committed in the US. All the institutions mentioned have no jurisdiction in the later locations noted: the high seas or foreign waters. So, unless a US citizen is involved the US coast guard, FBI etc would have no interest.
__________________
rhorsley is offline  
Old 05-26-2013, 10:01 PM   #495
pyramid2000
Member of the DD Geek invasion of CC
How exacty do you iron on a T-****?
 
pyramid2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Southern NJ
Posts: 10,442

Everyone has their opinions and their own views on how things happened and how they should or shouldn't have been handled.

I never had the notion that DCL was better than most other lines when it came to service, food,etc. We paid more for DCL because we love the Disney atmosphere; the hidden Mickey's, the music as you walked down the halls, the characters roaming about... and also because I felt Disney, as a corporation, had my family's back. I believed they cared more for their customers than most other places. Naive, I know, but it was what I believed.

After this, and other recent decisions made by the higher ups on DCL, I no longer believe this. Do I believe it would have been a different situation if it had been my child or any other US child when and where it occurred? I do. But now I question how it would be handled if it were my child and we were docked at foreign port. What if we were sailing in Europe or docked in Cozumel? Would they help me in my quest for justice or would they be looking for what was best for themselves first? My fantasy has been shattered and I cruised DCL for the fantasy.
__________________
Caroline

1988- 1st trip to WDW/senior class trip : 1990- Carnival cruise from Puerto Rico : 5/00- 3 night CB/4 night Magic : 9/05- 4 night PO/3 night Wonder : 1/06 - 7 night Western Magic: 7/06- 5 night RCCL Explorer (Bermuda):12/09/06- 7 night Magic-DD Geek Party: 8/17/08- 15 night EBPC Magic : 11/01/09- 4 night Wonder:: 2/20/11- 4 night Dream : 11/10/11 - 3 night Dream : 10/13/12 - 7 night Western Fantasy : 04/04/13 - 4 night Miami Wonder : 01/13/14 - 4 night Magic :
pyramid2000 is offline  
Closed Thread



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:12 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.