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Old 05-16-2013, 10:11 PM   #1
tentaguasu
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Carsland, Star Wars Land, Avatarland - What is Disney capable of doing?

I'm excited an anxious to see new things at Disney - I really want to have the joy of discovering new and exciting things so I'm amped up every time I hear about Carsland, or Star Wars land, or Avatarland - all of which are either announced (Avatarland) or seemingly credible/logical (Starwars Land).

The Studios needs some serious redos (according to most people) and Carsland makes sense. Star Wars Land - or at least some major starwars attractions, restaurants, etc. seem like a no-brainer given the new movies and enduring popularity of the franchise. And Avatarland seems to be moving forward despite the haters (I'm not one).

Yet... Can Disney do all of this? They just spent half a billion on Fantasyland and I take it the spent something like triple that on FP+.

I can't see them NOT doing some variation of all three (cars/SW/avatar) yet that seems like crazy cash investment in a short time frame.

Those of you who have a better sense of what Disney can and can't (or will and won't do) from a financial perspective, what do you foresee - can all of this happen soon (e.g. next 5 years)? If not, what stays and what goes?
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Old 05-17-2013, 09:03 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tentaguasu View Post
I'm excited an anxious to see new things at Disney - I really want to have the joy of discovering new and exciting things so I'm amped up every time I hear about Carsland, or Star Wars land, or Avatarland - all of which are either announced (Avatarland) or seemingly credible/logical (Starwars Land).

The Studios needs some serious redos (according to most people) and Carsland makes sense. Star Wars Land - or at least some major starwars attractions, restaurants, etc. seem like a no-brainer given the new movies and enduring popularity of the franchise. And Avatarland seems to be moving forward despite the haters (I'm not one).

Yet... Can Disney do all of this? They just spent half a billion on Fantasyland and I take it the spent something like triple that on FP+.

I can't see them NOT doing some variation of all three (cars/SW/avatar) yet that seems like crazy cash investment in a short time frame.

Those of you who have a better sense of what Disney can and can't (or will and won't do) from a financial perspective, what do you foresee - can all of this happen soon (e.g. next 5 years)? If not, what stays and what goes?
I think Star Wars land seems to be more for sure than a Carsland would be. Avatar I think will be amazing once it gets done but the question is when will it get done. Disney makes a ton of money through parks, movies, books, etc. and after the purchase of Lucas films they need to make these expansions in order to make more money. So you need to spend money in order to make money and disney is definitely not in need of huge amounts of money. Disney can do all of these things and more. Also don't forget they are also building disney springs which will cost a ton as well but help make more money in the future because its all shopping and restaurants so its going to be a goldmine for disney.

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Old 05-17-2013, 09:41 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tentaguasu View Post
I'm excited an anxious to see new things at Disney - I really want to have the joy of discovering new and exciting things so I'm amped up every time I hear about Carsland, or Star Wars land, or Avatarland - all of which are either announced (Avatarland) or seemingly credible/logical (Starwars Land).

The Studios needs some serious redos (according to most people) and Carsland makes sense. Star Wars Land - or at least some major starwars attractions, restaurants, etc. seem like a no-brainer given the new movies and enduring popularity of the franchise. And Avatarland seems to be moving forward despite the haters (I'm not one).

Yet... Can Disney do all of this? They just spent half a billion on Fantasyland and I take it the spent something like triple that on FP+.

I can't see them NOT doing some variation of all three (cars/SW/avatar) yet that seems like crazy cash investment in a short time frame.

Those of you who have a better sense of what Disney can and can't (or will and won't do) from a financial perspective, what do you foresee - can all of this happen soon (e.g. next 5 years)? If not, what stays and what goes?
~Of course Disney can do all of this! The question is -- do they have to? I am willing to say, no. I don't see any incentive for Disney to build anything when park attendance is up by 73%. I don't see Star Wars or Carsland happening until 2020 at the earliest. There is so much uncertainty right now, we'll see.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:11 AM   #4
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~Of course Disney can do all of this! The question is -- do they have to? I am willing to say, no. I don't see any incentive for Disney to build anything when park attendance is up by 73%. I don't see Star Wars or Carsland happening until 2020 at the earliest. There is so much uncertainty right now, we'll see.
I have thought about this as well. And while sad, it is likely true. Why spend more money on the parks when they are at record attendance and profit levels? I realize that in business, complacency is a death sentence, but this is Disney we are talking about.

On the other hand, purchasing Star Wars for over $4B would need a serious ROI for just movies and merchandise. I am thinking that a Star Wars "expansion" of HS in some fashion is inevitable, especially given the current condition of that park. However, both Star Wars and Cars Land in the same park might be pushing against Disney's main revenue source: princesses.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:42 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiber07 View Post
I have thought about this as well. And while sad, it is likely true. Why spend more money on the parks when they are at record attendance and profit levels? I realize that in business, complacency is a death sentence, but this is Disney we are talking about.

On the other hand, purchasing Star Wars for over $4B would need a serious ROI for just movies and merchandise. I am thinking that a Star Wars "expansion" of HS in some fashion is inevitable, especially given the current condition of that park. However, both Star Wars and Cars Land in the same park might be pushing against Disney's main revenue source: princesses.


Totally correct, except I don't think Star Wars or Cars land will compete with the princesses, more its part of the wide diversity that offers something for all ages groups. In addition what they offer is always or at least almost always top of the line, with what only Disney has been able to produce,*pixie dust*.

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Old 05-18-2013, 07:33 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbonfiber07 View Post
I have thought about this as well. And while sad, it is likely true. Why spend more money on the parks when they are at record attendance and profit levels? I realize that in business, complacency is a death sentence, but this is Disney we are talking about.

On the other hand, purchasing Star Wars for over $4B would need a serious ROI for just movies and merchandise. I am thinking that a Star Wars "expansion" of HS in some fashion is inevitable, especially given the current condition of that park. However, both Star Wars and Cars Land in the same park might be pushing against Disney's main revenue source: princesses.
I think what Cars Land and Star Wars would do is open up WDW more to the Boys age 6 to 16 demographic (and their dads). Which is an area Disney seems to be missing on. I could totally see, if a Cars land and Star Wars Land come to HS, me taking DS to HS while DW and DD hit MK for an extra day.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:08 PM   #7
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I think what Cars Land and Star Wars would do is open up WDW more to the Boys age 6 to 16 demographic (and their dads). Which is an area Disney seems to be missing on. I could totally see, if a Cars land and Star Wars Land come to HS, me taking DS to HS while DW and DD hit MK for an extra day.
good point agree both ip s help with this demographic at dhs
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:13 PM   #8
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:21 PM   #9
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I definitely think they need to do a Star Wars Land first. It will have a much greater appeal to a wider demographic, and believe it or not there is a HUGE female following (myself & DD included). Plenty of "Princess Power" in the SW franchise!

I understand there is value in reusing something tried-and-true, but I also think that having the same "land" on both coasts means there is less incentive for families to experience both locations. We are heading to WDW this year, but plan to hit up DL next summer when we are on the west coast for a family reunion. If DL didn't have anything I couldn't find in WDW, I would probably skip it and just plan another trip to WDW later in the year.
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Old 06-15-2013, 11:06 AM   #10
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Smile ~Excellent post!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbonfiber07 View Post
I have thought about this as well. And while sad, it is likely true. Why spend more money on the parks when they are at record attendance and profit levels? I realize that in business, complacency is a death sentence, but this is Disney we are talking about.

On the other hand, purchasing Star Wars for over $4B would need a serious ROI for just movies and merchandise. I am thinking that a Star Wars "expansion" of HS in some fashion is inevitable, especially given the current condition of that park. However, both Star Wars and Cars Land in the same park might be pushing against Disney's main revenue source: princesses.
~Hi Carbonfiber07, I just had another epiphany. Disney has ridden the tide with free dining, Food & Wine, etc. But in another thread, a poster mentioned DVC. I overlooked DVC -- and I see no signs of DVC construction slowing down. In contrast, we've seen very little investment of new attractions in the parks. I think Disney's strategy may encompass more DVC in lieu of new attractions. If they keep selling DVC and fill the rooms during the slower times with free dining -- there is really no incentive for Disney to build new attractions. With that said, I hope I'm wrong.
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Old 06-15-2013, 10:47 PM   #11
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~Hi Carbonfiber07, I just had another epiphany. Disney has ridden the tide with free dining, Food & Wine, etc. But in another thread, a poster mentioned DVC. I overlooked DVC -- and I see no signs of DVC construction slowing down. In contrast, we've seen very little investment of new attractions in the parks. I think Disney's strategy may encompass more DVC in lieu of new attractions. If they keep selling DVC and fill the rooms during the slower times with free dining -- there is really no incentive for Disney to build new attractions. With that said, I hope I'm wrong.
The very history of Disney should alleviate any concerns about them not expanding, and building new attractions. Can you honestly think of any time where they have not been building something new? Disney will continue to push DVC, yes, but that's completely separate from new attractions.
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Old 06-16-2013, 05:31 PM   #12
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~Of course Disney can do all of this! The question is -- do they have to? I am willing to say, no. I don't see any incentive for Disney to build anything when park attendance is up by 73%. I don't see Star Wars or Carsland happening until 2020 at the earliest. There is so much uncertainty right now, we'll see.
Not sure where the 73% numbers comes from. Based on the TEA numbers (since Disney doesn't release individual park or resort numbers), WDW attendance is up 3% between 2008 and 2012. By contract Universal Orlando is up 23% over the same period.
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Old 06-16-2013, 07:55 PM   #13
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Not sure where the 73% numbers comes from. Based on the TEA numbers (since Disney doesn't release individual park or resort numbers), WDW attendance is up 3% between 2008 and 2012. By contract Universal Orlando is up 23% over the same period.
That was year over year revenue (up 73%) for Parks & Resorts as of last quarter. By contracts, Universal Parks was up only 12% year over year revenue as of last quarter.
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Old 06-17-2013, 08:10 AM   #14
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Disney is capable of doing all of it and doing an amazing job. However, I'm sadly not convinced they won't just "call it in" at least for Star Wars land and Carsland.

The much-hyped, expensive New Fantasyland is really 2 rides and a restaurant when you get down to it. And one of the rides is a knock off of one that already exists in Disneyland. Well, and Dumbo was upgraded.

I expect if they go forward with all 3 projects, Carsland will be a couple of rides pilfered from California and Star Wars land will finally get the Cantina (probably a re-theme of Backlot Express) and maybe another ride. It could be so much more. It SHOULD be so much more. I am really hoping that all 3 go forward and really hoping that all 3 are incredible, but the last dozen years or so Disney seems much happier to push DVC membership than the parks themselves.
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Old 06-17-2013, 08:59 AM   #15
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~Of course Disney can do all of this! The question is -- do they have to? I am willing to say, no. I don't see any incentive for Disney to build anything when park attendance is up by 73%. I don't see Star Wars or Carsland happening until 2020 at the earliest. There is so much uncertainty right now, we'll see.
I think there is incentive for Disney to make the investment in new lands. For starters, Universal is making huge capital investments in their parks.

You are wrong if you think HP didn't hurt Disney World. It did. And yes, they are having a better year this year because of New Fantasyland, but what happens when Diagon Alley opens next summer? Do you really think vacationers are going to go to Disney with 1 new coaster or Universal with a whole new land and expanded Simpson land? It is going to take another major land expansion or two to get people back to Disney, so I do think the 2015/2016 time frame is realistic.

Also, Disney is now looking for the almighty land where guests will spend added $ for experiences and merchandise. The profit/guest that enters the WWHP is much higher than what Disney is seeing. I believe Disney is looking for a land that will give them that kind of payback.

Is Star Wars, Avatar, or Cars it? I don't know, and I think Disney doesn't either, but they are willing to give it a try and find out.

Further, AK has the lowest admissions of the Disney World parks and in need of an additional land or something to get get those turnstiles moving.

It will be interesting to see. I hope we hear something official soon. D23 Expo, maybe???

If I were going to pick one that I think is the furthest off or the least likely of the 3, it would be Star Wars. And not because I dislike Star Wars. I would love to see a land. But big decisions take time to make, and they only purchased the franchise this year. They might want to see how fans react to the first Disney Star Wars film before they move forward with a concrete investment.

We shall see.
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