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Old 05-16-2013, 02:28 AM   #46
bocaj1431
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If you check out the new thread about Merida by disdork, there is a side by side picture of the orig. Merida and the "improved" Merida.

When I read this string prior to seeing the new post, I tended to think this might be an example of things being blown out of proportion. However, after seeing the actual versions side by side, there is a clear difference. That difference is a more sexualized version.

It is sad, when you see this type of marketing creep it's way into Disney. I do not have a problem with having all princesses be a vision of perfection. The problem I have, is that Disney finally had a strong female character, who was not drawn in the stereo typical princess mold, and then decided that was not good enough. The fact that someone thought a more sexualized version would be better than the original is upsetting. It is not a big deal but it is sad!
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:13 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bocaj1431 View Post
If you check out the new thread about Merida by disdork, there is a side by side picture of the orig. Merida and the "improved" Merida.

When I read this string prior to seeing the new post, I tended to think this might be an example of things being blown out of proportion. However, after seeing the actual versions side by side, there is a clear difference. That difference is a more sexualized version.

It is sad, when you see this type of marketing creep it's way into Disney. I do not have a problem with having all princesses be a vision of perfection. The problem I have, is that Disney finally had a strong female character, who was not drawn in the stereo typical princess mold, and then decided that was not good enough. The fact that someone thought a more sexualized version would be better than the original is upsetting. It is not a big deal but it is sad!
It's interesting how two people can see the same thing but have a totally different read on it. I saw that 'before and after' pic and decided that this was even less of an issue than I had previously thought. There are only two real differences between the before and after. Her dress has more embellishment and she's 2D. She has the same face, the same body, and the same attitude. I have no clue what the drama is about.
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:53 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bocaj1431 View Post
If you check out the new thread about Merida by disdork, there is a side by side picture of the orig. Merida and the "improved" Merida.

When I read this string prior to seeing the new post, I tended to think this might be an example of things being blown out of proportion. However, after seeing the actual versions side by side, there is a clear difference. That difference is a more sexualized version.
It is sad, when you see this type of marketing creep it's way into Disney. I do not have a problem with having all princesses be a vision of perfection. The problem I have, is that Disney finally had a strong female character, who was not drawn in the stereo typical princess mold, and then decided that was not good enough. The fact that someone thought a more sexualized version would be better than the original is upsetting. It is not a big deal but it is sad!
I believe you hit it right on the head.......Merida was a new independent princess and someone thought she needed to be sexualized.

There is so much of that in entertainment today, I feel most people found her refreshing as the original and a good role model for girls!


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Old 05-16-2013, 10:16 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dadddio View Post
It's interesting how two people can see the same thing but have a totally different read on it. I saw that 'before and after' pic and decided that this was even less of an issue than I had previously thought. There are only two real differences between the before and after. Her dress has more embellishment and she's 2D. She has the same face, the same body, and the same attitude. I have no clue what the drama is about.
This hits the nail on the head.

The drama is completely unnecessary.
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Old 05-16-2013, 02:02 PM   #50
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Do people believe that showing a bit of shoulder is 'sexualized'?
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Old 05-16-2013, 04:42 PM   #51
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To give the full changes.........dress........hair........eyes/makeup effects and over all body language by any common sense standard is indeed sexualizing.

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Old 05-16-2013, 04:46 PM   #52
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To give the full changes.........dress........hair........eyes/makeup effects and over all body language by any common sense standard is indeed sexualizing.

AKK
Again, 'common sense' doesn't exist and is used too often as a crutch to support an unsupportable argument.

Looking at the 'before and after' pictures, the only differences is that she is now 'flat' (2d) and her dress has been changed to include some embellishment and have her shoulders show a bit. This is not 'sexualizing', in my opinion.
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Old 05-16-2013, 05:26 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by dadddio View Post
Again, 'common sense' doesn't exist and is used too often as a crutch to support an unsupportable argument.

Looking at the 'before and after' pictures, the only differences is that she is now 'flat' (2d) and her dress has been changed to include some embellishment and have her shoulders show a bit. This is not 'sexualizing', in my opinion.


As usual, it your opinion only, I have the pictures which clearly show what I indicated.


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Old 05-16-2013, 07:04 PM   #54
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As usual, it your opinion only, I have the pictures which clearly show what I indicated.

AKK
We all have the pictures. They're on the Internet and linked from this thread.

It is my opinion, but it isn't just my opinion. Others in this and the other thousand threads have agreed.

I've noticed that you repeatedly try to force your position by making it appear that everyone agrees with you. The interesting thing is that even if that were true, it doesn't make you right or your argument stronger.
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Old 05-16-2013, 07:42 PM   #55
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Again, 'common sense' doesn't exist and is used too often as a crutch to support an unsupportable argument.

Looking at the 'before and after' pictures, the only differences is that she is now 'flat' (2d) and her dress has been changed to include some embellishment and have her shoulders show a bit. This is not 'sexualizing', in my opinion.
Are you serious? That's all you see?

Her hair, rather than being the wild and free tangle has been smoothed and hotcurled to within an inch of its life. Her eyes are completely different, complete with a sultry rather than spitfire gaze. Her dress is now off the shoulders - and yes, that absolutely is sexualizing. Her waist is smaller, her chest is bigger, her shoulders are narrower. No bow, no arrows, just a belt that points, not very subtly, to her genital area.

And people really don't think that's a problematic change?

Well, thankfully enough people DO, and the uproar has caused Disney to seriously backpedal, and say that the changed image was JUST for her "coronation" and that they are now back to the original Merida.
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Old 05-16-2013, 08:31 PM   #56
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I've been annoyed ever since they put Mulan back in that pink dress that SHE hated.

The basic problem is if you saw the film, there was never anything glamorous about Merida. There was never supposed to be anything glamorous about her. But if you're selling Princess merchandise, you gotta have some glamor. As a result she went from a 15 year old tomboy to a siren who looks about 27 and the difference is more jarring with her than it was with the other Princesses.

If they wanted to stay true to the stories they should never have used Merida or Mulan to sell glamorous merchandise. But they're pretty, little girls want to see them on their shirts and stuff, and the glamor is what sells.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:46 PM   #57
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Are you serious? That's all you see?

Her hair, rather than being the wild and free tangle has been smoothed and hotcurled to within an inch of its life. Her eyes are completely different, complete with a sultry rather than spitfire gaze. Her dress is now off the shoulders - and yes, that absolutely is sexualizing. Her waist is smaller, her chest is bigger, her shoulders are narrower. No bow, no arrows, just a belt that points, not very subtly, to her genital area.

And people really don't think that's a problematic change?

Well, thankfully enough people DO, and the uproar has caused Disney to seriously backpedal, and say that the changed image was JUST for her "coronation" and that they are now back to the original Merida.
Wow. You got all of that from the 'after' drawing? I am not seeing what you are seeing.

Her hair is still a big curly mess, but it is 2d now so it looks differently.
Her eyes are the very same shape and color. Her gaze seems just as direct.
Her dress' neck opening is the same shape, but now shows some shoulder. If someone thinks that's overly sexy, they should be very careful with google images.
Her waist does appear to be slightly smaller, but her bust seems to be as small as before while her hips are as large as before. I can't tell any difference in her shoulders. Any perceived difference could simply be because her shoulders are nekkid, like the Disney on Ice costume.
She has her bow and arrows in some of the 2d pics, but not all of them.
I'm not finding any way that her belt is pointing at her goods. It appears to be just like the park costume belt; a wide belt with a round medallion and her family's tartan attached.
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Old 05-17-2013, 12:10 AM   #58
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Reading these Merida threads are kind if like watching a train wreck... I can't stop looking...
To add my two cents... I don't like the new image. However, I also don't think that it sells a message of "sultry" ****tiness that is being discussed.
1. I don't like the way they changed her face, but not because its a come hither look. I don't see that in it personally. I don't like it because I think it takes away the traditional scottish features of her appearance and seems to have more Asian influence. I could be totally off on that... But that's what I see.
2. Her dress is fancier and sparkler, and yeah her character would hate every minute of it.. But what about the lesson she learned in her experience during the movie? When you try to change your fate and family, bad things happen.. Accept responsibility to your family and the requirements that come from it. If part of her responsibility was to wear a fancy dress for awhile, she would grin and bear it for her mother and dream of the moment to could change out if it.
3. I don't see the relationship between her belt pointing towards her genitals at all. In fact, the belt could be way glitzier, but it's fairly simple. The pointed part is on her hip pointing down her leg. It hangs to the right, not to the center. If it were higher on her waist, centered and without the flowy part.. Maybe you pull that our if it..
4. Maybe the dress shows more shoulder, but the laced part in the center if the bodice seems more closed to me. It seems more like there is fabric behind the laces. That looks more covered than the original. I guess it can be claimed that showing more shoulders is sexier, I just don't agree with that. Everyone's entitled to their opinions,
5. The hair is still wild. It's all over the place. There are way more curls that are poking out in all different directions. As a person with curly hair, I assure you her hair in the original picture is falling in line, the new one is not listening very well.

Does she need to be chanted drastically at this point. No. Do I love the changes? Some of them yes. I actually like the new dress and if she had to wear a fancy dress I think she would have chosen that over that light blue one in the movie. At least here her hair is free, and she can totally go pick up her bow after the fancy party and still shot it. I don't like the new face. Do I think it is overtly sexy? Absolutely not.


I guess this is what you end up when watching the train wreck for do long before jumping in.... Sorry for the length...

Last edited by swebb0310; 05-17-2013 at 05:58 AM.
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Old 05-17-2013, 02:02 AM   #59
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A quibble: Merida is from Scotland.
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Old 05-17-2013, 05:56 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dadddio
A quibble: Merida is from Scotland.
Thank you! That's what I meant, I fixed it... I was tired while typing... But the premise is the same.

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