Disney Information Station Logo

Go Back   The DIS Discussion Forums - DISboards.com > Just for Fun > Community Board
Find Hotel Specials & DIScounts
 
facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS UpdatesDIS email updates
Register Chat FAQ Tickers Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read





Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 02-22-2013, 11:33 AM   #31
Planogirl
I feel the nerd in me stirring already
Oh well, let's look on the bright side
If I hadn't been so wiped out I would have kissed my anesthesiologist
 
Planogirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Frisco,Texas
Posts: 45,764

How aware is the father? He might actually enjoy "just a visit". There is that to consider too.
__________________
PG
Planogirl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 11:34 AM   #32
Disney Doll
DIS Security Matron
 
Disney  Doll's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Too far from WDW!! :(
Posts: 28,974

Well, I think you need to decide what works best for you, what will be what you can tolerate from your relationship and what will make you feel the least guilty after Mom & Dad are gone.

Try as we may, the past always has an impact on the present. In your case, you seem to not feel like your parents put huge effort into raising you, so you don't feel the need to put huge effort into helping them. I'm not going to fault you for that...you grew up with them so only you know the extent to which they were "good" or "bad" parents. If you feel comfortable with what you're doing and if you feel comfortable that when Dad (and Mom for that matter) dies that you will have no guilt, no regrets etc., then I'd say you're fine. Because in one sense you are right...if they were neglectful etc. as parents, then they did reap what they sowed...or are reaping what they sowed.

As far as your brother....if he's interested in seeing your dad more then he needs to say to Mom "When is a good time for me to come?" and "While I am there why don't you plan to go out and do something that you need to do? I'll be with dad so he'll be OK." because truth be told, Mom is probably overwhelmed with caregiving and based on what you said about the past, has a martyr complex so you have a double whammy there. But brother needs to pin her down. He needs to be direct and say "What can I do to help you?" and if she says "Take him to your hoouse for a while" then he needs to take him to his house for a while and see how it goes. If it goes well, he can do it again. If it doesn't go well, then he and she need to discuss why it didn't go well and what alternatives there are for him to help, such as "I will come over every Monday and Thursday after work to spend time with dad so you can get a break".

If she pooh-poohs this, then he is well within his right to say " I understand that you feel like you have been left with the burden of caring for him. I am here now offering help and every offer I make is met with resistance from you, and a million excuses of why it won't work. I am willing to help but you seem unwilling to let me help while at the same time complaining that I don't help".

Often people in these situations don't know what they want. My elderly mother gets like this. Her most recent "kick" is arthritis. She has it in her hands. I understand it's difficult sometimes to open jars, write etc.

Here's how the conversations go:
I suggested taking Tylenol or some other pain reliever. "No I don't like taking pills".

I suggested using a heating pad when they are very stiff assuming the warmth would help relieve some of he stiffness. "What am I supposed to do carry the heating pad around with me all day?"

I suggested a Ben Gay type muscle rub or pain relief rub. "It smells".

I was at a health fair and they were giving away spongy "squeeze balls". I picked up a couple thinking that perhaps the squeezing would help strengthen the hands and unstiffen them a bit. "Just what I need more junk in my house"

I suggested going to a rheumatologist. "I don't need to go to another doctor. I already go to too many".


So now when she complains to me about her hands I say "Mom I have made all the suggestions I have. You choose not to do any of them. There is nothing more I can do to help you. I'm sorry but you are correct when you say you will have to suffer from your arthritis because you are unwilling to try anything that might help".

Sometimes that's all you can say. Your mother may be exactly he same. The whole thing stinks but she doesn't want to do anything to change it either. But have your brother offer to spend more time there and see what happens.
__________________
Disney Doll
Prepare your child for the path, not the path for your child.
Stop telling your God how big the storm is. Instead, tell the storm how big your God is.
It's time to put on your big girl panties and deal with it!
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
There's no pill that cures stupid.
He is your friend, your partner, your defender, your dog.
You are his life, his love, his leader.
He will be yours, faithful and true, to the last beat of his heart.
You owe it to him to be worthy of such devotion.
~~In loving memory of Teddy~~1994-2007~~

Last edited by Disney Doll; 02-22-2013 at 05:59 PM. Reason: fixing typos
Disney  Doll is offline   Reply With Quote
|
The DIS
Register to remove

Join Date: 1997
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,000,000
Old 02-22-2013, 11:35 AM   #33
Nancyg56
DIS Veteran
 
Nancyg56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CT
Posts: 15,473

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I guess maybe another question is how much help and effort should you give parents who gave no real effort to raising their kids. I know she's probably tired and feels lonely and trapped, but I have so many times growing up felt the same. My mother and father were very self absorbed people and I was often made to feel children should be seen and not heard. There's a history of alcoholism with my father. When he was sober he was more of a "buddy" than a father. My mother drank too but always played the victim. But hey....every now and then they took us to theme parks or a movie. I'm sure I need therapy. I just really feel no moral obligation to either of my parents. Especially my father. My mom tried harder but always was the martyr and let us all know all the time. There's a lot of back story here but i guess I'm kind of in a position where I'm saying "you made your bed, now lay in it". Heartless as it sounds.
I think that there is a part of you that wants your Mom to suffer. I am not saying that you are right or wrong, but I am pointing out that no matter what suggestions people are giving you there is a reason why it won't work.

The bottom line is that only you can decide how to handle your own visits. Only your brother can decide how to handle his. What jumped out at me was that your brother would leave your dad alone when he wanted to leave. No wonder your Mom does not trust him to care for Dad so she can leave. I would not either.

If you want to help then you just do it. If you want to visit you go. If you don't want to visit then just don't.

Your brother is not tying hard enough, IMO. He says he wants to visit but your Mom says his timing is inconvenient. He needs to decide how badly he wants to visit and how much inconvenience he is willing to deal with. You should stay out of this, it is not your business.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I feel my mom is this way a lot. I think she wants help but doesn't want him around to help. It's weird. I really think she thrives on playing the woe is me card. Wants people to say "oh poor her". She hints at stuff but never asks so you never know what she's thinking. If she's expecting people to just volunteer it's not gonna happen. It happens with my DH all the time. You basically have to say "hey put up that light fixture this weekend". If I hint at it like "man it would be great if that light fixture was up" it would never get done.
She is not going to ask. If you want to help then you just pitch in. If you don't want to help, stop trying to make it her fault. If you don't want to take a hint, that is fine. Personally, I would not ask my kids to help me. If they could not see that I was overwhelmed undder the circumstances, it would be clear they had blinders on.

You and your brother are looking for justification to stay away. You don't need it.
__________________
Nancyg56 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 11:51 AM   #34
mad madam mim78
DIS Veteran
 
mad madam mim78's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 943

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nancyg56 View Post
I think that there is a part of you that wants your Mom to suffer. I am not saying that you are right or wrong, but I am pointing out that no matter what suggestions people are giving you there is a reason why it won't work.

The bottom line is that only you can decide how to handle your own visits. Only your brother can decide how to handle his. What jumped out at me was that your brother would leave your dad alone when he wanted to leave. No wonder your Mom does not trust him to care for Dad so she can leave. I would not either.

If you want to help then you just do it. If you want to visit you go. If you don't want to visit then just don't.

Your brother is not tying hard enough, IMO. He says he wants to visit but your Mom says his timing is inconvenient. He needs to decide how badly he wants to visit and how much inconvenience he is willing to deal with. You should stay out of this, it is not your business.




She is not going to ask. If you want to help then you just pitch in. If you don't want to help, stop trying to make it her fault. If you don't want to take a hint, that is fine. Personally, I would not ask my kids to help me. If they could not see that I was overwhelmed undder the circumstances, it would be clear they had blinders on.

You and your brother are looking for justification to stay away. You don't need it.
My mom leaves my dad all the time. He's probably home by himself around 60-70 hours a week. My mom goes out sometimes on weekends to the casino. She isn't completely stay at home caregiver.
mad madam mim78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 11:54 AM   #35
lovemygoofy
Man I shot myself in the foot
I got new moves and everything ready for some serious tips
No, in case you ever wondered, golf carts can't float
Loved by many!
 
lovemygoofy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: nothing, nothing, nothing....oooh tumbleweed!
Posts: 9,215

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I feel my mom is this way a lot. I think she wants help but doesn't want him around to help. It's weird. I really think she thrives on playing the woe is me card. Wants people to say "oh poor her". She hints at stuff but never asks so you never know what she's thinking. If she's expecting people to just volunteer it's not gonna happen. It happens with my DH all the time. You basically have to say "hey put up that light fixture this weekend". If I hint at it like "man it would be great if that light fixture was up" it would never get done.
Oh I could write the entire encyclopedia set about screwed up families and obligation as I live that Titanic story everyday. Either decide you want to be a part of the family and help or don't. It's kinda that simple. You can carry on and complain about how your mom does it but the bottom line is she is doing it. There is no being between mom and brother because just make a decision and maybe if you make one so will the siblings. There is no right or wrong decision but harboring all the resentment isn't doing anyone any good.

She probably does complain and hint and whatever else but do you know why? It is damn hard to do the job she is doing? If she left the house when your brother was there but your brother didn't stay the entire time, she is going to worry about your dad. If your brother comes to visit and is a lump on the couch for the 15 minutes that he is there what good is that?

Your mom needs an outlet where she is a priority. No doubt all the people coming to visit your dad are asking all about your dad and worrying about him and your mom is the "good person" standing by his side. The majority of conversations will revolve around your dad and about his medical issues or his happiness. It's a very lonely life when you are a caregiver.
__________________
Tina
Proud Army Wife


Love doesn't make the world go around, it makes the ride worthwhile...
lovemygoofy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 11:55 AM   #36
dadddio
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,215

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
My brother just wants to visit my dad when he gets a chance. My mother is basically holding my dad hostage and won't allow his other children to come see him. It's always too inconvenient for her. She has to clean. She has stuff to do. She has to take a nap. Whatever. My brother just wants to visit for a bit.
In my opinion, your brother should stop asking permission to visit with his father.
dadddio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 12:26 PM   #37
mad madam mim78
DIS Veteran
 
mad madam mim78's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 943

I just want to say thank you to everyone. Believe it or not its helping.
mad madam mim78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 12:36 PM   #38
brockash
DIS Veteran
 
brockash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,197

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I'm going to try to sum this up the best I can. Insight would be greatly appreciated.

My father is an old man in pretty bad shape. He has survived cancer last year and suffers from a bit of dementia. My mother is 20 years his junior and is now in charge of taking care of my dad. She works full time and basically is his caregiver.

My father has 2 other children from previous marriage. We have all remained fairly close. My mother has always claimed to like them but she has many issues with them. They are nice people but have never made major efforts to visit. The occasional call or Father's Day, birthday, or Christmas is about it. I will admit i am the same. We're all busy yadda yadda yadda. My father has never been much on reaching out either. Apples don't fall far.

I am now in between my brother and my mother.

My brother just wants to visit my dad when he gets a chance. My mother is basically holding my dad hostage and won't allow his other children to come see him. It's always too inconvenient for her. She has to clean. She has stuff to do. She has to take a nap. Whatever. My brother just wants to visit for a bit.

She is upset because she feels they basically only want to come around when its convenient for them and tread on her time and don't respect all she does for my dad when they contribute nothing except the short visit or call.

My brother is upset because my mom NEVER thinks its convenient for them to come over and he thinks the next time he's allowed to see my dad will be in a casket.

My mom insists that "anytime he wants to come pick your dad up and take him over to their house they can."

My brother doesn't do this so my mom takes that as they don't want to see him that bad. I know how I feel. I just want to know how others would take this. Any advice from people who have dealt with similar situations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Disers.
It sounds like your mom has a lot of issues and needs to get over herself. I think it's really cruel to not let the kids see their basically dying father. She needs to remember that she CHOSE to marry someone 20 years older than herself, and it may sound rough, but she needs to deal with the consequences of that, if that's how she see's it. Sure it'd be great if all the adult kids were able to and willing to really help out etc., but it is what it is, and if your mom wasn't in the picture, I'm guessing someone else would end up doing the caregiving, but it seems pretty logical that it would be the able wife of the husband that would be doing the majority of the caregiving in this type of situation.

Is there a way that your mom and dad could possibly pay for a part-time caregiver to help her out a little? Or maybe someone to help with the cooking/cleaning, so maybe she gets a little bit of a break? I think that would be ideal, but regardless, I think your mom is being really cruel to your dad and your siblings.
__________________
brockash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 12:39 PM   #39
2disneyboys
DIS Veteran
 
2disneyboys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,235

OP, Its hard as adults to have just the right relationship with our parents and it just gets harder when there are other family members (like step parents 1/2 siblings, etc etc) Ultimately, each of you need to decide what type of relationship you going to have with your parent based on your individual history and then make that relationship happen. If current wife is making things hard on any of the kids, then the kids needs to have a one on one with current wife. As kids, unless you have mistreated your parent or been disrespectful to the current spouse, you have a right to time with your parent. However, this does not mean that the "terms" of the visit are 100% up to you. you need to work out some sort of compromise w/ the spouse who is the primary caregiver that is realistic.

It sounds like it would be detrimental to your father for him to be taken to brothers house. In this case, brother needs to clearly communicate this to step mom and find out what he has to do to spend time with his father.

I can tell you this. If I truly wanted to spend time with my father, NO ONE would stop me. I would find out what the terms of visitation are, and I would make it happen. However, keep in mind, everyone involved should have the same primary concern - what's best for dad.

A good friend told me once when I was explaining an uncomfortable position I was in with someone, "Well, 2disneyboys, if you knew for a fact that 6 months from today this person would be dead, what would you change about the next 6 months." That is such a simple statement, but it had impact for me. I realized I was so caught up in the history between me & this person that I was wasting our "current" and future. The reality is you don't know if someone has even 6 months left, much less more. Only you can decide how you want to spend what time is left.
__________________
~I apologize in advance for the many typo's you will find in my posts! It's an unfortunate result of adding most posts by a tiny phone screen. . ~

DH ME
DS#1 13 DS#2 10

Lots of Magical Memories between 1999 - 2012
Maybe another visit in 2013 ? I can only hope!
2disneyboys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 12:39 PM   #40
The Mystery Machine
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Missouri
Posts: 45,213

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I just want to say thank you to everyone. Believe it or not its helping.
Don't make your BROTHER'S issues with your mother and father YOUR issues.

If he starts complaining, tell him to go and pick up dad.

He is "dumping" on you to make HIMSELF feel better about not visiting his father.

All the shenanagins and back story do not apply to this issue of visitation. I hope you can "see" that. Your brother knows he can go and get his dad. He CHOOSES not to.

I will quote The Matrix instead of LOTR's....."Choice, the problem is choice".
The Mystery Machine is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 12:51 PM   #41
disykat
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Washington State
Posts: 17,382

I think it's really sad that your mom won't let her "step-son" visit his father. It sounds like she has no relationship with him and simply doesn't want him in her home - thus limiting his access to his dad unless he will take him out of the house.

I get why it would be easier for brother to just visit with his dad in his home. However, he may have no choice but to pick him up and take him out if he wants to see him since step-mom is denying access otherwise.

I'd be tempted to ask mom if I could come over and then simply bring brother with me.
__________________
DL - 1966,1974,2007 WDW 1987,
WDW/BRB 12/90 Honeymoon, DW/DCL 07/01 family 10th Ann, WDW 12/10 family 20th anniversary
disykat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 01:09 PM   #42
cabanafrau
DIS Veteran
 
cabanafrau's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: michigan
Posts: 5,262

Quote:
Originally Posted by disykat View Post
I think it's really sad that your mom won't let her "step-son" visit his father. It sounds like she has no relationship with him and simply doesn't want him in her home - thus limiting his access to his dad unless he will take him out of the house.

I get why it would be easier for brother to just visit with his dad in his home. However, he may have no choice but to pick him up and take him out if he wants to see him since step-mom is denying access otherwise.

I'd be tempted to ask mom if I could come over and then simply bring brother with me.
That seems somewhat manipulative and disrespectful.
cabanafrau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 01:41 PM   #43
disykat
DIS Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Washington State
Posts: 17,382

Quote:
Originally Posted by cabanafrau View Post
That seems somewhat manipulative and disrespectful.
I guess so, but we're talking about family here, not bringing a total stranger into her home. This is Dad's son we're discussing! OP hasn't given us any reason to believe he has a criminal record or has treated step-mom badly or any other reason he wouldn't be allowed in her home. She seems to feel her mom is the one manipulating.
__________________
DL - 1966,1974,2007 WDW 1987,
WDW/BRB 12/90 Honeymoon, DW/DCL 07/01 family 10th Ann, WDW 12/10 family 20th anniversary
disykat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 01:47 PM   #44
cabanafrau
DIS Veteran
 
cabanafrau's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: michigan
Posts: 5,262

Quote:
Originally Posted by disykat View Post
I guess so, but we're talking about family here, not bringing a total stranger into her home. This is Dad's son we're discussing! OP hasn't given us any reason to believe he has a criminal record or has treated step-mom badly or any other reason he wouldn't be allowed in her home. She seems to feel her mom is the one manipulating.
But the bottom line is it is her home. She's not denying him an opportunity to see his father, merely setting up terms which work for her, whatever her reasons may be, good or bad.

OP's brother is only interested in things working his way. Wife seems to want things to work her way from what we've been told. Her home. She is the only one doing the caretaking. Her rules.
cabanafrau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2013, 01:54 PM   #45
Kellydelly
DIS Veteran
 
Kellydelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,795

Quote:
Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
I guess maybe another question is how much help and effort should you give parents who gave no real effort to raising their kids. I know she's probably tired and feels lonely and trapped, but I have so many times growing up felt the same. My mother and father were very self absorbed people and I was often made to feel children should be seen and not heard. There's a history of alcoholism with my father. When he was sober he was more of a "buddy" than a father. My mother drank too but always played the victim. But hey....every now and then they took us to theme parks or a movie. I'm sure I need therapy. I just really feel no moral obligation to either of my parents. Especially my father. My mom tried harder but always was the martyr and let us all know all the time. There's a lot of back story here but i guess I'm kind of in a position where I'm saying "you made your bed, now lay in it". Heartless as it sounds.
This sounds a bit like me and my parents, but my parents divorced when I was 15. I had a father that was self absorbed and didn't make much of an effort to be a part of his 7 kids' lives (kids from two marriages). I went for two years before his death of not seeing him, not because I didn't want to, but because he was 1200 miles away and it wasn't convenient for me to get to him (job, dh's job, 4 kids, distance). I feel horrible that I have no idea what he looked like when he died . I feel horrible that nobody but his *****y 4th wife was there with him the days before he died. So don't let any unresolved stuff hang in the air if you want to clear it.

Anyway, just saying if you are close by, don't waste an opportunity to be a good daughter, even if he was a crappy father. Don't put yourself out, but put yourself into the situation as much as you feel you can or need to for your own mental health. I think your brother should just show up with some takeout food as a treat to your parents. If he is too much of a woose to just show up and say hello, then there is not much you can do for him . Let your mom play the martyr if she wants to, that's her perogative.
Kellydelly is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

facebooktwitterpinterestgoogle plusyoutubeDIS Updates
GET OUR DIS UPDATES DELIVERED BY EMAIL



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:51 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Copyright © 1997-2014, Werner Technologies, LLC. All Rights Reserved.