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Old 02-08-2013, 10:57 AM   #16
Dean
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Thanks, so in the case of a room not rented the points go up, or that option of staying at a non DVC goes away.
That's the reality now. CRO takes a reported 50% of the actual rental price and I was told a number of years ago by one of the VP's, that they only had a 75% rental rate but I'm sure it has varied over time. So yes, if there are any changes in the variables, the points will go up (or down potentially). I'm told this is supposed to be a zero sum situation where the program pays for itself but there's no profit margin to DVD (CRO different ball game of course). The variables include rental rate, rental % and the cash cost of the item. CRO should be fixed. There are ways to control the number they haven't employed. They haven't been aggressive on the pricing within the company and they haven't limited the number of people that could exchange other than enforcing the limits on cruising the last couple of years. If they were willing to play hardball with DCL and the DC components, they could likely get a better price. However, that approach means they'd have to be willing to leave off components that didn't ante up and that might be your favorite.
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Old 02-08-2013, 02:44 PM   #17
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$41 million annually to operate OKW W/ taxes???? Something just doesn't pass the smell test here, I have a feeling disney is doing better than we think
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:05 PM   #18
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If they were willing to play hardball with DCL and the DC components, they could likely get a better price.
Since DVC and DCL are in the same business unit, New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, how hard do you think that they should have to play to get a better price?

Bill
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:14 PM   #19
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$41 million annually to operate OKW W/ taxes???? Something just doesn't pass the smell test here, I have a feeling disney is doing better than we think
I don't have OKW's exact numbers, but based on SSR's numbers x1.1 (because OKW uses less points per room) and 1.1 equal uses total dues

All amounts in millions:
Front desk $4
Housekeeping $6.3
Maint. $3.6
Management fee $3
Mbr Activities $1
Security $0.5
Transportation $4.7
Utilities. $2.2
Roof replacement $.2
Interior refurb $3
Common area refurb $2.2
Paving $.3
Exterior Painting. $2.3
Property taxes $8.4

There are some smaller fees and small income like breakage.
DVC sends the full breakdown to owners every year.
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:16 PM   #20
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Since DVC and DCL are in the same business unit, New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, how hard do you think that they should have to play to get a better price?

Bill
You would think that DCL could offer some special cruise + villa packages that would benefit both parties.....at the expense of CRO
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:30 PM   #21
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Since DVC and DCL are in the same business unit, New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, how hard do you think that they should have to play to get a better price?

Bill
Same business unit, but each is still responsible for their own profit. What advantage is there to DCL to offer less expensive cruises to members? The ships don't seem to be running with lots of empty cabins. And what potential profit would there be for DVC? They would still need to turn rooms over to CRO cash to offset the cost.
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:38 PM   #22
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Same business unit, but each is still responsible for their own profit. What advantage is there to DCL to offer less expensive cruises to members? The ships don't seem to be running with lots of empty cabins. And what potential profit would there be for DVC? They would still need to turn rooms over to CRO cash to offset the cost.
Since we are valued and in the club, I just thought that it would be easier for Disney to offer something since the same President runs DVC and DCL verses getting some other business unit to buy off on giving something to DVC.

Bill
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Old 02-08-2013, 04:02 PM   #23
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Same business unit, but each is still responsible for their own profit. What advantage is there to DCL to offer less expensive cruises to members? The ships don't seem to be running with lots of empty cabins. And what potential profit would there be for DVC? They would still need to turn rooms over to CRO cash to offset the cost.
You'd have to remove CRO as a middleman. DCL could operate like David's rentals (only during DCL + Villa combos) and undercut CRO while paying DVC members more per point than CRO.
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Old 02-08-2013, 04:08 PM   #24
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Since DVC and DCL are in the same business unit, New Vacation Operations and Disney Cruise Line, how hard do you think that they should have to play to get a better price?

Bill
I fully understand both DVC/DVD's reluctance to compete and to push the other entities as well as DCL's reluctance to give more if they don't have to. It's like buying a car from a close relative. I'll use DCL as the reference but the principles apply to any similar concept/system. There are many angles. Should DCL give more just to be nice? Is it appropriate for DVD/DVC to play one against the other? etc, etc. However, the realities are as I set out. DVC/DVCMC and to a degree, DVD all have the responsibility to put the members first in such matters. We all know it's unlikely DVD is going to threaten contracting with another company over DCL or to simply not offer the option but they could take such an approach if they chose. Realistically I don't think the membership as a whole has the stomach for it either because they might lose a preferred option at least short term.

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Same business unit, but each is still responsible for their own profit. What advantage is there to DCL to offer less expensive cruises to members? The ships don't seem to be running with lots of empty cabins. And what potential profit would there be for DVC? They would still need to turn rooms over to CRO cash to offset the cost.
They could also potentially negotiate a better rate from CRO on the management side. Realistically the best time to deal with all of these issues would have been day 1 up front. Of course none of us have enough inside details to truly evaluate the nuts and bolts of this question other than to take a 10000 ft view of the issue and realize as it's set up it's pretty worthless other than to give some the chance to burn up points they might not use otherwise.
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Old 02-08-2013, 04:59 PM   #25
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The other DCL/DVC issue is the future cruise cost and value of points is ate in stone for the next 2 years.

CRO guarantees what it will pay DVC to rent points for the next 24 months (regardless if the hotel market goes up or down) , and DCL guarantees what DVC$ it will take for the next 2 years. (Regardless if the cruise market goes up or down)

There is really no reason to offer an occasional points only "deal." If DCL can never raise their points rate if demand is too high.
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