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Old 01-18-2013, 07:29 PM   #406
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I think something good is coming out of this raise in tax. Everyone is feeling the effects of raising taxes.

Sorry, I think that is a good thing. If everyone's taxes increase, maybe more thought will be given to spending.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:10 PM   #407
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HUH?

1. Most of us were well aware this was a temporary tax reprieve.

2. I was well aware of my spending before this tax break went away.

3. The theory that taxes should increase to help us learn how to budget is a rather flawed theory IMO.

4. Why the apology if you truly believe higher taxes is a good thing?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Muushka View Post
I think something good is coming out of this raise in tax. Everyone is feeling the effects of raising taxes.

Sorry, I think that is a good thing. If everyone's taxes increase, maybe more thought will be given to spending.
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:13 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
HUH?

1. Most of us were well aware this was a temporary tax reprieve.

2. I was well aware of my spending before this tax break went away.

3. The theory that taxes should increase to help us learn how to budget is a rather flawed theory.

4. Why the apology if you truly believe higher taxes is a good thing?
Calm down Dawn! I wasn't talking about our own personal budgets, I was talking about the spending in the US (United States)!

You know, skin in the game, fair share?
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:19 PM   #409
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OHHHHH......yeah, I didn't get whose spending you were talking about. Sorry.

I am not sure the Government getting more money will make them more aware of their spending though.

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Calm down Dawn! I wasn't talking about our own personal budgets, I was talking about the spending in the US (United States)!

You know, skin in the game, fair share?
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Old 01-18-2013, 08:26 PM   #410
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Originally Posted by DawnM View Post
OHHHHH......yeah, I didn't get whose spending you were talking about. Sorry.

I am not sure the Government getting more money will make them more aware of their spending though.
No worries, my statement needed clarification, thanks .

Hopefully when people hear about the losses that we are taking/took on GM or Solyndra, it will be a wake up call.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:18 PM   #411
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I won't know what the difference is until the last day of the month.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:20 PM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muushka View Post
No worries, my statement needed clarification, thanks .

Hopefully when people hear about the losses that we are taking/took on GM or Solyndra, it will be a wake up call.
Off topic, but are we taking a loss on GM? I know people have been flipping out about them building Chinese factories (which they will use only for Chinese car sales) but I work in construction and recently have noticed they seem to be building here too. I have a facebook friend who angrily posted an article about them closing a plant- what the article didn't say was that they are relocating a couple towns away to a bigger site.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:44 PM   #413
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistysue View Post
Off topic, but are we taking a loss on GM? I know people have been flipping out about them building Chinese factories (which they will use only for Chinese car sales) but I work in construction and recently have noticed they seem to be building here too. I have a facebook friend who angrily posted an article about them closing a plant- what the article didn't say was that they are relocating a couple towns away to a bigger site.

No not a loss. so this is my undrstanding from fact check.org

GM got about 50 mill from the government. they found out they did not need that much and so a few million of it was sitting in an escrow account. they gave it back and the GOP got made because they said it wasn't money made from profits. GM countered why keep the full loan they did not need

some politicians are saying it wasn't "meaningful' since it didn't come from earnings. GM countered that it is not more loans to pay off old loans it's just lowering the amount borrowed.

that's my understanding of it
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:46 PM   #414
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We lost $50 a month. It has cut into my gas and grocery bill.
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Old 01-18-2013, 09:53 PM   #415
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistysue View Post
Off topic, but are we taking a loss on GM? I know people have been flipping out about them building Chinese factories (which they will use only for Chinese car sales) but I work in construction and recently have noticed they seem to be building here too. I have a facebook friend who angrily posted an article about them closing a plant- what the article didn't say was that they are relocating a couple towns away to a bigger site.
The US Treasury owns about 500 Million shares of GM common stock. In order to break even on the bailout, the stock would have to be sold at $53/share. It closed at $46.46 today. It was announced this afternoon that the Treasury will be going forward with a "pre-arranged written trading plan" for their remaining holdings in GM.

Yes, we are taking a loss on the bailout.
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Old 01-19-2013, 08:56 AM   #416
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Originally Posted by eliza61 View Post
I think the problem is (at least this is what I laugh at) is all these disser who swear that all people on public assistance have 12 babies by 10 different daddies (average family on PA has 1.8 kids), are on welfare for life (36 months is the national average) and go to disney (so untrue). So it always makes me wonder exactly where people hang out at.

The second one I love is how every one goes to the supermarket and knows exactly who the welfare/food stamp repients are and how they are living their life. case in point the one about how some one at the store was using food stamps but getting fancy manicures. Sorry but unless you've been stalking that person how could you possible know this. I go to the grocery store 2-3 times a week and I couldn't remember how the person in front paid even if you offered me a million dollars.

So personally I think people are just repeating the popular tv stereotypes. sort of when you see a fat person eating a donught you immediately judge them.

I totally know there are some abuses in the system but personally I think the poor and welfare people are easy targets.

Gov christie just got a whole bucket of money for sandy victims yet no one is screaming about those people getting government aide? So we have a serious stereotype problem. Israel just got another couple of billion dollars for aide yet that's perfectly ok, we've been forking money to them for ages yet I don't hear you screaming about us taking care of them from cradle to grave.

So basically we want to "choose" who we feel is worthy and who is not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eliza61 View Post
I'm on my cell so I can't link but if you google tanf statistics, it will give you the census data on assistance given to families in need for 2010

TANF is just a small part of PA. I am still waiting for proof.


http://www.nber.org/papers/w6995.pdf?new_window=1

Table 1
Expenditures in the Six Largest Welfare Programs in the U.S.,
1994 (millions)
Total Federal State-Local
Medicaid $143,593 $82,147 $61,446
Food Stamps 27,396 25,599 1,797
SSI 27,310 23,544 3,766
AFDC 25,920 14,141 11,779
EITC 16,549 16,549 0
Section 8 Low-Income Housing 14,576 14,576 0
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Old 01-19-2013, 10:26 AM   #417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mistysue View Post
Off topic, but are we taking a loss on GM? I know people have been flipping out about them building Chinese factories (which they will use only for Chinese car sales) but I work in construction and recently have noticed they seem to be building here too. I have a facebook friend who angrily posted an article about them closing a plant- what the article didn't say was that they are relocating a couple towns away to a bigger site.
No, that is not what I was referring to. Below is not even close

Quote:
Originally Posted by eliza61 View Post
No not a loss. so this is my undrstanding from fact check.org

GM got about 50 mill from the government. they found out they did not need that much and so a few million of it was sitting in an escrow account. they gave it back and the GOP got made because they said it wasn't money made from profits. GM countered why keep the full loan they did not need

some politicians are saying it wasn't "meaningful' since it didn't come from earnings. GM countered that it is not more loans to pay off old loans it's just lowering the amount borrowed.

that's my understanding of it
E, I wouldn't even bother to bring up a 50 million dollar loan. Heck, Solyndra got (as a gift from the taxpayers) more than 500 million. Never to be seen again. No, GM got a lot more than that. I would be curious to see that factcheck article. A site I wouldn't trust, personally.

Below is what I'm talking about

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marionnette View Post
The US Treasury owns about 500 Million shares of GM common stock. In order to break even on the bailout, the stock would have to be sold at $53/share. It closed at $46.46 today. It was announced this afternoon that the Treasury will be going forward with a "pre-arranged written trading plan" for their remaining holdings in GM.

Yes, we are taking a loss on the bailout.
My point in bringing up the raise in taxes is so that hopefully people will be more aware of where their tax dollars are being spent or wasted.

A HUGE loss for the taxpayers But today's stock price is really closer to $30 a share, not $46.

https://www.google.com/#hl=en&newwin...e32a4cea89f529

Articles

http://news.investors.com/politics-a...all.htm?p=full

And the dailybeast, in case anyone wants to see what they say

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...ors-stock.html

Right now the exact amount lost is cloudy (to me at least) but it is a huge amount of money, in the billions.
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Old 01-19-2013, 01:30 PM   #418
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovemk76 View Post
TANF is just a small part of PA. I am still waiting for proof.


http://www.nber.org/papers/w6995.pdf?new_window=1

Table 1
Expenditures in the Six Largest Welfare Programs in the U.S.,
1994 (millions)
Total Federal State-Local
Medicaid $143,593 $82,147 $61,446
Food Stamps 27,396 25,599 1,797
SSI 27,310 23,544 3,766
AFDC 25,920 14,141 11,779
EITC 16,549 16,549 0
Section 8 Low-Income Housing 14,576 14,576 0
Do you consider SSI and EITC "welfare programs"?

That's funny on a thread about the social security tax....which comes out of our paychecks...that we work for (aka not welfare).

That source is outdated as well.
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Old 01-19-2013, 02:03 PM   #419
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Do you consider SSI and EITC "welfare programs"?

That's funny on a thread about the social security tax....which comes out of our paychecks...that we work for (aka not welfare).

That source is outdated as well.
I am still waiting for the proof that welfare mothers have less kids than the American woman that was claimed by a poster. She posted TANF and that is not all that is welfare.

Yes EITC is welfare since you are getting money to raise your kids. SSI is also a welfare program. SSDI is the insurance that working people get if they become disabled. SSI and SSDI are two different programs.
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Old 01-19-2013, 02:36 PM   #420
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I am still waiting for the proof that welfare mothers have less kids than the American woman that was claimed by a poster. She posted TANF and that is not all that is welfare.

Yes EITC is welfare since you are getting money to raise your kids. SSI is also a welfare program. SSDI is the insurance that working people get if they become disabled. SSI and SSDI are two different programs.
what proof are you waiting for? I told you where i found the information go read. if you google the question you will get 2. I'm assuming htat those folks rounded up as it's pretty weird to say 0.8 of a child. I claimed the number is 1.8 per household.
I did consider money and food stamps only. I did not considered ssi sorry.

What you want me to go count them personally? where's the proof that it's not that number. Outside of fox news? Ok, is this acceptable?

Myth: Welfare gives mothers an economic incentive to have more children.

Fact: Studies have not found a correlation between size of welfare benefits and families

The average AFDC family is virtually the same size as the average American family. Of all welfare families, 73.9 percent have two children or less. (3) Of all American families with children, this figure is 79.1 percent. (4) (Families without children are not qualified for welfare, even though they may need it, so there are conceptual problems with adding childless families to either side of this comparison

This on is from the usda.

Food stamp households have little income. Only
9 percent are above the poverty line, while 40
percent have incomes at or below half the
poverty line. The typical food stamp household
had gross income of $558 per month and
received a monthly food stamp benefit of $169.
Food stamp households possess few resources.
The average food stamp household possesses
only about $92 in countable resources (including
vehicles, checking and savings accounts, and
other savings).
Most food stamp households are small. The
average food stamp household size was 2.4, but
varied considerably by household composition.
Households with children were relatively large,
averaging 3.4 members. Households with elderly
members tended to be smaller, with an average
size of 1.3 people.


Natural assumption is that one of the 3.4 members is not a child so that brings the number of children down to 2.4

I did forget to include SSI though. I'll go play and see what the family size is for that but some thing tells me you be bitterly disappointed that you won't be able to hold onto the ghetto queen myth there either.
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