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Old 01-06-2013, 01:52 PM   #46
"Cinder" Ella's Mom
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Originally Posted by ShannonMB
Thank you all so much for the responses!

I do know my child, and I am certain she can be trusted to follow the protocol we put in place. She is also very comfortable in her own skin and enjoys little tests of her independence. Thing is, she just turned 12, is my only, and I am still trying to wrap my brain around all these changes that take place at this age!

I'm not taking a poll, I will definitely ultimately decide on our strategy based on my gut and what I think is best. But this discussion is already giving me SO much to think about - AND so much concrete info. In all the times I've been, I never knew about the chicken exits!!!! I do think DD would enjoy seeing the queues (esp for ToT), so that's probably the solution. But the discussion is definitely helping me sort my thoughts, so thanks!

And Seven Dwarfs, I'm so sorry, too.
My DD9 went through the ToT line with us and chickened out at the last second. It happened really fast and I stayed with my DS instead of going with her. I was panicked the whole ride about where she would meet us, etc. when the elevator doors opened she was right there. The CMs had given her a mini-bellhop outfit and she was directing all of us off the ride. It was so sweet and she didn't feel silly about bailing out at the last minute. Awesome experience. I would not leave any of my kids without a cellphone. Too easy to get separated. With one, at age 12, yes.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:01 PM   #47
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I would not leave my child at the age of 12 alone anywhere in Disney. I know Disney seems so friendly and full of workers and that bad things can't happen there. I also know we have made many trips to Disney and never had anything bad happen with a stranger. Until this past summer trip.

I would like to share that my daughter (12) was touched in an inappropriate manor while on the stitch attraction. She was sitting by her sister who was 8and I was sitting next to the eight year old. There were many empty seats as it was not that busy. The gentleman was sitting behind her and did not allow his harness to tighten. I noticed him alone on the ride and that his harness was not down but just thought maybe he doesn't like space mountain and his family is riding that and maybe he doesn't like the idea of a harness. During the dark parts he slipped out of his seat. At first she was not sure what it was, and I think she was in such shock. But then once she processed what was going on, she took her hand with her nails and dug into his hairy hands. (I hope she drew blood!)

I have talked to my children about strangers, and the "what ifs". I have also told them over and over what to do in a situation like this. Even after many talks, my daughter froze up and by the time she was able to tell me what had happened, the man was gone. It was for his best because he would have taken his last breath had my husband and I found him. My daughter said she now understands why I have a 2 person rule. She used to think it was silly. I have six kids so we do everything in two's. It was an awful situation that has forever changed my family.

I believe this man knew what he was doing and that it wasn't his first time and won't be his last until he is caught. He knew the ride well. Since there is no video in the ride they were unable to locate the man. I believe had there been just a touch of light during the dark parts, this would not have happened.

I am sad to have to share such an awful experience my family had during the happiest place on earth. But, I believe it is important to share to prevent others from going through what she did. I would never leave my 12year old daughter anywhere alone in Disney. You can not put a price on a childs safety. This has forever changed my daughter and I am very sad that it has changed her thoughts of Disney. I also know it can happen anywhere.

I am so sorry this happened to your princess! My daughter is 15 and I am still very protective of her. She is much smaller than most 15 year olds and not very strong. My daughter's safety means more to me than what society says I should allow her to do. I would much rather have my baby girl here in my life and have her without harm or violation instead of adding a lot of freedom and have something happen to her. And for what it is worth, she does not feel I am over protective, she does not feel like she cannot do anything and she does not feel like she is coddled. She thanks me that I love her that much and she tells me all of the time that she is glad I am not like "some other moms".
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:11 PM   #48
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Since my DS17 has mild autism, I probably have a totally different viewpoint. DH and decided a long time ago that no ride or attraction is important enough to leave our kids alone. We would take turns going alone if neither of our DSs was interested. That said, my view has changed as my younger DS has gotten older (he's now 14). He is more than capable of staying by himself, walking home from school, meeting friends at the movies, etc. I have no problem leaving DS17 home alone, but I can't leave him alone in public places. If someone talks to him or brushes up against him, he gets anxious and kind of freaks out a little. It's best for one of us to stay with him if he doesn't want to go on a ride. DS14 would be fine, and would have been fine when he was 12. I probably wouldn't have left him when he was younger than that.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:11 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by seven dwarfs View Post
I would not leave my child at the age of 12 alone anywhere in Disney. I know Disney seems so friendly and full of workers and that bad things can't happen there. I also know we have made many trips to Disney and never had anything bad happen with a stranger. Until this past summer trip.

I would like to share that my daughter (12) was touched in an inappropriate manor while on the stitch attraction. She was sitting by her sister who was 8and I was sitting next to the eight year old. There were many empty seats as it was not that busy. The gentleman was sitting behind her and did not allow his harness to tighten. I noticed him alone on the ride and that his harness was not down but just thought maybe he doesn't like space mountain and his family is riding that and maybe he doesn't like the idea of a harness. During the dark parts he slipped out of his seat. At first she was not sure what it was, and I think she was in such shock. But then once she processed what was going on, she took her hand with her nails and dug into his hairy hands. (I hope she drew blood!)

I have talked to my children about strangers, and the "what ifs". I have also told them over and over what to do in a situation like this. Even after many talks, my daughter froze up and by the time she was able to tell me what had happened, the man was gone. It was for his best because he would have taken his last breath had my husband and I found him. My daughter said she now understands why I have a 2 person rule. She used to think it was silly. I have six kids so we do everything in two's. It was an awful situation that has forever changed my family.

I believe this man knew what he was doing and that it wasn't his first time and won't be his last until he is caught. He knew the ride well. Since there is no video in the ride they were unable to locate the man. I believe had there been just a touch of light during the dark parts, this would not have happened.

I am sad to have to share such an awful experience my family had during the happiest place on earth. But, I believe it is important to share to prevent others from going through what she did. I would never leave my 12year old daughter anywhere alone in Disney. You can not put a price on a childs safety. This has forever changed my daughter and I am very sad that it has changed her thoughts of Disney. I also know it can happen anywhere.
No cameras on stitch? Are you saying there's no surveillance at all or they don't record footage. I'm curious.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:22 PM   #50
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I'm a yes vote (yes, she can manage the time by herself and be safe). If she's nervous about it, the "wait in line with you/take the chicken exit" is a good option, but I'm guessing she's not nervous and would prefer to spend the time browsing the shop. I like the phone as an added reassurance layer. She'll be fine. Yes, there are bad people out there, but it's rare, perfect protection is impossible, and Disney strikes me as a very safe spot for you both to try on some stretching of the safety zone.
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:25 PM   #51
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Seven Dwarfs - I am so sorry this happened to your daughter. Truly awful for her and for you. I just can't imagine.

But you said yourself you were sitting just a few feet away. So I'm not sure how stories like this affect anyone's thinking as to whether to give their adolescents a measure of independence.

Bad things can happen whether parents are physically there or not. And children will grow up whether they are allowed to mature at a normal pace or not. Teaching children how to look for danger signs, how to avoid vulnerable situations, and to always listen to your inner voice seems far more valuable in the long run than just never letting your children out of your sight.

Again, Seven Dwarfs, I feel so sad for your daughter. I'm glad you shared the story, as it may remind some of us to be careful in situations like this. (I know I will think of it.)
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Old 01-06-2013, 02:26 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by mad madam mim78 View Post
No cameras on stitch? Are you saying there's no surveillance at all or they don't record footage. I'm curious.
They told us it was live time closed circuit. (I can only say what we were told, I have no clue what the truth is) If someone is not watching such behavior it goes without notice. No one was watching and he got away with it. They did have some recorded video of main street and tried to find someone who matched the description (so we were told) and they were unable to locate him leaving the park. I have no doubt in my mind this man knew this and I have no doubt it wasn't his first time. We went to the customer service desk to see if they could find him as we wanted to prevent this from happening to others. This can happen anywhere, I understand that, not just Disney. I have always felt so safe at Disney. Not anymore.

I would like to add, someone said in a couple of posts back, 'if my child screams in a store someone will hear'. I have told my kids to scream etc when in danger. My daughter did not and it took her a minute to process what was happening and be able to tell me.

I have always wondered how perverts were able to take children in areas that are populated. Why would a child not scream? You have seen in the news where a taken child is in public yet tells no one they are in danger? I am telling you my daughter did not react as she had been taught nor like I would have thought she would. Kids can become so affraid that they are unable to process what is happening and are unable to find that voice. And her Mom was right there! It was a learning lesson for me as a parent and for my children. I just hope this helps other families and prevents any one else's child from experiencing what mine did! I am sad that my child had to learn the hard way what kind of evil is in this world.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:03 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Love Tink View Post
Seven Dwarfs - I am so sorry this happened to your daughter. Truly awful for her and for you. I just can't imagine.

But you said yourself you were sitting just a few feet away. So I'm not sure how stories like this affect anyone's thinking as to whether to give their adolescents a measure of independence.

Bad things can happen whether parents are physically there or not. And children will grow up whether they are allowed to mature at a normal pace or not. Teaching children how to look for danger signs, how to avoid vulnerable situations, and to always listen to your inner voice seems far more valuable in the long run than just never letting your children out of your sight.

Again, Seven Dwarfs, I feel so sad for your daughter. I'm glad you shared the story, as it may remind some of us to be careful in situations like this. (I know I will think of it.)
Absolutly bad things can and do happen anywhere and even when a parent is present. And trust me I have gone over and over in my head what I could have done different. My daughter has too. If she had sat by me, was her skirt to short, should I have been more concerned about a lone man with a harness not in correct position?

You can't stop sick people from doing sick things. But I do think you can deter it. One way would be not to leave a small child alone in a store. I am not saying that I would not allow my children to become independant and what age that would be. To be honest, even my friends who tend to be way more overprotective compared to me, have independant children. I haven't met anyone yet who has a child that is not able to function in the world because they were to protected. (I am sure they are out there somewhere)

There is a huge difference in someone who is 12 alone, then someone who is 16 alone. There is a difference in a child alone or with an older sibbling. I believe a child can learn to be independant in many situations. Does it need to be 12 years old at Disney? Would this man have done what he did to a 16 year old, who knows, but I don't think so.

I think it is important to note what you think your child would do, or you teach your child to do, isn't always what will happen. To me the concern I have is leaving a child in an unfamiliar place alone (without a sibling at least) which is a huge target for a pervert. Statistics have proven even children in numbers are multiple times less a target then a child alone. I am not telling anyone not to leave their child alone in Disney. What works for me may not work for others. I may not have felt the way I do today had my daughter not be violated like she was. What I am saying, now that I have been through what I have, is my daughters at the age of 12 will never be left alone anywhere in Disney. This is my opinion to the question asked and my reason why. I don't think people realize stuff like this can and does happen at Disney. I just hope this gives others something to talk about. Open conversation between a child and parent.

I have no doubt my 12 year old daughter could handle waiting alone in a store for her parents and following all rules. What I didn't take in consideration was there may be a pervent watching and waiting and what she was taught was not what she did. Although, she did not find her voice, she was able to scratch him and I do hope he has a nice scar from her nails!

And one last thing, Security from Disney and the county sheriff deputy told me it happens way more then people know at Disney. I just was in the boat of the "Happy Place and stuff doesn't happy there camp with security being so good!"
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:10 PM   #54
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Yes, I would.

Another idea is to have them wait in line together & have your DD use the chicken exit. She could then simply wait at the off-load point. It would, at least, minimize time she spends alone.
This
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:15 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by seven dwarfs View Post
Absolutly bad things can and do happen anywhere and even when a parent is present. And trust me I have gone over and over in my head what I could have done different. My daughter has too. If she had sat by me, was her skirt to short, should I have been more concerned about a lone man with a harness not in correct position?

You can't stop sick people from doing sick things. But I do think you can deter it. One way would be not to leave a small child alone in a store. I am not saying that I would not allow my children to become independant and what age that would be. To be honest, even my friends who tend to be way more overprotective compared to me, have independant children. I haven't met anyone yet who has a child that is not able to function in the world because they were to protected. (I am sure they are out there somewhere)

There is a huge difference in someone who is 12 alone, then someone who is 16 alone. There is a difference in a child alone or with an older sibbling. I believe a child can learn to be independant in many situations. Does it need to be 12 years old at Disney? Would this man have done what he did to a 16 year old, who knows, but I don't think so.

I think it is important to note what you think your child would do, or you teach your child to do, isn't always what will happen. To me the concern I have is leaving a child in an unfamiliar place alone (without a sibling at least) which is a huge target for a pervert. Statistics have proven even children in numbers are multiple times less a target then a child alone. I am not telling anyone not to leave their child alone in Disney. What works for me may not work for others. I may not have felt the way I do today had my daughter not be violated like she was. What I am saying, now that I have been through what I have, is my daughters at the age of 12 will never be left alone anywhere in Disney. This is my opinion to the question asked and my reason why. I don't think people realize stuff like this can and does happen at Disney. I just hope this gives others something to talk about. Open conversation between a child and parent.

I have no doubt my 12 year old daughter could handle waiting alone in a store for her parents and following all rules. What I didn't take in consideration was there may be a pervent watching and waiting and what she was taught was not what she did. Although, she did not find her voice, she was able to scratch him and I do hope he has a nice scar from her nails!

And one last thing, Security from Disney and the county sheriff deputy told me it happens way more then people know at Disney. I just was in the boat of the "Happy Place and stuff doesn't happy there camp with security being so good!"
I for one am glad you shared your story. As a parent of 3DD's, it really gives some more food for thought on this subject. I do believe it happens a lot more then we as park and resort guests know.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:33 PM   #56
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I'm in the minority,and I would not leave my 12 year old.
again,it's not really about the maturity of the child,but other people.

I would simply be uncomfortable,but it's each to their own.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:42 PM   #57
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This is the second time I've seen you post something way over the top... I'm guessing you are a troll (teenage boy posing as an adult and looking for attention)
You really don't spend much time on the boards, do you? This poster is FAR from being a troll. Since when did voicing your opinion in a no-nonsense manner equate to being a troll. You really owe an apology.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:58 PM   #58
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My son is 10 and even now, I would probably let him go through the chicken exit by himself to wait for us. He is very good about following directions in those instances, he is very familiar with Disney World and would enjoy a few minutes of freedom. I would not let him be by himself for a long time and would probably give him my cell phone just in case we got stuck or something. He has a level head on his shoulders and is pretty resourceful, I'm sure he'd be fine.
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:00 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by seven dwarfs View Post
Absolutly bad things can and do happen anywhere and even when a parent is present. And trust me I have gone over and over in my head what I could have done different. My daughter has too. If she had sat by me, was her skirt to short, should I have been more concerned about a lone man with a harness not in correct position?

You can't stop sick people from doing sick things. But I do think you can deter it. One way would be not to leave a small child alone in a store. I am not saying that I would not allow my children to become independant and what age that would be. To be honest, even my friends who tend to be way more overprotective compared to me, have independant children. I haven't met anyone yet who has a child that is not able to function in the world because they were to protected. (I am sure they are out there somewhere)

There is a huge difference in someone who is 12 alone, then someone who is 16 alone. There is a difference in a child alone or with an older sibbling. I believe a child can learn to be independant in many situations. Does it need to be 12 years old at Disney? Would this man have done what he did to a 16 year old, who knows, but I don't think so.

I think it is important to note what you think your child would do, or you teach your child to do, isn't always what will happen. To me the concern I have is leaving a child in an unfamiliar place alone (without a sibling at least) which is a huge target for a pervert. Statistics have proven even children in numbers are multiple times less a target then a child alone. I am not telling anyone not to leave their child alone in Disney. What works for me may not work for others. I may not have felt the way I do today had my daughter not be violated like she was. What I am saying, now that I have been through what I have, is my daughters at the age of 12 will never be left alone anywhere in Disney. This is my opinion to the question asked and my reason why. I don't think people realize stuff like this can and does happen at Disney. I just hope this gives others something to talk about. Open conversation between a child and parent.

I have no doubt my 12 year old daughter could handle waiting alone in a store for her parents and following all rules. What I didn't take in consideration was there may be a pervent watching and waiting and what she was taught was not what she did. Although, she did not find her voice, she was able to scratch him and I do hope he has a nice scar from her nails!

And one last thing, Security from Disney and the county sheriff deputy told me it happens way more then people know at Disney. I just was in the boat of the "Happy Place and stuff doesn't happy there camp with security being so good!"
That's pretty terrible. Just one more reason not to ride that stupid thing.
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:01 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Love Tink
I never get why people ask questions like this on the Dis - you will obviously get answers as varied as can be, and never a consensus. You have to go with what your own parenting style dictates.

I have a 12 year old. I, frankly, can't even wrap my brain around the perspective of someone who would not leave their 12 year old alone for a little while in a Disney gift shop. But I know those people are out there (and according to the teachers I know, becoming more and more prevalent).
Well I think the OP is basically asking because they are wondering maybe about the setup or security in the park?? This is a forum to ask questions after all...and do you mean you can't wrap your brain around someone who would NOT leave their child alone?? Our did you mean to type you couldn't wrap your brain around someone that would leave their child? Not sure I understand the second part of your post....thanks
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